Alexander Palace Forum

Discussions about Other Imperial Palaces => Tsarskoe Selo Palaces => Topic started by: ArchitectCS on February 21, 2007, 11:53:22 AM

Title: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on February 21, 2007, 11:53:22 AM

I was hoping someone could tell me what the time line is for the restoration of the Catherine Palace?  I know that within the past few years the amber room and Rastrelli's anterooms have been restored, but does anyone know anything about other rooms?  Is the chapel going to be completed soon?  or any of Catherine the Great's private apartments?  Any information would be sincerely appreciated. 

Also, I have been trying to find photos of the anterooms I just mentioned.  I have several very nice shots of the anteroom closest to the great hall, but I don't have any of the other two.  What I would most like to know is if the porcelain stands from the second anteroom were restored.  I can't find any information either way.  I've added a link here http://www.alexanderpalace.org/2006tsarskoe/fourth_suite.html (http://www.alexanderpalace.org/2006tsarskoe/fourth_suite.html) showing what I'm talking about.  (In almost every instance I've ever seen a photo of the room, it is called the first anteroom, though this is erroneous.  Thought I should clarify as it can get confusing)

Again, any information at all would be truly appreciated, and photos would be wonderful!
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on February 23, 2007, 11:49:58 AM

I thought I might get the ball rolling with a few pics of the first anteroom I found online. 

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/CatherinePalacefirstanteroomwallele.jpg)

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/CatherinePalacefirstanteroom3.jpg)
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Vladimir_V. on February 23, 2007, 12:56:02 PM
The Second Antiroom
(http://geglov2.narod.ru/jpg/Ekat_dvor_zdan/Komnati/Anticamera_02/001.jpg)

Look:
http://narod.yandex.ru/cgi-bin/yandmarkup?cluster=5&prog=0x2757571A&HndlQuery=2091755920&PageNum=0&g=2&d=0&q0=1933579872&p=

http://narod.yandex.ru/cgi-bin/yandmarkup?cluster=5&prog=0x2757571A&HndlQuery=2091755920&PageNum=0&g=0&d=0&q0=1933579872&p=
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Vladimir_V. on February 23, 2007, 12:56:24 PM
The Second Antiroom
Look:
http://narod.yandex.ru/cgi-bin/yandmarkup?cluster=5&prog=0x2757571A&HndlQuery=2091755920&PageNum=0&g=2&d=0&q0=1933579872&p=

http://narod.yandex.ru/cgi-bin/yandmarkup?cluster=5&prog=0x2757571A&HndlQuery=2091755920&PageNum=0&g=0&d=0&q0=1933579872&p=
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: lori_c on February 23, 2007, 01:08:35 PM
The Anteroom view looks like the part of the palace where the movie Young Catherine with Julia Ormond and Vanessa Redgrave was filmed.  Does anybody know if this is true?  The floor looks very familiar. ???
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on February 26, 2007, 11:55:11 AM

Vladimir,

Thank you so much for the links.  I had no idea that there were porcelain stands in the first anteroom as well.  It's a pity they weren't restored.  They must have been a later addition and it is nice to have Rastrelli's rooms returned to his original intention.  I appreaciate your research!

Chad
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on February 26, 2007, 11:56:54 AM

Lori,

Young Catherine was filmed in the Catherine Palace.  It has been many years since I have seen it, but there were a few scenes filmed in the Great Hall, which is similar to the anterooms.  Hope this info helps.

Chad
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: lori_c on February 26, 2007, 12:33:00 PM
Chad,

Thanks so much!  The Great Hall resembles the anterooms in many scenes.  This is one of my favorite movies as it was filmed not long after communism broke down and I was able to see Real Russia for the first time. 

As a side note, do you know if the park scenes, there were some by an Urn were filmed there as well or in Peterhof?

Thanks!

Lori
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on February 27, 2007, 12:01:04 PM

Hi Lori,

Gosh, it's been so many years since I've seen it, I'm not sure.  I remember a scene in the garden with Catherine and one of her ladies.  They were sitting on white benches and talking about pregnancy.  I know that was at Tsarskoe Selo, but I don't remember an urn.  Peterhof was used as well in the movie.  I think it was for King Frederick's palace in Germany.  I know they used the exterior but I'm not sure about the interior.

Chad
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: lori_c on February 27, 2007, 12:44:13 PM
It was a scene where after the birth of Paul, Catherine consults Hansbury-Williams played by Christopher Plummer about not being able to see her son.  Andhe calls her Tsarina. BTW Julia Ormond looks every bit the part of a Tsarina.  It's got a rose garden in it and he is seen pruning them. 

Oh well, thanks anyway ;)
 
I love the movie so much because I get to see Russia - especially the palaces at Peterhof, Catherine Palace and Alexander Palace - and I don't know that I'll ever get there in person.  I thought I had read that the Urn in the scene was of some significance.  Dedicated to somebody important.  But what do I know? :-\

Thanks again!

Lori
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Joanna on March 11, 2007, 09:39:30 PM
From an interview with Ivan Sautov, there are watercolors of the Chinese, Lyons, Arabesque Halls and restorations of the rooms along with the Antechamber:

http://d-c.spb.ru/archiv/27/25-28/25-28.htm

Joanna
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Venois on March 14, 2007, 02:16:13 AM
I think the palace Chapel is in a final stage of restoration. Hopefully it will be opened next summer.

Venois.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ChristineM on March 15, 2007, 06:39:38 PM
Yes, and it was the inspiration and work of the wonderful, late Alexander Kedrinsky.   Sadly he has not lived to see the ripening of this particular fruit of his superb labours at Tsarskoe Selo.   

I'm sure Father Gennady will not fail to pay due respect to this remarkable man (whose grandfather was a priest at the Feodorovsky Sobor) at an appropriate moment during the reconsecration of the Cathedral.

tsaria
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on March 29, 2007, 11:53:21 AM

I had no idea Kedrinsky was dead.  When did he die?  It's a pity he couldn't have lived just a few more years and seen the palace finished.  He would have been one of the few to see it both before the war and restored from the war.

Any idea of a date for the completion of the chapel?  Any pictures?
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ChristineM on March 29, 2007, 06:04:27 PM
He died about four years ago.   I was privileged to see him, for the last time, about a week before he died.

tsaria
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Vassili_Vorontsoff on April 26, 2007, 09:39:01 AM
I think this is the chinese room which is under recreation...(http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r248/vassiliv/tsarskoye%20selo/catherine.jpg)
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Arleen on April 26, 2007, 12:13:30 PM
Thanks for posting the beautiful picture Vassili, I'd never seen one of the Chinese Room before.

A
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: lori_c on April 26, 2007, 12:16:41 PM
Absolutely beautiful.  Look at the funiture especially the middle rounded cushioned sofa.  What era does that date from?
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Vassili_Vorontsoff on April 29, 2007, 09:32:08 AM
Another image of the chinese room...
(http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r248/vassiliv/russie-2.jpg)

I'm delighted Arleen to give you the occasion to dicover this image,I found it by chance on the net...


