Alexander Palace Forum

Discussions about the Imperial Family and European Royalty => The Greek Royal Family => Topic started by: Marc on February 23, 2005, 05:25:22 PM

Title: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Marc on February 23, 2005, 05:25:22 PM
Any good picture of his wife Irene?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: LORENZO on May 16, 2005, 04:19:11 PM
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y214/LORENZ1977/IRENEDAOSTA.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Alex_for_King on May 26, 2005, 07:31:56 AM
Who is this King of Croatia?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Jane on May 26, 2005, 02:36:35 PM
Quote
Who is this King of Croatia?


King Tomislav II was the name taken by the 4th Duke of Aosta (of the junior line of the Italian royal house of Savoy).  Prince Aimone was married to Princess Irene of Greece in 1939.  

In 1941, as Tomislav II, he was proclaimed King of the independent state of Croatia, a Germanand Italian puppet state covering most of Croatia and Bosnia and Herzegovina. He never had any power or even set foot on the territory of the state, and subsequently abandoned the crown in 1943, after the Italian withdrawal from the war.

He died in 1948.

Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Alex_for_King on May 27, 2005, 01:15:34 AM
Thank you Jane, for that information.

The Croats have hardly anything to be proud of, regarding this so-called King of Croatia. The so-called state of Croatia was a Nazi puppet state and resulted in genocide of the Serbs, Jews, Roma, etc.

Neither this "King" who was a fascist and who never set soil to Croatia, nor that "Independent state of Croatia" should be even mentioned on Royalty forums.

Croatia had its Kings in the Middle Ages and that's it.

The only true Royals from what used to be Yugoslavia are the Karadjordjevic dynasty of Serbia and the Petrovic-Njegos of Montenegro.

Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Marc on May 27, 2005, 06:37:20 AM
''King Tomislav II of Croatia",Prince Aimone of Savoy,Duke of Aosta set soil on Dubrovnik,but when he realised that he is considered as a puppet,he went back to Italy and resigned the throne,but never resigned his claimes...
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: xX_Mashka_Xx on July 06, 2005, 09:15:11 PM
I've never heard of this Tomislav II. I'm Croatian, and sometimes, my dad would tell me about King Tomislav I and Queen Jelena.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Mandie, the Gothic Empress on July 31, 2005, 01:49:51 PM
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v477/MMPC/PrincessireneDuchessofAosta.jpg)
(from Point De Vue)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v477/MMPC/TheRoyalChildren1916.jpg)
(from CZ's book)

Princess Irene is the girl in the back.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Alicky1872 on July 31, 2005, 04:56:48 PM
Thank you for posting those pictures, Mandie. In the first one, she is the spitting image of Tino. I'd like to find out more about Irene, her personality and so forth. Maybe someone would be kind enough to share some information with us...
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Mandie, the Gothic Empress on August 01, 2005, 08:45:49 PM
All i can fine of Princess Irene is that she was born on 13 Feb 1904. She was the fifth child of Konstandtin and Sophie. She married the Duke of Aosta. and had one child a son. and she died on 15 Apr 1974.


Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: trentk80 on August 01, 2005, 11:13:32 PM
I read somewhere that in the Second World War she was sent to a Nazi concentration camp.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: grandduchessella on August 02, 2005, 09:25:38 AM
Yes she was. While Princess Mafalda of Hesse (nee Savoy) was the famous internee there were quite a few royals who were rounded up. Her husband, Philipp of Hesse had already been detained and action against Mafalda was thought to have been in retaliation for her father's recent abandonment of Mussolini and Italy's withdrawal from the Axis. This anger at Italian royals was probably the reason for the roundup of Princess Irene of Greece, Duchess of Aosta, and her SIL Anne of Orleans, Dowager Duchess of Aosta (sister of the late Comte de Paris) as well as their children. I'm not sure which camp they were at though. I know that CPss Antonia of Bavaria was at a separate camp from Mafalda so the royals were split up.

Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: gleb on September 12, 2005, 12:10:09 PM
Thanks for this photoes,
I never saw them before.

Does anybody know how she went to know Ajmone di Savoia?
As far as I know their marriage was not so happy and successful.
There are so few infos about her.

Is it true that her mother lived in Villa Sparta, near Firenze?
So did she spend her life in exile?

Thanks
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: isabel on September 12, 2005, 02:34:25 PM
Because my bad english i will try to write as better i can.

Princess Irene of Greece was know as Tittum or Tim in her family. She was very close to her sister Helena, and also to her brother Pablo. She was born in Athens the 13 of February of 1904. She was not speccialy beauty, but she was tall, slender, and had the elegance of the greec princesses of her generation.

Is it true that her mother lived in Fiesole, near Firenze, in Villa Sparta. This house was of her sister Helena, who bought it after her exile of Roumania.

In 1923, Irene was engaged (not officialy) with Nicholas of Roumania, brother of Irene´s brother in law, Carol, and brother of Irene´s sister in law, Elisabetha (Queen of Greece), but this engagement was not well acepted in the court of Roumania, so, it was broken (i have seen a few picks of this relation).

At the end of the twenties, a german cousin, Christian de Schaumburg-Lippe (one of the sons of Louise of Denmark), wanted to married Irene, but suddenly, in 1927, this engagement too was broken without a clear justification. At the age of 30 Irene continued single.

Because of the exile of the Greek Royal Family, she was in very good terms with the Italian Royal Family, and in Italy she meet the handsome Aimone de Saboya, cousin of the King of Italy, but the mother of Aimone didn´t like Irene because she was a niece of the Kaiser, finaly they married en 1939, Irene was 35.

They lived in Firenze in Villa de lla Cisterna.

Sorry i have to go now, i will continue later.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Prince_Christopher on September 12, 2005, 09:57:54 PM
That's interesting.  If Irene of Greece had married Nicholas of Romania, a triple marriage alliance would have been the result, as Irene's sister Helen married Carol II of Romania and her brother George II married Elizabeth of Romania.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: isabel on September 13, 2005, 01:23:28 AM
Elisabeth of Roumania was absolutly against this couple (Nicholas and Irene), she thought that a third alliance between Grece and Roumania was not a good choice for Roumania, " An other greek.- they will say"

Elisabeth´s marriage, was not happy, also Carol´s marriage with Helena of Greece was a marriage of convenience. Elisabeth had not a lot of affection for the Greek Royal Family. Anyway, the project breakdown
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: isabel on September 13, 2005, 05:20:57 AM
In 1941, Aimone was proposed to be King of Croatia, he would be crowned as Tomislav II. But Aimone was not at all interested in this new Throne, so the projet falled through.

About 1942, when germans occuped Italy, the Duke could escape to the allied area, but Irene was trapped in german territory, ....she was arrested, this same year, Amadeo, their only son was born.

Later, Irene and little Amadeo were sent first to Sartirana, near Pavía, and then to Hirschepg in Germany, during 10 months they lived precouriously.

In May 1945, they were finally liberated. Mother and son stayed in their home in Firenze, but in 1946, the fall of the italian Monarchie obliged them to scape to Seitzerland. During this period Aimone could scape to Argentina. He died there in january 1948.

Irene continued in Switzerland, alone and widow, with a little son. Later she could finally return to Italy, where the italian Republic returned to the Aosta´s Family all their propertys.

She established herself in Villa Domenico (Fiesole), near her sister Helena, who lived in Villa Sparta. She died there in april 1974. She is buried in Arezzo, in "Il Borro" one of the Aosta´s propertys
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Svetabel on September 13, 2005, 06:20:02 AM
Thanks for info,Isabel!
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Marlene on September 15, 2005, 01:00:41 PM
Quote from: isabel  She is buried in Arezzo, in "Il Borro" one of the Aosta´s propertys[/quote



The Duke of Aosta, for financial reasons, sold Il Borro more than a decade ago to Salvatore Ferragamo
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: TampaBay on September 15, 2005, 01:20:04 PM
Quote
The Duke of Aosta, for financial reasons, sold Il Borro more than a decade ago to Salvatore Ferragamo


The Fashion Designer Salvatore Ferragamo?

