The Alexander Palace Time Machine Discussion Forum

I spent high school in the 70s at an international / American school in France.  The school was strong in history and literature, but we had no specific class on Russian history that I can recall.  But of course Russia came up all the time as we studied European history – the Napoleonic Wars, partitions of Poland, Europe between the World Wars, WWII, etc...  I ate it up, particularly anything about Russia.

For some reason I cannot explain, I have always been interested in Russia – from about the time I was 12 and brought home a book on Karl Marx from the library.  My parents flipped – they thought they had a budding commie on their hands (this was the 70s – the terrorists du jour in Eurioe were the Red Brigades and Bader Meinhof gang).  I was hardly a communist but one of my later history teachers was an ardent socialist and she made a deep impression on me.  Under her tutelage, my first research paper in high school was on the covert American and British invasion of Russia during the Russian Civil War – something that of course still interests me.

All this culminated in a trip to the Soviet Union that my high school organized (I posted about this on another thread).  I loved Russia even more, although the Soviet tour organizers kept leaving us all kinds of silly propaganda pamphlets published by the Novostoy Press (anyone know this publisher?).  It was the usual sort of stuff about bourgeois bosses and starving workers in the capitalist west, racism in America, etc...  Like all propaganda, these missives were not entirely untrue, just myopic, one-sided and offensive.  But when I got home, I could not help feeling everything I read (including our daily paper – the august International Herald Tribune) seemed just as biased against the other side.  So that was my big high school history lesson – skepticism about anything I read or hear by anyone, anywhere – a gift from the Novostoy Press that has kept giving ever since.

Not until college was I able to take specific classes on Russian history – early, imperial and soviet.  One professor was a native Russian, who of course encouraged my interest in Russia.  All the same, not being an academic, most of what I have learned of Russian history and culture has been through reading outside of a school or college.  But that’s where most learning takes place anyway – school is just the spark to get you going (no disrespect to the academics out there).

Here’s a link to images of Gorki Leninskie (in Dutch)

http://www.commietravel.nl/ussr/rusland/gorkileninskie/leninhuis.htm

Lenin chose a nice place; ochre stucco and pressed tin roofs get me every time.  Does anyone have any information on Kokushkino, a remote estate (near Kazan?) of Lenin’s mother’s family to where the family retreated after the execution of Lenin’s brother.  Perhaps that too was preserved as some sort of shrine?

I’m still pondering Muranovo – there must be some story behind how Tyutchev’s descendants were allowed to stay on the estate until 1984.  I know Tyutchev is highly respected poet.  It’s not so surprising that the state would preserve his house – like Tostoy’s and Turgenev’s.  But that his descendants were allowed to stay on contradicts much that I’ve been reading (thanks to the helpful recommendations of AP members here) about the fate of estate owners and their properties after the revolution.  How did they survive Stalin and the Nazis?  Any insights?

Here is a link to Feodor Tyutchev State Museum – Muranovo.  Thanks Hikaru for letting us know of this beautiful place.

http://www.museum.ru/muranovo/eng_03.htm

It seems that until 1984 the decedents of the pre-revolutionary owners stayed on, managing the property as a museum.  Pretty amazing – a real time machine.  

while we are on the subject, there was talk of repatriation of some of these properties a number of years ago...does anyone know if anyone was successful? it would be interesting if soem of these estates were (or are) being restored by their rightful owners.

There' s a thread on this interesting topic here:
http://hydrogen.pallasweb.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=history;action=display;num=1081185145

This quote from Galina seems reasonable to me:

Can I also mention that it was  not just Romanovs/aristocracy who have lost property in Soviet times. Think of ''raskulachivanie'' - millions of peasants were effected. On the subject of which - should I insist on my grandfather's 3 cows and a house to be returned? I think I will manage without........
Mescherskie were lucky to be well received by local residents. Imagine if the land they claim has been in use etc? No, it smells another redestribution/Revolution. We had enough.

Not to suggest that past wrongs can never be redressed .  But so much time has passed and so many segments of society lost so much during the Russian revolution and the ensuing decades. Perhaps the best redress for Russia’s pre-revolutionarily elite would be the recognition and preservation of their many positive contributions to Russian culture – including a great architectural heritage.  