Lori,as far as I'macquainetd in art,sofas were one of the most important thing in the interiors (there was a huge developpement of such thing at that time) during the 2d Empire in France which correspond grossly to the reign of Alexander II,to my point of the design is typical of eclectism(1860-1880).

If you are interested ,I could "prove my point" with some documents.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: lori_c on April 30, 2007, 11:54:23 AM
I am interested.  We have homes here in New Orleans with antique French Furniture that includes sofas of this kind. The ones I have seen dated a little after 1880 but thereabouts.

Regardless, I love that period furniture and design.

Thanks!
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Vassili_Vorontsoff on April 30, 2007, 11:11:42 PM
The fashion of sofia continued until 1914(in the movies of Visconti such as Death in Venice it is well pictured),the high point was however in the 1870-1880 years...

Look at the Napoleon III's appartement in the  Louvreshttp://www.galerie.roi-president.com/album-22-louvre+appartement+napoleon+iii+tuileries+meubles+et+objets+royaux.html

http://pros.orange.fr/nunes.antiquites/le_style_napoleon_iii.htm
http://freenet.buffalo.edu/bah/a/archsty/sec/index.html

I hope this would cast some light on this fashion,I have documents thta I could scan next week,tell me..
Vassia
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: lori_c on May 01, 2007, 09:23:06 AM
Thanks for the links!

Yes, this period is evidenced well after the turn of the century.  The wealthy french planters that settled in plantations near New Orleans have pieces extremely similar to those.

Any other pictures you have would be wonderful.  I would love to see more!

Thanks again,

Lori

Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Arleen on May 01, 2007, 12:46:57 PM
Thank you for the interesting links Vassili.

Lori, you live in my favorite American city....New Orleans!  What wonderful homes there are there.

Arleen
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: gleb on May 01, 2007, 01:19:14 PM
I think this is the chinese room which is under recreation

Really? I did  not know but I am so glad to hear it
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: lori_c on May 01, 2007, 04:30:29 PM
Thank you for the interesting links Vassili.

Lori, you live in my favorite American city....New Orleans!  What wonderful homes there are there.

Arleen
Yes, with much French influences in architecture as well as furniture and decor.  Especially during the Era Vassili mentioned! :)
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Vassili_Vorontsoff on May 02, 2007, 12:23:29 PM
Gleb ,

I may mistaken for the recreation of the chinese room however it seems to me that this was said in a russian document (sent in the first page of the topic)...

I hope anyway that it is true...

Vassia
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Helen_Azar on May 02, 2007, 12:38:11 PM
I think the palace Chapel is in a final stage of restoration. Hopefully it will be opened next summer.

Venois.

Interesting thing about the Palace Chapel, which is directly beneath the domes, is that most of it survived intact. Even the floors are original (at least from the mid-19th century, prior to the first great fire)... For some reason the Germans did not burn that part down when retreating in 1945... According to one of the CP museum curators, they used to use the chapel as a garage...
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ChristineM on May 02, 2007, 02:01:39 PM
Yes they did use the church as a garage and, like the Agate Rooms which was used as the officers' mess, it survived largely unscathed - desecrated, but the architectural features are extant.   Standing in the choir, I think of Nicholas II who, instead of as is customary, being a parent, leaving the church during the sacrament of baptism, stood in the choir to witness his first born, Olga, being christened.

tsaria
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Venois on May 07, 2007, 12:00:17 AM
Thank you, Helen, for this encouraging information.

Agate rooms are going through restoration process too. It is actually very sad that they have not been restored since the war, despite the authenticity of the interiors. They are in a dilapidating condition right now. Hopefully this will be alleviated soon.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ChristineM on May 07, 2007, 04:29:22 AM
Sorry Valois - give me 'dilapidated' over 'restored' any day.   Just so long as the structure is sound, I would much prefer to see interiors worn, aged and in the case of the Agate Rooms with a very moderate degree of vandalism (e.g. the medallions stolen from the fireplaces), but with atmosphere remaining, than restored until not one single iota of authenticity remains.

Of the entire Tsarskoe Selo ensemble, the Agate Rooms and the Palace Church are the only areas where one can actually feel the history.   Visitors should know the rest is an exercise in craftsmanship and the remarkable drive of human beings to overcome adversity in the rebuilding post WWII and soviet vandalsim/neglect.   Not that there is anything wrong with this, and it is superb... but not to the detriment of history.

tsaria   
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: dmitri on September 13, 2007, 09:47:07 AM
I don't think there would be much to see if the Catherine Palace has not been so well restored by the Soviet experts after the destruction caused by the Nazi Germans. It really has been a truly remarkable act of love restoring what others would have thought was an impossible undertaking.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Vecchiolarry on September 13, 2007, 10:39:42 AM
Hi Dmitri,

Yes, great credit must go to the restorers, carpenters, plumbers, plasterers and goldsmiths - etc. who did a superlative job on The Catherine Palace and so many more.
I understand there are several other places that will be done too.  Wonderful!!

I know when I have my palace built, that I will definitely hire them!!!
OK - - so I live in a dream world.......

I'm glad you got to see it all.

Larry
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: dmitri on September 13, 2007, 11:16:03 AM
Yes there are very few other things in life as thrilling.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Helen_Azar on September 13, 2007, 11:26:09 AM
Sorry Valois - give me 'dilapidated' over 'restored' any day.   Just so long as the structure is sound, I would much prefer to see interiors worn, aged and in the case of the Agate Rooms with a very moderate degree of vandalism (e.g. the medallions stolen from the fireplaces), but with atmosphere remaining, than restored until not one single iota of authenticity remains.


I feel exactly the same way, tsaria, but many people disagree...
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: dmitri on September 13, 2007, 11:40:53 AM
I can understand your opinions. Where the essential fabric remains this is indeed possible. Sadly though when buildings are basically destroyed through gross acts of barbaric behaviour, restoration is the only real option. I hate to think of Pavlovsk, Peterhof and the Catherine Palace at Tsarskoe Selo still in ruins. I admire what the Soviet and Russian restorers have done to bring back these treasures to their former glory. How much poorer we would all be without them. Gatchina is also an example of the need for further restoration as is the Alexander Palace at Tsarskoe Selo.   
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Helen_Azar on September 13, 2007, 12:52:20 PM
It's true that they couldn't leave Catherine Palace as is, since it was nothing but ruins when they got through with it. So there had to be restoration of course. I am talking more about places like the AP, where most of the original structure is intact, and I would hate to see it "restored, i.e. things changed and added, and become "touristy" like some other palaces, and lose it's authenticity. Not to say that it shouldn't be upkept, like the roof, the basic structure, etc., but "restored" in the sense that they have done with some other places, to a point where it loses it's original flavor - I am not so sure about that.

