Alexander Palace Forum

Discussions about the Imperial Family and European Royalty => The Hesse-Darmstadts (Hesse and by Rhine) => Topic started by: Romanov on November 30, 2004, 03:22:49 PM

Title: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Romanov on November 30, 2004, 03:22:49 PM
Does anyone have any pics of there jewels? I guess some that originally belonged to Victoria Melita and alixs' mother Alice?
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: jfkhaos on December 01, 2004, 07:56:25 AM
Elisa, is it possible for you to post the photograph of Princess Alice that you mentioned?
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: grandduchessella on December 01, 2004, 03:32:27 PM
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/grandduchessella/File0739.jpg)

She's wearing the Orders of Victoria and Albert (I think the one on th left with a profile of QV) and the Crown of India
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Jim1026 on December 01, 2004, 04:04:50 PM
I may be wrong but weren't some of the Hessen jewels
destroyed in the 1937 plane crash?
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Sergei on December 01, 2004, 04:15:01 PM
I saw a documentary on the History Channel about G.I looting during WW2 which mentioned what they called the Hesse Crown Jewels. Apparently the jewellery had been buried in a castle which had been occupied by American forces at the end of the war. When one of the Hesse family members came to retrieve the jewellery(for a family wedding)  it was missing. On investigation it was recovered and there was a court martial back in the US. The news reel footage screened in the documentary showed one of the Hesse Princesses looking over the displayed jewellery during the trial. What struck me was how similar in appearance and movement she was to Queen Elizabeth, the present Queen.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Sergei on December 01, 2004, 04:17:31 PM
From a google search. I just typed in "Hesse crown jewels war"
The best known case of looting by American personnel was the theft of the Hesse Crown Jewels. The primary instigator of the theft was Captain Kathleen Nash. Nash, Major David Watson and Colonel Jack Durant, Nash’s lover, found a fresh patch of concrete in the cellar as they were exploring the castle. They chipped through the concrete and found zinc lined boxes full of jewels. The trio removed the jewels from the tiaras, bracelets, etc and sold them in Switzerland. In late 1945, the trio returned to the United States. In addition to the jewels and gold, the trio had looted silverware, books, and hundreds of other items. In January 1946, the jewels were reported missing by a member of the Hesse family. The Army’s Criminal Intelligence Division determined the extent of the theft and soon arrested the trio. Durant married Nash so she would not be allowed to testify against him. Watson was sentenced to three years in prison but was released after four months. His family owned a large West Coast grocery store chain that apparently had connections to people in power. Durant was sentenced to fifteen years and released after six years. Nash however, was described as a difficult prisoner and served her entire sentence of five years. About one half of the jewels had been mailed to Nash’s sister.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Jim1026 on December 01, 2004, 04:58:25 PM
Wasn't that to do with the jewels of the Hesse Kassel
family not the Hesse Darmstadt family ???
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: HerrKaiser on December 01, 2004, 05:03:35 PM
Such stories of massive looting in Germany following the Allied takeover are quite common and widespread. I have no exact percent of personal property and state property that was stolen once surrender was made, but it is amazingly high. Friends of mine who lived in Breslau were stripped of everything from wedding rings to Meissen collections to Christmas ornaments to expensive jewelry and on and on. The royals at least had a "celebrity" to make a public claim of loss and attempt to retrieve their property, but the average people lost it all.
Did the Hessen jewels ever get returned completely? Or are they still trying to find them?
My my, the jewel thief Nash was also a difficult prisoner? How a few diamonds will create a real ogre!  ;)
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Martyn on December 02, 2004, 08:50:09 AM
The jewels in question were  those that had belonged to Empress Friedrich and which had been left to her daughter Mossy, were they not?  They were from her personal collection and were not 'crown jewels'.
The Hesse Darmstadt jewels are altogether different.  David Duff on page 88 of his book 'Hessian Tapestry' includes a list of jewellery that Pcss Alice received at her marriage.  This includes the wonderful diamond tiara from her mother Q.Victoria, not to mention a sapphire and diamond parure from Bertie and a curious gold bracelet from the Duke of Coburg with a painting of his own eye upon it, supposedly to remind Alice that 'the eye of Coburg was ever upon her'!
It would appear that Alice was not short of jewellery and this does not take into account pieces that she may have had the use of when she became Grand Duchess.  On page 126 David Duff aslo has this to say.
'It was a sad Christmas (1866) for Darmstadt.  There were few gifts to be bought in the shops and little money for festivities.  There were still many wounded in the hospitals and the Princess took her daughter, Victoria, round the wards to amuse tham.  She thought of "Vicky the victorious" in Berlin; of Helena in the peace of Frogmore, secure with her dowry and the income that came to her husband from the Queen.  She thought of herself as the Princess "with the second-best pearls", although the famous Hessian jewels graced her neck.'
Anybody know what these might have been?
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: grandduchessella on December 05, 2004, 02:39:46 AM
The Tiara:
Alice and Louis
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/grandduchessella/d20gb20tir20hesse201.jpg)

