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1
Having Fun! / Re: Russian Quizzo/Trivia Round
« on: March 11, 2017, 04:20:14 PM »
Which large Russian island is named in honour of an important Romanov relative, with the neighbouring island not named in honour of this relative's mother, as one would presume, but in honour of the predecessor of a princess of an Ascanian fief on the Lahn?

edubs almost cracked this one, but no-one took it further:

These Russian islands are part of the Arctic Franz Joseph Land / Земля Франца-Иосифа in the Barents Sea (east of Svalbard / Spitsbergen). (And as a Norwegian I of course think they should have gone with the post-Revolutionary proposal Fridtjof Nansen Land. (Another pre-Revolutionary proposal was Romanov Land / Земля Романовых!))

The large westernmost islands of the archipelago are called Prince George Land / Земля Георга, named by a British explorer for George V of the UK. The neighbouring island Alexandra Land / Земля Александры was named in honour of Grand Duchess Alexandra Pavlovna (1783–1801), married to Archduke Joseph of Austria, Paladin of Hungary, who after her early and tragic death due to childbirth remarried to Princess Hermine of Anhalt-Bernburg-Schaumburg-Hoym (Anhalt = Ascanian, Schaumburg is on the Lahn - see this post for more info). This according to the English Wikipedia, which leads you to believe this island was named by the Austrian-Hungarian North Pole Expedition who named the archipelago itself.

But then I now see that the Russian and German Wikipedias claim that Alexandra Land was actually named by a British explorer after George V's mother, Alexandra of Denmark! It is more logical, as the Austrian-Hungarian expedition seems to have concentrated on the islands further east (Prince Rudolph Island, Wiener Neustad Island! etc.)

Anyways lots of turn-of-the-century royal names up there in the realm of die Könige auf dem ewigen Eis - the kings on the eternal ice. (Ostalgic pop hit about polar bears from DDR / GDR.)


2


I think the name is Hans Otto Adolph von Koetteritz.  (Instead of Herr Otto Adolph v. Koetteritz.)
Father's name is probably Hans Ernst Julius von Koetteritz. His rank is Oberstleutnant, Lieutenant Colonel.

NB the name Hans is a short form of Johannes and can as such also be rendered as Johann (and Russified into Ivan).

I doubt Yulevich / Julevitch / Юльевич is a matronymic. Much more likely it's a patronymic from Julius (German) / Jules (French) / Юлий / Yuliy (Russian). Doesn't necessarily have to be from a biological father, but possibly from an (Orthodox) godfather.





3
Some Lieutenant Colonel Julius von Kötteritz (from Saxony, died in Vilnius in 1819) from a database of foreigners in pre-Revolutionary Russia:
http://dokumente.ios-regensburg.de/amburger/index.php?id=27718&mode=1

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Rulers Prior to Nicholas II / Re: Did Catherine the Great lie
« on: March 04, 2017, 09:41:34 AM »
The bad and abusive one was the Baltic-Swedish tutor Otto Friedrich von Brümmer (engaged by Peter III's uncle, after his father's death, dismissed by his aunt in Russia), but the tutors chosen by his father, who remained as assistants during Brümmer's time, were good tutors: Pastor Gustav Christoph Hosmann and the French teacher Monsieur Mild. In addition his aunt Elisabeth engaged a very good German tutor for him in Russia: Professor Jakob Stählin.

He was also accompanied on his journey to Russia by a very good and caring scientist: Johann Albrecht Korf. He wrote an account of the journey and portrayed the young Peter as an intelligent and sensitive youngster. He had to leave his beloved dog in Kiel and was rather upset about this. (Remember he was only 11-12 years old and had lost both his parents. The dog was, together with his tutors and his trusted and loyal equerry / valet Bastian, his friends and family.) So one of the things he was most curious about regarding Russia was Russian dogs, dog breeds and if he could get a new dog in Russia.

His father was a rather educated man and ruler and took great care of his son's education untill he died. His aunt Empress Elisabeth, although uneducated and frivolous herself, took a wise and careful approach to her heir's education, at least in theory. (One problem was the many interruptions in the schedule due to the many parties and balls she hosted and wanted Peter to attend.) All this according to Elena Palmer.

