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Messages - Hector

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1
Italian Royal Families / Re: Savoia-Genova
« on: May 25, 2014, 08:07:12 PM »
This is an excerpt from Quarterly Review, 1872.

The private lives of royal personages long to history and the Duchess of Genoa was too tempting a subject to be omitted. A princess of Saxony by birth, she was married to the Duke of Genoa, the king's brother, who died in 1855. The marriage was not esteemed a happy one, and shortly his death, she privately and suddenly married M. Rapallo, a lieutenant in the army, of mean birth who had belonged to the staff of her deceased lord. 'How came it to pass that this proud woman, who had never been suspected of irregularity, was hurried into startling the court of Turin by the scandal of a secret union and so strange a mésalliance!' The dramatic and mysterious stories that were whispered about are dismissed by M. d'Ideville as void of foundation, with the exception of one, equally apocryphal, which attributes the event to a fit of vexation and pique, to smothered auger resulting from disappointed ambition. 'She had dreamed it was said, and there was nothing extravagant in the dream of becoming queen of Sardinia. She was handsome, insinuating: the King, her brother-in-law, was already captivated. But at the first advances of the princess, and from the moment when she had declared the conditions on which she would accept the royal attentions, he drew off in terror. At this particular epoch the thought of such a union was tinged with a sadness and fatality which frightened the superstitious monarch.

Not long since, this same palace of Turin, within the space of fifteen days, had opened its gates to give passage to three coffins of the royal family; the Queen, the Duke of Genoa, and the Queen Dowager. Although still in love with his sister-in-law, his Majesty came to an explanation with her: on its conclusion there remained to the Duchess no hope of mounting the throne of Sardinia. Disappointed in her projects, maddened by resentment and eager for revenge, she was bent on humiliating the sovereign and exasperating the lover at any price. To attain this end, she did not hesitate to sacrifice herself. She was secretly married to Rapallo at night in a chateau some leagues from Turin; and, as soon as the ceremony, was over she caused it to be made known to the King. His anger knew no bounds: in the first burst of passion he resolved on banishing his brother's widow from his realm, take away her children, forbid her to bear the title of Duchess of Genoa, and send her back in disgrace to her father, the King of Saxony. But he calmed down by degrees: the representatives of Saxony at Paris and Turin interposed, and she was simply forbidden to abide in any Piedmontese town; the villa of Belgirate on the Lago Maggiore being resigned to her for a residence Rapallo received the title of Marquis and became the chevalier d'honneur, or lord in waiting of the Duchess. This adds M. d'Ideville, was the sole function that he ever fulfilled at Belgirate.

Her exile was brief. The female nobility of the newly annexed states, Milan, Parma, Modena, and Florence, claimed the privilege of presentation, and there was no royal duty or prerogative for which the King felt more thoroughly disqualified or disinclined than that of holding a levée or a drawing room. The Duchess was recalled to do the honours of the court, with a suite comprising two ladies-in-waiting. Their husbands bore the same title as the Marquis Rapallo, who was named chamberlain, and regularly took his stand in the antechamber to introduce the personages officially presented to his wife.

2
The Wittlesbachs / Re: King Maximilian & Queen Marie (Princess of Prussia)
« on: December 31, 2013, 08:07:39 AM »
Just saw this picture http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Marie_preussen_01.jpg and I'm sure isn't Queen Marie of Bavaria in 1855. Maybe I'm wrong, but just asking if anybody agrees or not?

3
The Wittlesbachs / Re: Helene of Thurn und Taxis (Duchess in Bavaria)
« on: October 15, 2013, 04:12:29 PM »
You mean anyone right ? Are we sure it was Queen Marie ?
I'm not sure. Still anybody know?

4
The Wittlesbachs / Re: Helene of Thurn und Taxis (Duchess in Bavaria)
« on: October 15, 2013, 12:06:32 PM »
Okay, this isn't neither here nor there. Again, read that Helene and Sissi were in black for a mourning of "an aunt" (or a relative of the Queen of Bavaria) in summer of 1853. Wondering if anything know who it is?

5
The Wittlesbachs / Re: Helene of Thurn und Taxis (Duchess in Bavaria)
« on: October 14, 2013, 10:53:33 PM »
Queen Marie I think, Queen Therese wasn't queen yet when Sisi was a girl.
You're think of the wrong Queen Therese. I guess you're thinking of Ludwig III's wife, but I was referring to Ludwig I's wife.