Alice
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/grandduchessella/img491.jpg)

I think this was ID'd as Ella but notice not only the same tiara but I think the same necklace and earrings. It looks very like the above photo:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/grandduchessella/tiara.jpg)

Victoria Melita when Grand Duchess of Hesse:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/grandduchessella/VictoriaHelitaFeodorovnaofSaxe-Coburg-GothaGrandDuche.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/grandduchessella/victoria20melitta.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/grandduchessella/Foto0043.jpg)

Eleanor, Grand Duchess of Hesse
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/grandduchessella/gd20dss20eleanore20of20hesse.jpg)
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: dp5486 on March 06, 2006, 02:00:24 PM
I know this is a little of topic but was that portrait of Princess Alice by von Angeli the portrait that hung in Alexandra's Mauve Room? On the Alexander Palace site, it mentions that she had a portrait of her mother by von Angeli and another copy belonged to Queen Victoria. Also, on the site it only shows the Van Sant portrait of Princess Alice in the Mauve Room not the di Angeli one.

Thanks!
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: lancashireladandre on March 07, 2006, 12:32:38 PM
Quote
The jewels in question were  those that had belonged to Empress Friedrich and which had been left to her daughter Mossy, were they not?  They were from her personal collection and were not 'crown jewels'.
The Hesse Darmstadt jewels are altogether different.  David Duff on page 88 of his book 'Hessian Tapestry' includes a list of jewellery that Pcss Alice received at her marriage.  This includes the wonderful diamond tiara from her mother Q.Victoria, not to mention a sapphire and diamond parure from Bertie and a curious gold bracelet from the Duke of Coburg with a painting of his own eye upon it, supposedly to remind Alice that 'the eye of Coburg was ever upon her'!
It would appear that Alice was not short of jewellery and this does not take into account pieces that she may have had the use of when she became Grand Duchess.  On page 126 David Duff aslo has this to say.
'It was a sad Christmas (1866) for Darmstadt.  There were few gifts to be bought in the shops and little money for festivities.  There were still many wounded in the hospitals and the Princess took her daughter, Victoria, round the wards to amuse tham.  She thought of "Vicky the victorious" in Berlin; of Helena in the peace of Frogmore, secure with her dowry and the income that came to her husband from the Queen.  She thought of herself as the Princess "with the second-best pearls", although the famous Hessian jewels graced her neck.'
Anybody know what these might have been?

The sapphire parure (necklace with pendant,brooch,bracelet)from Bertie passed to Alice's eldest daughter Victoria who wore them with a matching tiara on her wedding day.In 1914 Victoria & her second daughter Louise went to russia to visit her sisters.As they were to attend various state functions she took all her gems.The outbreak of WW1 and the gruelling journey back to the UK via the Scandanavian countries meant she was advised to leave them in Russia.The revolution meant they were never able to recovered.Count Benkendorff mentions them in his memoirs etc.Among the gems was Queen Victoria's wedding present to her grandaughter a set of diamond stars and a diamond locket ( a christening present from Queen Marie Amelie of the French).
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: dp5486 on March 07, 2006, 12:43:40 PM
The aforementioned case of Victoria of Battenberg sounds like what happened to Queen Marie of Roumania.Did this happen to any other royals (non-Russian royals who left jewelry in Russia).

Where exactly did they leave these jewels? In bank vaults?