Last week I had a similar conversation with a curator at the Edgar Allan Poe House-Museum in Philadelphia. Right now the house is as bare as can be: basically the original structure and walls and that's it. The museum is thinking of "restoring" it, bringing in furniture, etc. The problem is, they don't really know what kind of furniture was there, where it was located, what the place really looked like... Right now, when you walk in there, you can really use your imagination and feel the former occupants, and they feel real, it feels authentic. But if they do restore it - I think it will lose that, and become just another museum...

For those interested in EAP: http://www.dlackey.org/weblog/images/PoePhil.jpg 

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/db/RavenStatue-Philadelphia.JPG/300px-RavenStatue-Philadelphia.JPG
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: dmitri on October 05, 2007, 08:36:40 AM
I do understand what you are saying. The situation though with the Alexander Palace is one where a great deal is no longer there.  Much needs restoration as it simply no longer exists. You get some idea of how it may have been to a certain extent but so much is gone that no real impression is left. The other thing that comes to mind is that none of these Palaces will ever serve their original purpose ever again. They are museums. The imperial age is over and will never return. What you see today at most of the Palaces is restoration. Peterhof is a case as is Pavlovsk and the Catherine Palace. There really was no real alternative. Some items of furniture, clothing and artworks have been returned to the Alexander Palace. There are also many items that are simply left over from a film that was shot there. I guess the real question that needs to be asked is what do people want to see happen there? At the moment it is an interesting curiosity far removed from any real connection with Nicholas and Alexandra. Unless I had been familiar with old photos before my visit and also seen the large photos in the rooms which tried to give an impression of how they once were, I very much doubt that I would have really known which room was which as so much has completely changed. Thank goodness there were some items still there on display. The uniforms and some clothing from Nicholas, Alexis, Alexandra and the four Grand Duchesses provided some connection. I found there was more in fact to see from the reign of Nicholas II in the Kremlin Museums in Moscow than in the sadly neglected, largely destroyed interiors of the Alexander Palace. Restoration is desperately needed there. It's a vastly different story where most is intact. This simply is not the case at the Alexander Palace.       
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Nemos on July 12, 2008, 10:44:03 AM
(http://i37.tinypic.com/2zfod4w.jpg)

1942 год. Может кто-то знает из какого зала дворца столик у Испанцев ?
1942. Someone little table at Spaniards can knows from what hall of a palace?
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Joanna on July 12, 2008, 01:13:04 PM
(http://i37.tinypic.com/2zfod4w.jpg)

The wall is painted lower portion darker than upper. I am wondering if it is possibly basement room of a palace as it has more a raw feel compared to the family's wall-papered rooms. As this photo is during war years, the elaborate table and divan was probably moved for comfort of their quarters.

Joanna
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Nemos on July 12, 2008, 01:22:19 PM
Почти 100% что это комната в бывшем Офицерском собрании Собственного Е.И.В. конвоя, после революции здание использовал Молочный институт. Как я понял в войну его Испанцы использовали под казарму.От линии фронта оно защищено другими зданиями.

Almost 100 % that are a room in former Officer assembly Own Е.И.В. An escort, after revolution the building was used by Dairy institute. As I have understood in war its Spaniards used under a barracks. It is protected from a front line other buildings.

Ближе был Александровский дворец, из него скорее всего и взяли мебель для украшения солдатского быта.
Was closer Aleksandrovsky a palace, from it most likely and have taken furniture for an ornament of a soldier's life.

Всю остальную мебель "приличную" после революции уже всю "прибрали" ...
All other furniture "decent" after revolution already all "have tidied up"...
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Nemos on July 12, 2008, 01:30:51 PM
Плохо видно, но кровать там тоже стоит не "простая" ...
It is badly visible, but the bed there too costs not "simple"...

Интересно благодаря тому что из дворца брали мебель во время войны, часть её и сохранилась. Интерьер парадного кабинета Императора во дворце так и нашли илив блиндаже или где- то в здании - казарме ...
Interestingly that owing to that that from a palace took furniture during war, its part and was kept. An interior of a smart cabinet of Emperor in a palace and have found илив a dugout or где-that in a building - a barracks...
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Nemos on July 12, 2008, 01:47:13 PM
(http://i059.radikal.ru/0807/2f/a43901c375c5.jpg)

Не удивительно бросили очень много и янтарную комнату.
Можно подумать по фото что это город курорт, а это 1942 год город в оккупации зонтики от солнце и другое ... ( а рядом Ленинград уже один год в блокаде).

Have not surprisingly thrown much and an amber room. It is possible to think on a photo that it is city a resort, and it is 1942 city in occupation umbrellas from the sun and another... (And a number Leningrad one year in blockade).
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Nick_Nicholson on October 20, 2008, 01:45:58 PM
the target date for completion o the Catherine Palace restoration is 2010, for the 300th anniversary of Tsarskoye Selo.  Exterior restoration of the Alexander Palace is also scheduled for then.

The Italian team leading the restoration effforts uncovered the original blue of the palace, and also the original layer of lacquered gilding.  Watch out, because it will be restored to its original Rastrelli finishes, and it will be BLINDING for years.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on October 21, 2008, 10:04:44 AM
How fantastic!  The effect will be dazzling indeed.  Nick, where did you find this info?  If there is an article, I'd love to read it.

Thanks.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Nick_Nicholson on October 22, 2008, 01:37:26 PM
From the Tsarskoye Selo website.

http://www.tzar.ru/museums/museums-300let/restauro

Very interesting!

N

If you don't read russian, view it through the www.translate.ru website, which though it comes out sort of in gobbledy gook, helps alot--you'll get the gist.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on October 22, 2008, 01:58:54 PM
Thanks so much for the link-fascinating stuff!  Just from looking at some of the pictures of the paint scrapings, it looks like the palace was originally a darker blue (sort of an azure) than what is used today.  That, along with the gilding, should be pretty spectacular.

Does anyone have good pictures of any of the newly restored rooms?  I've seen some bits of the second and third anterooms, but nothing all that substantial.  I'd love to know how Catherine the Great's rooms are coming, as well as the work on the chapel.

Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Douglas on October 22, 2008, 05:10:57 PM
Easier way to translate web page from Russian to English:

Go to Google Translate....Text and Web.   Enter the URL of the Web page and language you wish to translate to.  Click...a near perfect translation will appear for you.

I did it and it works great.

Douglas....Los Angeles
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: G.Michael on November 14, 2008, 07:47:25 PM
The Italian team leading the restoration effforts uncovered the original blue of the palace . . . .

Was blue really the original color? I've seen a painting of the palace that makes it appear a more traditional stucco color, a dull yellow or cream (although I can't figure out how to post the image).

Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on November 17, 2008, 07:45:14 AM
I remember reading in a book once that the Catherine Palace was originally yellow, but the book didn't cite a source and wasn't very scholarly.  I assumed it was a mistake.  G.Michael, if you want to send me the picture, I can post it for you.