TampaBay
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: isabel on September 15, 2005, 02:09:38 PM
Marlene, I didn´t know the sale of "Il Borro" to S.F., and it´s very interesting. I supose that Irene stills there...
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: gleb on September 16, 2005, 01:54:22 PM
Quote
Marlene, I didn´t know the sale of "Il Borro" to S.F., and it´s very interesting. I supose that Irene stills there...


It's not right, some years ago S.A.R. il Duca Amdeo d'Aosta wanted his parents to be reburied in Turin, where all the other Savoia are buried (Aosta, Genova, the Kings of Sardinia....), in the BASILICA DI SUPERGA.

Gleb
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Marlene on September 19, 2005, 11:52:36 AM
Quote

The Fashion Designer Salvatore Ferragamo?

TampaBay



Yes, the shoe designer
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: QueenEna1887 on September 19, 2005, 03:35:33 PM
I read she became Queen of Croatia!!
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: isabel on September 20, 2005, 04:24:46 AM
No, in 1941 Aimone was proposed to be King of Croatia, but finally this proposal didn´t go on.

Anyway, either Aimone and Irene were interested in the Croatia´s crown.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Linnea on October 02, 2005, 10:26:24 AM
Quote
Yes she was. While Princess Mafalda of Hesse (nee Savoy) was the famous internee there were quite a few royals who were rounded up. Her husband, Philipp of Hesse had already been detained and action against Mafalda was thought to have been in retaliation for her father's recent abandonment of Mussolini and Italy's withdrawal from the Axis. This anger at Italian royals was probably the reason for the roundup of Princess Irene of Greece, Duchess of Aosta, and her SIL Anne of Orleans, Dowager Duchess of Aosta (sister of the late Comte de Paris) as well as their children. I'm not sure which camp they were at though. I know that CPss Antonia of Bavaria was at a separate camp from Mafalda so the royals were split up.


Also Maria of Savoy (the youngest daughter of Vittorio Emanuele III. of Italy) and her husband Louis of Bourbon-Parma were in a concentr. camp, Sachsenhausen. there were also Prince Albrecht with his family and his step-sisters Irmingard, Editha, Hilda, Gabrielle and Sophie, the daughters of Antonia of Luxembourg. Mafalda of Savoy died in Buchenwald.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on May 08, 2006, 11:48:34 AM
Quote
a couple more of their wedding--her dress is very 1930s  :)


(http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f282/vickyandfritz/greece/Picture3656irenewedw.jpg)

Who is the Lady at right between Aimone and Paul ? Is it Princess irene's sister, Helen ?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: grandduchessella on May 08, 2006, 05:14:44 PM
Yes, it is:

From left: George II, Prince George, Princess Irene, Prince Aimone, Helen of Romania, CP Paul of Greece.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on June 06, 2006, 05:23:07 AM
Yes indeed ! He was that and more. I think all the Greek Princesses were elegant and slim looking, that's why they  look good in 30's fashion. The only expection was Princess Margarita and Princess Cecilie who both put on weight after giving birth. Especially Margarita became quite stout in her late years.  ;)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eurohistory on July 02, 2006, 10:31:36 PM
Helen, Olga, Elisabeth, Marina, Cecilie and Sophie I always thought the cream of the crop...however none of these formerly beautiful girls aged well.  Maybe it was all the suffering they experienced what with wars, family tragedies, exile, etc...

Perhaps Olga and Marina were the two who preserved most of their looks as they aged, but by their fifties, these were but a faint memory.  Do not take this as a nasty comment, simply an appreciation based on hundreds of photos I have of each one of them going from birth to just before their death.

What has always struck me personally is the amount of tragedy these first cousins experienced in their lifetime...simply amazing!

Arturo Beéche
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 02, 2006, 11:04:00 PM
Yes...However I think even though their looks faded, they retained their sense of elegence which is quite unique among the royals in Europe. Irene and Sofie were not really looked beautiful compared to their more striking cousins (The Nicholas daughtets had the benefit of a Paris upbrining that suited them well in fashion and the arts), but they retained their elegant slim figures while others (Marshka and Kyra, Margarita Hohenlohe and Queen Juliana) didn't... ::)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eurohistory on July 04, 2006, 10:46:11 AM
I have not mentioned "sense of elegance" once in my reply...you insinuate I did.

You seem to equate "sense of elegance" with putting on weight, which is nt the same of course. Kira Prussia and Marie Leiningen possessed a different body structure, which was not certainly helped by giving birth to as many children as they did.  The same can be said of Margarita Hohenlohe.  Yet despite their putting on weight they remained quite "elegant," and I have the photos to prove it!

The fact that Olga, Elisabeth and Marina lived in Paris really did not matter that much and I will tell you why.  Olga hardly lived in Paris for example.  Read my republished memoir of Prince Nicholas and do some mathematics.  By the time her parents settled permanently in Paris, she was married off to Paul of Serbia (later Yugoslavia).

Elisabeth and Marina did live in Paris for a far longer time, certainly.  However, they lacked the funds to indulge in Parisian grand couture.  Their clothes were ordered from a lesser-known seamstress who was friends with their mother, who was herself a very elegant and distinguished woman, and who possessed a great sense of style, which she in turn passed on to her daughters.

As for the "arts" ...they did not get this from just living in Paris.  Certainly living in that beautiful city contributed to their appreciation of fine things.  But let us not forget who their father was!  Prince Nicholas was the most artistically inclined of the sons of King George I of the Hellenes, for not only did he paint beautifully, but he spent most of his time learning and appreciating art.  This passion he also shared with his son-in-law Paul, an erudite and artistically knowledgeable man, a leader in the arts in his own country.

All of this and more can be found inside the pages of MY FIFTY YEARS: The Memoirs of Prince Nicholas of Greece (Eurohistory, 2006).

Regards,

Arturo Beéche
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 04, 2006, 11:10:37 AM
Well...beauty is in the eyes of the beholder, but chic is not. Olga had been a long term client of Dior and dressed elegantly. As you said Elisabeth and Marina spent more time in Paris and saw how the rich dressed. Marina was famous for copying gowns and have them made for less. When she married George of Kent, the first designer she thought of was Jean Patou to make her wedding dress. George reminded her as a future British Princess, she should use a British designer. So Edward Molyneux, a Britsh designer living in Paris was awarded the job. All three sister remained well dressed and elegant until the last.

Helen and Irene were also elegant and well dressed. Their slim figures suited the fashion of that time to perfection. Like their cousins, they reminded fashionaly dressed till the last (and I got the photos to prove it too).

No My turn on elegance is more on the fashionable or the chic side. Kyra and especially Marshka were not slim looking even as young woman (unlike their mother Ducky, most likely inherited the bulky figure of Michen). They are elegant as royal women, but unlike their Greek cousins, you would not expect to see them in Vogue.

It is quite interesting that Margarita grew quite stout, while her younger sister Theodora was pencil thin.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eurohistory on July 04, 2006, 11:27:44 AM
So you believe stout people possess no chic or elegance?  Do you think that only slim people do?  For it seems to me you equate slenderness with elegance.

Margarita Hohenlohe was stout, yes, that is unarguably true...yet she remained quite elegant even though she possessed a lesser access to funds than her two other sisters.  Kira Prussia gained a considerable amount of weight in later life, yet she remained very elegant.  Her own mother did not retain her slim figure in her later years, yet retained her elegance.

Marie Leiningen is a far more difficult case to argue.  She died too soon after the war at a time when more importance was placed on survival than in fashion.

Arturo Beéche

Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 04, 2006, 11:59:32 AM
Well...As the late Duchess of Windsor put it. "Nobody can be too thin or too rich". As fashion is considered I think that sums it up as far as fashion is concerned.

I am not to say that people cannot be elegant in gesture, speech or movements. Grant you that the first thing Queen Victoria noticed about Prince William of Glucksborg (later King George I of Greece) was that he was a "slim and elegant boy". George I was to retain both his slim fit and elegance through out his life. It is also notice worthy that all his three sisters remained elegant and slim (maybe that was in the DNA, so that can be why most of the Greek Princesses retained their figures).

