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Topic: 1994 British TV Documentary - Anastasia Dead or Alive?  (Read 15596 times)
« on: November 26, 2007, 10:13:25 AM »
Annie Offline
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Did any tests commissioned by a British TV documentary in 1994 do tests on the face and ears of AA and declare her to be AN? This is stated as fact in the wikipedia "Anastasia" article. I have disrupted it and been told it was true because Kurth said so in "Tsar." I still disagree, because I believe the TV show in question is the NOVA special "Anastasia Dead or Alive" in which the ears were found to be similar, but no one ever said it meant she was AN. The facial examination, by Geoffrey Oxlee, a renowned specialist awarded by the British military and often called as an expert witness in forensic facial analysis in criminal trials, did the comparisons and declared AA to be FS. I have the video of this, and these things are very clear. If there is not another 1994 TV documentary doing tests and claiming AA was AN, then the statement is false. Is there? Can anyone help me out here?
« Last Edit: May 27, 2009, 08:07:14 PM by Alixz » Logged
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« on: November 26, 2007, 10:17:53 AM »
Annie Offline
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Update: I see the wiki paragraph has been changed to this:

New forensic non-DNA comparisons in 1994 with photos of Grand Duchess Anastasia and pretender Anna Anderson's face and ears, following routine procedures of legal identification alleged that Anna Anderson's ears matched those of the Grand Duchess. The tests were commissioned for a British television documentary connected with well known Anna Anderson supporter Peter Kurth. As such their objectivity is questionable.


This is not a false statement, so it can stand. However I still want to know if they were talking about the NOVA special or not. Can anyone tell me if there is another 1994 TV special in question here other than the NOVA special?  Thank you.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2007, 10:21:17 AM by Annie » Logged
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« on: November 26, 2007, 05:24:20 PM »
Kransnoeselo Offline
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Annie,

I believe the study in question was performed by Peter Vanesis.  He did appear on the NOVA program (Though I am unsure who originally authorized the study.)

The study showed photographs of several women's ears (the scientific observers were blind to the various ears identities) and compared them to known photographs of the Grand Duchess Anastasia's ear.  He along with several colleagues picked the photographs of AA as being closest to Anastasia's.  Vanesis gave a photograph of Anna's left inner ear a perfect "5" match to that of a photograph of Anastasia's ear (on a scale of 1 to 5) and a "4" on her left ear.  Yet interestingly one of Vanesis's colleagues disagreed with Vanesis and the others that the ears of AA and Anastasia were the same and thus inadvertently proving that the experiment was indeed subject to the viewer's interpretation and not objective.

 
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« on: November 26, 2007, 06:06:50 PM »
Annie Offline
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Annie,

I believe the study in question was performed by Peter Vanesis.  He did appear on the NOVA program (Though I am unsure who originally authorized the study.)

The study showed photographs of several women's ears (the scientific observers were blind to the various ears identities) and compared them to known photographs of the Grand Duchess Anastasia's ear.  He along with several colleagues picked the photographs of AA as being closest to Anastasia's.  Vanesis gave a photograph of Anna's left inner ear a perfect "5" match to that of a photograph of Anastasia's ear (on a scale of 1 to 5) and a "4" on her left ear.  Yet interestingly one of Vanesis's colleagues disagreed with Vanesis and the others that the ears of AA and Anastasia were the same and thus inadvertently proving that the experiment was indeed subject to the viewer's interpretation and not objective.

 

Thanks, that's what I thought, but I didn't have his name. The name of the show, or the scientists, are not mentioned in the quote which I found to be incorrect and misleading. Maybe they didn't mention the name of the program so no one could see it for themselves!

So the facts are, without any slant or twisting, is that Vanesis found a match in the pictures of the ears, but did NOT declare 'with certainty' that 'AA was indeed AN.'

In the facial comparisons, Geoffrey Oxlee found a match between AA and FS, so it's completely false to claim any facial comparisons in the show claimed AA was AN.
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« on: November 27, 2007, 09:43:17 AM »
Suzie Offline
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This is not really on topic but I have been pondering for a quite a while about how odd is is that AA got as far as she did with the whole AN thing. I mean, if I was slilghtly deranged and decided that I was someone missing and famous, I would be found out pretty quickly because in some way I clearly would not match or even have it questioned that I matched, the missing person. My height wouldn't match or my ears or my feet. My relatives (even though I have no living parents or siblings) would know me...even those I haven't seen for years. AA does look like AN in some pictures (AA also looks like FS)- at least much more so than I would if I was just claiming to be someone. You could put my picture along side say Sarah Ferguson and even if we were squinting into the sun, I would not look like her enough for people to debate it.  Even taking into account that there were people with vested interests in protecting AA's assumed identity, it seems so improbable that she was able to carry it on so long. 
I believe the DNA evidence. I am only intriegued by how this clever, yet disturbed woman was able to make herself "be" someone else.