Chad
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on November 17, 2008, 12:23:58 PM

Here is the photo G.Michael was talking about (and thanks for sending it to me!)

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/CatherinePalace.jpg)

The palace is indeed a shade of pale yellow.  I can't imagine how different the palace would look with this color scheme, but I have to admit, I prefer the blue.  I wonder if Catherine the Great changed the color?  You can see the church wing has been extended and the statues are no longer on the roof, so the image must be from her reign or later. 

I seem to recall an engraving or watercolor of the Winter Palace with a somewhat similar color scheme as well.

Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Cathy on November 18, 2008, 02:12:52 PM
I think that Rastrelli remodelled the Winter Palace (he completed the previous reincarnation under Empress Anna) and completed it just after the death of Elizabeth in 1762. Under Rastrelli it was painted yellow and white. He then went on to create other palaces in St. Petersburg and the Catherine Palace in TS so it would not surprise me the learn that he had it painted yellow and white too.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on November 18, 2008, 02:24:55 PM
The only thing I find hard to believe would be how truly blinding the palace would be.  The roof was some sort of silvery material, and all the trim and statues were gilded (which was not done at the Winter Palace, to the best of my knowledge).  Combine that with a white and yellow color scheme and on a sunny day the palace would be absolutely blinding.  In all honesty, I am a huge Rastrelli fan, but all that would be too much even for me.  The blue is an elegant choice and helps to 'cool' the palace, so to speak.  I can't wait to see it all redone-the blue and gold should be dazzling. 
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Cathy on November 19, 2008, 07:53:35 AM
I have seen the Catherine Palace 'in real life' 3 times now. Each time the colour blue has been a different shade (at least in part) and the gilding has been different tones. There was still much to do in 1996 because the back sections had not been restored completely. In 2006, the blue was lovely but the gold was very strong and bright. Now, in 2008, the blue is not as pretty as it was in 2006 but the gilding has been toned down to a dull colour which I like better. Not all mind you - the roof is bright.
The Smolny has been (and actually still is) many shades of different blues.
I loved the shade of blue of St. Nicholas Cathedral the best but even it changes with every painting.
I love seeing pictures of the Winter Palace, Peterhof and the Anichkov in dark red but I like the current colours best.
I've seen the Stroganov green and pink and I liked the green best but my Russian friends like the pink.
I would love to see a picture of the Winter Palace in yellow.
I LOVE the many colours in St. Petersburg. 
They repaint buildings a lot!!!
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: G.Michael on November 19, 2008, 08:54:33 PM
The only thing I find hard to believe would be how truly blinding the palace would be. 

A quote from AlexanderPalace.org:

"The contemporaries were literally blinded by the magnificence of the adornment, marvels about the palace were related, saying even, that its roof was made of gold. The story is told, that when the Empress Elizabeth arrived with the whole of her court and the foreign ministers to inspect the finished palace, everyone, struck by its splendor, hastened to express his enthusiasm; the French ambassador alone did not say a word; the Empress remarking his silence, desired to know the reason of his indifference; he answered, that he did not see the most important thing, 'a casket for this jewel'."

Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: G.Michael on November 19, 2008, 10:26:14 PM
For what it's worth, "A History of Russian Architecture," by William Brumfield, 1993, seems to offer contradicting evidence. In one paragraph about the original appearance of the palace, we find a description of "gilded atlantes supporting white columns against a turquoise background." But later in the very same paragraph, we find a quote from an English traveler, William Coxe, who saw the palace soon after it was completed. Coxe describes "a brick edifice stuccoed white."

Can we reconcile a "turquoise background" with "stuccoed white?"

Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Douglas on November 19, 2008, 10:37:22 PM
I suppose one could figure that the new 'white stucco'  was later painted 'turquoise'.  At least that would make sense.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Nick_Nicholson on November 20, 2008, 07:38:34 AM
When he says "Stuccoed white" he simply means that the brick was covered with a final coat of white plaster.  That is a mention of construction method, rather than a comment on the building's decoration.  White stucco was always a ground for a painted finish.  In italy, stucco was often pink or ochre, which was intended as a final decorative finish. 

Also, that picture of the Catherine Palace is misleading.  The "Yellow" that people see is actually the yellow paint that the artist used to show the gilded window surrounds, lintels, and caryatids that cover the surface of the building.  If you look at the right hand side of the picture, you can clearly see the blue-painted capital bases, stairs,and hints of wall.  It is the perspective that makes the building appear yellow (gold)  I think the yellow haze was the artist trying to show how brilliantly gold the surface of the building was.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Nick_Nicholson on November 20, 2008, 07:40:41 AM
Finally, that watercolor dates from the 1830's or 40's (look at the carriages and costumes) and we know that the palace was blue at that point.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Cathy on November 22, 2008, 02:25:13 PM
I think that Nick is right - if one looks at the watercolour painting on the cover of the book Tsarskoe Selo, The Imperial Summer Residence, 2005 Alfa-Colour Art Publishers, one can see the yellow between the white pillars but as a closer image to the eye - the blue is clearly visible on most of the palace. I think that it is only there to clearly show the pillars.

It is common in Russia for many buildings (from homes to offices to palaces) to be constructed in brick, covered in a white stucco or cement-like stuff :-) and then painted the famous pastel or the darker shades and colours.

Has anyone ever seen an image of the winter palace in yellow?
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: G.Michael on November 23, 2008, 01:11:32 AM

Has anyone ever seen an image of the winter palace in yellow?

Yes, I have a couple of images lurking somewhere in the depths of my collection. Let me dig around for them.

As for the above-posted image of the Catherine Palace, if the artist didn't intend to depict the exterior colors as yellow and white, then I hope he flunked art school. He may have been looking at a blue palace, but he painted a yellow one. 
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Vassili_Vorontsoff on November 23, 2008, 08:45:18 AM
GMichael,

On the official page of the hermitage, could you find a vitual representation of the palace through the ages:

http://www.hermitagemuseum.org/html_En/05/hm5_7_10_0_0.html

(http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r248/vassiliv/hm12map34.jpg)

It is not the place to develop on that subject however, I think it would be wise to restore the original yellowcolor at the occasion of the 250 years of the Winter palace in 2014.

Indeed, since the large Hermitage project provides for the return of colors of the Admiralty, it would interesting that the place gets its colors, in order to recreate the architectural spirit of the palace in the 19th when the place with the columna of Alexander I were adjusted ...
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Nick_Nicholson on November 23, 2008, 06:25:00 PM
Here is an image of the Winter Palace in 1832-33 during construction of the Alexander Column.  (Hermitage collection)

(http://i412.photobucket.com/albums/pp208/NickNicholsonNYC/winterpalace1833.jpg)

And here is a watercolor of Palace Square and the Winter Palace in 1804 from the Nevsky Prospect.  (Also Hermitage)

(http://i412.photobucket.com/albums/pp208/NickNicholsonNYC/winterpalace1804.jpg)

You can see the yellow and white WP in both.

