Alexander Palace Forum

Discussions about the Imperial Family and European Royalty => Imperial Claimants Post Here => Topic started by: Olga on July 09, 2004, 07:30:46 AM

Title: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Olga on July 09, 2004, 07:30:46 AM
What has been happening with the Filatovs lately? I read the book a while ago and found it pretty piss poor. Filatov's son, Oleg, was pushing for DNA confirmation of his father's claims.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: david_Johnson on July 09, 2004, 12:37:14 PM
I thought his book was compelling.  8)

Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Michelle on July 28, 2004, 08:31:53 PM
Me too  :)
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Olga on July 29, 2004, 02:47:03 AM
Care to elaborate?
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Michelle on July 29, 2004, 09:13:27 PM
I have to admit I am VERY skeptical about any claimant saying they're Alexei.  But, nonetheless, I enjoyed the book; it made fascinating entertainment.  I think Filatov looks absolutely NOTHING like Alexei--infact, Anna Anderson has much more credibility in the looks department than Filatov--but the teenage picture of one of his daughters (I believe it was Nadezhda and it was placed right next to a young picture of Alexandra) did bear somewhat of a resemblance to Alix.  I guess just because that book might've been false, doesn't mean that it wasn't interesting to some people.   ;)
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: rskkiya on July 30, 2004, 11:01:51 AM
Michelle

You made a good point yet almost almost anyone can look like anyone else with clever lighting and a good photographer...
:D
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Merrique on July 31, 2004, 10:16:31 PM
Quote
Michelle

You made a good point yet almost almost anyone can look like anyone else with clever lighting and a good photographer...
 :D


Don't forget a good makeup job or plastic surgery. ;) ;D
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Michelle on August 02, 2004, 11:06:49 PM
True.  I almost forgot another picture, though of Oleg.  It was on the back cover of the book next to a portrait of the tsar.  Oleg looked like he was in his fifties or somewhere around there.  At first I had to do a double take--it was almost a dead ringer for Nickolas II!  I showed it to my mom and she was like, "WOW!  That's amazing!  Maybe he IS the real son of the tsarevich!"  Stuff like this make the book interesting, as I've said, but unfortunately, that doesn't always make it true.   :'(  But I'm also saying that my mind will remain open to all possibilities--even if it's coupled with some wishful thinking.   :)
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Annie on August 06, 2004, 09:27:56 AM
I haven't seen this book so I can't say.

But one thing I have thought about in the cases of claimants and people saying they look like them when others say they don't is, I think that the power of suggestion is a big thing. If no one said, this is Alexei or Anastasia, and you were asked to say which historical figure the person resembled, you might not name a Romanov. But when someone says, this is so n so, it kind of takes our minds in that direction, and people are more likely to go, oh yes, I see it!

For example, take the backward masking in songs. There was a lot of flak years ago about people claiming there were evil messages in Led Zeppelin songs. Then I saw a guy on  TV set out to prove a point, and he did- he played the record backwards for one group of people, telling them they were supposed to hear "here's to our sweet satan" and the people all gasped and said, oh yes, they heard that! How scary! Then he played the same part of the same song backwards for another group of people and did not tell them what the message allegedly was. They all said it sounded like gobbledegook, or some foreign language. No one suggested what it was supposed to be, and since it wasn't really there, they didn't hear it. It's no offense to anyone who sees and hears things because of the power of suggestion, it's part of the way the mind works. But it is a factor in these stories, I think.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: ChristineM on September 01, 2004, 04:54:48 PM
I have met and interviewed Oleg Filatov.   When I first glimpsed him at our appointed meeting place - an international bank on the Moika where he was employed in PR! - I confess I was quite surprised by his resemblence to the late Emperor.   Like so many claimants, he delivered his story with sincerity.   His hair, beard and moustache had been carefully cultivated in precisely the style of Nicholas II.   However, his colouring, hair and eyes are so light  he presents as an 'Albino'.   He says this is a legacy from his 'father's' haemophilia.   I doubt this would be confirmed medically.

In his explanation for his 'father's' survival... he avered, this was due to the herbs and frozen fish fed him by the peasants of the 'north'.

I did not know of the existence, and therefore have not read, his book.   I do not know if any photographs are included.   What did cause me some consternation, was the remarkable resemblance between his sister Irene and the Grand Duchess Xenia.