Suzie
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« on: November 28, 2007, 09:48:36 PM »
Kransnoeselo Offline
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Suzie,

As a former long time supporter of Anna Anderson I must say that on the surface there is a lot of strange coincidences and circumstantial evidence which seems to support her claims to be Anastasia.  Yet the closer one looks at all of the evidence it becomes clearer how Anna became as the most successful Romanov claimant.  


I have found it immensely helpful reading Pierre Gilliard's La Fausse Anastasie which I have very slowly been translating from French.   In it he had testimony from people who met Anna Anderson in the early 1920's.  By reading these accounts one sees the evolution and transformation from "Frau Unbekannt" (Miss Unknown) to Anastasia claimant.  

I too found it a coincidence that there would be so much similarity between Anna and Anastasia. How lucky for someone to claim to be Anastasia and look similar to her.  In fact I now think it the reverse: That being that it was because of her similarity that she claimed to be Anastasia. In fact it wasn't until a fellow inmate in a mental asylum insisted that Anna was the Grand Duchess Tatiana that this story really begins.  Anna went to a nurse and ask her if she saw anything striking when shown a photograph of some of the Grand Duchesses, when the nurse replied that she did not Anna proceeded to ask her  "Then you don't see any resemblance between the two of us?"  

Once the Russian monarchists were alerted to the presence of a Grand Duchess in a Berlin asylum they began to visit Anna, eventually she was introduced to  Zinaida Tolstoy (who had known the Grand Duchesses as children) as Tatiana and Zinaida recognized her as such. Zinaida became an early supporter of Anna and saw her on many occasions.  I think it odd that Anna didn't confide in Zinaida that she wasn't Tatiana but Anastasia. It wasn't until Baroness Sophie Buxhoeveden's visit in which the Baroness proclaimed Anna too short to be Tatiana and to be Anastasia's size that it seems her identity as "Anastasia" came to light.

 Early on Anna said nothing which indicates an intimate knowledge of the Romanov family.  Yet as the visits of Russian monarchists increased (During one of their first visits with Anna they gave her a piece of paper with the Romanov family code word) so did her knowledge of the Imperial family.  It wasn't until her time with Harriet von Rathlef-Keilmann in the mid 1920's that she began to have a fairly decent amount of anecdotes. (Though they were not always correct.  She would state that her English tutor Sydney Gibbes was deformed on one side of his body and walked with a limp.  This was completely inaccurate. She would reinterate it again after having actually met Mr. Gibbes some 30 years later and insisting that she would not recognize him because he did not have a limp -whether this is before or after he pronounced her a fraud I am unsure).  Harriet von Rathlef-Keilmann also stated that Anna recalled that "Ania" Anna Vyrubova (One of Anastasia's Mother's closest of friends) had red hair-which she did not.  As a former AA supporter I would used to point out that X-rays confirmed that she had suffered a head injury and thus her memory would be impaired-yet I now find it odd that someone suffering from a sort of amnesia would remember things which were absolutely incorrect or which never occurred.
  

Her earliest home outside of the asylum and hospitals was with  Baron Kleist and his family.  Later both he and one of his daughters would denounced her.  His daughter recounted Anna muttering in both Russian and Polish in her sleep (Another early host also stated she used Polish phrases) and an incidence of her jumping up from the dinner table and ducking under the table to wipe her nose. Certainly her manners would greatly improve by the time she stayed with the Duke of Leuchtenberg. In fact most of those she stayed with in those early years would become bitter enemies of her's including Baron Kleist (Apparently his wife would support Anna's claims until her death) Captain Schwabe and even Clara Peuthert the fellow inmate which recognize Anna as Anastasia.  Interestingly and very telling is that Baron Kleist's daughter also claimed that Felix Dassel (A former Russian officer who met Anna while she was staying with the Duke of Leuchtenberg and who positively recognize her as Anastasia who had been the former patroness of the hospital on the grounds of Tsarskoe Selo where he had stayed after injuries sustained in WWI) had in fact met her years prior at her father's house and had told Anna all his memories of his time with the real Grand Duchess.

