Author Topic: Formal Press Release from Ekaterinburg  (Read 81445 times)

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Offline Lanie

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Re: Formal Press Release from Ekaterinburg
« Reply #30 on: August 26, 2007, 02:47:40 PM »
Thank you for posting this.

I don't think we will ever know for sure which sister is missing, simply because the height discrepancies and how both teams only positively identified Olga, but it will be wonderful for them to be laid to rest with their family.  Like Bob said it surely won't make the AA fanatics shut up, but who cares?  It's unimportant.

I wonder why it took so long. It's exactly where Yurovsky said it was!

Offline Annie

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Re: Formal Press Release from Ekaterinburg
« Reply #31 on: August 26, 2007, 02:54:12 PM »
Well, me, of all people, the big 'anti-AA'/supporter person sure doesn't want to be controversial and cause a fuss but I realy can't understand how if all of the female skeletons were at least 5'5" that one of them is Anastasia who was 5'2". It sounds like the opposite of 'she's too short to be Tatiana', she's too tall to be Anastasia. Also all three were said to be cleary full grown and over 18 because of backbone, collarbone and wisdom teeth growth, the other girls were all 19 or older, while Anastasia had only just turned 17. The third daughter skeleton has a damaged femur, and the Bolsheviks said Marie was shot in the thigh. So what exactly is the evidence that the skeleton was Anastasia, did they do a facial reconstruction? What is their evidence and can anyone present some?

If all the scientists had agreed the body was Anastasia I would accept it readily. But because Dr. Maples, a man very respected in his field who helped prove the bones were the IF even when others doubted and thought it was the merchant's family beileves that AN was missing, and the British scientists agreed and the Russians were the only dissenters, IMO it's the Russians who are the odd man out on the ID of the last grand duchess and I would really like to see more info on this, along with a reevaluation once all the tests are done to be completely sure, after all these years and all the confusion, mystery, and suffering for so many, that at last the entire family can be buried together and each person have their own name on their own grave. I am afraid due to the lack of this new find not being an entire skeleton they probably will never be able to evaluate the bones for height and age the way they did the others. Let's hope the whole truth comes out in the end, for all of them.

And yes, I do know that the main thing that matters is that they are all found, the mystery is solved, Yurovksy is not a liar and the claimants' stories can officially be laid to rest as the fiction they always were, though wild theories are sure to come from those who will not be able to give up or admit they were wrong and move on.  Though still shocked, I am relieved, amazed and excited this find has been made. I would say happy, but it's hard to be happy when you think that these are innocent murder victims who died horrible deaths and then had their bodies desecrated. When I first started obsessing over the Romanovs 33 years ago as a 12 year old, I never thought communism would fall and that the bodies would be found and honored, and even up until this year never thought this find was possible. This does honor to their memories and lives at last. Time has brought the IF justice, and reverence, and hopefully peace. Though nothing can ever right the wrongs that were done to that family back in 1918, it means something that people are trying and that they care. It's a great moment in history.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2007, 03:05:04 PM by Annie »

Offline Lanie

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Re: Formal Press Release from Ekaterinburg
« Reply #32 on: August 26, 2007, 02:55:38 PM »
Annie, I think the problem is the height thing is so hit-and-miss considering it's only a rough estimate from bones that were sawed off and so on.  We didn't have full skeletons, and I'm sure we couldn't exactly say, "Okay, this rib bone definitely goes to THIS skeleton!"

Offline Annie

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Re: Formal Press Release from Ekaterinburg
« Reply #33 on: August 26, 2007, 03:07:57 PM »
But what if these bones are old maybe a century?
Do we know where those remain were killed?

In the report the explain how this grave matches the other and even contains identical items to the first one.

Yes nena when you started this thread I bet you never imagined all the news that was to come and that the missing kids would actually be discovered and acccounted for. I still can't believe it, I have to keep coming back here reading the headline again to make sure I didn' t dream it, wow!

Offline Annie

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Re: Formal Press Release from Ekaterinburg
« Reply #34 on: August 26, 2007, 03:09:56 PM »
Annie, I think the problem is the height thing is so hit-and-miss considering it's only a rough estimate from bones that were sawed off and so on.  We didn't have full skeletons, and I'm sure we couldn't exactly say, "Okay, this rib bone definitely goes to THIS skeleton!"

That's true, and I admire the work of all who have worked on this. I only hope in the end it will all come out as accurate, and we will know the whole story. Maybe these new Yurovsky papers will shed new light too. Again this is an exciting time to be a Romanov and Russian history fan.

Offline BobAtchison

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Re: Formal Press Release from Ekaterinburg
« Reply #35 on: August 26, 2007, 03:16:55 PM »
There were dozens of professionals on the Russian side who worked on the identification of the main remains years ago.  They came from all areas - Russia's top dental forensics team were involved.  They respected Maple's contribution and the fact he disagreed with them.  They were firmly convinced they had Anastasia.

