Author Topic: Wittelsbachs pics.  (Read 14273 times)

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Offline José

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Wittelsbachs pics.
« on: September 12, 2007, 11:18:13 AM »
I am looking for pictures of early Wittelsbachs:

Christian III (1674-1735) and his wife Caroline of Nassau Sarrbruck

Maria-Anne Camasse, wife of Christian IV
(What0s the story behind her ? I guess she was a huguenot commoner who got the eye of Christian IV.
A most catholic king marring a commoner huguenot ? )

Karl II of Wittelsbach (1746-95) and his sister Maria Amalia, queen of Saxony

Thamks in advance.

Offline Yseult

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Re: Wittelsbachs pics.
« Reply #1 on: September 12, 2007, 04:04:41 PM »
I´ve found some images and information, José.



The portrayed man is Christian IV von Pfalz-Zweibrücken. I can´t find a bigger version of the portrait.



And the portrayed woman is Marianne Camasse countess of Forbach, morganatical wife of Christian IV. The boy is one of her sons, fathered by Christian.
This is a detail from a portrait. Show you the entire portrait:



Her full name was Marie Jeanne Françoise Camasse or Gamache. Her father was named Jean Baptiste Camasse sometimes, but also Jean Baptiste Gamache. Her mother was named Eléonore Roux. I don´t know if they were huguenots. As far as I know, Jean Baptiste and Eléonore were actors. Eléonore was delivered from her baby Marie Jeanne Françoise, "Marianne", when the couple was settled for a while in Strassbourg. After the childbirth, they returned to Mannheim. Little Marianne became a good ballerina, she danced classical ballets when she caught the eye of Christian. The man was twelve years older than the girl, aged sixteen. For a time, Marianne received a good education payed with the founds of Christian. When she had became a sophisticated enough young lady, the duke married her morganatically. Stanislas Leczinski, who had been briefly king of Poland and was at this time duke of Lorraine, granted to Marianne the tittle of countess of Forbach. She was also in good terms with the powerful Madame Pompadour, mistress of Stanislas´s son-in-law the king Louis XV of France ;). A few decades later, she was also friendly with Marie Antoinette.
Marianne had six children, four sons (Christian, Philipp, Karl Ludwig and Julius August) and two daughters (Maria Anna and Elisabeth). Two of the sons made good careers in the french army, and one of them fought in the american independence war. Marianne lived in Paris, but she spent a lot of time in her castle of Forbach.

More historical portraits:

1.-Christian III of Pfalz-Birkenfeld.

2.-His sister Maria Anna Amelia, queen of Saxony by marriage.


Best regards.

Offline José

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Re: Wittelsbachs pics.
« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2007, 04:47:50 PM »
Thanks for the pics and the information.

One question however.
Are you sure about the last picture.
I had that picture as Maria Anna, wive of Wilhelm duke IN Bavaria, sister of the requested Maria Amalia, queen of Saxony  :-\

Offline José

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Re: Wittelsbachs pics.
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2007, 11:19:21 AM »
Can anyone confirm the id of the princess Yseult posted ?

Offline MarieCharlotte

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Re: Wittelsbachs pics.
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2007, 12:04:34 PM »



This is Maria Anna of Birkenfeld-Zweibrücken, Duchess in Bavaria, sister of Max I. Joseph King of Bavaria
Ich aber breite trauernd aus
die weiten weissen Schwingen,
Und kehr' ins Feenreich nach Haus -
Nichts soll mich wieder bringen.


Elisabeth

Offline Mari

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Re: Wittelsbachs pics.
« Reply #5 on: November 10, 2007, 02:33:49 AM »
Wow, these paintings are georgeous! Where did you hear that Marianne, Countess of Forbach was Huguenot which would be very interesting?