When Anna recounted to Harriet von Rathlef-Keilmann that she used to be called "Schwibes" (sp?) by her Aunt Olga and in turn Harriet informed Olga Alexandrovna of this recollection Olga was stunned and impressed.  Until Olga found out that a former officer with whom she had a former acquaintance had visited Anna and had not only told Anna of the nickname but had gone to the extent of spelling it out letter by letter for her.

 
« Last Edit: November 28, 2007, 10:15:45 PM by Kransnoeselo » Logged
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« on: November 28, 2007, 09:49:59 PM »
Kransnoeselo Offline
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It has been pointed out by various authors (GIlliard, Klier, Welch etc) that Anna  reacted very oddly when confronted with individuals who had known the real Anastasia.  At times she would simply refuse their visit.  This includes at least one of Anastasia's first cousins (Son of Xenia Alexandrovna) When she did meet with them (sometimes these visits were forced or surprise visits)  Anna would usually stop speaking and hide her face from her visitors, either by covering her face with a kerchief (during Sydney Gibbes visit), an bed sheet (during Baroness Buxhoeveden's visit) , or simply leave the room (during Princess Irene's visit).  This way she prevented any false steps in either etiquette, speech or memories.  When Pierre Gilliard asked her to reminisce about her memories she stated that she didn't know how to chit-chat and when Gilliard questions aloud why her memory was so bad Anna replied that she suspected that if someone had tried to kill him his memory would be poor too.  (The simple fact that she even allowed a visit from Prince Felix Yussuppov-the murderer of Grigory Rasputin who was the real Anastasia's Mother's most trustest friend and advisor should sent up a few red flags)
 
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« on: November 28, 2007, 09:50:26 PM »
Kransnoeselo Offline
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Here are a few passages from Pierre Gilliard's La Fausse Anastasie (Note that I am not a professional translator, I have used a language program, French dictionaries, a friend, and my own limited knowledge of French in order to arrive at this final translation:

[Baroness Buxhoeveden's visit

   The Baroness Buxhoeveden was without interruption in the service to the Russian Imperial family, as a maid of honor, from 1913 to 1918, but ever since 1904 she had long stays at the court.  She therefore knew the Grand Duchesses since their childhood and had seen them daily for years.  She rejoined the Imperial family in Siberia and was separated from them six weeks before the catastrophe.

Here is the narrative of her visit:

   "March 12, I left for the hospital, accompanied by Mrs Tolstoii, my father the Baron Charles Buxhoeveden, the lieutenant Adriieevski and Mr. Schwabe (along with Ms. Peuthert.)  Although it was very early, - it was 8 in the morning,- the director of the hospital seemed to have been warned of our visit, and a nurse took us into the women's common room where the patient was located.  She was in bed close to the wall, she was turned facing against the window, in full sunlight.  When she heard us enter the room, she hid herself under the cover to hide herself from our stares, and we were not able to get her to show us her face.  The nurse and Mrs. Tolstoii told me that she always acted in this manner when someone wanted to she her, but the nurse added that the patient had a habit of acting in this manner with an older woman, Miss Peuthert, a former patient of the hospital and who apparently had the unknown one's confidence, and who was also present when I arrived.

   The unknown one spoke German with Miss Peuthert.  Although she was permitted to get up, she prefered to stay in bed as long as possible.  This is how I found her.  She was in a night shirt and a white morning coat, her hair was pulled away from the forehead and pulled back, and was arranged simply.  After asking my companions to move away from the bed a little, I tried to attract the young woman's attention as I caressed her hair and speaking to her in English while using the types of phrases I would have used while speaking with the Grand Duchesses, but I did not refer to her by any name other than 'Darling'.  She did not reply and I saw that she did not understand a word of what I had said, for when she raised the cover after a certain period of time, and I saw her face, there was nothing in her eyes which showed she had recognized me.  The eyes and forehead showed some resemblance to the Grand Duchess Tatiana Nicolaievna, resemblance that disappeared, nevertheless, as soon as her face was not covered.  I had to remove the cover by force, and I saw that neither the nose, the mouth, nor the chin were formed like that of the Grand Duchess.  The hair was lighter in color, some of her teeth were missing-and the remaining ones were not like those of the Grand Duchess, whose teeth were arranged like those of her Majesty the Empress Alexandra Feodorovna, that is to say that the superior teeth were slightly inclined inwards.  The teeth of this young woman on the contrary were all right.  Her hands were also completely different, the fingers were longer and the nails narrower.  I wanted to measure her height, but she refused, and I found it impossible to get an exact measurement without force.  We judged roughly that in any case, she was smaller than me, while the Grand Duchess Tatiana was more than ten centimeters taller than me.  I have been able to verify this, thanks to the patient's official measurement at the time of her arrival at the hospital and that corresponded exactly with the one which was taken in my presence.