Another example was Queen Ena of Spain. She retained both his dress sense (she was on the best dressed list of royals)and figure despite constant child-bearing. She dis not have the prefect figure but managed to look striking even after she went into exile.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eurohistory on July 04, 2006, 01:16:48 PM
Yet your reply does not address the issue at hand...your thinking that because Kira, Marie and Margarita were stout, they were not elegant or chic...

Arturo Beéche
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 04, 2006, 09:03:24 PM
Yes I believe that it is hard to be BIG and CHIC at the same time, yet you can still be graceful and elegant. Yes I don't think Marska was EVER fashionable and graceful looking (like her cousin Mignon).
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: TampaBay on November 11, 2006, 10:57:54 AM
Yet your reply does not address the issue at hand...your thinking that because Kira, Marie and Margarita were stout, they were not elegant or chic...

Arturo Beéche

I think what we are talking about here is the indescribable quality of "IT".  Some people have "IT" and some people do not.  This "IT" quality has nothing to do with beauty.

Wallis Windsor had "IT" as did Marina and her sisters.  I do not think it can be explained any other way as to why some people capture the imagination and attention of the public (Diana & Alexandra & Missy) and some do not (Queen Mary).  Good looks help (Jackie Kennedy& Kate Moos)) but it is more than good looks (Wallis, Diana Verland, Rosie O'Donnell and Oprah).

TampaBay

Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Mandie, the Gothic Empress on November 11, 2006, 11:21:51 AM
Yes...However I think even though their looks faded, they retained their sense of elegence which is quite unique among the royals in Europe. Irene and Sofie were not really looked beautiful compared to their more striking cousins (The Nicholas daughtets had the benefit of a Paris upbrining that suited them well in fashion and the arts), but they retained their elegant slim figures while others (Marshka and Kyra, Margarita Hohenlohe and Queen Juliana) didn't... ::)

I don’t understand with you mean, Eric, are you saying fat girls aren’t pretty?  :-[ It was a same issue in a topic of Ella of what you said about Alix.
Maria and Kyra were pretty, but the sizes mean nothing to me. I don’t much about them (like their attitudes and what their charterics are) so I can’t judge them, same with Juliana of Holland, she wasn’t a size 3 of course, but I can’t judge her. 
Every girl has her loveliness like a diamond, even if they are plain looking or not as pretty as their sister or slim and elegant.
They have something about them, even if there is a woman that’s the sexy woman in the world; and she nasty as hell, then she ugly to me.
Queen Latifah is not a size 2, and she beautiful! Anastasia of Russia, she may not be as elegant as Tatiana or Angel-like Marie or like Olga the Russian rose. She pretty to me and even in some pictures, she looks lovelier then her sisters. :)  ;)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 12, 2006, 10:40:39 PM
Well...Everybody have their concepts of beauty. I am not arguing of what beauties is to you or to me. That is never a question. For example Jackie O was a deemed slim and beautiful. while Christina O was forever deemed fat and dowdy. I am sure that she was a beautiful woman to those that loved her. But to the fashionable world she wasn't.

Going back to Irene, there wasn't a lot on her later life. Wonder how it was with her during the sunset years.  ???
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on October 12, 2008, 05:32:29 AM
Princess Irene of Greece :

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/iri.jpg)

Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on October 27, 2008, 08:48:46 AM
Princess Irene of Greece :

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/gisc.jpg)

The two sisters Helen and Irene together :

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/hiiex.jpg)

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/iert.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on November 22, 2008, 08:08:47 AM
Princesses Helen and Irene of Greece (Photo from the Mary Evans Picture Library) :

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/irinaelena34.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on March 14, 2009, 09:36:50 AM
Young Princess Irene (early 1920s) :

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/sweetirene-1.jpg)

Same day with her brother Paul :

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/irenepaul-1.jpg)

Irene as a young woman :

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/i4.jpg)

Irene in the 1930s :

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/duchess.jpg)

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/irenedispoleto.jpg)

Her wedding with Aimone of Spolete in 1939 :

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/1939.jpg)

At the wedding of her son Amedeo :

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/ireneandson.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on March 14, 2009, 02:05:58 PM
Irene looked more like Queen Helen as she aged...Even the clothes they wore were similar.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Georges duke of Kent on October 25, 2009, 02:00:22 AM
Who can tell me how Irene's relation with Anne of France was? I heard that they struggle together during the War.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Mandie, the Gothic Empress on October 25, 2009, 11:05:46 AM
I think her husband's cousin.  Aimone's mother was a Princess of France.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: grandduchessella on October 25, 2009, 11:17:32 AM
They were sisters-in-law. Anne was married to Amedeo of Aosta while Irene was married to his younger brother Aimone. Both brothers succeeded their fathe as Duke of Aosta (Amedeo had only daughters so his brother succeeded to the title) and died within 6 years of each other (1942 and 1948 respectively).
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Mandie, the Gothic Empress on October 25, 2009, 04:13:04 PM
And also cousins!!! I was right, Aimone mother (Princess Helene of Orleans, later Duchess of Aosta; daughter of Louis Philippe, Count of Paris) 's and Anne's mother (Princess Isabelle of Orleans, later Duchess of Guise; daughter of  Louis Philippe, Count of Paris) were sisters. Making Irene and Anna also cousins.


and also Anne's sister Francoise of Orleans was married to Irene's uncle Chrisopter of Greece.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: grandduchessella on October 25, 2009, 04:35:14 PM
They were cousins only by marriage, the closer relationship was sisters-in-law. As you pointed out, it was Irene's husband who was the child of an Orleans princess, not Irene. Irene and Anne shared no close blood relation, only a marital one.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 26, 2009, 01:31:20 PM
Are they close friends ? Irene and Anne ?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on January 06, 2010, 11:19:45 AM
Lovely Irina :

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/lovelyirina-1.jpg)

Irene with Prince Christian of Schaumbourg-Lippe, one of her betrothed ?

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/christianschambourglippeirene.jpg)

Irene wearing pearls :

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/irene4ng1.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 06, 2010, 11:31:26 AM
Yes. They were betrothed for awhile. It was later broken off (like another betrothal with Nicholas of Romania).
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Georges duke of Kent on January 07, 2010, 11:03:41 PM
To all of you a gracefull thanks for your genealogical answer! Unfortunately I am lost and hav eto draw the family tree in order to put Anne and Irene at the right spot.

Regarding fatness and fashion, I had in mind 'Fat Mary' the late Queen Mary's mother. She is the one who put hudge emerald (almost uncut) into fashion in the western society....After her came: the Windsor, Queen Frederika of Grece, etc...

Ah! Being stout has some charm: 'I am a little teapot short and stout....' Remember this? Got to go the kettle is boiling!
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 08, 2010, 11:24:05 AM
You mean Anne of Orleans & her sister in law Irene of Greece right ?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Georges duke of Kent on January 10, 2010, 12:34:56 AM
Yes Mr. Lowe those two. The Greece family had spread so many interesting princes and princess to western societies that they should be name 'the 20th c.  royal family' such as 'the Bourbon of the 18th c. or the Saxe Cobourd of the 19th c. .

Have you read La dernière Bonaparte by Celia Bertin? It's the life of Marie Bonaparte and Georges.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 10, 2010, 06:07:19 PM
Yes I have read the English edition. Quite surprise by the level of honesty in that book.

Don't know too much about the relationship of Anne & Irene. They were sisters-in-law and appeared to get along with each other in public.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Georges duke of Kent on January 10, 2010, 08:45:24 PM
Does anyone agree thet Laurent or Lorenz d'Autriche-Este looks like Anne's husband? (sorry..jump from one subject to another - Du coq a l'âne...)

I think the book adressed itself to open minded amateur because Marie's passion for Freud needs to go through intimacy in order to be fully explain. Honesty is yes key word here.

Thanks again Mr. Lowe.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 10, 2010, 09:07:21 PM
Thanks for the information. We can discuss more on Marie Bonaparte's thread in the Greek Royal Family.