That is tantalizing!  I just spent a couple of hours trying to find this site, to no avail – but I did find hundreds of W. Brumfield’s photos of Russian architecture at the Library of Congress website.  There are many images of  churches, monasteries and provincial town houses, but the best are the log structures:

http://depts.washington.edu/ceir/brumfield/

Also, here’s an interesting article on selling historic properties to the newly rich tycoons:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2004/10/17/wruss17.xml&sSheet=/news/2004/10/17/ixworld.html.

I really love Russian architecture – it’s right up there with Russian achievements in painting and literature.   I particularly like particularly the vernacular architecture of the countryside and the early modernists.  Someday, I may even come to appreciate Soviet architecture after WWII.

I was unaware that she had a website, perhaps the site simply changed its URL?

Priscilla Roosevelt founded the American Friends of Russian Country Estates and this organization is (or was) apparently in the process of restoring several of these structures.  The website is nowhere to found any more but according to WHOIS the URL is still valid – I phoned the contact listed but they have vacated their exec-u-suite in DC.

Another great book on this topic is Echoes of a Native Land:  Two Centuries of a Russian Village by Serge Schmemann.

Thank you so much for your suggestion.  I’ve ordered this book too – Schmemann is an excellent writer and I’ve enjoyed reading him in the NYTimes over the years.

H,I have other books, but most about Imperial  Palaces, if you want any  info on them let me know.F

Thanks Felix – I’m into the palaces as well, but I would be particularly interested in the post-WWII reconstruction of these buildings.  Please let me know if any of your books covers this topic.  Feel free to email me directly.

Thank you all for your helpful suggestions -- I have plenty to read for awhile and I will post my comments later.  I think there is a book thread somewhere on this forum.

The topic of architectural preservation in Russia is close to my heart.  Fixing up the great architectural icons, such as the palaces and cathedrals, is of course a priority.  But there are also countless everyday, nameless structures that make up a vital segment the cultural landscape.

Hi Belochka,

I know this book but have never bought it because it was expensive.  I believe that Priscilla Roosevelt is the person behind the American Friends of Russian Country Estates.  I wonder what happened to their website.  Anyway,  I have ordered her book along with "Lost Russia."  Thanks.

Thanks Felix,

I just read somthing by the author of Lost Russia -- W. Brumfield -- his book would be of great interest to me.  I am going to order a copy.  You may be interested in the article he wrote about his book and his comments on architecture and ruins:

http://www.umich.edu/~iinet/journal/vol5no2/BRUMFIEL.html

If you know of any other books on this subject please let me know -- Thanks for your help

Hi all,

I’m new to this forum but have lurked for some time and thank you for helping to satiate my appetite for Russian history – this is one of the better forums on this topic that I’ve found.

I’m curious as to the current status of pre-revolutionary country estates in Russia.  I’m not referring to the imperial palaces or the great estates such as  Arkhangelskoye, which are national treasures, but rather the more garden variety of manor house that once dotted the Russian countryside and figure prominently in 19th century Russian literature.  I know that places like Nabokov’s Roshdestweno and Tolstoy’s Yasnaya Polyana have been or are being restored as museums. However, there must be many other manors that were not owned by such notables but that survived revolution and war – some perhaps now used as schools or hospitals, and perhaps others that are derelict but salvageable.

In the former East Germany and Poland many of these properties, in various states of disrepair, have been sold to private owners and restored.  Is this also the case in the former Soviet Union?  Whatever one may think of the system that supported the landed class, the structures they left behind are an important part of Russian culture, and the present condition of these buildings would be worth documenting.  Does any such documentation exist?

There used to be a web-site called A-FORCE (American Friends of Russian Country Houses), but it seems to have disappeared.  The website’s author published a book on this topic but I think it was more of a nostalgic look at Russian country life and a collection of historical photos.  I am interested in the conditions today.  Any insights or info would be welcome.  I hope this is the right place to post this.  Thanks.