I tried to awaken the memory of the young woman by all the possible means; I showed to her an 'icon', with the date of the Romanov jubilee, that the emperor had given to some persons of the suite, after that a ring that had belonged to the empress; the latter had been given given to her in the presence of the Grand Duchess Tatiana.  But none of these things seemed not to evoke in her the slightest recognition.  She remained completely indifferent, she whispered some incomprehensible words into Ms. Peuthert's ear.  Although I noted a certain similarity in the upper part of the face with the unknown -currently Mrs. Tschaikovski- with the Grand Duchess Tatiana, I am sure that she is not her.  I later learned that the she supposes that she is the Grand Duchess Anastasia, but she does not physically resemble her in the least.  She has none of the special characteristics that would allow any one who knew the Grand Duchess Anastasia well to identify her.

When Ms. Peuthert saw that the unknown one remained completely mute and did not show that she recognized me, she tried to attract her attention by whispering some words into her ear in German and showing photographs of the Imperial family to her.  She pointed to the Empress, while saying: 'Tell me, isn't that mamma?'  (Or similar words).  In the end she put into her hands a copy of a Russian New Testament with ribbons of the Russian national colors.  All these attempts failed, the patient remained mute and strove to hide her face with her cover or her hands.  I must point out that the Grand Duchess Anastasia hardly knew any German words and that she pronounced them with a strong Russian accent."]


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« on: November 28, 2007, 09:51:06 PM »
Kransnoeselo Offline
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Here is another passage from the book pertaining to Anna's time with the Kleist family.

[With Baron Kleist

May 30, 1922, the unknown one moved in to Baron Kleist's home.  It was there  where a lot of persons who had formerly had relations with the court came to see her; they brought her photographs and books concerning the Imperial family.  Little by little the unknown one familiarized herself with the Russian language.  Annie (this is what she was called by those who looked after her.) received medical care while staying with the Baron, she was suffering from tuberculosis of the bone and consumption.  According to statements by Dr Graede to me who had cared for her during this time, stated that there were some lesions on the body of the patient, but they all had tuberculosis of the bone and not in any case could be caused by rifle butts or of a bayonet.  Unfortunately, this doctor, who was completely objective, did not submit the patient to a gynecological examination, but she declared to him that she had a son and "that one could always recognize this child thanks to the linens he wears with Imperial crowns and a medallion." which she had left to him.

In the file of the Baron Kleist are located two important facts:


1. The 6th of August 1922, the sick one yelled out in delirium in both Polish and Russian words (1) [Mr. and Mrs. Schwabe certify also that she would sometimes use the expression "Jesus-Maria", known to be used by Polish women.]

2.  The second is a letter sent to Copenhagen to the Grand Duchess Xenia, Nicholas II's sister, the unknown one signed "Astouchka".  As her hand trembled, the Baron was obliged to guide it.  The Grand Duchess Xenia replied that she had never given the nickname "Astouchka" to any of the Emperor's daughters.

 The Baroness Kleist recalled interesting conversations that she had with the patient, and during one which she asserted that the Emperor had deposited several millions in an English bank in the name of his daughters.

Nevertheless, all the attempts by Baron Kleist to identify the unknown one remained unsuccessful.  Among numerous persons who came to see her, none of them recognized her as the Tsar's daughter.  Mrs. Zenaïde Tolstoii who at first had taken her for the Grand Duchess Tatiana, recounted her error in a letter she addressed to Baron Kleist on August 7, 1922.]


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« on: November 28, 2007, 09:52:01 PM »
Kransnoeselo Offline
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Here is a passage which includes Princess Irene's account of her visit with Anna.

[Visit of Princess Irene Of Prussia

In the month of August of the same year, on the request of the counselor Gaebel, the patient was transported with the police inspector Dr Grunberg, in his property of "Funkenmuhle".  The Dr.  Grunberg requested the Princess Irene of Prusse, sister of the empress Alexandra Feodorovna, travelled incognito to "Funkenmuhle".