Maples was not always correct; in his book he says that the remains of the Imperial family would have been unrecognizable in a day or two because they would have started to decompose in the July heat in Yekaterinburg.  This was not true.  The bodies were immersed in the cold waters at the bottom of the mine shaft and when they came out they were frozen. This was a reason they could not successfully burn the corpses.  This is the same reason Jimmy's body was preserved for so long.

It is interesting that they found cloth spieces in the newly discovered pits.  When Alexis body was taken from the mine it was the only one partially clothed.  He was wearing a striped naval undershirt.

Bob

Offline nena

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Re: Formal Press Release from Ekaterinburg
« Reply #36 on: August 26, 2007, 03:21:56 PM »
Bob, how do you know what Aleksei was wearing?
I don't understand....What Yurovsky...Something about new found grave and his memories? What?
please, someone can answer me!

nena
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Mathematics, art and history in ♥

Offline Lucien

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Re: Formal Press Release from Ekaterinburg
« Reply #37 on: August 26, 2007, 04:02:03 PM »
The Ekaterinburg Press Conference - the first formal announcement of the archeological findings.


Thank you very very much dear Belochka,for taking the trouble and time to post this very moving news.The only thing that really matters now is that the children will be re-united with their family in St.Petersburg in a not to distant future.A tragedy that has captivated so many for so long,not in the least myself ever since I was a child,has found an ending in the find of Alyosha and Marie.Very moving.
Je Maintiendrai

Offline rgt9w

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Re: Formal Press Release from Ekaterinburg
« Reply #38 on: August 26, 2007, 04:12:18 PM »
Bob and Belochka,

Thank you for the information you have shared.

Bob, can you share where you found the information about Alexei wearing the shirt?


Offline rgt9w

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Re: Formal Press Release from Ekaterinburg
« Reply #39 on: August 26, 2007, 04:13:29 PM »
Bob and Belochka,

Thank you for the information you have shared.

Bob, can you share where you found the information about Alexei wearing the shirt when he was removed from the mine?


Offline charley

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Re: Formal Press Release from Ekaterinburg
« Reply #40 on: August 26, 2007, 04:22:54 PM »
If they found the bones exactly where Yurovsky said they were, why did no one look there until now?  When will DNA testing be done?

Offline dmitri

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Re: Formal Press Release from Ekaterinburg
« Reply #41 on: August 26, 2007, 05:04:56 PM »
I agree with Bob completely. I think Maples was wrong as well. The Russians have some of the greatest experts in the world in many different areas. To dismiss their abilities is quite frankly insulting. I think the latest remains are Alexis and Maria. Anastasia is already buried with the others.

Offline AGRBear

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Re: Formal Press Release from Ekaterinburg
« Reply #42 on: August 26, 2007, 05:23:18 PM »
There were dozens of professionals on the Russian side who worked on the identification of the main remains years ago.  They came from all areas - Russia's top dental forensics team were involved.  They respected Maple's contribution and the fact he disagreed with them.  They were firmly convinced they had Anastasia.

Maples was not always correct; in his book he says that the remains of the Imperial family would have been unrecognizable in a day or two because they would have started to decompose in the July heat in Yekaterinburg.  This was not true.  The bodies were immersed in the cold waters at the bottom of the mine shaft and when they came out they were frozen. This was a reason they could not successfully burn the corpses.  This is the same reason Jimmy's body was preserved for so long.

It is interesting that they found cloth spieces in the newly discovered pits.  When Alexis body was taken from the mine it was the only one partially clothed.  He was wearing a striped naval undershirt.

Bob

I remember us talking about Maples and the bodies being immersed in the mine water.   We had gone into  the time line hour by hour about the condition of the bodies. We had some great links to the decomposition of  a pig.     I can't seem to find it when using "search".    If anyone knows where it is,  I'd like to reread that information.
----

Thanks  Belochka for the  information which was translated into English so we all could read the latest news.

AGRBear
"What is true by lamplight is not always true by sunlight."

Joubert, Pensees, No. 152

Offline Alice

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Re: Formal Press Release from Ekaterinburg
« Reply #43 on: August 26, 2007, 05:39:36 PM »
In my opinion we will not know, definitively, which Grand Duchess this is until more tests have been conducted on the recently disovered remains. I've always believed that until all four were found, we could not be conclusive about which Grand Duchess is which.

The Russians had valid arguments for believing Anastasia was in the mass grave, likewise, Maples had valid arguments for believing that Marie was in the mass grave. Obviously this was not easy to discern if it was Marie or Anastasia, given the condition of the remains and the Grand Duchess' proximity in age. I tend to think that the Russians have it correct though, as Maples' arguments seemed to rely on the remains being too tall/too developed for Anastasia - but none of us know how tall or how developed Anastasia was at her time of death.

Offline Alice

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Re: Formal Press Release from Ekaterinburg
« Reply #44 on: August 26, 2007, 05:43:08 PM »
I agree with Bob completely. I think Maples was wrong as well. The Russians have some of the greatest experts in the world in many different areas. To dismiss their abilities is quite frankly insulting. I think the latest remains are Alexis and Maria. Anastasia is already buried with the others.

It's insulting to dismiss the abilities of either team, IMO.