Author Topic: Re: Franziska -An Interesting Story on Her own - A Timeline of Her Life #4  (Read 72392 times)

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Offline Annie

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Re: Re: Franziska -An Interesting Story on Her own - A Timeline of Her Life #4
« Reply #240 on: September 06, 2007, 02:11:56 PM »
I don't think AA deserves any 'approval' for her theft of AN's identity until her image and life is too often taken for that of the real AN. She deserves no 'approval' for causing a court fight for years which tormented the grieving relations of the real AN. If the only way AN could be 'famous' is to have some crazy woman impersonate her and lie about her, I bet she'd just as soon have stayed obscure. I know I would.

Offline dmitri

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Re: Re: Franziska -An Interesting Story on Her own - A Timeline of Her Life #4
« Reply #241 on: September 06, 2007, 05:30:07 PM »
Yes AA did nothing to promote the real Grand Duchess Anastasia. There was plenty of information on her without the rubbish Anderson invented. Grand Duchess Anastasia would have always been known, like the rest of her family, due to her tragic and brutal demise.

Olishka~ Pincess

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Re: Re: Franziska -An Interesting Story on Her own - A Timeline of Her Life #4
« Reply #242 on: September 07, 2007, 04:39:00 PM »
No she did not thats why I say thumbs down for Anna Anderson! She did not do anything positive for Anastasia. All she did was made Anastasia reputation bad, by lying and pretendng. It is true the woman is sick and mentally ill she had serious problems.

Alixz

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Re: Re: Franziska -An Interesting Story on Her own - A Timeline of Her Life #4
« Reply #243 on: September 07, 2007, 06:30:05 PM »
I guess that is why I do have some compassion for AA/FS.  She was mentally ill and that is not a crime.

I think that as the years went by, she truly came to believe that she was ANR. 

As for her family recognizing her and then recanting, that is, as Yule Brenner said in The King and I, "A puzzlement".

And I know a lot of theories have been put on this thread and into books about why her family would not want to recognize her and have her back in their lives, but just think about your own family and siblings and aunts and nieces. Could you just walk away from one of your own?

We know the "how" of her story, but I suppose we will never know the "why".  Not entirely.

Offline Annie

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Re: Re: Franziska -An Interesting Story on Her own - A Timeline of Her Life #4
« Reply #244 on: September 07, 2007, 07:28:04 PM »



As for her family recognizing her and then recanting, that is, as Yule Brenner said in The King and I, "A puzzlement".

And I know a lot of theories have been put on this thread and into books about why her family would not want to recognize her and have her back in their lives, but just think about your own family and siblings and aunts and nieces. Could you just walk away from one of your own?


I usually go into a long post on this, but now I've written it all out on my site. I really think they denied her for her own good! She could have gotten into a lot of trouble for filing a fraudulent claim, could have gone to jail, been sued for expenses, and in Nazi Germany, even gone to a death camp for being insane if they knew she was FS. The family had NO good reason to claim her and every good reason to deny her, for her own good as well as theirs. They didn't want to have to worry about possibly being held responsible for her actions, and they didn't want to have to deal with a miserable, broke, mentally ill sister whose life they had ruined by exposing her. It's my theory that she begged them not to expose her, and they left her to, as they later said, her 'career' as "Anastasia" where she'd always have someone to take care of  her. (again much more on my my site in the "Schanzkowska family' chapter. As for 'could you walk away from your own?' They probably felt they were doing her a favor and she was better off. And yes, some people can. I have seen it first hand personally in real life. If someone is going to cause their relative to have to be put out to a minute's inconvenience, or even worse cost them one cent of their precious money, you're outta there!

Offline dmitri

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Re: Re: Franziska -An Interesting Story on Her own - A Timeline of Her Life #4
« Reply #245 on: September 08, 2007, 02:56:54 AM »
Yes people lie and cheat every day, even their own family. What pathetic excuses for human beings such creatures are.

Offline Foxglove

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Re: Re: Franziska -An Interesting Story on Her own - A Timeline of Her Life #4
« Reply #246 on: September 08, 2007, 03:45:24 AM »
I usually go into a long post on this, but now I've written it all out on my site. I really think they denied her for her own good! She could have gotten into a lot of trouble for filing a fraudulent claim, could have gone to jail, been sued for expenses, and in Nazi Germany, even gone to a death camp for being insane if they knew she was FS. The family had NO good reason to claim her and every good reason to deny her, for her own good as well as theirs. They didn't want to have to worry about possibly being held responsible for her actions, and they didn't want to have to deal with a miserable, broke, mentally ill sister whose life they had ruined by exposing her. It's my theory that she begged them not to expose her, and they left her to, as they later said, her 'career' as "Anastasia" where she'd always have someone to take care of  her. (again much more on my my site in the "Schanzkowska family' chapter. As for 'could you walk away from your own?' They probably felt they were doing her a favor and she was better off. And yes, some people can. I have seen it first hand personally in real life. If someone is going to cause their relative to have to be put out to a minute's inconvenience, or even worse cost them one cent of their precious money, you're outta there!

This makes the most sense logically. I imagine that looking after a mentally ill sibling was not a preferable choice for any of the Schanzkowskis, especially since more likely than not, if they did bring Franziska home, they would have had to put her back to an asylum again.