5
Rulers Prior to Nicholas II / Re: Did Catherine the Great lie
« on: March 04, 2017, 09:09:58 AM »
I recommend this book to balance Catherine's malevolent justifications and all the historians who believed her:

In Peter's native Kiel last summer I happened upon a little book about Peter III, a German biography called "Peter III - der Prinz von Holstein" by Russian-German Elena Palmer. I now see it has been translated into English too: https://www.amazon.com/Peter-III-REBIRTH-Elena-Palmer-ebook/dp/B00B3NF5FI. Although a bit hagiographic, it certainly shows how Peter III and his enlightened plans for Russia can be shown in a totally different light if you rely on other sources than Catherine's very biased propaganda. He was as educated and enlightened as his wife, with great plans for reforms, but more pedantic (and gentle) and far less politically savvy / ruthless than his wife. He truly wanted to be an enlightened monarch, Catherine just pretended to be.

It also gave some very interesting insights into the relationship between Peter and his tutors. Some were abusive, but others were kind, caring and loyal and instilled very high (and unrealistic) ideals in him.

6
Nicholas II / Re: The Romanov bloodline decending from 4th century AD
« on: February 25, 2017, 06:14:41 AM »
I'll keep it up.

Do you have any ideas for a sarcasm emojo?

I like the tongue-in-cheek: :p

7
Nicholas II / Re: The Romanov bloodline decending from 4th century AD
« on: February 24, 2017, 12:03:54 PM »
I'm exercising my rather dry sense of humour by approaching the absurd claims with a degree of mock seriousness!
The points are serious, but the tone is intended to be mocking (or is it a bit too dry?).

Lol, I was wondering if you were serious, thinking you were much too generously condescending! Great deadpan delivery :-)

8
Nicholas II / Re: The Romanov bloodline decending from 4th century AD
« on: February 24, 2017, 11:41:43 AM »
I'm sure that would be useful for Preved as well as me.

Gogol is fast becoming my favourite Russian author because of his outrageous sarcasm. Just the obsession with rank and a bodily characteristic in "The Nose" is enough to make one think of our dear Junker von Ebert, but consider this dinner scene at a peculiar noble's nest in a godforsaken rural backwater, from "Dead Souls":

In the dining-room there were already two boys, Manilov's sons, children of an age to sit at the dinner table but still on high chairs. With them was their tutor, who bowed politely with a smile. The lady of the house sat behind the soup tureen; the visitor was placed between his host and hostess. A servant tied dinner napkins round the children's necks.

'What charming children!' said Tchitchikov, looking at them. 'How old are they?'

'The elder is eight and the younger was six yesterday,' said Madame Manilov.

'Themistoclus,' said Manilov, addressing the elder boy who was trying to free his chin which had been tied up in the dinner napkin by the footman. Tchitchikov raised his eyebrows a little when he heard this somewhat Greek name, which for some unknown reason Manilov ended with the syllable us; but he tried at once to bring his countenance back to its usual expression.

'Themistoclus! tell me which is the finest town in France?'

At this point the tutor concentrated his whole attention on Themistoclus and looked as though he were going to spring into his face, but was completely reassured at last and nodded his head when Themistoclus said: 'Paris.'

'And which is our finest town?' Manilov asked again.

The tutor pricked up his ears again.

'Petersburg,' answered Themistoclus.

'And any other?'

'Moscow,' answered Themistoclus.

'The clever boy, the darling!' Tchitchikov said upon this. 'Upon my soul,' he went on, addressing the Manilovs with an air of some astonishment, 'at his age, and already so much knowledge. I can assure you that that child will show marked abilities!'

'Oh, you don't know him yet,' answered Manilov, 'he has a very keen wit. The younger now, Alkides, is not so quick, but this fellow if he comes upon anything such as a beetle or a lady-bird, his eyes are racing after it at once; he runs after it and notices it directly. I intend him for the diplomatic service. Themistoclus,' he went on, addressing the boy again, 'would you like to be an ambassador?'

'Yes, I should,' answered Themistoclus, munching bread, and wagging his head from right to left.

At that moment the footman standing behind his chair wiped the ambassador's nose, and he did well, as something very unpleasant might else have dropped into the soup. The conversation at the dinner table began upon the charms of a tranquil life, interspersed with observations from the hostess about the town theatre and the actors in it. The tutor kept an attentive watch upon the speakers, and whenever he saw they were on the point of laughing, he instantly opened his mouth and laughed vigorously. Probably he was a man of grateful disposition and wished to repay the master of the house for his kindly treatment of him. On one occasion, however, his face assumed a severe expression and he sternly tapped on the table, fastening his eyes on the children sitting opposite him. This was in the nick of time, for Themistoclus had just bitten Alkides' ear, and Alkides, screwing up his eyes and opening his mouth, was on the point of breaking into piteous sobs, but, reflecting that he might easily lose the rest of his dinner, he brought his mouth back to its normal position and, with tears in his eyes, began gnawing a mutton bone till both his cheeks were greasy and shining.


