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Messages - ordino

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1
Janet, I agree with your words at all and Matushka it will be great that you sare with us those articles about V.I. Gedroyts
Thanks.
Ordino

2
Sarushka I agree with you, I don't know a lot about the labour of Gedroyts, but the information about her is full of goods actions. The link is in the message to Janet up to this. You see , maybe Gedroyts knew that Viruvova's was not serious injured, it's difficult to believe that a doctor in medicine do not pay attention to a patient, and Viruvoba was alive after the accidente and she lived several years after, so V.I. Gedroyts was o.k in her indication.
Thanks
Ordino

3
Thank you very much to you Janet, I'll look for the information about sister Valentina. Of course it will be really nice to talk about V.I. Gedroyts, she was, I think, a woman with an important roll in the russian history, don't forget, for instance, that she was the first surgeon woman in Russia.
so Janet (and everybody of course), it will be great to talk about V.I. Gedroyts, she deserved it
Thanks

Ordino

4
Janet use the translation site of altavista,  and read the story of V.I Gedroyts, there are several pages with her byography, find them. The name "Bepa" (russian) is for
http://babelfish.altavista.com/
 for us Vera in translation in English means Faith and is a very traditional name in Russian culture.
Do you know that she was deported becouse she was a revolutionary, this took place before 1905 when she come back to Russia because of the Japanesse Ward and also her parents were very upset for the dead of Sergey, the brother of Vera. Years later, she used the name of her dead brother in her publications.
And I agree with you Janet, of course Gedroyts was scientific woman and maybe with  few patient, I m sorry for Anna Vyrubova's  but it's sure that V.I. Gedroyts had a strong temper.
Thanks. Ordino

5
http://kfinkelshteyn.narod.ru/Evpatoria/Evp2.htm
I hope this time it will be ok
thanks
Ordino

6
Hello Janet;

of course I have more information about V. I. Gedroyts, there is a Russian site with information about her, I will try to post here the link to it and with the altavista site for translation you can read all the infomation in the language  that do you prefer. And please, it will be very nice to speak about this interesting woman, her life was so interesting!
Well here is the link
[ftp][http://kfinkelshteyn.narod.ru/Evpatoria/Evp2.htm/ftp]

I'll try again if not goes.
Thanks. Ordino

7
Servants, Friends and Retainers / Princess Bepa Ignat'evna of Gedroyts
« on: March 12, 2007, 03:41:38 PM »
The first russian woman surgeon, from the family of Prince Ignatius ignat'evich Gedroytsa, Bepa  ,in the russians sites her name is V. (Vera) I. (ignat'evna) Gedroyts, was a revolutionary woman in imperials times, an splendid surgeon in wards times, a poet, and author (she writed with a Spudonimum; the name of his dead brother, Sergey) and she was the tutor at hospital in Alexander Palace of Alexandra, Olga and Tatiana. Her life was full of goods actions. Is there at the forum a topic (not this) for her?. She was from Lituania
Thanks. Ordino

8
 :D :D thank you very much Helen Azar for this beautiful video.
Congratulations.
Ordino

9
The Final Chapter / Re: Realistically, was escape possible?
« on: May 18, 2006, 06:15:10 AM »
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When I said 'for that period of time', I meant much more than just those nights; I don't remember exactly how many men were originally enlisted as part of the Red Army in the Ural Soviet at the time, but two disappeared sometime between May and August of 1918, without being accounted for as casualties - in fact, their absence is not accounted for at all.  It's entirely possible that the two soldiers left or were lost before or during the executions, as well as afterwards.
But itīs a very, very interesting information and itīs very nice to read your message Ivan Komarov, thank you very much for them.
Ordino.