Thanks!
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on March 07, 2006, 08:04:48 PM
Either in bank vaults or with their relatives.  ;)
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eddie_uk on March 08, 2006, 02:12:34 AM
Yes, how did Queen Marie come to lose her jewels? Such a shame!
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on March 08, 2006, 07:05:09 AM
She thought it was safer to store the jewels in Russia than in Romania...So did VMH. They both lost their jewels... :(
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: dp5486 on March 08, 2006, 08:42:50 AM
Yes it was very unfortunate. I was reading through the biography (or autobiography?-can't remember which) about how Marie started to rebuild her jewel collection with the help of her sister Ducky. Ducky and Kirill had inherited jewelry from Miechen and they started to sell it to sustain themselves. Marie says how unfortunate it was but she did pay Ducky upfront and for face value.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Marlene on March 08, 2006, 08:43:47 AM
Quote
Yes, how did Queen Marie come to lose her jewels? Such a shame!



About 20 years or so ago, the Sunday Times magazine (London)  had a nice article about the loss of the Roumanian jewels.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: grandduchessella on March 08, 2006, 05:26:13 PM
Missy petitioned several times to the Soviet government for the return of the jewels but to no avail. She was especially upset over the loss of the jewels that had been given to her by her father for her wedding.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on March 08, 2006, 07:02:14 PM
Yes...She should have left it in England, where it was the safest place.  :(
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eddie_uk on March 09, 2006, 06:01:12 AM
Quote


About 20 years or so ago, the Sunday Times magazine (London)  had a nice article about the loss of the Roumanian jewels.


How interesting, I would love to see that I like the Sunday Times magazine.

I'm not suprised Marie was upset. Especially when the jewels had family connections :(

That's the soviets for you!! ::)
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on March 09, 2006, 06:54:37 AM
I wonder if they had records of how they dispose of the jewels... ???
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: grandduchessella on July 18, 2008, 11:51:51 PM
Has anyone heard more of this?

The Hessen Affair

 1945 - Castle Kronberg, outside Frankfurt, is turned into a 'country club' for victorious American officers. The cynical Colonel Jack Durant and the dazzling beautiful Lieutenant Kathleen Nash uncover the crown jewels of Germany - more diamonds, rubies, emeralds, sapphires and pearls than are gathered in any one place outside the Tower of London. Nash and Durant manage to get the gems to New York, where they must deal with gangsters to fence the loot. To make matters worse for the two renegade officers, Princess Sophie discovers the theft of her jewels and complains to American army headquarters. It now turns out that her brother fought for the Allies and is about to marry the future Queen of England. With double-crossing gangland figures trying to control the gems and the army closing in on them, will Kathy Nash and Jack Durant stay true to one other and their plan? Or will one sell the other out? 

The movie's still in production.


Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Robert_Hall on July 19, 2008, 09:12:27 AM
Sounds like a fun movie, a bit fantasy fiction based on semi-truths.  Hope it is a "Pink Panther" comedy.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Yelena Aleksandrovna on October 08, 2009, 03:18:36 PM
What beautiful tiara!!! Thank you very much for posting all the photos grandduchessella,
Of what materials was it made? Diamonds?
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 10, 2009, 10:23:47 AM
Most likely diamonds.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Thomas_Hesse on October 10, 2009, 05:37:35 PM
Of course diamonds - the tiara was designed by the Prince Consort himself.

It was the only item to survive the terrible 1937 aircrash - protected in it special box. I think it is not worn anymore
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: ashdean on October 11, 2009, 02:33:25 AM
Of course diamonds - the tiara was designed by the Prince Consort himself.