Best,

Nick
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Nick_Nicholson on November 23, 2008, 07:05:41 PM
(http://i37.tinypic.com/2zfod4w.jpg)

The wall is painted lower portion darker than upper. I am wondering if it is possibly basement room of a palace as it has more a raw feel compared to the family's wall-papered rooms. As this photo is during war years, the elaborate table and divan was probably moved for comfort of their quarters.

Joanna

Compare the table with this one.  Perhaps from the same suite?

(http://i412.photobucket.com/albums/pp208/NickNicholsonNYC/tableOTMA.jpg)
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Joanna on November 23, 2008, 08:55:58 PM
Off topic, but this engraving has the yellowish tint of the Winter Palace:

http://apa.confessmedia.com/cm/shv7ebYnaejG7RfU2oJQ4eRUHytaoVyI/2/zoom=400x400,quality=80/EYEKS_00078360.jpg

Joanna
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Nick_Nicholson on November 23, 2008, 11:13:41 PM
Joanna,  Wonderful image, I have the same one, but only in black and white.  Is yours tinted?

Oh dear. Do we need a "Russian Palaces Original COlors" thread?
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Joanna on November 24, 2008, 07:36:00 PM
Nick, I had found the image on a German site. It is a print of the actual engraving that may have been a lithograph c1750s-60s. I have worked with the process of lithography using various colors roll pressed on the stones.

I have several large format books that I had bought during trips to StP that have many pictures of the various palaces through the centuries. One of the Winter Palace c1754 is of the private garden side (rooms of N&A) that is the yellow color with two dark red bands - one below the windows of the first floor and the other along the lower part of the railing on the roof. It is quite dramatic as the bands completely circle the palace. I do not have a scanner but when Laura comes to my place next, she will be able to photo digitalize for you.

Joanna
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: G.Michael on November 26, 2008, 07:28:31 PM
For what it's worth, here's another depiction of the Catherine Palace painted white.


Scroll about halfway down the page: www.free-time.ru/razdels/!anzikl/e_9.html

Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on December 01, 2008, 08:21:55 AM
I can't get the link to work.  Could you post the pic?
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: G.Michael on December 01, 2008, 11:28:20 PM
The link, posted above, should work if it's copied and pasted. I thought someone who reads Russian might be able to discern some context for the image -- when was it painted, for example? Clearly, it depicts the palace as painted white. Now, whether this was the ORIGINAL color, I don't know . . . but surely the palace has not always been blue.

(http://i377.photobucket.com/albums/oo212/gmoverall/e92.jpg)
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Vassili_Vorontsoff on December 03, 2008, 05:58:51 AM
http://74.125.43.100/translate_c?hl=fr&sl=ru&tl=fr&u=http://saint-petersburg.ru/m/221973/zimniy_dworets__w_peterburge_stanet_nebesnogo_tsweta.html&usg=ALkJrhhA0GdxKOjevffwwE36taoqIxcIBQ


The original color of the winter palace will changed!
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on December 03, 2008, 07:39:53 AM
Fascinating!  I think it's interesting that they are painting the Winter Palace blue, since according to the Hermitage's own website, it has never been so.  Personally, I've always liked the green.  It helps tell the Winter Palace apart from the Catherine Palace for those people who aren't as observant as they should be.  The new blue will contrast nicely with the yellow of the General Staff building, though.  Honestly, if the WP was painted its original yellow, I think that would be too much for Palace Square.

Back to the Catherine Palace, I think somewhere I've seen a painting of the palace dating from Elizabeth's time and it showed it blue.  I'll have to track it down.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Joanna on December 14, 2008, 09:42:01 PM
Photo of the restored Catherine Palace basement that contains a conference hall, staff cafe, office and some living space:
http://www.d-c.spb.ru/archiv/34/33/index.html

Joanna
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Douglas on December 14, 2008, 10:19:42 PM
http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.d-c.spb.ru%2Farchiv%2F34%2F33%2Findex.html&sl=ru&tl=en&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

Here is the link that translates the article about the restored basement that Joanna posted above.  Just click on the link  and the article is in English.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on May 29, 2009, 10:40:24 AM
My boss, Jerry, went to Russia about two weeks ago and took a ton of photos for me.  Here are a few of the exterior of the Catherine palace showing how the gilding is coming along.  I was surprised to see that the domes of the church are covered in scaffolding, as I thought they were in good repair and had been gilded fairly recently.  Honestly, I kind of like the encolsure-it's very Christo.  I've got some more pictures of the interior that I'll post soon.  Jerry got me some good pics of the second and third anterooms; I've had difficulty finding pics of these on the net.  Enjoy!

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091160-1.jpg)

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091167-1.jpg)

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091301-1.jpg)

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091322-1.jpg)

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091315-1.jpg)

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091320-1.jpg)

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091321-1.jpg)
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Vecchiolarry on May 29, 2009, 08:24:09 PM
Hi,

The chapel was covered last August too when I was there, but there was no scaffolding of the main building then.
I will look forward to the interior photos - thank you for posting them...

Larry
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on June 06, 2009, 01:56:11 PM

Here are some good pics of the restored first anteroom.  I'll post some of the second and third anterooms later (still formatting the pics).  It's great to see the room restored to what is (presumably) Rastrelli's original intent.  I love the stoves, but I have to admit I had a fondness for the 19th century etageres as well.  I wonder how accurate the stoves are to the original design?

An overall view of the room (not sure why there is carpet in there...):

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Saint_Petersburg_Catherine_Palace_5.jpg)

A wall elevation-you can see into the second anteroom beyond:

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Saint_Petersburg_Catherine_Palace_4.jpg)

Here are two views of the corners with stoves:

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091217.jpg)

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/CatherinePalacefirstanteroom3.jpg)

Close up of the ceiling:

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/CatherinePalacefirstanteroomceiling.jpg)

Hope everyone enjoys these. 

Forum admin-I hope the pics aren't too large.  If so, let me know.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: BobG on June 07, 2009, 06:59:40 AM
These are wonderful pix.  Hoping your boss has lots more to share! 
Aren't digital cameras amazing!
thanks for posting them.
BobG
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Vassili_Vorontsoff on June 08, 2009, 09:02:15 AM
I'm mesmerized, great pics really,  -Architect I hope you received my mail with the russian links-

Vassia
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on June 10, 2009, 12:10:14 PM
Here are a few pics of the First Anteroom that I forgot.

Here is an elevation of one of the side walls.

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091215.jpg)

Here is one looking through the room.  I thought this was particularly interesting because, if you look above the last window, you can see that they left the cherubs unrestored.  It's nice to be able to appreciate how it used to be.

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091209.jpg)

I will post pics of the other two anterooms soon.  Sorry it's taking me longer than I thought.