Do you know much about Irene's relationship with other members of the House of Savoy. It is quite strange that she married a Catholic.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Georges duke of Kent on January 10, 2010, 11:58:29 PM
Well my dear Mr. lowe, the problem came from Greece's autonomy itself as a country I guess, at the time of the wedding. Autonomy toward the neigbours, the close one and the devil one, il Duce and Hitler first. Giving a beautiful bride to the Royal family of Italy was a strategic issue in order to keep the safety of the country. I don't think the farewell to Tatoi was a big issue for the poor princess. But as we know, the link with the Savoy was not a real gift for her, did bring any luck unfortunately.  I guess from what we know, Irene was very much isolate in her thougts within that House of Savoy and within the facist circle of Helene de France. and regarding Anne, well cant say she was I think, as the daughter of duchess de Guise, a symbol of compassion for the 'people'. No with all my respect, I dont think Irène was happy with those French 'dry at heart' and maurassienne princess.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 11, 2010, 02:41:17 PM
Thanks for your insight into Irene's siutation within the Savoy family. No wonder she remained close to her sister Queen Mother Helen of Romania.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on January 12, 2010, 01:53:20 PM
About Irene, I also wonder why she decided so late to marry. Indeed, she married the Duke of Puglia to thirty five years ago, relatively advanced age for a princess of her time.

However, she seems to have had other opportunities as a youngster. Is it Irene was so traumatized by the failed marriages of her brother George and her sister Helen, she had

so long hesitated to marry as well ?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 12, 2010, 03:37:08 PM
I think she decided to get marry when she is ready to. Indeed, the unhappy marriages of George & Helen served as a warning.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on January 14, 2010, 12:27:35 PM
And what were the relationships of Irene with this other princess came by marriage into the royal family of Savoy, Marie Jose ?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Georges duke of Kent on January 14, 2010, 02:14:39 PM
Marie-Josée: smart, clever and verbal -She knew I think how to speak out things where Irene was a low profile figure. Let's put it this way: the intelect queen with a byzantine nun. The queen look at the princess with maybe compassion but do not share much with her. My humble opinion here cause I have no material proof of it. Regards
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on January 14, 2010, 02:49:26 PM
Thank you Count Guiramov for these interesting findings. Basically, the only true friend Irene had was perhaps her own sister Helen that she seemed to be virtually inseparable.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 14, 2010, 03:03:08 PM
Yes. Queen Marie of Romania called Irene Helen's "shadow". More than a grain of truth here. It is also true that Irene & Helen got along with the Italian Princesses (sisters of Umberto) famously.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: grandduchessella on January 15, 2010, 05:34:00 PM
It is also true that Irene & Helen got along with the Italian Princesses (sisters of Umberto) famously.

Not long ago, in Helen's thread, you wrote:

I agree. Alexandra of Greece had a less full face than the lady in the photo. I wonder how close was the Greek Princesses with the Italian Royal Family. Their closeness has not been investigated.

Has more come to light on how 'famously' they got along?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 16, 2010, 10:56:37 AM
After looking at more photos of Helen & Irene in other Italian Royal functions especially with the sisters of Umberto, who were also close with OEM (The Nicholas girls).
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: grandduchessella on January 16, 2010, 03:44:50 PM
So a body language kind of thing?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 16, 2010, 04:37:28 PM
Well...Common sense, would you hang around people you don't like ? Especially Helen & Irene who were very natural and not fakes. She would force herself to entertain a relationship that wasn't real. At the very least they are social friends.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: grandduchessella on January 16, 2010, 05:33:03 PM
Well, you hang around them if you're related to them. I'm sure we can find dozens of royal photos of people posing with those they didn't like or didn't know that well. Royals had their duties and their appearances to maintain. Also, you can hang around someone that you like well enough but that's not necessarily getting on 'famously' which implies a fairly high level of camaraderie. 'Social friends' is something much different.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eurohistory on January 16, 2010, 06:54:15 PM
It somehow always seems to me, perhaps I am not correctly understanding things, that Eric constantly implies as fact something the he infers.

We do not know many private aspects of the relationships of these people. We can assume (always a mistake) or infer...but we lack the knowledge to state as fact that which we have no proof of.

Because she lived in Florence for many years, Princess Irene of Greece was able to establish a friendship with members of the Italian Royal Family – this eventually led to her marrying the Duke of Spoleto, himself a first cousin of Françoise of France, second wife of Christopher of Greece, Irene's uncle. Furthermore, one of Irene's first cousins, Philipp of Hesse, was married to Mafalda of Savoy, which may have contributed to cementing the already existing relationship between Greek and Italian royals.

The Italian royals extended hospitality to their Greek colleagues...that we know. They interacted socially, that we know. Members of both dynasties married each other, that we know. That they got on "famously," is assumed, but we do not know.

Regards,

Arturo Beéche
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 16, 2010, 07:31:26 PM
Indeed. Arturo. Many of us do speculate (you included at times) about the royals. But I do agree that living in the country does help. I believe it was Queen Sophie who first lived in Florence. Irene was also engaged to Nicholas of Romania and a prince of Schamburg-Lippe, so her martial adventures seemed little to do with the location. She seemed the most comfortable with her sister Helen. I guess that must be one of the reasons for her engagement to Nicholas.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: grandduchessella on January 16, 2010, 11:59:33 PM
Ah, I had forgotten that the Greek royals went into exile in Florence as well as the Francoise of Orleans connection.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eurohistory on January 17, 2010, 01:26:44 AM
Indeed. Arturo. Many of us do speculate (you included at times) about the royals. But I do agree that living in the country does help. I believe it was Queen Sophie who first lived in Florence. Irene was also engaged to Nicholas of Romania and a prince of Schamburg-Lippe, so her martial adventures seemed little to do with the location. She seemed the most comfortable with her sister Helen. I guess that must be one of the reasons for her engagement to Nicholas.

Eric,  I do not speculate. What I write is what I know. I never, EVER, have assumed and written as spoken truth that which I know to be hearsay. You must be confusing me with someone else. I treat these historical figures at a distance, not as people I know or pretend to be "friendly" with.

Arturo Beéche
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eurohistory on January 17, 2010, 01:36:19 AM
Indeed. Arturo. Many of us do speculate (you included at times) about the royals. But I do agree that living in the country does help. I believe it was Queen Sophie who first lived in Florence. Irene was also engaged to Nicholas of Romania and a prince of Schamburg-Lippe, so her martial adventures seemed little to do with the location. She seemed the most comfortable with her sister Helen. I guess that must be one of the reasons for her engagement to Nicholas.

Irene of Greece was never engaged to Nicholas of Romania. Irene visited Romania frequently. I have in my possession photos of private trips she made to Bucharest, images that have never been published before. She visited Romania to see her sister and if by doing so she and Nicholas paired, so much the better. But it never happened. She was never engaged to Nicholas. The families hoped, bit the parties were not interested.

Christian of Schaumburg-Lippe (1898-1974), eldest son of Princess Louise of Denmark (1875-1906, herself a first cousin of Irene's father, proposed to Irene of Greece and was accepted. Announcements were made, articles were published in the European and American press, preparations began. However during the courtship differences arose and the engagement was broken off. It took Irene more than a decade to find herself officially engaged and preparing a wedding once again.

Arturo Beéche
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Georges duke of Kent on January 17, 2010, 03:20:34 AM
Gentleman please recollect yourself:

Nobody is on this wonderfull forum to revealed sensational news about the Gotha.  :-X and when one tells something, one gives an appreciation it should be wrap with humility, the best virtue for a writer, the most important one for a forumist. 

As Ghislaine de Polignac use to say gracefully: Where is your sens of Grandeur?
Let's face it:
Nobody is perfect;
The War minister is dead, the war is over;
Live and let live;
Tomorrow is another day.

I can understand how much there is temptation to brag about being in contact with celebrities. It's human to be proud sometimes. It's also human to fall into speculation make-beleive or wishfull thinking. You are certainly both human being ( ::)) and talented men. Writers on Royalty and nobility matters have a special ego. But they are important. They rise stories with science and yes, hearsay sometimes... I have in mind Évelyne Lever, Pierre de Nolhac, Jacques Banville, Peter Williams, Stefan Zweig, Eric Lowe, Arturo Beeche, etc...