It was the only item to survive the terrible 1937 aircrash - protected in it special box. I think it is not worn anymore
At least one other tiara survived the aircrash,...and we have no knowlwdge if the 2 Grand Duchesses were taking all their jewels with them to London in 1937.
A set of diamond and aquamarines ,at least a part of which (tiara?) were by Faberge..and had come to Ernie from his sister Ella were still in existance...long after there were given by Louis & Margaret to a Hessian neice and were in the 90s sold in London.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 11, 2009, 03:05:42 PM
The diamond lettice tiara worn by Alice, Ducky and Onor is still intact. It was last seen in the Tiara exhibition in the V&A in London and photographed in Jeffery Munn's fab book. The emerald and star tiaras last seen worn by Cecilie of Greece was never seen again.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Yelena Aleksandrovna on October 14, 2009, 07:12:52 PM
Thank you very much for answer my question below. It was indeed a very beautiful tiara
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 14, 2009, 07:54:38 PM
Now the two branches of Hesse jewelry are united under one roof.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: grandduchessella on October 15, 2009, 03:31:05 PM
It would've been nicer through marriage rather than death, though.  :( Of course, Ernie would have had no reason to suspect his line would die out, nor would George Donatus (the father of 3 children with a fourth on the way). Does anyone know if Ludwig, once he knew he would have no children, made provisions for any Hesse items to go to the branches of his family via his sisters Victoria and Irene who actually left descendants? They would be the last Hesses in the 'by Rhine' line, albeit in the female descent. Obviously, the family would have wanted to keep most of the family treasury intact and in Darmstadt but was anything left to those branches?
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 16, 2009, 03:50:12 PM
The Battenbergs have their own property in Hesse and both Irene & VMH had nice dowries and some jewels.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: grandduchessella on October 16, 2009, 07:47:55 PM
I realize that--I was wondering if any specific bequests might have been made by Ludwig of Hesse to any of his Mountbatten cousins for instance. Things that would have sentimental value, perhaps, to the immediate family but wouldn't mean much to the Hesse-Cassel branch.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 16, 2009, 09:32:22 PM
I don't think so. Peggy Hesse was close to the Hesse-Kassel boys.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Alejandro Spain on May 10, 2010, 05:35:31 PM
The diamond lettice tiara worn by Alice, Ducky and Onor is still intact. It was last seen in the Tiara exhibition in the V&A in London and photographed in Jeffery Munn's fab book. The emerald and star tiaras last seen worn by Cecilie of Greece was never seen again.

I have never seen the two tiaras that you menton on your post (the emerald and star tiaras). Do you have pics of the two jewel?

Regards and thanks in advance!
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on May 11, 2010, 11:13:45 AM
No problem. I can sent it to your email address which you can sent it on a private message.

The emerald one was also worn by Eleanore, Cecilie's mother-in-law.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Thomas_Hesse on September 08, 2010, 11:08:13 AM

Tiara belonging to Grand Duchess Eleonore of Hesse and the Rhine. Given to her by he Grand Duke on Christmas 1905

(http://www.hadis.hessen.de/hadis-eLink/HStAD/R%204/29391.JPG)
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on September 08, 2010, 11:19:23 AM
Yes. This was a new design and one that survived the crash that killed Eleanore & Don's family. I read Peg Hesse wore it sometimes, but saw no photo of it though.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: grandduchessella on September 08, 2010, 03:16:36 PM
Wasn't there a photo of Eleanore wearing it in Geoffrey Munn's book?
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on September 08, 2010, 06:18:56 PM
Yes. I think it was a painting though...
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Alexander1917 on September 09, 2010, 01:37:39 PM
that's true.. didn't it survive the plan crash?
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on September 09, 2010, 02:08:51 PM
Yes. It was in a strong box on the plane. Sad affair though... :(
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Alejandro Spain on December 22, 2010, 04:40:09 PM
Do you know if the diadem that is wearing Tatiana of Sayn-Wittgenstein-Berlebug in this picture is a Hessian jewel?

(http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/8288/guestsb6.jpg)

(Photo from Glittering Royal Events)

Regards!
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on December 23, 2010, 11:23:55 AM
Maybe...but the House of Hesse-Kassel lost much jewelry after the theft immediately following the war.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Alejandro Spain on December 23, 2010, 02:35:59 PM
The photo was taken in 1968, after the end of IIWW. Maybe it was sold?

Regards!
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on December 24, 2010, 02:52:33 PM
Could be or not there in the first place.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Alejandro Spain on January 03, 2011, 07:18:11 AM
Well, the pearl/emerald tiara that Tatiana wore it's the first time that I have seen it (maybe a Hesse-Kassel piece). But see that:

(http://img832.imageshack.us/img832/6136/guestsb113.jpg)

(http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/2392/cecilehesse2.jpg)
 
(http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/5130/cecilieofgreeceandhesse.jpg)
 
The sister of Tatiana wore a Hesse-Darmstadt tiara at Benedikte of Denmark's wedding day!
 