Vassia-thank you for the wonderful email!  I hope you got my response.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on June 25, 2009, 11:43:35 AM

Sorry it has taken me so long to post more pics, but here is what I have for the Second Anteroom.

Some prewar pics.  I know that the titles on the photos say they are the First Anteroom, but the cannot be-just look at the pilaster capitals and the pictures I already posted of the First Anteroom.  As you can see, the room used to have some small fireplaces with heavy rococo mirrors above them and on the opposite wall were those wonderful porcelain etageres.  Both the fireplaces and the etageres were 19th century additions and have not been restored.

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/IMG_0257.jpg)

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/IMG_0256.jpg)

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/IMG_0258.jpg)

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/IMG_4353.jpg)

Here is what it looks like today.  On one wall there are Rastrelli's stoves and on the other Quarenghi's fireplaces.  I think it is interesting how they tried to create a transition from Baroque to Neoclassical.  I am a little confused as to some of the changes of decor.  The two main wall elevations are very different from one another, but also look quite a bit different restored.  See how one central door now has a window over it?  Then again, a lot of the carved decoration above the fireplaces looks pretty heavy in the old pics, which leads me to believe it was 19th century.

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091221.jpg)

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091218.jpg)

I'm sorry I don't have any more pics of this room.  My boss took a video of it that sweeps from one wall to the other, but I'm having issues putting it on photobucket (not sure why, it took the others).  Can we post video's here anyway? 
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Svetabel on June 26, 2009, 12:20:19 AM


I'm sorry I don't have any more pics of this room.  My boss took a video of it that sweeps from one wall to the other, but I'm having issues putting it on photobucket (not sure why, it took the others).  Can we post video's here anyway? 

You can put your video on some site like youtube for example and then post the link to it here.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on July 17, 2009, 11:00:09 AM
Good idea Svetabel.  I'll post it soon.  Sorry I haven't had a chance to yet.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on July 17, 2009, 11:08:23 AM
Here, at last, is the Third Anteroom.  My apologies that I dragged this out so much.

Corner of the room with fireplace.

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091226.jpg)

Elevation of the long wall.

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091223.jpg)

Detail of central doorway.

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091225.jpg)

Detail of roundel above a fireplace.

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091227.jpg)

The fantastic ceiling.

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/Balticcruise20091222.jpg)

Originally instead of Catherine the Great's apartments, there were two more anterooms and an immense staircase at the far end of the palace, which was under a dome and was the main entrance.  The staircase was based on the Ambassador's staircase at Versailles.  I've only ever seen plans of it, but I'm sure it was spectacular.  I'm constantly amazed at the sheer variety Rastrelli existed.  The whole palace was variations on the same theme but with unlimited creativity.  If anyone has any more info on these long-lost rooms, I'd love to hear it.  Do Rastrelli's drawings survive?
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Alexander1917 on July 19, 2009, 10:22:27 AM
Some images from the restauration works in july 2009, views of the courtyard


(http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w245/alexander1917/DSCI0210.jpg)

(http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w245/alexander1917/DSCI0207.jpg)
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on October 06, 2009, 03:30:38 PM
Now that the main enfilade has been almost totally restored, does anyone know what will be done with the 'minor' enfilade that adjoins it?  I know there was a baroque bedroom that was used by both Catherine the Great and Alexander I, as well as some beautiful Neoclassical rooms made for Maria Feodorovna (Paul I's wife).  I'll post some pics of these later, but if anyone has any information, it would be most welcome.

Also, any news on how Catherine the Great's apartments are coming?  Has the Arabesque Hall been completed?
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Vladimir_V. on October 09, 2009, 02:39:11 PM
Also, any news on how Catherine the Great's apartments are coming?

A journalist asked this question one year ago. The director said that there is only a project but really they don`t know who can repeat today the glass work for the decoration of the walls.


Has the Arabesque Hall been completed?

Deadline is June 2010!

Probably the next will be the Lion Hall, than the Chinese Hall and the Cupola Room. I think it will be logical in logistic point of view. There is a staircase after the Cupola Room which goes to the first floor (to the wardrobe).
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on October 13, 2009, 07:20:43 AM
Thanks Vladimir!  It's so exciting to think we will get to see some of Cameron's interiors restored soon.  I'm especially curious to see what they do for the Lyon Room and the Chinese Hall.  I'm curious to see what time period they restore them to.  The Lyon Room was altered somewhat in the 19th century by Monighetti, who added all that wonderful lapiz lazuli furniture.  I'm sure they'd still include that, but Monighetti altered the ceiling to insert his chandelier, so maybe that will be Cameron's?  As for the Chinese Hall, I've only seen some bad photos and some 19th century watercolors, which show the room looking very Victorian.  Cameron's original design called for a sort of shelf with a recess, but I don't know if that was even built in the first place.

I hope they can figure out something for the glass.  I know that at least one piece of milk glass from Catherine's bedroom survives.  The drew a portrait of one of her lovers on it and it was preserved.  At least her bedroom and the Tabetiere are very small, so that should make things a little easier.

I will post those photos of the minor enfilade soon, probably by this weekend.

Thanks again for the info!
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on October 31, 2009, 03:12:45 PM
Here is some info on the minor enfilade.  Of course it originally was all designed by Rastrelli, but was partially redecorated in 1820 after a fire.  Alexander I had a suite of rooms made for his mother, Maria Feodorovna, though she never used them.  The suite consisted of a Reception Room, Karelian Drawing Room, Blue Drawing Room and a Bedchamber.  I only have pictures of the Karelian or Red Drawing room and the Blue Drawing room.  The whole suite was designed by Vasili Stasov.  If anyone else has photos of the Reception Room or Bedchamber, I would love to see them.  Does anyone know when they will be restored?  I believe they are currently being used for exhibition halls?  If anyone could let me know, I'd appreciate it.

The Karelian, or Red Drawing Room

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/IMG_0770.jpg)

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/IMG_0763.jpg)

The Blue Drawing Room.  I have to admit I find this room particularly fine.

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/IMG_0772.jpg)

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/IMG_0761.jpg)

Here is some of Stasov's furniture for the Blue Drawing Room:

(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o236/architectcs/Catherine%20Palace/Alexander%20Palace%20Forum/IMG_0773.jpg)

There is also the bedroom of Alexander I that was originally used by Catherine the Great and was designed by Rastrelli, but I'll save that for another post.