Now, shake hands and get on with another subject! Poor Irene de Grèce! Les cheveux doivent lui dresser sur la tiare! She does'nt deserve to 'hear' that for God sake..

With all my respect to you both, Best regards, Cte Guiramov
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eurohistory on January 17, 2010, 12:12:23 PM
Ah, I had forgotten that the Greek royals went into exile in Florence as well as the Francoise of Orleans connection.

Yes Courtney it is an interesting connection. Two of the daughters of the Count of Paris (Amelie and Hélène) were married to grandsons of Vittorio Emanuele II, King Carlos I of Portugal and the Duke of Aosta respectively.

The Greek royals settled in Florence, where they kept close contact with the Aostas. Hélène Aosta played an important role as matchmaker for her her niece Françoise of France and Christopher of Greece. Françoise, as you recall, was the daughter of Isabelle d'Orléans (sister of Amelie and Hélène), who had married her first cousin the Duke de Guise. Interestingly, Isabelle had hoped to marry Albert of Belgium, but his uncle Leopold II did not grant permission for the engagement as he feared it would complicate his kingdom's relations with Republican France. This same Albert went on to marry Duchess Elisabeth in Bavaria and they became the parents of Marie José, the May Queen, consort of Umberto II of Italy, whose sister Mafalda married Prince Philipp of Hesse, a first cousin of Princess Irene of Greece.

Matrilineal connections are an amazing jigsaw puzzle to which more attention ought to be paid.

Arturo Beéche
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 17, 2010, 06:44:09 PM
Irene's choice of husbands appear to be her own decision. Her other sisters married into Orthodox & Anglican Churches in Romania & England. It would be interesting to know if her conversion was as tramuatic as Ena (Queen Victoria of Spain)'s or as easy as Baby Bee (Infanta Beatrice of Borbon-Orleans)'s. Don't forget even Helene herself toyed with the idea of marrying Eddy (Prince Albert Victor of Wales) despite her being a devout Catholic.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on February 05, 2010, 05:09:26 AM
Irene in the early 1930s :

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/irinadgr.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on March 21, 2010, 12:14:11 PM

Irene with Prince Christian of Schaumbourg-Lippe, one of her betrothed ?

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/christianschambourglippeirene.jpg)


Another version of the engagement picture with Christian of Schaumburg-Lippe :

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/irenegrecechristianschlippe.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Carolath Habsburg on March 21, 2010, 12:35:05 PM
A gorgeous picture of Irene in costume (?)

(http://i44.tinypic.com/o9pogy.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on March 21, 2010, 03:09:14 PM
I wonder about the failed engagement between the Prince of Schaumburg-Lippe.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on July 04, 2010, 11:16:14 AM
Irene young woman :

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/lovelyirina-2.jpg)

Irene posing with a dog can be one of those of her sister helen :

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i221/pastroyals/Greeck%20royalty/isd.jpg)

Notice the fleur de lys brooch she wears on her left shoulder and she sometimes shared with her older sister.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on September 28, 2010, 03:07:58 PM
Smiling Irene :

(http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/448004pssirene.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=448004pssirene.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on October 03, 2010, 07:39:26 AM
Irene seemed a temperament more spontaneous and outgoing than her sister Helen. True ?

Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 03, 2010, 02:21:03 PM
That is true, although both sisters endured much hardship in their married lives.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on October 06, 2010, 01:39:42 PM
That is true, although both sisters endured much hardship in their married lives.


Indeed, neither of them lived very long with their husbands, although in different circumstances.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on October 19, 2010, 09:31:07 AM
Irene in the Twenties :

(http://img7.hostingpics.net/pics/174156irena.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=174156irena.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on October 25, 2010, 12:15:26 PM
Which of her brothers, Irene Was closest, George or Paul ? Thanks.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 25, 2010, 02:03:21 PM
I think George (she was seen more with him), but they were a devoted family.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Carolath Habsburg on October 29, 2010, 10:05:57 AM
Irene with sister Helena and Carol II. 1925

(http://img834.imageshack.us/img834/8868/tjhusdrt57y4678.jpg) (http://img834.imageshack.us/i/tjhusdrt57y4678.jpg/)

 
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 29, 2010, 10:09:32 AM
Thanks ! Look like London to me.  ;) Carol looked really smart with hat, cane and a cigarette at hand.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on October 29, 2010, 01:50:32 PM
Irene and Helen :

(http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/341/helenirene.jpg) (http://img687.imageshack.us/i/helenirene.jpg/)


Irene with her sister Helen and her mother Sophie :

(http://img704.imageshack.us/img704/178/irenelensop1918.jpg) (http://img704.imageshack.us/i/irenelensop1918.jpg/)


Photos already posted by me in " Queen Elena of Romania "'s topic.

Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 29, 2010, 01:53:01 PM
They were very devoted sisters.  ;)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on October 29, 2010, 01:57:31 PM
They were very devoted sisters.  ;)

Irene and Katherine are less often seen together. They obviously loved each other like two sisters but one gets the impression that Irene was much less close to her.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 29, 2010, 02:20:32 PM
Missy called Irene "Helen's Shadow". They were as close as Alix & Dagmar was in the previous generation.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Naslednik Norvezhskiy on October 29, 2010, 08:30:27 PM
This kind of information is not found in English books.

Royalty is a rather snobbish hobby or interest if it doesn't inspire you to learn the language(s) of your favourite RF(s) and their subjects, or at least the major languages of royalty: French, English and German.

Really, Eric, your idiosyncracies would have been a lot more entertaining if you instead of being some pussycat sucking up to the British lion, had rather been some crazy non-Anglophone royalty expert at odds with the Anglophone royalty watcher establishment! Indeed if you'd been a Teutonic Ebenbürtigkeit-obsessed Erich foaming against morganauts and their fans I would have loved you! :-)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on November 05, 2010, 05:20:33 PM
Two pictures of Irene :

(http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/553532pssirene.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=553532pssirene.jpg)

(http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/799922irenee.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=799922irenee.jpg)

I appreciate more and more this Princess when I find new pictures and info on her...

Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on November 14, 2010, 09:15:47 AM
Irene with her sister Helen, 1931 :

(http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/657835irenehelene1931jpg.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=657835irenehelene1931jpg.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 15, 2010, 11:20:19 AM
Quite a blurry image. The lady in the left could also be idenitify as Mafelda as she had that kind of smile too.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on November 15, 2010, 02:33:50 PM
Quite a blurry image. The lady in the left could also be idenitify as Mafelda as she had that kind of smile too.

The photo is captioned as " Princess Helen of Romania, on the right,the wife of King Carol, and her sister Princess Irene of Greece trevelled on Saturday from London to Scotland in Third Class Which they found "quite comfortable."
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on November 27, 2010, 10:03:26 AM
Irene was the greatest of all Greek Princesses. She formed a well matched couple with Aimone, who was also very tall. But what was her exact height ?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 27, 2010, 10:16:55 AM
It is sad that so little was known about her in letters and private life and tastes... :(
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on January 09, 2011, 06:28:21 AM
They also sometimes dressed in the same manner as shown in this picture where they both carry the same clothes :

(http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/501528idem.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=501528idem.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 09, 2011, 01:47:27 PM
Helen was a bit more attractive.  ;)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on January 14, 2011, 02:28:18 PM
Irene with her father Constantin and her sister Helen :

(http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/4229109.png) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=4229109.png)

Irene and Helen :

(http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/4784068.png) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=4784068.png)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Carolath Habsburg on January 16, 2011, 09:05:17 AM
Irene and Helene

(http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9777/89378849.jpg) (http://img707.imageshack.us/i/89378849.jpg/)

 
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 16, 2011, 12:44:31 PM
I think taken during their family's exile in St. Moritz.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on January 23, 2011, 11:01:13 AM
Again Irene and her sister Helen :

(http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/299867irenehelen.png) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=299867irenehelen.png)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on March 09, 2011, 01:51:47 PM
Young woman :

(http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/681938lovelyirene.png) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=681938lovelyirene.png)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on March 24, 2011, 02:42:00 PM
I think it's Irene, but it's possible this is Helen so great is the resemblance between the two sisters on this photo of Julietta in 1928 :

(http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/142061irene8.png) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=142061irene8.png)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on April 05, 2011, 01:24:29 PM
Irene little girl, four or five years old :

(http://img10.hostingpics.net/pics/586959pssirene.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=586959pssirene.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on June 15, 2011, 03:03:44 PM
The Greek family was very close to each other. When Prince Philip married Princess Elizabeth of York. Princess Marina, Duchess of Kent later travelled to Germany to tell his sisters about the details. Princess Elisabeth of Greece, Countess Toerring was later invited by Queen Mary to her birthday some years after the war.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on June 23, 2011, 12:23:28 PM
Irene in 1936 :

(http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/225957pssirene1936.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=225957pssirene1936.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on June 23, 2011, 12:30:54 PM
She looked very elegant here with hat and sensible shoes. Wonder about the location...
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on June 23, 2011, 12:41:03 PM
She looked very elegant here with hat and sensible shoes. Wonder about the location...