I'm sure their ludicrious father just as well could have given them Merovingian instead of high-flying Greek names and be led to believe (the novel is about swindling, after all) that the scars of fraternal strife on their ears were divine auspices that little Themistoclus was destined to be become an ambassador and have the ear of the great of this earth or, with his bent for scientific inquiry, a great and misunderstood geneticist!

The next matter is your comments of this writer shows he is a want to be royal, that is the last thing I would want to be, as royals work harder and longer for their subjects than any of us who have a degree or otherwise. 
Those who still have subjects, yes. Who do you think the Orléans, the Romanovs, the Hohenzollerns etc. have worked for for the last 100 years?

9
Nicholas II / Re: The Romanov bloodline decending from 4th century AD
« on: February 21, 2017, 06:30:30 PM »
Quote
Might you be an expert in DNA inherited visible markers from birth or only an expert in criticizing.
I corrected an error that you were constantly making.  Nicholas 11 means Nicholas the Eleventh.  No such Tsar existed.
 
Going by his own esoteric logic that sees secret Merovingian patterns in everything there is perhaps (anything is likely, just ask him!) a hidden meaning to his usage? In Russian Nicholas 11. / XI = Николай одиннадцатый = Nikolay odinnadtsatniy, which can be broken down (quite contrary to grammar and etymology à la von Ebert) to odin + nad + tsatoy = Odinn / Wothan above the crescent! So Nicholas 11 is Odinn who will defeat Islam in his Caucasian homeland! Hail Odinn, Rurik and Sæhrímnir, the boar (Eber > Eberhart > (von) Ebert) feasted upon in Valhall!

BTW Your high- and well-earlobed dudeness: Nicholas 2. is also quite acceptable.

10
Some great maps:
Hesse-Kassel and Hesse-Darmstadt in the 17th century: http://www.lagis-hessen.de//img/ga/s3/25.jpg
Hesse-Kassel 1567-1866: http://www.lagis-hessen.de//img/ga/s3/26.jpg
Hesse-Darmstadt 1567-1866: http://www.lagis-hessen.de//img/ga/s3/27.jpg
Maps of Hessian history: http://langen.ykom.de/geschichtlicheratlas.html

11
Continued from http://forum.alexanderpalace.org/index.php?topic=16966.msg549954#msg549954

Hesse-Philippsthal and Hesse-Philippsthal-Barchfeld were not immediate (reichsunmittelbare) houses, like Hesse-Kassel, Hesse-Darmstadt and Hesse-Homburg (by some regarded as immediate after 1768), but examples of mediate paragium / partagium / pariage / paréage (shared control of a territory, with the paragierter Herr / Landgraf having local jurisdiction, but not sovereignty). It was similar to the situation of the abgeteilte Herren in Schleswig-Holstein, i.e. the Dukes of Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg and their cadets line Augustenburg and Beck / Glücksborg.

These cadet lines did not have any other immediate territories (just mediate lordships) to title themselves with besides the collective titles of the House of Hesse and as such they used the same titles as junior members of the main lines. (The designations Hesse-Philippsthal-Barchfeld etc. were just like H-Kassel and H-Darmstadt just geographical terms for their territories or dynastic lines and not officially used as titles.)

All members of the House of Hesse were (and could bear the arms of):
Landgraves of Hesse (the Landgraviate was divided between all lines, the larger part was controlled by Hesse-Kassel, partly due to control over the Hesse-Marburg division)
Counts of Nidda (controlled by Hesse-Darmstadt)
Counts of Ziegenhain (ended up controlled by Hesse-Kassel)
Counts of Katzenelnbogen (the title and some territory divided with the House of Nassau (the Orange-Nassaus are still Counts of K), but the Lower County by the Rhine was controlled by Hesse-Kassel and the Upper County south of the Main, around Darmstadt, was controlled by Hesse-Darmstadt and led to the designation Hesse extending south of the Main)
Counts of Diez (part of the Katzenelnbogen inheritance, but most of this part was controlled by the Nassaus, only smaller parts were Hessian)

Territories acquired after the main divisions in the 16th century, the titles used by at least the heads of both / all main lines:
Counts of Schaumburg (divided with Hannover and the line of Lippe that called itself Schaumburg-Lippe, the Hessian part (exclave north of Kassel) was controlled by Hesse-Kassel
Princes of Hersfeld (secularized monastic territory controlled by Hesse-Kassel, location of the territories of some of the cadet lines)
Counts of Hanau and Rieneck, Lords of Münzenberg (Hanau was controlled by Hesse-Kassel, Rieneck became Bavarian and Münzenberg was controlled by Hesse-Darmstadt)

(Counts of Isenburg and Büdingen - Hesse-Darmstadt acquired these titles in the 17th century, but did not mediatize the territories (some parts ended up in Hesse-Kassel) untill the 19th century.)