(Photos from Glittering Royal Events and Noblesseetroyautes.com)
 
Regards!
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 03, 2011, 12:12:31 PM
I don't think it was the same tiara.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Alejandro Spain on January 03, 2011, 12:42:03 PM
I find the two diadems the same (the first without the stars).

Regards!
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 03, 2011, 02:46:21 PM
Too small in the photo to make good comparisons. Anyway Peg Hesse may have given it away. She did not wear much jewelry period.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: ashdean on January 04, 2011, 06:13:50 AM
I find the two diadems the same (the first without the stars).

Regards!
I think it is the same.The diadem was probably made so the stars could be removed to be worn as brooches etc...my own families tiara was made that way...however it looks rather weedy without the stars.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 04, 2011, 12:42:27 PM
Hard to say from that little picture though.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: HerrKaiser on January 31, 2011, 04:35:19 PM

Tiara belonging to Grand Duchess Eleonore of Hesse and the Rhine. Given to her by he Grand Duke on Christmas 1905

(http://www.hadis.hessen.de/hadis-eLink/HStAD/R%204/29391.JPG)

This tiara is a nice jewel that would look good even on a modern woman in a contemorary dress. Diana of wales was able to pull of wearing her designer clothes as well as hea-band style tiaras and still looked snappy because the tiaras she chose, like this one, were more subtle and seem more like jewelry than diadems.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: CountessKate on February 03, 2011, 08:59:34 PM
When I saw this tiara at the V&A tiara exhibition in 2002, I remember thinking it looked solid, rather chunky and not at all pretty - it was surprising to me as the photos I had seen previously (and the one here) make it look light and charming. 
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: HerrKaiser on February 04, 2011, 10:39:09 AM
Bummer. Another reason not to buy one's tiara online or via mail order.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on June 07, 2011, 05:04:29 PM
It was quite charming. Mr. Munn took it out and showed us at the time of the exhibition.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Martyn on September 23, 2011, 11:54:21 AM
I've seen it up close and it isn't one of my favourites.  Not enough glitter for my liking (call me shallow!) and I must add that I find the design a bit heavy........
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on September 25, 2011, 10:12:28 PM
It was a very creative design though.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Martyn on September 27, 2011, 12:30:18 PM
I suppose that it is a question of taste.  The workmanship of this piece is incredible.  However turquoise and moonstones just don't do it for me......
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Marc on September 27, 2011, 06:16:26 PM
I suppose that it is a question of taste.  The workmanship of this piece is incredible.  However turquoise and moonstones just don't do it for me......

To me moonstones look like glass and turquise stones look like plastic...not to my liking either!
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Martyn on September 28, 2011, 08:30:55 AM
I would love to see a clearer image of the tiara that Cecile was photographed wearing, set with cabochon stones and daimonds...anyone have one?  Also anyone know what the cabochon stones were?
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on September 28, 2011, 09:09:43 AM
I think they were emeralds (i am not 100% sure though). Cecile was the last to wear the emerald tiara alongside an emerald drop choker (with diamonds) that used to belong to Eleanore That photo was taken by Cecil Beaton). After the death of Cecile, I never saw those jewels again. Peg Hesse never wore them. I don't think I have seen a picture of her wearing a tiara and jewels.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Carolath Habsburg on October 06, 2011, 12:14:31 PM
Mandie. the gothic Empress, posted it on colorized images

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v477/MMPC/A%20Imperial%20Album/Germany/3-1.jpg)

Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 07, 2011, 12:08:08 PM
I think there is a postcard of Eleanore wearing the same tiara, choker and pendant. This photo shoot was by Cecil Beaton, one version of it is in the Sotheby's photography collection in London.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Carolath Habsburg on October 07, 2011, 12:38:22 PM
Yup these ones

Courtesy of Gogm site

(http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/7370/grandduchesseleonoreof2.png) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/27/grandduchesseleonoreof2.png/)

 
(http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/5816/grandduchesseleonorezus.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/225/grandduchesseleonorezus.jpg/)

 
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 07, 2011, 01:17:37 PM
Thanks ! Exactly. However I don't know if those jewels were lost in the plane crash. Never saw them worn again by Peg Hesse or the current Hesse family.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Martyn on October 12, 2011, 12:12:05 PM
Thank you Carolath Habsburg, that is a fantastic image!  Really shows the detail of the diadem, which is quite a substantial item.  The cabochon emeralds are impressive....