Incidentally, these photos came from the book 'Tsarskoye Selo: The Imperial Summer Residence' (which you can find in the Alexander Palace Book Finder) and 'Tsarskoe Selo: Furniture and Interiors' by Loukomskii. 
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Jamesffarley on February 03, 2010, 02:50:42 PM
Does anyone have floor plans of the Catherine Palace?
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: maribel on May 27, 2010, 06:11:12 PM
I am looking for pictures that can be reproduced of The Amber Room.  Can anyone direct me to books, catalog, etc....
Maribel
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: richard_1990 on May 27, 2010, 11:21:33 PM
http://www.geo.uw.edu.pl/HOBBY/AMBER/amberroom.jpeg
http://www.thehistoryblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/02/amberroom.jpg
http://www.imaging-and-art.com/russia/rus_images/amber-room.jpg
http://image63.webshots.com/63/8/89/55/470588955FDIKVQ_fs.jpg

There are plenty on google.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Constantinople on May 28, 2010, 12:05:11 PM
the feeling that I get when I look at those pictures, i think what would it look like if i covered a room's walls in toffee or peanut brittle.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: lilianna on August 24, 2010, 01:24:36 AM
http://www.vesti.ru/doc.html?id=387521&cid=460
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on November 13, 2010, 05:27:39 PM
Does anyone have recent pictures of the exterior of the Catherine Palace?  Last I heard, they were restoring the church domes and I believe it is done now.  I also think work was being done on one of the facades.  Any info would be appreciated.  Thanks.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Alexander1917 on November 13, 2010, 07:54:00 PM
Does anyone have recent pictures of the exterior of the Catherine Palace?  Last I heard, they were restoring the church domes and I believe it is done now.  I also think work was being done on one of the facades.  Any info would be appreciated.  Thanks.

A picture could be found here.
http://www.google.de/imgres?imgurl=http://www.thecureforeverything.org/images/uploads/CatherinesPalace.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.thecureforeverything.org/&usg=__nDBrH-NpymF-3FvwBcKkUROXL1E=&h=478&w=640&sz=191&hl=de&start=15&zoom=1&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=ZwjJpfgdj_3YTM:&tbnh=102&tbnw=137&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dst%2Bcatherine%2Bpalace%2B2010%26um%3D1%26hl%3Dde%26sa%3DN%26tbs%3Disch:1

this must be recently. During my visit in May 2009 the top of the domes very very shinning from new gold. but the the other parts of the church were scaffolded.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on April 11, 2011, 08:00:50 PM
Does anyone know what work is being done at the Catherine Palace these days?  They finished the Arabesque Hall last year-has any progress been made on the Lyon Hall?  Any work on the Chapel or any of the pavilions? 
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Vladimir_V. on April 29, 2011, 10:48:11 AM
Catherine Palace - no plans. New goal is the AP. In June we see 2nd floor.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: PAVLOV on May 04, 2011, 08:06:41 AM
Are you saying that they are restoring the 2nd floor of the AP ?
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Vladimir_V. on May 04, 2011, 10:18:31 AM
Restoration is a long process and I think we see the rooms before the restoration. TS director Olga Taratynova said that the museum opens an exhibition in June in the AP (the 2nd floor).

She also said that they start to restore the garden facade of the Catherine Palace and the Agate Rooms.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Alexandre Mikhaelovitch on July 11, 2011, 02:31:26 AM
The Lower Bathhouse of Tsarskoïe Selo are restored and opened !!  Here a video : http://www.angelfire.com/pa/ImperialRussian/news/356news.html

The history of this pavilion : http://eng.tzar.ru/museums/palaces/catherine_park/regular/lower_bath
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: G.Michael on July 10, 2012, 10:01:07 PM
To bring back an old discussion from earlier in this thread, I recently stumbled across another depiction of the Catherine Palace in yellow, this one apparently from the 1830s. I don't know about the original color, but it seems the palace was not always blue.

http://antiquariy.ru/engraving-4-151.html
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: bongo on August 04, 2013, 12:07:52 PM
The proportions of the Great Hall in the Catherine Palace have always looked odd to me, and not quite right.
Now thanks to the new found autochrome I see my suspicions were correct: the original ceiling was higher and coved. I've seen a photograph of the ruins with some of the beams still intact above the coved section, so why did they choose to lower it and ruin the historical proportions - esp with their usual commitment to historical exactitude? It's quite shocking!

(http://www.angelfire.com/pa/ImperialRussian/blog/0920a.jpg)
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: londo954 on August 04, 2013, 05:22:00 PM
I remember seeing a documentary years ago on the restoration of the main ballroom . It was done by National Geographic. You are correct about the proportions but there had to be a reason. From my own research on Russian Palace architecture I have found that each successive occupant of a given palace would alter it to suit their own tastes. the post war restorers had to decide as to WHEN to restore the rooms to... I suggest that they current look of the main ballroom reflects an earlier period before the pciture posted.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: bongo on August 04, 2013, 09:40:15 PM
Here's the photograph of the damaged hall. You can see the remaining beams resting higher on the third tier which now no longer exists. I can't believe the hall ever looked as it does now with the mis-proportioned ceiling, so recreating it thus makes no sense. In terms of proportions its as disastrous as the modern dome on the Berlin Cathedral. Both look odd. Say what you like about the past: trained in classical studies at least architects then got their proportions right.

I can't find any mention of this lowered ceiling anywhere so it's intriguing.

(http://www.angelfire.com/pa/ImperialRussian/blog/0920b.JPG)
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: londo954 on August 06, 2013, 10:36:16 PM
I did a comparison with a modern day photograph and the older one posted here. I noticed that there could be a possible explanation. If you examine a current photo it appears that the ceiling g painting was extend to cover the third tier. I suggest that the ceiling being lower is an illusion created by the extension of the painting and removal of the third tier of decoration. The decorative element could have been a later addition.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: londo954 on August 07, 2013, 02:21:10 PM
I know at the time of the restoration (from the National Geographic documentary) that there was a concern over the amount of gold leave needed to gild the decorative elements in the room. Most likely the painting was extended to save some money. What you need to find is the original plans which a lot of the restoration work was based on. The ceiling itself is a miracle since it was reproduced based on black and which photographs.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: londo954 on August 08, 2013, 12:06:09 AM
Here is two links that are photographs taken of the Great Hall
The first is 1900.....
http://www.hermitagemuseum.org/fcgi-bin/db2www/descrPage.mac/descrPage?selLang=English&indexClass=PICTURE_EN&PID=JRFT-32599&numView=1&ID_NUM=3&thumbFile=%2Ftmplobs%2FC91A_233_40AO_40KK0NL_236.jpg&embViewVer=last&comeFrom=quick&sorting=no&thumbId=6&numResults=34&tmCond=Catherine+Palace&searchIndex=TAGFILEN&author=Nikolayevsky%2C%26%2332%3BFiodor
the second is 1859
http://www.hermitagemuseum.org/fcgi-bin/db2www/descrPage.mac/descrPage?selLang=English&indexClass=PICTURE_EN&PID=JRFT-32495&numView=1&ID_NUM=11&thumbFile=%2Ftmplobs%2FOU7P4EQ3PXC0P0GB6.jpg&embViewVer=last&comeFrom=quick&sorting=no&thumbId=6&numResults=34&tmCond=Catherine+Palace&searchIndex=TAGFILEN&author=Richebourg%2C%26%2332%3BE.

