Alexander Palace Forum

Discussions about the Imperial Family and European Royalty => Servants, Friends and Retainers => Topic started by: Thomas_Hesse on July 08, 2008, 05:10:30 AM

Title: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Thomas_Hesse on July 08, 2008, 05:10:30 AM

I am searching for information and fotographs of all the ladies in waiting, maids of honor etc who served Empress Alexandra Feodorovna and her sister Grand Duchess Elizaveta Feodorovna (Ella).

I'd be very grateful to anybody able to provide me with news! Predominantly in addition to:

Princess Maria Victorovna Bariatinskaya
Princess Obolenskaya
Catherine Schneider
Princess Lobanow-Rostowsky
Princess Olsufieva
Maria Vassilshtchikova
Kitty Kozlianinova
etc ...

Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Svetabel on November 20, 2011, 11:10:18 PM


Princess Lobanow-Rostowsky
Princess Olsufieva
Maria Vassilshtchikova
Kitty Kozlianinova
etc ...



Hi Thomas

if you are still interested in those ladies (of Elizaveta Fedorovna) I can provide information. Recently I've done a research on GDss' suite and her ladies and posted this info in my livejournal, in Russian.
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: ashdean on November 21, 2011, 03:16:12 AM


Princess Lobanow-Rostowsky
Princess Olsufieva
Maria Vassilshtchikova
Kitty Kozlianinova
etc ...


It would be fascinating to know brief biographies of those ladies.Didnt Countess Olsufieva later as a emigree in Berlin write a memoir of Elizabeth?

Hi Thomas

if you are still interested in those ladies (of Elizaveta Fedorovna) I can provide information. Recently I've done a research on GDss' suite and her ladies and posted this info in my livejournal, in Russian.
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Svetabel on November 25, 2011, 06:02:15 AM
Countess Olsufieva indeed wrote a short memoir-bio on GDss Elizaveta. As well as Maria Troubetzkaya (married Count Belevskiy-Zhukovskiy), another lady-in-waiting of the GDss.

Some info on Countess Olsufieva.

Alexandra Andreevna Olsufieva was the GDss' third and last Hofmeisterine. She was appointed as the Hofmeisterine in 1891 year, the year the Grand Ducal pair moved to Moscow. The Countess' predecessor Princess Golitzine resigned as she was a Catholic - such thing could bring many problems  in patriarchal and highly-orthodox Moscow.

Alexandra Andreevna Miklashevskaya was born in 1846, married Count Alexei Olsufiev (he was her own Uncle!!) and had 2 sons - one of them was and ADC of GD Sergei.



(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v433/feomarie/royals/LJ/olsufieva.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v433/feomarie/royals/LJ/03_11_2zqys.jpg)

She was a much-respected person within the Grand Ducal court, though her husband - a dashing hussar - sometimes disturbed the Grand Duchess with his manners. Felix Yousupov mentions the Countess in his memoirs - he says that she looked like a marquise from the XVIII century. I guess he meant her manners and education.

Alexandra Andreevna was faithful to her mistress even after GD Sergei' death and after 1909 when the GDss dissolved her court forever. The Countess had a chance to leave Russia in the revolutionary years and died in 1929.
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: blessOTMA on November 25, 2011, 07:44:23 AM
What a great thread ! Svetabel , you must know the GD EF lady in waiting nicknamed Mashka? She was a huge woman known for her huge size, booming voice  and great physical strenth...I have wondered if she was why Marie N. got that  nickname as well. Since Marie's sisters called her " fat little bow wow" , it's quite possible they first used this lady's nickname for Marie as a joke as well.
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Kalafrana on November 25, 2011, 08:00:31 AM
'Alexandra Andreevna Miklashevskaya was born in 1846, married Count Alexei Olsufiev (he was her own Uncle!!) and had 2 sons - one of them was and ADC of GD Sergei.'

Svetabel

I am a bit puzzled about this. If the Orthodox Church won't marry first cousins, surely they would not marry an uncle and niece. Was the husband an uncle by marriage? That is within the Prohibited Degrees of the Church of England, but maybe the Orthodox are different.