In the 17th and 18th century you would probably see unofficial or semi-official references to Princes and Princesses of Hesse-Kassel and Hesse-Darmstadt, but these mere geographical and dynastical terms were never official. The rulers themselves were sometimes referred to as X, Landgraf von Hessen zu Kassel / Darmstadt etc., i.e. Landgrave of Hesse at Kassel / Darmstadt etc.

Then, after the Napoleonic wars, you get limited titles for each main branch:
Hesse-Kassel: Electorate of Hessen (including the Principiality of Fritzlar), Electoral Prince and Prince and Princess of Hesse.
Hesse-Darmstadt: Grand Duchy of Hesse, Grand Duke of Hesse and by Rhine and Prince and Princess of Hesse and by Rhine.
1815-1866 the title Landgrave of Hesse was first and foremost used by the reigning Prince of Hesse-Homburg (who added Prince of Hersfeld and Count of Katzenelnbogen, Diez, Ziegenhain, Nidda, Schaumburg, Isenburg and Büdingen, since he didn't have a general sovereign title like his cousins in Kassel and Darmstadt.

12
Alexandra Feodorovna / Re: voices of the Imperial Family
« on: February 20, 2017, 06:19:24 PM »
Maybe Alexandra Fyodorovna sounded a bit like Stalin in Russian? :P

I wonder if Alexandra Fyodorovna's Russian sounded somewhat like Stalin's, who spoke Russian well, but with a Georgian accent.
Stalin speaking, with less palatalisation (i.e. Aliksandra and Stalin instead of Alʲiksandra and Stalʲ in) and vowel reduction (i.e. Aleksandra Fyodorovna instead of Ehliksandreh Fyodaravneh)  than a native Russian: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gp7IQRZ6MTI
Background-wise, as you can hear here, Stalin's native Georgian is not that different, phonetically, from AF's native German and RP English: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TpU3ktOXQ_k

I think both may have struggled equally with the palatalisation, but perhaps AF had less problems with spelling pronunciation (including lack of vowel reduction), as she got more oral tutoring when learning the language than Stalin did in the seminary, whose focus on Church Slavic without vowel reduction perhaps added to him exhibiting that feature.

13
Having Fun! / Re: Russian Quizzo/Trivia Round
« on: February 20, 2017, 04:26:50 PM »
Additional side question...with higher mortality rates and shorter life expectancy it made sense for most couple to get started in the child bearing process sooner rather than later.

For royals who were desperate for (male) heirs, yes, but not for most people, who rather wanted to limit the numbers of mouths to feed and the number of heirs sharing an inheritance / farm / livelihood. One of the traits that made Western Europe stand out from the rest of the world and spearhead modernity (and romantic love?) was exactly this pattern of late marriage (mid to late 20s) and a significant minority remaining lifelong singles and thus fewer children, who were better provided for. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_European_marriage_pattern. Russia and European royalty were in this respect "east of the Hajnal line", while you can observe the pattern very well in Norwegian peasants before industrialisation, with mothers as young as Alexandra Pavlovna being very uncommon and mostly tragic cases of out-of-wedlock births, arranged marriages for very rich heiresses (early marriage as some kind of status symbol or pawn in alliance building) or other odd circumstances.

Most peasant girls and boys worked for a few years in their teens and early 20s as maids and farmhands (and engaged in nattefrieri, night courting, i.e. all kinds of romantic sleepovers, heavy petting and probably oral sex etc. without full intercourse), saved money and didn't marry (someone more or less of their own choosing) untill they could support a family, which could be the stereotypical 10-15-20 children where half of them died in infancy, but just as likely 5-6-7, where most survived. Upper-class women who did not breastfeed their babies themselves were probably fertile more often than peasant women, whose fertility was not only limited by their later marriage, but also by breastfeeding.

Quote
That said was their thought given at the time to a young woman's age and how that could be a benefit or detriment in having a healthy pregnancy?
I'm sure there was, but as with Semmelweis's case I'm sure there were very conflicting opinions.

14
Cool, how ingenious!

15
Having Fun! / Re: Russian Quizzo/Trivia Round
« on: February 20, 2017, 11:56:02 AM »
Side question...did Alexandra Pavlovna die in child birth? So young...very sad.

Yes, from puerperal fever, only 17 years old, in the city where Ignaz Semmelweiss were to make his groundbreaking discovery regarding puerperal fever a few decades later.

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