Anyone know anything about the date of manufacture or origins?  Or who the diadem was made for?
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 13, 2011, 09:15:43 AM
Not sure. It wasn't something Alice or Ducky worn so it might either be Ernie's wedding present to Ona or part of her own dowry. The tiara had a kind of Gothic element to it, so it might even be designed by Ernie himself (who was really into the arts & craft movement). The jewels were not seen again after Cecile died.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Gabriella on October 28, 2011, 01:36:42 PM
Thank you, Carolath Habsburg for the fantastic picture of Cecile and the ones of Eleonore.

The first one I have never seen before, she looks fantastic.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 28, 2011, 09:45:58 PM
Actually there is more pics of Cecilie that are unpublished. Went to Darmstadt archives and see quite a lot on her...
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: grandduchessella on May 13, 2013, 01:26:30 PM
Eleanore's turquoise & moonstone tiara has reappeared. There is speculation that the lady wearing it is Baroness Geddes.  Since the tiara was apparently Margaret's personal property--it was on the ill-fated flight as a wedding gift to her--she may have left it to a member of her own family. This was at the opening of Parliament and Margaret of Hesse's nephew, Euan Geddes, 3rd Baron Geddes is a deputy speaker of the House of Lords.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v207/dronning/QueenElizabethIIAttendsStateOpeningParliamentSRR3_wyfTzXx.jpg)

http://members2.boardhost.com/royal-jewels/msg/1368045123.html
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on May 13, 2013, 01:32:24 PM
Yes. Although I never saw a picture of Peg Hesse wearing it...
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Marc on May 14, 2013, 06:47:22 AM
I saw her just once wearing an unknown tiara...it was in documentary during the banquet ball when Queen Elizabeth II visited Germany,I think in 1965...
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on May 14, 2013, 07:13:47 AM
Wonder where that one came from ?
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: grandduchessella on May 14, 2013, 11:11:52 AM
The turquoise & moonstone tiara? Geoffrey Munn covers it in his must-read Tiaras.

And it does seem that it does belong to the Geddes family:

"Or maybe the turquoise and moonstone one that I later spot on Lady Geddes during cocktails at the River Room, attached - how sweet is this- by a little ribbon at the back. "

This was from a report on the Opening of Parliament last year.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on May 14, 2013, 04:12:06 PM
Yes. That tiara was in the Munn book and also in the Hesse archives photo.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Clemence on May 07, 2014, 04:04:23 PM
Quote
The jewels in question were  those that had belonged to Empress Friedrich and which had been left to her daughter Mossy, were they not?  They were from her personal collection and were not 'crown jewels'.
The Hesse Darmstadt jewels are altogether different.  David Duff on page 88 of his book 'Hessian Tapestry' includes a list of jewellery that Pcss Alice received at her marriage.  This includes the wonderful diamond tiara from her mother Q.Victoria, not to mention a sapphire and diamond parure from Bertie and a curious gold bracelet from the Duke of Coburg with a painting of his own eye upon it, supposedly to remind Alice that 'the eye of Coburg was ever upon her'!
It would appear that Alice was not short of jewellery and this does not take into account pieces that she may have had the use of when she became Grand Duchess.  On page 126 David Duff aslo has this to say.
'It was a sad Christmas (1866) for Darmstadt.  There were few gifts to be bought in the shops and little money for festivities.  There were still many wounded in the hospitals and the Princess took her daughter, Victoria, round the wards to amuse tham.  She thought of "Vicky the victorious" in Berlin; of Helena in the peace of Frogmore, secure with her dowry and the income that came to her husband from the Queen.  She thought of herself as the Princess "with the second-best pearls", although the famous Hessian jewels graced her neck.'
Anybody know what these might have been?