Also, about the responsibility of expenses… the Schanzkowski family was repeatedly assured that they would not be responsible for Franziska's costs that she had racked up during her time as “Anastasia”, but then how exactly was that going to work? If Joe Blow demanded back monetary payment for food, lodging, jewellery, and what not presented in good faith to what he assumed was GD Anastasia, who was going to pay him back? Who would prevent him from filing a lawsuit against Anna or the Schanzkowski family? In later years, when Anna travelled abroad to the United States, she was a guest at lavish parties, and given presents. What would happen if one of those people decided to sue her, or her minders? How would a court case like that be settled? I am genuinely curious to know now, as my Criminology classes didn't cover this aspect. ;)

Alixz

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Re: Re: Franziska -An Interesting Story on Her own - A Timeline of Her Life #4
« Reply #247 on: September 08, 2007, 09:01:03 AM »
Annie:

I have been slowly reading your site and I did read that part.  I recommend your site to anyone who wants to get all of the information in one place.

Just think how complicated any law suits would be just because mostly (until much later in her life) AA never herself claimed to be ANR.  She let other people do it for her.

She let others present her as ANR and simply kept quiet until her mental illness came to the fore and she had a psychotic break and began to abuse those who had taken her in.

And also, filing law suits in the early to middle part of the 20th century was not the norm as it is today.  Today, all someone has to do is to looked cross eyed at another and its off to court they go.

Olishka~ Pincess

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Re: Re: Franziska -An Interesting Story on Her own - A Timeline of Her Life #4
« Reply #248 on: September 09, 2007, 10:40:28 AM »
Thats exactly why you should not feel and sorrow for Anna Anderson their is nothing to feel sorry for her about becuase she was a pathetic fraud and her ways are sick. The woman was mentally ill and she had problems it was her fault.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2007, 10:42:00 AM by Elizabeth~Princess »

Alixz

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Re: Re: Franziska -An Interesting Story on Her own - A Timeline of Her Life #4
« Reply #249 on: September 09, 2007, 11:13:38 AM »
Ah, Elizabeth~Princess, I understand your anger.

But no one is responsible for being mentally ill.  It is like any other illness.  I would not be responsible for having cancer(unless I smoked) and I would not be responsible for having the flu or a sinus infection or any other illness that hasn't already been eliminated by vaccine.

AA/FS needed a doctor's care, but in the early part of this century, mental illness was treated as a non illness.  It was not given the attention that is is given today.  Now we acknowledge that people very often have chemical imbalances that make them do and say things that others would not do or say.

Those who function on a "normal" level are called "neurotypicals" while those who have Autism or bi polar disorder or schizophrenia are now recognized as needing medical help and professional therapy.  And thankfully there are now medications that can help them and there are no longer any of the horrible "insane asylums" as there was 100 years ago.

AA/FS is one of the greatest enigmas of our time.  I don't think that there is a simple answer to her position in history.  Yes, she was a impostor, but that was not a simple answer until after she was dead and DNA sampling and testing had been developed.

I have said before that I could never reconcile her slovenly behavior and her rudeness to the image of a grand duchess, therefore I never believed that she was ANR.

But I still feel for the young woman who felt that her life was so not worth living that she threw herself into a canal.  Had no one rescued her, then she would have not even been a footnote in history.

Offline dmitri

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Re: Re: Franziska -An Interesting Story on Her own - A Timeline of Her Life #4
« Reply #250 on: September 09, 2007, 11:24:45 AM »
yes she was in the right place to be rescued ... I do think her behaviour was quite extraordinary .. certainly she displayed abnormal character traits ... she was a frightful play actress .. perhaps that was just a sign of her mental instability - I think she will only remain as a very brief footnote in history. The real Grand Duchess Anastasia will be remembered as a child of the last Tsar and Tsarina of Russia.   

Olishka~ Pincess

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Re: Re: Franziska -An Interesting Story on Her own - A Timeline of Her Life #4
« Reply #251 on: September 09, 2007, 06:55:31 PM »
I understand what you mean Alixz. You are right no one is responsible for being ill I mean it was sad scenario she was in and everything I know that she should not be blamed for her illness and good thing someone rescue her from killing herself. But however she is not innocent but just sick but the part about her fraud ways is someone for herself to blame as becuase the lying and pretending was her fault. I understand that she was sick and everything but it just does not make sense to lie and pretend unless her illness gone too far.

Offline PrincessSophie

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Re: Re: Franziska -An Interesting Story on Her own - A Timeline of Her Life #4
« Reply #252 on: September 09, 2007, 11:09:56 PM »
I understand what you mean Alixz. You are right no one is responsible for being ill I mean it was sad scenario she was in and everything I know that she should not be blamed for her illness and good thing someone rescue her from killing herself. But however she is not innocent but just sick but the part about her fraud ways is someone for herself to blame as becuase the lying and pretending was her fault. I understand that she was sick and everything but it just does not make sense to lie and pretend unless her illness gone too far.

Elizabeth~Princess, you are perfectly sweet but I'm not sure I agree.  Her suicide attempt was sad as was her mental illness but whoever prevented it inadvertently started an avalanche of deceit that may have been - at least in part - avoided in the event of her demise at that time. 

Sophie

Olishka~ Pincess

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Re: Re: Franziska -An Interesting Story on Her own - A Timeline of Her Life #4
« Reply #253 on: September 10, 2007, 05:35:07 PM »
Okay Sophie Yes I understand that it was sad and everything realy why would her illness give her a reason to be a fraud. I understand that her suicide attempt was a issue that was from her mental illness. But I think that her mental illness caused her to try to attempt suicide but as for being a fraud it was her own fault.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2007, 05:47:59 PM by Elizabeth~Princess »

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: Re: Franziska -An Interesting Story on Her own - A Timeline of Her Life #4
« Reply #254 on: September 10, 2007, 06:42:45 PM »
A lot of mentally ill people have delusions of grandeur and fancy themselves someone famous, most often some kind of [missing] royalty, etc. Thre were many many dauphins of France for example, and other "royal survivors" throughout the ages. This is fairly common, so AA and her situation is not unique in any sense of the word, she just happened to have very dogged followers, who fought for her, perhaps more than other claimants.