Photo taken at the villa of Alice Keppel, the " ombrellino" in Tuscany.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on June 23, 2011, 12:45:21 PM
What was she doing at Alice Keppel's villa ? Were they friends or just invited for an event ?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on June 23, 2011, 01:17:56 PM
The Greek royal family was a regular guest at the villa in Tuscany with Alice Keppel. Especially after 1930, when Helen moved to Villa Sparta in Italy. The two homes both located near Florence, were probably similar.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on June 23, 2011, 01:48:19 PM
Very interesting since Queen Sophie never lived in Villa Sparta (Helen bought it with money from the sale of her seaside villa in Romania). I often wondered where she lived in Florence....
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on June 23, 2011, 01:51:34 PM
Very interesting since Queen Sophie never lived in Villa Sparta (Helen bought it with money from the sale of her seaside villa in Romania). I often wondered where she lived in Florence....

Carol is not who sold the house to Helen in Romania ?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on June 23, 2011, 01:57:48 PM
Carol II sold the seaside villa that belonged to Helen to deprive her of a base in Romania. It was given to Helen by Missy. Queen Sophie told Helen how much she liked the place, but it was a bit expensive. When the money came through, Helen bought the villa. It became the base for the exiled Greek Royal Family and later the Romanian Royal Family after they were exiled.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on June 23, 2011, 02:09:16 PM
I suppose in Florence Irene lived with her sister until her marriage to the Duke of Spoleto.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on June 25, 2011, 07:28:46 AM
Paul and Irene with a group of friends in 1932 :

(http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/866968paulirenegroup1932.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=866968paulirenegroup1932.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on June 25, 2011, 11:43:25 AM
The man on Irene's right seem to be a Prince of Hesse (maybe husband of Princess Mafelda). Yes Princess Irene spent a great deal of time with her sister Helen.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on July 19, 2011, 11:00:16 AM
Princess of Greece :

(http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/12131881ig.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=12131881ig.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on October 19, 2011, 02:43:10 PM
Lovely Princess Irene in 1936 :

(http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/54057578ir.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=54057578ir.jpg)

Courtesy Mary Evans.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: ashdean on October 19, 2011, 03:29:53 PM
Lovely Princess Irene in 1936 :

(http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/54057578ir.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=54057578ir.jpg)

Courtesy Mary Evans.
This picture shows how beautiful the tiara Irene inherited from her mother and had originally come from her grandmother the Empress Frederick was.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 19, 2011, 03:53:34 PM
Thanks again to KarlandZita for posting this nice photo of Irene wearing the tiara that was given to her by her mother Queen Sophie. I don't know if it was a wedding present or she inherited after the death of the Empress Friedrich. In the letters, the Empress wrote that she had no more jewel to give Sophie and she will have to wait for her death to inherit more (The Empress Frederick Writes To Sophie). This photo is good that it showed the base of the tiara as well. In my humble knowledge, I have not seen the Empress wore it in a photo. Even Queen Sophie did not wore this more often in photos (preferring the big tiara or the diamond circle tiara) to this piece.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eddie_uk on October 20, 2011, 01:10:44 PM

This picture shows how beautiful the tiara Irene inherited from her mother and had originally come from her grandmother the Empress Frederick was.

Thanks ashdean, is it still owned by the family do you know?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Carolath Habsburg on October 20, 2011, 01:17:57 PM
For what i know , her son Amedeo auctioned it on Sothebys in 1979 ;)

Here a close up of the tiara (courtesy of Claudia of H&V)

(http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/4091/vickyprussiatiara.jpg)

And Irene, wearing it in her wedding (again, courtesy of claudia)

(http://img190.imageshack.us/img190/9601/img626v.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 20, 2011, 02:57:06 PM
Thanks for sharing the photo. I think Queen Sophie did not part with the tiara until Irene got married. She was seen wearing the tiara in a photo with her grandson Prince Michael of Greece. Also Irene wore a choker (that belonged to her mother) as a bandeau at the coronation of King Ferdinand & Queen Marie of Romania. I thought the bandeau she wore a bit strange until I looked at a choker that Queen Sophie wore in a photograph. I think Irene might have inherited the choker since it was not seen in the Greek Royal Family anymore.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: ashdean on October 21, 2011, 12:38:01 PM
Thanks for sharing the photo. I think Queen Sophie did not part with the tiara until Irene got married. She was seen wearing the tiara in a photo with her grandson Prince Michael of Greece.
I think  Sophie parted with the tiara (AND much else) long before Irenes wedding.....Sophie died in January 1932 and Irene did not marry till July 1939....so 7 1/2  years....unless Sophie was buried with it and her body was exhumed to remove the gem ....do tell us Eric...have you insider information????
Also I think you mean Prince Michael of ROMANIA.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eddie_uk on October 21, 2011, 12:39:36 PM
 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: ashdean on October 21, 2011, 12:41:56 PM
Also Irene wore a choker (that belonged to her mother) as a bandeau at the coronation of King Ferdinand & Queen Marie of Romania. I thought the bandeau she wore a bit strange until I looked at a choker that Queen Sophie wore in a photograph. I think Irene might have inherited the choker since it was not seen in the Greek Royal Family anymore.
As I have never seen pictures of Irene wearing the choker (either as a choker or shortened into bracelet form) till I see evidence I  would not dream of speculating that  Irene inherited the jewel.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Carolath Habsburg on October 21, 2011, 01:35:11 PM
Here s an image of Irene at King Ferdinand´s coronation

Helen and Carol during coronation, 1922 :

(http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/624948coronation1922.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=624948coronation1922.jpg)

I cant figure out which choker  might be. This one?

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3280/2337257452_c39c71a5eb_o.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 21, 2011, 03:20:33 PM
Yes. You spotted the same things I saw ! :) I think Sophie had quite a few chokers she worn in photos (including the diamond & pearl one she wore with her long lacy dress and long satoir of pearls), don't know what happen to them as they did not reappear in her children's collection. I think they might be sold.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: ashdean on October 22, 2011, 03:35:40 PM
Yes. You spotted the same things I saw ! :) I think Sophie had quite a few chokers she worn in photos (including the diamond & pearl one she wore with her long lacy dress and long satoir of pearls), don't know what happen to them as they did not reappear in her children's collection. I think they might be sold.
Two days before this post you said you thought Irene had inherited her mothers dogcollar....know you say you think they might have been sold!!!.....rather an about turn!...would not it be better not to say anything and save 2 posts!
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 22, 2011, 06:12:23 PM
Ashdean. Don't get excited. Queen Sophie had more than one dog collar. I am sure you remember the hexagon one she wore in a photo with her small circle tiara and the diamond pearl one with her big tiara. both those dog collars were not seen again in her children. It would be safe to assume they were sold as Queen Sophie was far from rich during her exile.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: ashdean on October 23, 2011, 03:01:11 AM
Eric...don't flatter yourself....excitment is an emotion I never experience when I see you innane,unsubstantiated and unthoughtout postings....and I know from dozens of contacts on this board I am not alone! ;)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 23, 2011, 10:29:44 AM
Save for judgment for others. Lets stick to the facts. Thank you.  ;)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eddie_uk on October 23, 2011, 10:55:29 AM
Facts?? I don't call posting that Sophie parted with the tiara following Irene's wedding when Sophie had in fact been dead for 7 and half years a fact. Ashdean always posts facts, pity you don't.  ;) ;)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 23, 2011, 02:43:01 PM
We were talking about the jewelled chokers or dog collars not the tiara !  ::)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: ashdean on October 23, 2011, 04:14:20 PM
We were talking about the jewelled chokers or dog collars not the tiara !  ::)
NO because you AS USUAL blithely glossed over yr factual errors....YOU DID say that..it is there in black and white!
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 23, 2011, 09:49:44 PM
No I did not. The tiara was auctioned in 1979 according to Carolath Hapsburg. What I am talking about was the choker that Irene wore as a bandeau in Queen Marie of Romania's coronation. That was the one who could have been sold period. Anyway I don't see you adding any new insight to that particular jewel.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eddie_uk on October 24, 2011, 02:33:10 AM
I think Queen Sophie did not part with the tiara until Irene got married. She was seen wearing the tiara in a photo with her grandson Prince Michael of Greece.