10
The Final Chapter / Re: Abdication and Alexandra
« on: May 16, 2006, 06:19:06 AM »
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It is very interesting of how things are remembered and not. In my reading of several statements not only on this forum and threads, but in books, etc., I am understanding [and to most readers as well that for the mainstay, HIH Alexandra chose NOT to be involved in court interfaces, and stuck primarily to herself, her family, [in the role of mother], and was anything from most reports of how most other Imperial Tsar's wives were. So, this leads me to wonder all the more about those who state presently what they do about HIH Alexandra. Letters aside, what she actually did, and on a daily basis, points exactly to how and with whom her life revolved around. Remember, this was one of the main issues the people had with her, that she was more or less, an invisible part of court interchanges, functions, etc. She however was involved foremost in charitable understandings, and that of the Russian Orthodox Church. Of course she had her private thoughts, and was certainly entitled to them. Like any family member, she probably discussed what she wished. Nothing wrong with that. Every member of every family does that. Most importantly, she was a 'private person' when it came to her emotions. HIH Alexandra was not a person who was without poise, and how to conduct herself in public, or with others. It is careless to typify her as being anything but poised, intelligent and most regal !

IF HIH Alexandra was the way many think she was, in terms of being the opposite of how to conduct her station, etc., how on earth would she take the reigns or dictate her will? This in itself would have been noted immediately.

People don't change so drastically, especially for all the years HIH Alexandra took to herself, along with her illnesses, it did not allow her to involve her much in most issues of court life, or politics for that matter. Her whole life, and focus was her children, and of course the next heir to the throne. Here of course, she had the right to rightfully stand up for her son, and his future. Her thoughts of Russia was of great love. Belochka is quite right, when she wept privately, she wept for Russia. She was not Russia's enemy, quite the contrary !

Anyway, for all of us here, it is more of less conjucture of what we thought she did or did not do.
But based on everything put together of her profile, imho, it is what I come up with to date.

Tatiana+
A very good message, Tatiana+.
Thanks. Ordino

11
The Final Chapter / Re: Realistically, was escape possible?
« on: May 16, 2006, 06:02:20 AM »
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No names, no records...so what makes them actually exsist in the first place ?
Well, can you imagine Yurosky making a perfect list of the soldiers at Ipatiev House, with names, ay ges and dates and saying at the end, "oh by the way, just the night of 16th to 17th this man, and this mas ( of course with the names, patronimics and surnames), were missing.
I cannot imagine this and donīt forget the revolution, the war, the caos. So, it will be interesting if at least two soldiers were missing those days.
Thanks. Ordino

12
The Final Chapter / Re: Pandemia  of Influenza in 1918
« on: May 15, 2006, 06:58:57 AM »
Quote
Thanks for the interesting information, itīs great. Please Phil Tomaselli about the scores of British Foreign Office and War Office files about Siberia. There were any comment about a rare or unknown disease when the Russian soldiers from the front come back to Siberia?. I rebember, not very well, that Doctor Derevenko visited the wife or a relative of a bolchevik offcial because she was ill. May be the Flu was in Siberia but they did not know it. Thanks. ordino
Any idea about this question??
Thanks. Ordino

13
The Final Chapter / Re: Realistically, was escape possible?
« on: May 15, 2006, 06:51:40 AM »
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Quote
:oVery interesting topic indeed!!! I have a lot of military training and experience. So, in my opinion of rescue and escape being possible........ I would say logistically is a nightmare. Impossible well, no. After reading the numerous posts here I can appreciate the pros and cons of the opinions being expressed.

I know that in 1917 there were no special forces, etc. But, if planned right and if one had the daring it could be done. Very risky though. Secrecy and extensive training would also play a major role in the sucess of the mission. The time needed to train men for a mission like that is also taxing and almost impossible in that time frame and period because timing and execution would be a big factor in the outcome. You would need a lot of fresh reliable intel too. Without it well, then it IS impossible. I'm just trying to break it down a little here so that even a layman would appreciate it.

I also believe that there would be a high casualty rate also which might even extend to some or all of the IF themselves. I say that because of the number of people being rescued. Hmmm.... Like I said, it'd be one big nightmare. I hope this helps.
I agree partially, if not wholly, with you...

Along with my history obsession, I also greatly enjoying studying militaries, their paraphenalia, and respective wars and how they were fought (believe me, I've played the video games with the best of them too) and I must repeat Jay's statement of such an operation being a 'logistical nightmare'. Undeniably so.