Oleg did ask if we could possibly obtain a sample of blood from the 'Queen of England's husband'.   I thought better than to stalk the corridors of Buckingham Palace, Windsor, Balmoral or Sandringham with a needle and syringe.    

tsaria

Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Michelle on September 01, 2004, 05:46:28 PM
Hey tsaria, it'd be really cool if you had a picture of his sister Irene--you've made me curious!! ;) :D
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Olga on September 02, 2004, 03:32:04 AM
And Oleg Filatov's sister Nadezhda looks remarkably like Alexandra Fyodorovna.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Lisa on September 02, 2004, 04:38:07 AM
Some illustrations of the book:
Oleg Filatov:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v393/lyzotchka/olegfilatov.jpg)

His father in 1939:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v393/lyzotchka/pre.jpg)
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Lisa on September 02, 2004, 04:40:04 AM
Her sisters:
Olga:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v393/lyzotchka/File0004.jpg)

Irina:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v393/lyzotchka/soueririna.jpg)

and Nadezhda (he compare her to Xenia and Alexandra... I can't see how someone could ressemble to Xenia and Alix at the same time ???)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v393/lyzotchka/File0005.jpg)
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Michelle on September 02, 2004, 02:32:48 PM
I don't think Irina really looks at all like any of the tsar's family, based on that picture.  Or his sister Olga for that matter.  It's hard to really say who Nadezhda looks like.  She resembles Alix somewhat in the younger picture of her when Alix's picture is held up to Nadezhda's.  But it's hard for me to see it now. :-/  I can't tell if she looks like anybody in her older photo.  

The only one that would convince me of a relation to the tsar would be Oleg, because he does look REMARKABLY similar to Nicholas II.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Candice on September 02, 2004, 05:54:55 PM
I don't see any resemblances to the IF whatsoever.  I think they're very lovely photos.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Alexa on September 03, 2004, 08:30:24 AM
While I can see a resemblence between Oleg and the Tsar, I can also see one between him and Alex Guiness in his later years (Obi Wan Kenobi style).

Alexa
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Penny_Wilson on September 03, 2004, 12:28:34 PM
Quote
The only one that would convince me of a relation to the tsar would be Oleg, because he does look REMARKABLY similar to Nicholas II.


I think that Oleg's resemblance to Nicholas was certainly heightened by his carefully cultivated hair and beard -- but still, they ARE very alike.

I also see a strong resemblance between his sister Olga and Alexander III.

As for Vassili Ksenofontovich being the grown up Alexei -- well, I've always thought that Alexei was a rather ordinary-looking boy.  And VKs was rather an ordinary-looking man.  So maybe there's a resemblance -- but on the other hand, maybe their resemblance is in their shared "ordinaryness."   ::)

Alexei's disappearance is a bit of a conundrum for me.  We have stories about Anastasia being rescued, either from the courtyard or from the forest -- but nothing about Alexei.  If he survived, and he was smart, he would probably have behaved much as Oleg Filatov claimed his father did -- if he stayed in Russia.

This whole thing is just riven with little mysteries and coincidences, isn't it?  One item that struck me during our research on FOTR was that the missing bodies are those of the minor children -- and Lenin had recently promulgated a law forbidding the execution of minor children.  Perhaps nothing more than a coincidence, since I am not convinced that the Ekaterinburg Soviet would have been impressed with Lenin's laws -- but perhaps a reason for hiding these bodies a little better?  Or -- to play on AGRBear's team for a little while -- a reason to rescue them?

It's just all so shady...  8)
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Michelle on September 03, 2004, 03:51:06 PM
It is definitely shady.  SO confusing.  I don't know WHAT to believe.  I love it whenever you comment on these things, Penny, because you make it so interesting--not that others don't make it interesting, it's just that you and Greg wrote books and know a great deal on this subject. ;)  Even though all these twists and turns get frustrating sometimes, I enjoy them immensely!!! :D
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: ptitchka on September 03, 2004, 07:29:47 PM
Dear Michelle:

DNA testing was done on a sample from Vasili Filatov, and his DNA was reported not to mesh with that of his alleged parents.  At least, unlike another recent claimant, Filatov did have hemophilia and something of at least a White Guard bearing about him.