Not sure since Archduchess Sofie wasn't in mourning (remember she was a princess of Bavaria) it must be from perhaps Duke Max's side.
I don't think so and esp. "must" is a bit strong. Sophie was Austrian and Ludovika was still in Bavaria and if the Queen's relative died, the court or at least the Queen would go into mourning and Ludovika would also go into mourning in sympathy for her Queen.

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The Wittlesbachs / Re: Helene of Thurn und Taxis (Duchess in Bavaria)
« on: October 14, 2013, 07:15:36 PM »
Read awhile ago that Helene and Sissi were in mourning for a relative of the Queen of Bavaria (unsure if that was Queen Therese or Queen Marie)?

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The Wittlesbachs / Re: Helene of Thurn und Taxis (Duchess in Bavaria)
« on: October 14, 2013, 03:04:19 PM »
Most books have "an aunt" and an aunt isn't that distant a relative. Either way, just hoping somebody else might be helpful in answering the question.

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The Wittlesbachs / Re: Helene of Thurn und Taxis (Duchess in Bavaria)
« on: October 14, 2013, 01:43:18 PM »
I read already that it was an aunt who in the summer of 1853 had recently died so asking for the actual relative.

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The Wittlesbachs / Re: Helene of Thurn und Taxis (Duchess in Bavaria)
« on: October 13, 2013, 03:18:43 PM »
Read that when she arrived with her mother and little sister to meet Emperor Franz Joseph at Bad Ischl, they were wearing black since they were in mourning. I was just curious who were they in mourning for?

10
Is there any more information on the first wife of the 6th Duke of Leuchtenberg, Therese of Oldenburg (b. 1852; d. 1883)? Posting it here since unable to locate a topic thread about the Russian Oldenburg branch descended from Grand Duchess Catherine Pavlovna's first marriage. Especially wondering about pictures since only seen the one that's currently on her Wikipedia entry.

11
Rulers Prior to Nicholas II / Re: Emperor Pavel - life and tragic end
« on: September 02, 2013, 11:43:07 PM »
So they already have Nicholas II's Y-DNA on record and there isn't a lack of Oldenburg males who aren't also descended through Emperor Paul like the surviving Romanov descendants.

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Rulers Prior to Nicholas II / Re: Emperor Pavel - life and tragic end
« on: September 02, 2013, 11:13:04 AM »
Quote
Couldn't they just compare Y-DNA from Nicholas II to Prince Phillip without exhuming Emperor Paul? If they match, then Catherine the Great really was just trying to discredit her son's hereditary claim.
 
Yes that could be done, IF anyone other than Prince Phillip knows what his Y-DNA results are. It is likely that Prince Charles and William and Harry have also been Y-DNA tested, but as no-one else knows the results, we cannot make the comparison.
Doesn't seem like Prince Philip would let researchers use his mtDNA yet wouldn't let them use his Y-DNA.

13
Rulers Prior to Nicholas II / Re: Emperor Pavel - life and tragic end
« on: September 01, 2013, 10:47:16 PM »
Prince Philp did assist in identifying Nicolas and family, and, of course, his sons are also male line Oldenburg descendants. But the Russians could be kinda reluctant to exhume Pavel!

Ann

Couldn't they just compare Y-DNA from Nicholas II to Prince Phillip without exhuming Emperor Paul? If they match, then Catherine the Great really was just trying to discredit her son's hereditary claim.

14
Rulers Prior to Nicholas II / Re: Emperor Pavel - life and tragic end
« on: August 30, 2013, 10:51:10 PM »
Quote
They did paternal DNA tests of the remains of Nicholas II right? Wouldn't that show he is an Oldenburg descendant or not?

No other male Oldenburg descendants have been tested for their Y-DNA so there is nothing to compare him with.
There are tons of male Oldenburg descendants. They used Prince Philip's mtDNA and he is a male-line Oldenburg descendant (he is direct male-line of King Frederick I of Denmark's younger son while Emperor Nicholas II is descended from male-line of his oldest son).

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Rulers Prior to Nicholas II / Re: Emperor Pavel - life and tragic end
« on: August 29, 2013, 12:23:23 PM »
They did paternal DNA tests of the remains of Nicholas II right? Wouldn't that show he is an Oldenburg descendant or not?

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