 So you see?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: ashdean on October 24, 2011, 04:03:44 AM
No I did not. The tiara was auctioned in 1979 according to Carolath Hapsburg. What I am talking about was the choker that Irene wore as a bandeau in Queen Marie of Romania's coronation. That was the one who could have been sold period. Anyway I don't see you adding any new insight to that particular jewel.
I could add all sorts of insights to the gems (I could even yell you what the tiara made at auctionas I have a catalogue )but I certainly wont because of YOU....and if you look at post 150 on this thread  you will see it was I who put you right about the tiara and Carolath who verified the fact....
Anyway Im wasting my precious time and the forums precious space arguing with a deluded meglomaniac who is a TOTAL  WASTE of TIME and SPACE!
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Robert_Hall on October 24, 2011, 04:17:35 AM
Ashdean, I have a great many books and catalogues about royal jewelry but no where near your knowledge,   Yet, certainly more than some here.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: ashdean on October 24, 2011, 04:38:58 AM
Ashdean, I have a great many books and catalogues about royal jewelry but no where near your knowledge,   Yet, certainly more than some here.
Thankyou Robert but  my knowledge is not that vast.I always admire yr sensible and factual posts.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 24, 2011, 01:36:32 PM
So why don't you. You do know something but apparently not everything. You have not contribute anything new on the subject of  Queen Sophie's dog collars. One of which was worn by her daughter Princess Irene. That is all I am saying.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eddie_uk on October 24, 2011, 01:44:15 PM
That's not all your saying, your bleating out a load of nonsense and ruining an interesting discussion. Ashdean knows what he is talking about. Enough said.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 24, 2011, 03:04:26 PM
More personal attacks. Can you make more sense in discussing issues that attacking people. The real losers are the ones who wanted to learn something or just to engaging in a rational discussion.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: ashdean on October 24, 2011, 03:10:56 PM
More personal attacks. Can you make more sense in discussing issues that attacking people. The real losers are the ones who wanted to learn something or just to engaging in a rational discussion.
The real losers are the ones that think 90 % of yr postings are based on fact....and what would you know about being rational...you cannot admit you are ever wrong!
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on December 03, 2011, 07:19:18 AM
Princess Irene with her brother Paul and sister Katherine in London :

(http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/758173paulireneinlondon.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=758173paulireneinlondon.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on May 19, 2012, 07:37:06 AM
Princess Irene, visiting Paris with her sister Helen, before her marriage to the Duke of Spoleto in 1939 :

(http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/401347ireneheleninparis1939.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=401347ireneheleninparis1939.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on May 19, 2012, 12:46:39 PM
What were they doing in Paris ?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on June 02, 2012, 06:09:59 AM
What were they doing in Paris ?

Probably with a view to prepare the trousseau of Irene in anticipation of her marriage to the Duke of Spoleto. Their cousin Marina had done before them in 1934 for her marriage to the Duke of Kent.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on June 02, 2012, 07:30:36 PM
Maybe. The difference is that Marina lived in Paris for a time and knew many designers and modeled a bit. Irene & Elena didn't. I agree Paris was the place to buy a trousseau, The Andrew girls also did their shopping in Paris. They also did studio wedding portraits there too.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on June 10, 2012, 10:42:04 AM
Irene again  in 1939 :

(http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/861278irenefa1939.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=861278irenefa1939.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on July 21, 2012, 05:49:06 AM
Irene in 1934, came to attend the wedding of her cousin Marina :

(http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/198187irene.png) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=198187irene.png)

Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 22, 2012, 09:01:04 AM
It is the age of the fox stole. Very interesting now to see a whole dead animal of a human now...
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on August 04, 2012, 05:22:31 AM
Irene in the Twenties :

(http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/786850yireni.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=786850yireni.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on September 01, 2012, 07:45:08 AM
Irene attending the wedding of her brother Paul in 1938, a year before her own wedding :

(http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/845077201202041449203.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=845077201202041449203.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on September 01, 2012, 11:18:13 AM
I wonder who was the young woman behind Helen ?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on September 05, 2012, 01:27:13 PM
I wonder who was the young woman behind Helen ?

You mean behind Irene ? No idea ...
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on October 13, 2012, 07:16:13 AM
Irene between her sisters Helen and Catherine :

(http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/502866threesisters1934.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=502866threesisters1934.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Carolath Habsburg on October 24, 2012, 10:49:08 AM
I wonder who was the young woman behind Helen ?

Pss Herzeleid von Preussen, Oskar´s daughter

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3208/3014790017_6256492c64_b.jpg
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on December 15, 2012, 07:13:52 AM
Irene posing in late 20s or early 30s :

(http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/456325irenii.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=456325irenii.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Mandie, the Gothic Empress on January 04, 2013, 02:24:59 PM
I wonder since I never read or heard if Princess Irene was named after her aunt-by marriage Irene of Hesse, since Royals name their children after relations or after the Saint Irene? like her cousin Marina was named after the popular Greek Saint Marina.

also and a bit off topic, the little Princess Elisabeth of Hesse, she died in 1903, and her mother was close friends (also first cousin and later sister-in-law) with Elena Vladimirovna, was Elisabeth of Greece was named after the late little Hessian Princess?

Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 04, 2013, 11:56:25 PM
Irene is named after Saint Irene of the Greek Church and not Irene of Hesse. The name Irene means "peace" in Greek. A good name for a Greek Princess.

There are also 2 Elisabeths in the Romanov family. Ella & Marva. Prince Nicholas of Greece was a good friend of Ella too.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Mandie, the Gothic Empress on January 05, 2013, 11:44:40 AM
I know the name means Peace, Eric. i was only wondering if she was either named after her aunt or the saint. as for the Elisabeths, yes i am aware, however since the little Hessian Princess died months before the Greek Princess was born, its a possibility or the Prince and Princess Nicholas just like the name (and that it was popular name in the Russian/Greek Orthodox Church) and named her like how they named their youngest daughter Princess Marina, after Saints.

thanks.


anyways back to topic, sorry for the little side track.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: eejm on January 05, 2013, 04:46:13 PM
I wonder since I never read or heard if Princess Irene was named after her aunt-by marriage Irene of Hesse, since Royals name their children after relations or after the Saint Irene? like her cousin Marina was named after the popular Greek Saint Marina.

also and a bit off topic, the little Princess Elisabeth of Hesse, she died in 1903, and her mother was close friends (also first cousin and later sister-in-law) with Elena Vladimirovna, was Elisabeth of Greece was named after the late little Hessian Princess?



I believe the fact that the second Irene of Greece was born during WWII and her family's exile in South Africa helped determine her name.  As Eric mentions, the name does mean "peace," and Irene of Hesse (born during the Austro-Prussian War) was given her name because of this.  The same can be said for Irene of the Netherlands, who was born at the beginning of WWII. 