I, too, would be very skeptical of anyone claiming to be the little Tsarevich in the first place.  
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: LisaDavidson on September 03, 2004, 11:52:44 PM
Regarding the Filatovs wanting a blood sample from Prince Philip, his mtDNA sequence has been published in Nature Genetics (I believe this is the name of the magazine). Several US labs have done testing on mtDNA samples - all that would be necessary would be a mtDNA sample from Vasili Filatov.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Michelle on September 04, 2004, 11:34:15 AM
Oh, so they DID test the Filatovs? :o  I had no idea.  I never heard anything about that.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: LisaDavidson on September 05, 2004, 09:07:52 PM
No, they did not test the Filatovs - that I know of. I have heard rumors that tests were done and there was no match. The post to which I was responding said the Filatovs were wanting a sample of Philip's blood, and I was merely pointing out that it was not needed. A sample is not needed because the results have already been published in a magazine.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Michelle on September 05, 2004, 10:33:38 PM
Ooops!  Sorry, Lisa! :-[  I misunderstood.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: ChristineM on September 09, 2004, 02:51:45 PM
Dear Lisa

This request from Oleg Filatov was made to us via a Russian Orthodox priest and probably pre-dates the magazine article to which you refer.   It predates the Anna Anderson DNA findings for example.   I recall there was also mention of a tooth and Scandinavian investigations.   It is so long ago - approximately ten years -  I cannot remember details.

There is one anatomical fact re the tsarevich which I found too sensitive to mention during the interview with Oleg Filatov, however even a 'son' might not have known the answer.  

Best wishes

tsaria
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: LisaDavidson on September 09, 2004, 11:19:51 PM
I think I know the issue to which Tsaria refers. In the case of the Vancouver Alexis, he had the same condition.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Olga on September 10, 2004, 10:09:44 PM
And what would this issue be?  ???
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Robert_Hall on September 10, 2004, 10:26:24 PM
Yes, what condition are you refering to? Was this some problem in his groin? I have heard vague rumours of that.
Cheers,
Robert
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: stepan on September 15, 2004, 04:44:40 PM
In Radzinskiīs book I read that Alexej suffered from something called cryptorcism which means that one of the testicles had not sunk down which happends in early age. I donīt know if this is true. I havenīt heard or read about this anywhere else. Radzinsky told about an Alexej claimant called Semjonov who was in a psychiatric hospital in Petrozavodsk in Karelia. He was examined by a doctor called Gendelevich who discovered this condition on the patient which he said the heir Alexej also suffered from. Is this what you refered to in the last posts?
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: AGRBear on October 31, 2004, 06:25:48 PM
See the book THE ESCAPE OF ALEXEI, Son of Tsar Nicholas II by Vadim Petrov,  Igor Lysenho and Georgy Egoroy


AGRBear

Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Georgiy on November 17, 2004, 07:56:49 PM
Well, the Alex of Denmark people look nothing like the Romanovs at all! Even Anna Anderson had a closer resemblance! I guess some people like to think their families had a romantic past, esp. if they are descended from displaced Russians, and after all a lot of people did escape from Russia in the revolutionary years.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: LisaDavidson on November 21, 2004, 03:39:10 PM
Alexei was supposed to have an undescended testicle. Sorry for being overly delicate on the subject!
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Denise on November 24, 2004, 04:09:59 PM
So, my question on the Filatov claimant concerns the DNA.  Has there ever been testing done on the claimant or his family?  And if not, why not?

I read the book a few years ago but found it to be a bit far fetched.  Oleg's resemblance to Nicholas is uncanny, but the grooming of the beard, angle of the head etc probably contribute a great deal to that.  We see what we are expected to see, especially as he has posed with the last tsar's portrait behind him.

Denise
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: BobAtchison on November 24, 2004, 05:16:37 PM
He doesn't look anything like Nicholas in person - except for the beard.

He and all the other Filatov 'Romanovs' look 100% Russian to me - nothing like Aleksey, Alix or Nicholas.  Their Russianess is quite striking.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Denise on November 24, 2004, 07:58:48 PM
Quote
He doesn't look anything like Nicholas in person - except for the beard.

He and all the other Filatov 'Romanovs' look 100% Russian to me - nothing like Aleksey, Alix or Nicholas.  Their Russianess is quite striking.


Thanks Bob.  I thought as much, based on how carefully posed the official photo he had in the book and is shown above seems.  

I appreciate the quick response!
D
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Olga on November 25, 2004, 09:07:48 AM
Posing in front of the photograph was a bit dodgy, wasn't it?  ;)
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: rskkiya on November 25, 2004, 09:56:17 AM
Bob
Please don't misunderstand my question - but just what is "Russian-ness?" A deeper voice? A hand with short round fingers? Very pale women?