Offline José

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Re: Wittelsbachs pics.
« Reply #6 on: January 12, 2008, 10:37:15 AM »



This is Maria Anna of Birkenfeld-Zweibrücken, Duchess in Bavaria, sister of Max I. Joseph King of Bavaria

Thank you Marie-Charlotte.
That's what I thought.
So, I still need a pic of Maria Amália (1752-1828)  wife of Frederich Augustus of Saxony.

Offline VN

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Re: Wittelsbachs pics.
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2008, 12:24:18 PM »
I am looking for pictures of early Wittelsbachs:

Christian III (1674-1735) and his wife Caroline of Nassau Sarrbruck

Maria-Anne Camasse, wife of Christian IV
(What0s the story behind her ? I guess she was a huguenot commoner who got the eye of Christian IV.
A most catholic king marring a commoner huguenot ? )

Karl II of Wittelsbach (1746-95) and his sister Maria Amalia, queen of Saxony

Thamks in advance.











Christian IV von Zweibrücken was a Duke and not a king and his family was protestant. I don't know when, but he became catholic, which, really upset his mother Karoline. His brother Friedrich Michael also was babtized protestant, but also convertet, thats why he took the name Michael. (which the adding of the Name Michael to Friedrich - I'm not 100% sure on this, I read it a while ago, can't remember where. I don't remember the source, but I read it. But sometimes, as you know, not all the sources are correct!! )


Christina IV and Marianne had 7 children

- Christian Graf von Forbach, Freiherr von ZW * 1752 ZW + 1817 Munich

- Wilhelm (Philipp)  Graf von Forbach, Freiherr von ZW  * 1754 ZW   + 1807 Munich


-  M. Anna Karoline * 1756      + ??

- Karl Ludwig  * 1759    +1763


- Daughter  *+ 1761


- Elisabeth Friederike  *1766  +1790


- Julius Maximilian  +1771   +1773



If you can read german - there is a book called "Der Herzog und die Tänzerin" written by a decendant of Christian and Marianne Forbach, Adalbert, Prinz von Bayern. You'll find a picture of Christian III. and his wife Karoline in this book









Offline beladona

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Re: Wittelsbachs pics.
« Reply #8 on: January 14, 2008, 05:36:40 AM »



This is Maria Anna of Birkenfeld-Zweibrücken, Duchess in Bavaria, sister of Max I. Joseph King of Bavaria

Thank you Marie-Charlotte.
That's what I thought.
So, I still need a pic of Maria Amália (1752-1828)  wife of Frederich Augustus of Saxony.

and what about this one?

It is listed in WIkipedia as "Heinrich Carl Brandt: Pfalzgräfin Maria Amalie Auguste von Birkenfeld-Zweibrücken-Rappoltstein (1752-1828) als Braut (spätere Königin von Sachsen)"

Offline beladona

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Re: Wittelsbachs pics.
« Reply #9 on: January 14, 2008, 06:05:36 AM »
I am sorry. Again and better - Maria Amalia Augusta?

Offline Eric_Lowe

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Re: Wittelsbachs pics.
« Reply #10 on: May 09, 2008, 08:55:43 PM »
Nice portrait but cannot tell if it was she...

Offline gogm

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Re: Wittelsbachs pics.
« Reply #11 on: May 10, 2008, 11:43:57 AM »
I am sorry. Again and better - Maria Amalia Augusta?


According to Wikimedia, the portrait was painted in 1769 by by Heinrich Carl Brandt: and she is Pfalzgräfin Maria Amalie Auguste von Birkenfeld-Zweibrücken-Rappoltstein. Her order is the cross of Saint Elisabeth.

Offline José

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Re: Wittelsbachs pics.
« Reply #12 on: May 14, 2008, 11:50:53 AM »
Iam looking for a picture of Leopold (1890-1973) last duke IN Bavarai.

Thanks in advance
José

Offline Eric_Lowe

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Re: Wittelsbachs pics.
« Reply #13 on: June 09, 2008, 12:41:43 PM »
Hard to find, but certainly worth a try.  ;)