However, if there were one or two of the soldiers who were directly involved with the imprisonment and apparent execution of the Imperial Family, the situation would have been no less risky, but perhaps easier to negotiate any final escape if need be.  For instance, even if the shooting actually occured, the running theory of someone 'falling off the truck' would be much more plausible.  The truck was theoretically unattended for a substantial time, according to most accounts, and if one of the Bolshevik soldiers had been unoccupied and unsupervised at the time, it would have been all to easy for him to slip into the woods (though the motive would be difficult to ascertain, with the exception of perhaps a romance with one of the GDs - Ivan Skhorokhodov and Marie Nikolaevna?).  Arguably, the woods were well guarded, but if the soldier went through his own sector...at that time, I do not believe that the well-known system of two guards, one supervising the other's actions at all times, was in place either.

Here's an important sidenote.  According to the former Office of Military Finances, Records and Historical Archives ([ch1054][ch1092][ch1080][ch1089] [ch1092][ch1080][ch1085][ch1072][ch1085][ch1089][ch1086][ch1074] [ch1074][ch1086][ch1080][ch1089][ch1082][ch1072], [ch1087][ch1086][ch1082][ch1072][ch1079][ch1072][ch1090][ch1077][ch1083][ch1077][ch1081] [ch1080] [ch1080][ch1089][ch1090][ch1086][ch1088][ch1080][ch1095][ch1077][ch1089][ch1082][ch1080][ch1093] [ch1072][ch1088][ch1093][ch1080][ch1074][ch1086][ch1093][ch1088][ch1072][ch1085][ch1080][ch1083][ch1080][ch1097], it dissolved into multiple libraries after 1992 as an effort to de-totalitarianize the country through dispersion of documents) two soldiers were missing from the division assigned to the Kopatkij Forest during that time frame; albeit, as the Red Army at that time was still considered a partisan force, and the Soviet government was still consolidating power, these records are questionable, if not downright unbelieveable.  Names of the two soldiers were never released, or either never recorded, so they cannot be cross-checked with their duties or presence in Yekaterinburg at the time.

I hope that was relative and insightful.
A very interesting message Ivan Komarov, not only that two soldiers were missing from the division assigned to the Kopatkij Forest,but better the second one: the Red Army in 1918 was not a perfect and disciplined force.
Thanks. Ordino

14
Quote
It is quite possible that these papers will not clear anything up at all, or possible they may raise more questions. As an historian, I support release of the papers for study or publication, because without them, there will still be questions as to what they contain.
It wil be possible to ask the Royal Danish House for this papers? I mean you, like as an historian or Alexandar Palace Time Machine as an historian movement.
Thanks. Ordino

15
The Final Chapter / Re: Abdication and Alexandra
« on: April 26, 2006, 05:59:46 AM »
Of course as Commander in Chief, Nicholas lost the confidence of the majoty of his Generals, and this was  very upset for him. But the Generals were not the Tsar, and may be Nicholas was in need of support, just somebody to say him, no better to remind him " Majestic your are the Tsar, you can do it, speak to the troops, do it something!". Let Alexandra apart, I agree with you, look just to Nicholas, he was really upset and desesperate and like Massie said in his book, his health was in bad condition ( about his heart problem),and he considered that Generals were his "military brothers", and because the lost of confindence of them, he just said "my Generals too say to me adbicate is better", but these Generals swored loyalty to him and Russia and they betrayed the Tsar and Russia. Some time ago in a TV program, History Channel, Michel of Greece, I think the same who wrote the book "white nigth in San Petersburg" or similar title, said that Nicholas was weak in a moment that he would have been more strong that ever. He was absolutely alone, anybody of his family or advisers were brave to say "Hey Nicholas, letīs go to do it, you are the Tsar, you can do it, you must do it". He was betrayed for everybody. He was in need of help, just a word to say "come to do this, and this and this".Itīs for this that I think of  his wife to do this.  He was in need of support and who better in  those moments that his wife?, the Generals?, The Romanov family? the Duma? the Senators?. How many advicers had George in England or  has now Elisabeth II or Margarita of Denmark or Juan Carlos of Spain?
How many loyals advicenrs, loyals I say had Nicholas II in March 1917, where were they, at the train?
This was my idea, Alexandra was in fact theonly loyal advicer that Nicholas had in March 1917 and she was not at the train. ( By the way, of course Alix was stubborn yes, a lot, but al so was intelligent, the first is not obstacle for the second.
Thanks. Ordino

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