To my knowledge, the first Irene of Greece wasn't born around or during any wars in which Greece was involved, so that may not have influenced her name.  Was Irene of Hesse one of the younger Irene's godparents?  She was a cousin and sister-in-law to Sophie. 
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 05, 2013, 09:57:06 PM
Might be. But it was chosen because it was Greek like Helen, Theodora or Sophie.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: grandduchessella on January 05, 2013, 10:09:44 PM
Sophia is Greek (wisdom). Wouldn't Sophie be for Queen Sophie?

Katherine is also a Greek name (pure). Margarita probably came from margarites (Greek for pearl). So it seems that they did try to pick Greek names, some of which also had family connections in other variations.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Mandie, the Gothic Empress on January 06, 2013, 12:17:06 AM
I read that Princess Alice didn't name her youngest daughter after the Queen Sophia. Alice picked Sophia since it is in every European language and secondly a good Greek name.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: grandduchessella on January 06, 2013, 11:50:32 AM
Yes, if the name was Sophia or Sofia, it would be the Greek version. My remark was made to the effect that if any of the princesses were named Sophie instead, it would seem to indicate being named after the Queen.

When I went and looked, it seems that the later Greek princesses (Alice's daughter and King Paul's daughter) were named Sofia/Sophia according to the Online Gotha.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 06, 2013, 01:35:56 PM
Yes. More like Sophia (sister of Prince Philip) & Sophia (Queen of Spain). Both named after the Greek name for wisdom.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: trentk80 on January 07, 2013, 03:37:34 PM
Yes, if the name was Sophia or Sofia, it would be the Greek version. My remark was made to the effect that if any of the princesses were named Sophie instead, it would seem to indicate being named after the Queen.

When I went and looked, it seems that the later Greek princesses (Alice's daughter and King Paul's daughter) were named Sofia/Sophia according to the Online Gotha.

King Paul's daughter, Queen Sofia of Spain, was named after her grandmother, Queen Sophie of Greece. The queen said this during an interview several years ago.

In any case, Queen Sophie was known in Greece as Sofia/Sophia, the Greek version of her name, not Sophie.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 07, 2013, 05:24:49 PM
Yes. But not Princess Alice's daughter Sophia. I don't think Princess Andrew or Queen Sophie was ever close, although the cousins were.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: eejm on January 10, 2013, 02:32:54 PM
Yes, if the name was Sophia or Sofia, it would be the Greek version. My remark was made to the effect that if any of the princesses were named Sophie instead, it would seem to indicate being named after the Queen.

When I went and looked, it seems that the later Greek princesses (Alice's daughter and King Paul's daughter) were named Sofia/Sophia according to the Online Gotha.

King Paul's daughter, Queen Sofia of Spain, was named after her grandmother, Queen Sophie of Greece. The queen said this during an interview several years ago.

In any case, Queen Sophie was known in Greece as Sofia/Sophia, the Greek version of her name, not Sophie.

Queen Sofia of Spain was known among her family as Sophie, and was also referred to as Sophie in in press reports before her marriage.  I don't believe she was ever officially known as Sophie in Greece.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 10, 2013, 03:41:35 PM
I think in Greek it was Sophia. I think Sophie is French ?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: grandduchessella on January 10, 2013, 09:47:15 PM
I think we've diverted the topic from Irene onto the various Sophie/Sophias long enough. Time to move on--8 or 9 posts is enough. If there's enough interest, a thread on names can be started.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 10, 2013, 10:49:23 PM
Yes. Even Irene's name has a variation. Grand Duchess Xenia's daughter was called Irina. I think a form of Irene.

Too bad that unlike Helen who kept a diary that was used in books on her and her son King Michael, Irene did not seem to keep a diary. Not an easy person to research.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Carolath Habsburg on January 18, 2013, 12:28:47 PM
Irene. Credits on the image

(http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/360/fsngilardi33380pr.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/26/fsngilardi33380pr.jpg/)
 
 
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on January 19, 2013, 08:01:08 AM
Irene's glamorous portrait doubtless taken in the 20s. As her older sister, had Irene a nickname in her family ?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: grandduchessella on January 19, 2013, 09:30:08 AM
Wasn't it Tim?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 19, 2013, 10:27:36 AM
Yes. It was Tim.  ;)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on January 24, 2013, 05:24:44 AM
Thank you for the answer.

Well, It is a very male nickname ... So nicknamed her one because she looked like strongly her father and because she seemed less feminine than her older sister?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 24, 2013, 08:57:28 AM
Not sure. Helen was called "Sitta" because of her brother's attempt to call her "sister". Tim may have another story to go with it. Like why is Victoria Melita called "Ducky" ? I am sure it is not that she looked like a duck.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: grandduchessella on January 24, 2013, 09:42:04 AM
Victoria Melita's mother Marie was called either Duck or The Duck within her Russian family--perhaps that had some correlation?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on January 24, 2013, 12:00:50 PM
Not sure. Although I read "Ducky" was a common nickname in English society either male or female. Missy was more feminine. So Tim might be a form of little Timmy or Tommy. It is so secret that Queen Sophie was very "English" in her tastes.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Svetabel on February 06, 2013, 02:44:56 AM
Please post here info and images on Princess Irene only of 1904-1939 period (before her marriage). For 1939-1974 years there's a topic in the Italian subforum:

http://forum.alexanderpalace.org/index.php?topic=3678.0 (http://forum.alexanderpalace.org/index.php?topic=3678.0)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on February 06, 2013, 09:16:29 AM
Not too info on her before her marriage. She was happy to live under her sister's shadow.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on February 09, 2013, 05:53:22 AM
Not too info on her before her marriage. She was happy to live under her sister's shadow.

Few information over this period of her life indeed, to part those concerning her hypothetical engagement or her breaks of engagement with diverse princes as Nicolas of Rumania or Christian of Schaumbourg-Lippe. Irene was even considered weather by the journalists of time as a bride possible for the Prince of Wales, later Edward WIII then always single.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on February 09, 2013, 05:55:58 PM
Indeed. Irene did not appeared to be overly concerned about getting married unlike her more eager sisters Helen & Catherine.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on February 11, 2013, 12:17:19 PM
Paradoxically, while staying in the shadow of her older sister, Irene who rarely left her and often accompanied her in her trips, was known so wel by journalists and was under the light of their objectives. If she had been less close to Helen, there would doubtless be no more photos of her before her marriage.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on February 11, 2013, 02:09:18 PM
Indeed, but her younger sister Katherine who wasn't close to her elder sisters did got plenty of photos before her marriage.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on February 23, 2013, 07:17:20 AM
Princess Irene with her elder sister Helen :

(http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/921282eu013696.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=921282eu013696.jpg)

(http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/247726eu013769.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=247726eu013769.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on February 23, 2013, 01:10:27 PM
Irene was Helen's shadow. I wonder about Irene's personality. Helen did not talk much about her sisters in her autobiography with Arthur Gould Lee.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on March 09, 2013, 07:48:23 AM
Irene and her sister Helen during a journey in London in 1931 :

(http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/1715451359905909.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=1715451359905909.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on September 28, 2013, 08:40:51 AM
Irene and Olga of Yugoslavia attending the marriage of their cousin Cecile of Greece on February 02nd, 1931 :

(http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/216338olgairenebis.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=216338olgairenebis.jpg)

(http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/294954olgairene.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=294954olgairene.jpg)

(http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/773686olgairene1.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=773686olgairene1.jpg)

Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on September 30, 2013, 05:52:22 PM
Nice. I wonder how many Greek Princesses attended that wedding
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on October 06, 2013, 10:42:12 AM
Nice. I wonder how many Greek Princesses attended that wedding

All her sisters and most of her cousins, Eugénie including.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on October 06, 2013, 07:50:57 PM
I wonder if there is a big photo of the bridal pair and the guests...All the Greek Princesses ?
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on April 05, 2014, 10:39:36 AM
Irene and her beloved sister Helen :

(http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/36252159th.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=36252159th.jpg)

Courtesy Argenta Images.
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: KarlandZita on September 20, 2014, 10:42:36 AM
Irene and Helen :

(http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/69606185hi.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=69606185hi.jpg)
Title: Re: Princess Irene of Greece (1904-1974)
Post by: Eric_Lowe on September 21, 2014, 12:09:15 AM
"Sitta" & her shadow according to Queen Marie of Romania