No insult implied - but this is a very confusing statement to me. Please clarify? :D

rskkiya
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Moth on November 26, 2004, 12:49:59 AM
Aside from the obvious grooming of Oleg's beard and hair, he does have one other feature (or should I say 2?) working in his favor:  his eyes, to me, strongly resemble Anastasia's eyes and, to some degree, Alexei's.

Don't know what to make of these claimants!  HOWEVER, why did/do people think Anna Anderson looked so much like Anastasia???  I just don't see it.  If anything, the few photos I've seen of her as a younger woman make me think more of Tatiana, and not even very much like her!  Am I the only person who wonders how in the WORLD they ever thought she was Anastasia based on looks alone?
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Marcel_Teerling on December 04, 2004, 10:04:07 PM
Would Oleg want reconition as heir to the imperial family? In that case, much changes. The present heir is Maria, and therefor they need to meet eachother.
Has there been knowledge by Maria of this Vasili story?
Something needs to be done. I think it is too important to dicover the truth.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: La_Mashka on May 03, 2005, 12:05:37 PM
someone did a very good job with the beard and the hair... apart from that... there's nothing in him that says ROMANOV!... at least not to me...
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: imperial angel on January 30, 2006, 10:31:57 AM
I read this book, and think his family resembles the last Romanovs a bit, but not more than that. It is interesting story, but that is all. It would be interesting to do DNA testing, or if that has been done to find the results. The book itself is well done, an interesting book, if you ignore the fact it is about a claimant. It is worth reading if you want to know about claimants, but after reading it, I would not start to believe it-it is very unlikely. It is an interesting case of someone being claimed for by his family, rather than claiming himself. ;)
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Joy0318 on January 30, 2006, 05:18:06 PM
I thought it was an interesting read although I did not believe it. I do not think Vasili Filatov was Alexei any more than I think Heino Tammet was.

And did anyone else notice that in one of the appendices they realte having blonde hair to hemophilia? :-/
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: imperial angel on January 31, 2006, 10:31:57 AM
Yes, it is one of the more well done ( or fancily done) books on a claimant-does that make it accurate-no! ;) And that part you mentioned is true-rather silly in my opinion. ;)
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: RealAnastasia on January 31, 2006, 11:04:15 PM
Quote
See the book THE ESCAPE OF ALEXEI, Son of Tsar Nicholas II by Vadim Petrov,  Igor Lysenho and Georgy Egoroy


AGRBear



They looks nothing like the Imperial Family...Besides, they forgot to said that the Imperial Grand Duchesses were FOUR and not three. THe authors said that Empress Alexandra went away from Rusia with her children, Olga, Maria, Anastasia and Alexei...Fine...But WHERE IS TATIANA? They forgot her absolutely!!!  :P

RealAnastasia.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: Joy0318 on February 01, 2006, 09:22:35 AM
I really don't think his family looks like the Romanovs that much. I can see a resemblance between one of his daughters and Alexandra but that does not  prove that they are related.  

As for Vasili's son Oleg I think he looks more like Sir Alec Guiness that Tsar Nicholas II.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: imperial angel on February 01, 2006, 10:07:36 AM
Well, we can all agree that the Filatovs are not the Romanovs in general... ;)
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: lexi4 on November 11, 2006, 10:15:29 PM
I just read this book and thought it was pretty bad. Very weak. And I don't think that Oleg looks anything like Nicholas, although he tries with that beard.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: imperial angel on November 28, 2006, 10:47:59 AM
I think that's why he had a beard... ;) But, his facial features are much different than those of Nicholas, or any Romanov I've ever seen. Anyone with that type of beard would look vaguely like Nicholas II.
Title: Re: Vasili Filatov
Post by: strom on November 11, 2011, 05:47:12 PM
Dear friends:

I note that Radzinsky mentions the surname of 'Filippov' in his record of the survival of the Heir --an identification which appears to be tacitly supported by HH Valerian Obelensky. One wonders if this might not have been a misspelling of 'Filatov'.  That is not an impossible explanation for the identity of the Radzinsky 'Heir' and the man known as Vassili Filatov --the pseudoym adopted by the Heir after the events of 1918.  I think we all must wait for more information coming out of Russia on the lineal descendants of the last Emperor and Empress --moreover it appears there are also lineal descendants in the west. 

Strom.