Ann

Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Svetabel on November 25, 2011, 02:25:25 PM
I was also puzzled when found out the fact. He was really her Uncle, her mother was his sister - Daria Vasilievna Olsufieva...I don't understand actually how the Church gave a consent to such a marriage. I am not that comprehensive in the Orthodox rules but I know that a marriage between Uncle and Niece is forbidden (3 degree of relationship, only 5-7 degrees of relationship have a chance to get  a special consent of an Archbishop....who knows what were reasons for the Olsufiev alliance...
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Svetabel on November 25, 2011, 02:33:44 PM
What a great thread ! Svetabel , you must know the GD EF lady in waiting nicknamed Mashka? She was a huge woman known for her huge size, booming voice  and great physical strenth...I have wondered if she was why Marie N. got that  nickname as well. Since Marie's sisters called her " fat little bow wow" , it's quite possible they first used this lady's nickname for Marie as a joke as well.


Actually they called her Masha. You speak about Maria Alexandrovna Wasilitchikova - she was not in fact a lady-in-waiting of the GDss. She was a l-i-w of the Empress and in 1886 was sent to EF 'to fill the gap' as the GDss' first l-i-w Princess Lyudmila Lobanova married GD Sergei's ADC Konstantin Balyasniy. The newlyweds left the Grand Ducal court and the GDss began to search for a new l-i-w. While she was searching Masha was her companion in Ilinskoe - after that they became great friends until 1915 year.
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: blessOTMA on November 25, 2011, 11:05:50 PM
Thank you so much!
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Svetabel on November 26, 2011, 02:16:33 PM
Princess Alexandra Nikolayevna Lobanova-Rostovskaya, another more or less famous l-i-w of the Grand Duchess, can be seen in many memoirs of her contemporaries. She was very vivid, lively and eccentric person.

She was born in 1868 year in a large family, whose male members very often were diplomats, ambassadors, ministers, and women form the family often found their husbands within the diplomatic corps. In 1889 year Alexandra - her nickname was Fafka - became a l-i-w of GDss Alexandra Georgievna and after her death she didn't left the court but became a l-i-w of GDss EF. She resigned in 1902 year (the reasons I still can't find) - she never married and often lived with the family of her eldest sister Lady Olga Egerton (whose husband was a minister in Greece and Vatican). The sisters continued to be together after the death of Olga's husband and lived in London, where Fafka died in 1946.Olga Egerton moved to the USA and died there in 1947.

Fafka was indeed an eccentric person as every memoirist who mentions her writes about her jovial character, funny jokes and endless chatting.

There is also an interesting fact about Fafka - when I was beginning my research on the Grand Ducal courtiers I realized that in every source (Russian or English)  Fafka is mixed up with her cousin Lyudmila Lobanova - first l-i-w of the Grand Duchess. Even Mr.Warwick in his bio on the GDss EF writes about Fafka's being a l-i-w in 1885 year...no...it was Lyudmila.

Here's Fafka:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v433/feomarie/royals/LJ/__1899-.jpg)

with the GDss

And here's Lyudmila Lobanova, Fafka's cousin:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v433/feomarie/royals/LJ/ludmila.jpg)

in 1884

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v433/feomarie/royals/LJ/___1885.jpg)

and in 1885 with the GD pair and her future husband Konstantin Balysniy.
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: matushka on November 27, 2011, 02:53:26 PM
Thank you, Svetabel, for these informations and precisions. Even if it is probably the subject of another thread, could you provide more information about Baliasny?
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Talya on November 27, 2011, 03:06:25 PM
Wait, Fafka if didn't become lady-in-waiting in 1885 (that was Lyddy), then why is she in the picture with the GDss and the GDk?
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Svetabel on November 27, 2011, 08:55:03 PM
Wait, Fafka if didn't become lady-in-waiting in 1885 (that was Lyddy), then why is she in the picture with the GDss and the GDk?

Sorry, what picture? If you speak about the last photo in my previous post - there is Lyudmila, not Fafka in the picture.
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: blessOTMA on November 28, 2011, 08:30:27 AM
Thank you , Svetabel . I love learning about the other people in the photos. Every face is a connection and every connection leads to  more information
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Svetabel on January 22, 2014, 11:14:07 AM

I am searching for information and fotographs of all the ladies in waiting, maids of honor etc who served Empress Alexandra Feodorovna and her sister Grand Duchess Elizaveta Feodorovna (Ella).