I wonder why this bracelet was not mentioned:

Quote
‘Visibly parted, ever united’: ‘Rare’ gold bracelet found inscribed with a poignant message from Queen Victoria for her late husband to mark daughter’s wedding
Given to Princess Alice before she married Prince Louis of Hesse
Bracelet was last item commissioned and could fetch £10,000 at auction
Lost from royal family when Empress Alexandra killed in Russian in 1918
By EMILY DAVIES
PUBLISHED: 20:11 GMT, 4 March 2013 | UPDATED: 09:30 GMT, 5 March 2013
   
A gold bracelet Queen Victoria had inscribed with a poignant message from her late husband which was then gifted to one of her daughters has been discovered.
The gold, diamond, pearl and enamel band was bought by Victoria and Prince Albert for a wedding present to Princess Alice.
Albert tragically died six months before the big day which went ahead, although Alice was instructed to wear black mourning dress immediately before and after her marriage to Prince Louis of Hesse.

Victoria presented the memento to the princess three months before the ceremony and four months after Albert's untimely death.
It is thought it was the last significant item the couple had commissioned for any of their children.

Queen Victoria gave the gold bracelet to her daughter Princess Alice as a gift for her wedding to Louis of Hesse
The bracelet features a portrait of the princess on the front next to a picture of a ship to signify her leaving the family home and moving to Germany with her new husband.
Princess Alice died in 1878 and the bracelet is thought to have been passed on to her second eldest daughter, Empress Alexandra Feodo Rovna.

It is thought the band left the family after the empress was executed with her husband Tsar Nicholas II during the Russian Revolution in 1918.
It was acquired by Professor Leonard Shaw, a millionaire engineer and antiques collector, who kept it at his home on Guernsey.
An auctioneer visited the property after he died aged 98 in November 2010 and discovered the rare piece of royal memorabilia amongst the vast collection.
The item is to be sold with a pre-sale estimate of £10,000. James Bridges, director at Martel Maides Auctions in Guernsey, said: 'The bracelet was found as part of Professor Shaw's collection after he passed away.
'He had a huge collection of jewellery and pocket watches, he was a real philanthropist, but we don't know how he came to acquire the bracelet.
'He bought a lot at auction in the 1960s through to the 1980s but it could have been from a private seller. I would be surprised if it was ever on the market before now.
'Princess Alice was engaged in 1861 and Queen Victoria and Prince Albert commissioned the bracelet to be made before she moved to Germany with her husband.

'The message on the back can be read in two ways; to signify her leaving the family behind or because Prince Albert was apart from his wife and daughter after his death.
'Princess Alice died when she was 35 and had seven children but two of them were murdered in Russia. It could have been here that the bracelet left the family.
'Queen Victoria liked giving jewellery as gifts to people such as nannies and godparents, but it is unusual to have something she gave one of her children for sale. It is incredibly rare.'
Princess Alice's wedding at Osborne House on the Isle of Wight was described as 'most sombre of Royal weddings' following her father's death.


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2288045/Queen-Victoria-Rare-gold-bracelet-given-Princess-Alice-inscribed-poignant-message.html#ixzz3149JIaqJ
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2288045/Queen-Victoria-Rare-gold-bracelet-given-Princess-Alice-inscribed-poignant-message.html (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2288045/Queen-Victoria-Rare-gold-bracelet-given-Princess-Alice-inscribed-poignant-message.html)
The sapphire parure (necklace with pendant,brooch,bracelet)from Bertie passed to Alice's eldest daughter Victoria who wore them with a matching tiara on her wedding day.In 1914 Victoria & her second daughter Louise went to russia to visit her sisters.As they were to attend various state functions she took all her gems.The outbreak of WW1 and the gruelling journey back to the UK via the Scandanavian countries meant she was advised to leave them in Russia.The revolution meant they were never able to recovered.Count Benkendorff mentions them in his memoirs etc.Among the gems was Queen Victoria's wedding present to her grandaughter a set of diamond stars and a diamond locket ( a christening present from Queen Marie Amelie of the French).
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Dru on September 17, 2014, 01:56:52 PM
(https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5569/15247247426_ecdc3d0acf_o.jpg)