Note the changes in the decorative elements on the third tier???
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: londo954 on August 08, 2013, 11:19:16 AM
Eureka I have discovered why the difference in the ceiling. This is from the Tsarkoe Selo Website:

In 1953–54, during restoration work on St Michael’s Castle in St Petersburg, the side parts of Valeriani’s ceiling painting – the Allegory of Peace and Allegory of Victory that had been considered lost – were rediscovered. Thanks to that find, it was decided to recreate the ceiling decoration in its original form, returning the two surviving elements to the Catherine Palace. The recreation of the central part was aided by the existence of so me rough sketches by Valeriani and his description of the composition with an interpretation of all the allegories plus a drawing made by Stakenschneider in 1857, when the ceilings in several of the state rooms were redecorated to designs by the court architect

It would seem that when the room was restored the original ceiling painting was restored which did not include the third tier of decoration. As I hypothesized the original painting was much bigger and the room was altered in between.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: ArchitectCS on August 16, 2013, 12:02:15 PM
The question of the ceiling is something that has always bothered me, but if you look at the rest of Rastrelli's architecture in the palace, the current design makes sense. In all of the other large ante rooms, he used a flat ceiling. It was only in the smaller one story rooms that a cove was used. Making it flat makes it consistent with the rest of the architecture in this portion of the palace.

The other thing that has bothered me is that in the old pictures there are candelabra on either side of the mirrors on the lower and upper level while there currently are candles on only the lower. It makes the room look rather dark in the upper portion. Anyone have any idea why this is? Is it the original design?
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: londo954 on August 16, 2013, 04:00:55 PM
A guess.... remember the palace (like the AP) was originally a Summer Palace ....
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Alexandre Mikhaelovitch on September 27, 2013, 11:51:42 AM
Agate Rooms re-open from September 27 !!!

http://eng.tzar.ru/info/info-events/title/?id=3233
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Alexandre Mikhaelovitch on June 05, 2015, 06:59:06 PM
Restoration of Catherine Palace Chapel

http://www.angelfire.com/pa/ImperialRussian/blog/index.blog/1468042/restoration-of-catherine-palace-chapel-to-cost-1-billion-rubles/
Title: Hello Group
Post by: Dwightzery on February 27, 2017, 05:33:18 AM
Hello,
 
I'm the new guy. I justed wanted to say hello to the gang in hopes of making new freinds.
I hope everyone is doing great and I'm looking forward to great discussions within the site.
Have a good day!(http://www.xdreamsx100.site/images/happy.jpeg)(http://www.xdreamsx100.site/images/happy.jpeg)
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Alexandre Mikhaelovitch on March 01, 2017, 01:05:43 PM
Welcome for your arrival Dwightzery ^^

Latest news for the restoration of the Catherine Palace : after the restoration of the  the golden chandelier made of lapis lazuli and gilded bronze and the gilt-bronze and lapis-lazuli furniture set , a door of the fabulous Lyons room was recently restored .

(photos from the facebook page of the Tsarskoie Selo State Museum).

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/01//1703010756405012514885308.jpg) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703010756405012514885308.jpg)
©Tsarskoye Selo State Museum

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/01//1703010756195012514885299.jpg) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703010756195012514885299.jpg)
©Tsarskoye Selo State Museum

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/01//1703010756285012514885302.jpg) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703010756285012514885302.jpg)
©Tsarskoye Selo State Museum

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/01//1703010756155012514885298.jpg) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703010756155012514885298.jpg)
©Tsarskoye Selo State Museum

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/01//1703010756395012514885306.jpg) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703010756395012514885306.jpg)
©Tsarskoye Selo State Museum

The lapis-lazli and golden door was restored by Amber room team :

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/01//1703010756275012514885301.jpg) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703010756275012514885301.jpg)
©Tsarskoye Selo State Museum

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/01//1703010756105012514885297.jpg) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703010756105012514885297.jpg)
©Tsarskoye Selo State Museum

http://eng.tzar.ru/museums/palaces/c_atherine/lyons_hall



Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Sanochka on March 01, 2017, 03:41:56 PM
Absolutely stunning.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Joanna on March 26, 2017, 06:56:28 PM
(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/01//1703010756405012514885308.jpg) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703010756405012514885308.jpg)
©Tsarskoye Selo State Museum

I am in awe of the restorers work. Magnificent!

Joanna
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: JGP on March 27, 2017, 11:16:05 AM
(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/01//1703010756405012514885308.jpg) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703010756405012514885308.jpg)
©Tsarskoye Selo State Museum

I am in awe of the restorers work. Magnificent!

Joanna
I am too!  That is a beautiful facsimile.
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Alexandre Mikhaelovitch on March 29, 2017, 01:33:03 PM
Dear members , anothers photos of the Lyons Hall :

Fabulous details of the golden and lapis-lazuli restored doorway :

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/04//1703040904495012514889764.png) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703040904495012514889764.png)

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/04//1703040905005012514889766.png) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703040905005012514889766.png)

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/04//1703040905125012514889768.png) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703040905125012514889768.png)

Views of the Lyon's room with original furnitures and an imperial inlaid piano .
We can see too the fabulous recently restored chandelier of empress Maria , wife of emperor Alexander II :

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/04//1703040904305012514889761.png) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703040904305012514889761.png)

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/04//1703040904365012514889762.png) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703040904365012514889762.png)

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/04//1703040905295012514889771.png) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703040905295012514889771.png)

Details of the piano's marquetry :

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/04//1703040905245012514889770.png) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703040905245012514889770.png)

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/04//1703040905185012514889769.png) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703040905185012514889769.png)

And finally on the foreground a view of the future restored inlaid parquet (also burned during the WWII): 2 m² have been already reconstitued :

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/04//1703040905045012514889767.png) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703040905045012514889767.png)

Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Alexandre Mikhaelovitch on March 29, 2017, 01:45:17 PM
For memory , the original Lyons Hall (here painting by Hau , circa 1860) ... there is still work to be done ! ^^
(you recognize the doorway to the right . The original pearl and precious wood inlaid door leaves still exist , held in reserve).
click on for best resolution ;)

(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/29//1703290904045012514952823.jpg) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703290904045012514952823.jpg)
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Joanna on March 29, 2017, 06:14:54 PM
(http://nsm07.casimages.com/img/2017/03/29//1703290904045012514952823.jpg) (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=1703290904045012514952823.jpg)

Do pieces from the ceiling still exist?

Joanna 
Title: Re: Catherine Palace Restoration
Post by: Alexandre Mikhaelovitch on March 31, 2017, 11:12:27 AM

Do pieces from the ceiling still exist?

Joanna

Sadly the ceiling burned too in 1944.
The Carrare marble fireplace disapeared too  : you can see it here in 1917 and 1942-43 . The Lyons Hall was still intact . 1944 was the horrific year for the palace.
http://forum.alexanderpalace.org/index.php?topic=6503.60