Princess Obolenskaya




Thomas, did you mean Princess Elizaveta Nikolayevna Obolenskaya (1864-1936) ? GDss Elizaveta was also on friendly terms with Princess O., at least I've found in the Archives postcards and letter sent to Obolenskaya by the GDss. I've seen a note by Alexandra F. written to Prss O. (I mentioned it in the topic about Empress Alexandra's handwriting).

Here's Princess  O., eldest daughter of Prince Nikolai Nikolaevitch Obolenskiy (1833-98), commander of Preobrazhenskiy regiment

http://minus.com/i/vz4stP9M9YNj (http://minus.com/i/vz4stP9M9YNj)
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: mishaxenia on January 22, 2014, 03:42:28 PM
 you know what is the exact title of the book  of Maria Troubetzkaya ? thanks
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Svetabel on August 06, 2014, 02:38:57 AM
Here's my short article (in Russian) on Lyudmila Balyasnaya, nee Prss Lobanova,1st maid-of-honor of GDss Elizaveta Fedorovna. As well as on her husband, ADC of GD Sergei A.

http://www.kalendar.blagodrevo.ru/6.html (http://www.kalendar.blagodrevo.ru/6.html)


I have much more info on that couple and other members of GDss' suite but of course they can't be all in one article. Hope one day will be a book : )
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: katmaxoz on August 06, 2014, 07:30:01 PM
Here's my short article (in Russian) on Lyudmila Balyasnaya, nee Prss Lobanova,1st maid-of-honor of GDss Elizaveta Fedorovna. As well as on her husband, ADC of GD Sergei A.

http://www.kalendar.blagodrevo.ru/6.html (http://www.kalendar.blagodrevo.ru/6.html)


I have much more info on that couple and other members of GDss' suite but of course they can't be all in one article. Hope one day will be a book : )

Even reading this through google translation this is a good article. I'm glad that someone is looking at the retinues and servants of the Romanovs. Its obvious, even only from photos, that some of these people were like family the members of the imperial family (and not just N&A) and they really deserve not to be forgotten - and it would be great to put names to faces in photos as well:) Keep up the good work Svetabel.

Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Svetabel on August 07, 2014, 01:10:19 AM
Here's my short article (in Russian) on Lyudmila Balyasnaya, nee Prss Lobanova,1st maid-of-honor of GDss Elizaveta Fedorovna. As well as on her husband, ADC of GD Sergei A.

http://www.kalendar.blagodrevo.ru/6.html (http://www.kalendar.blagodrevo.ru/6.html)


I have much more info on that couple and other members of GDss' suite but of course they can't be all in one article. Hope one day will be a book : )

Even reading this through google translation this is a good article. I'm glad that someone is looking at the retinues and servants of the Romanovs. Its obvious, even only from photos, that some of these people were like family the members of the imperial family (and not just N&A) and they really deserve not to be forgotten - and it would be great to put names to faces in photos as well:) Keep up the good work Svetabel.



Thank you Kathy! Yes, those people are deserved to be remembered, after all many of them had a lot of influence on the Romanovs.
I have a lot of material, almost on every member of GD and GDss' suite, could be a book ; ). Actually I want all that to be a book.
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: rachel5a on August 14, 2014, 02:14:36 AM
Interesting article. I have a question - in the last picture is that Victoria MH sitting?
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Svetabel on August 14, 2014, 04:26:41 AM
Interesting article. I have a question - in the last picture is that Victoria MH sitting?

Yes, that's her. Late summer of 1890 - visit of the Hesses to Russia.
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Bambi on February 07, 2018, 04:45:06 AM
So sorry to be reviving an old thread, but would anyone be able to confirm the nicknames of Ella's ladies-in-waiting? I know a couple (eg. Ekaterina Kozlianinova - Kitty and Princess Lyudmila Lobanova - Fafka), but with such an abundance of names, I can sometimes get confused...
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Grandoffsky on February 07, 2018, 12:26:50 PM
So sorry to be reviving an old thread, but would anyone be able to confirm the nicknames of Ella's ladies-in-waiting? I know a couple (eg. Ekaterina Kozlianinova - Kitty and Princess Lyudmila Lobanova - Fafka), but with such an abundance of names, I can sometimes get confused...