The Hesse family wedding tiara, made from sheaves of wheat that were on a gown in Grand Duchess Alexandra Nikolaevna's trousseau.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on September 19, 2014, 05:44:57 AM
They were saved while other jewels belonging to Mossy & Malfelda were lost during WWII.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Kimberly on September 19, 2014, 01:16:31 PM
Hi there Eric. Please could you tell me who "Peg Hesse" is?
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: rachel5a on September 19, 2014, 01:55:25 PM
Peg- Margaret Geddes- the wife of prince Louis of Hesse, BTW was their marriage cosidered morganatic?
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Dru on September 19, 2014, 02:32:18 PM
Malfelda

I thought her name was Mafalda?
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Kimberly on September 19, 2014, 03:26:13 PM
Thanks Rachel5a.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Marc on September 20, 2014, 04:39:50 AM
Peg- Margaret Geddes- the wife of prince Louis of Hesse, BTW was their marriage cosidered morganatic?

I don't think the marriage was considered morganatic.As a daughter of a Lord,she could probably scrape through,if the Head of the family says "yes".

Even in the case of "scheduled to be morganatic" by his family(which I don't think so),at the time of his actual marriage Prince Ludwig was the only Head of the family due to airplane crash and thus he was the only one able to decide will it be morganatic or not...
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: rachel5a on September 20, 2014, 06:21:48 AM
That's true. But her father was created Baron Geddes in 1942 so at The time of her marriage she was miss Geddes wasn' she?
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Carolath Habsburg on September 20, 2014, 02:13:23 PM
Malfelda

I thought her name was Mafalda?

You re right, Dru. Its Mafalda. Eric loves to miswrite names , lol.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Marc on October 01, 2014, 09:26:08 AM
That's true. But her father was created Baron Geddes in 1942 so at The time of her marriage she was miss Geddes wasn' she?

True :-)

But even if it was supposed to be a morganatic marriage,the actual decision in the end was made by Prince Ludwig himself,as at the time of their marriage,he was the Head of the family and the only one who could decide...

Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Marc on October 01, 2014, 09:30:01 AM
Malfelda

I thought her name was Mafalda?

You re right, Dru. Its Mafalda. Eric loves to miswrite names , lol.

Not just the names ;) as a person who wrote many books about royalty and visited many archives,as he said,he always says "morganEtic",the term which doesn't exist ;)

Even when he is told that that he is wrong,he always repeats the same mistake again and again ;) But,that's just Eric we used to,so no hard feelings ;-)
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 01, 2014, 11:09:51 PM
Yes it always easy to look at other people's mistakes. I am sure you never make any.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Marc on October 02, 2014, 03:04:48 PM
Yes it always easy to look at other people's mistakes. I am sure you never make any.

Of course I do...but I learn from my mistakes and,at least,try to not make them again ;)

It's not just about the mistake,but about the effort made to learn something properly,especially if you write books about it...

As an expert in this area,you,for example,always say morganEtic,the term which doesn't mean anything and does not even exist...when corrected you simply ignore it and keep on saying it again and again,which is bad propaganda only for you,as a royal writer with experience...
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 03, 2014, 11:54:36 PM
morganatic marriage for the last time. This word and term does exist. period.
Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Helen on October 04, 2014, 02:03:16 AM
Malfelda

You re right, Dru. Its Mafalda. Eric loves to miswrite names , lol.

Not just the names ;)  (...) he always says "morganEtic" (...)

Eric, could the issue be correct spelling? It is "morganatic", not "morganetic", and "Mafalda", not "Malfelda"
(And: yes, we all make mistakes.)

Title: Re: Jewels of the Houses of Hesse (by Rhine and Kassel)
Post by: Marc on October 04, 2014, 05:16:14 AM
morganatic marriage for the last time. This word and term does exist. period.

Oh Eric, again, you don't read at all, you just post randomly in order to post or reply ;) Please read first...if your concentration allows you!

I did not say that morgAnatic does not exist,but the term morganEtic,as you often write,does not exist...period :P

Just like Eric Lowe does exist,but ErAc Lowe doesn't ;)

Or like Malfelda,Mafelda or Malfada doesn't exist,just Mafalda ;)