Also, Maria Petrovna Troubetskaya was Maroussia
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Svetabel on February 07, 2018, 01:12:31 PM
So sorry to be reviving an old thread, but would anyone be able to confirm the nicknames of Ella's ladies-in-waiting? I know a couple (eg. Ekaterina Kozlianinova - Kitty and Princess Lyudmila Lobanova - Fafka), but with such an abundance of names, I can sometimes get confused...

Fafka was Alexandra Lobanova, a cousin of Lyudmila Lobanova (the 1st maid-of-honor of Elizaveta). Lyudmila's nickname was Mila.
Princess Sophie Schakhovskaya was Sonia.
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Bambi on February 07, 2018, 02:50:23 PM
So sorry to be reviving an old thread, but would anyone be able to confirm the nicknames of Ella's ladies-in-waiting? I know a couple (eg. Ekaterina Kozlianinova - Kitty and Princess Lyudmila Lobanova - Fafka), but with such an abundance of names, I can sometimes get confused...

Fafka was Alexandra Lobanova, a cousin of Lyudmila Lobanova (the 1st maid-of-honor of Elizaveta). Lyudmila's nickname was Mila.
Princess Sophie Schakhovskaya was Sonia.
So sorry to be reviving an old thread, but would anyone be able to confirm the nicknames of Ella's ladies-in-waiting? I know a couple (eg. Ekaterina Kozlianinova - Kitty and Princess Lyudmila Lobanova - Fafka), but with such an abundance of names, I can sometimes get confused...

Also, Maria Petrovna Troubetskaya was Maroussia

Ah, so I mixed up the Lobanova cousins! Thanks for clearing that up! :)

Thank you both so much! Much appreciated! If anymore come to mind, please let me know. :)
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Grandoffsky on February 08, 2018, 01:29:10 AM
Thank you both so much! Much appreciated! If anymore come to mind, please let me know. :)

And you may come across Masha which usually refers to Maria Alexandrovna Vassilchikova (though I believe that technically she was not Ella's lady-in-waiting).
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Bambi on February 08, 2018, 01:45:16 AM
Thank you both so much! Much appreciated! If anymore come to mind, please let me know. :)

And you may come across Masha which usually refers to Maria Alexandrovna Vassilchikova (though I believe that technically she was not Ella's lady-in-waiting).

I think this is the first time I'm hearing of her. Who was she exactly? Just a friend? The surname does sound familiar, though. I think I may have seen it in Zinaida Yusupova's correspondence...
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Grandoffsky on February 08, 2018, 01:38:00 PM
I think this is the first time I'm hearing of her. Who was she exactly? Just a friend? The surname does sound familiar, though. I think I may have seen it in Zinaida Yusupova's correspondence...

She's the one who found the peach in her bed, I believe that's also where you might have seen the name. :)
If I remember correctly, she was the lady-in-waiting for the Empress, then Alexandra Georgievna and along the line got friendly with the Grand Ducal couple. However, I am not an expert on these matters.
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Bambi on February 08, 2018, 03:42:50 PM
I think this is the first time I'm hearing of her. Who was she exactly? Just a friend? The surname does sound familiar, though. I think I may have seen it in Zinaida Yusupova's correspondence...

She's the one who found the peach in her bed, I believe that's also where you might have seen the name. :)
If I remember correctly, she was the lady-in-waiting for the Empress, then Alexandra Georgievna and along the line got friendly with the Grand Ducal couple. However, I am not an expert on these matters.

Oh, yes! Of course, I couldnít forget about that! Like I said, itís just the abundance of names. :)
Title: Re: Ladies of Alexandra/Elizaveta Feodorovna
Post by: Svetabel on February 10, 2018, 09:48:22 AM
I think this is the first time I'm hearing of her. Who was she exactly? Just a friend? The surname does sound familiar, though. I think I may have seen it in Zinaida Yusupova's correspondence...

She's the one who found the peach in her bed, I believe that's also where you might have seen the name. :)
If I remember correctly, she was the lady-in-waiting for the Empress, then Alexandra Georgievna and along the line got friendly with the Grand Ducal couple. However, I am not an expert on these matters.

Masha was a maid-of-honor of the Empress not to any Grand Duchess. She was a friend of the Grand Ducal couple.