Here the report of the princess Irene of Prusse:

   At the end of August 1922, I made a decision, on the request of the counselor Gaebel and police inspector Dr Grunberg, to return to Berlin to establish if the enigmatic person was my niece Anastasia.  Dr Grunberg took me, in the company of Miss of Oertzen, to his house in the country, close to Berlin.  The unknown one lived there under the name of "Miss Anny", and, as I arrived impromptu, she was not made aware of who I was, so that our encounter took place without her being affected by my presence.

   I saw right away that she could be not be any of my nieces; for, although I not seen them for nine years, the basic traits of the face could not have changed to this point, in particular the position of the eyes, the ears, etc.

   At first sight, one could possibly have found a certain resemblance with the Grand duchess Tatiana.

   At first I remained with the unknown one in the company of Miss of Oertzen, then alone, but I was not able to notice in her any signs which led me to believe that she recognized me.  I had lived in 1912 and 1913 entire weeks with my nieces and since that time I have changed little.

   At the table, we sat straight across from each one other; then, she got up and left, without saying a word, and went to her room.  At this time I already had the conviction that she was not my niece, but, at the desire of the Dr Grunberg, I went up to her room, and approached her bed.  I addressed her in vain with words in the language that we habitually used, recalled situations from the past, spoke the nicknames or the names of persons we knew: she did not react to anything.  She still did not reply when I prayed for her to say a word or to make a sign that she had recognized me; even when -in order to not neglect anything - I said to her:  "Do you not know your Aunt Irene?"

   To the Grunbergs big disappointment, who were so well intentioned, I left with the firm conviction that this unknown one is not my niece; I no longer kept the least doubt in this respect.

   We had lived, formerly, in such intimacy, that it would have sufficed for a small sign or an unconscious movement to awaken in me a familial feeling to convince me.

Signed:  Irene, Princess Henri Of Prussia.]
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« on: November 28, 2007, 09:53:13 PM »
Kransnoeselo Offline
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Again passages about Anna's time with Baron Kleist

[The Words of Baron Kleist

   June 7, 1922, I, Arthur Gustavovitch Kleist, was present for the questioning of the unknown one which took place at the Dalldorf asylum.  She declared the following:

   'I arrived in Berlin in the middle of the month of February 1920, I do not remember the exact date.  I arrived here alone, coming from Russia and having gone through Romania.  Immediately in Berlin, I changed clothing, in order not to be recognized. for it seemed to me that I was followed.  I no longer know what with that which I changed clothing.  I was free for less than a week, for I was first placed in the Elizabeth Hospital, where I spent six weeks, then I was transferred to the Dalldorf asylum.'

   After that, the unknown one was overcome by strong emotion, and, when I ask her how she came from Russia she does not give any response and only declared that her companion died in Romania.  Being in an extreme agitation the unknown asked me if it was possible to recognize her and if her relatives in Paris had been informed about her stay with me. After giving her a negative response I told her it was preferable not to advise her relatives in Paris because in my opnion it would be more convenient to inform her relatives in Denmark.  For the moment the unknown one then  abstained from giving any information to me.

   That same evening, at supper, I asked the Unknown one if she would consent to say her name to me.  I wanted to write on a slip of paper two names, whereby she would cross out the one that would be false, after which I would destroy the paper.  The unknown one accepted my suggestion.  I wrote on the paper the names of Anastasia and of Tatiana in Russian and then I passed her the paper.  Having read it, she crossed out the name of Tatiana, and returned me the paper that was immediately destroyed, as planned.    Some moments later, the unknown one asked me not to change anything in our rapport, because of this declaration, and not to observe etiquette.

   Continuing my questioning, I wanted to know with whom she had come from Romania with and how she had made Marie Peuthert's acquaintance.   Replying to the first question, the Unknown one declared that she had arrived in Berlin alone and and that her companion died in Romania.  She refused to say more about it (she remained stubbornly silent).  Replying to the second question, she explained that she had made Marie Peuthert's acquaintance at the Dalldorf hospital, that she had not known her beforehand and that in any case she had not come with her to Berlin.]

   
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« on: November 28, 2007, 09:53:57 PM »
Kransnoeselo Offline
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Baron Kleist's statement continued:

{June 20 1922, the young woman that I had taken to my house from the asylum invited me to come to her room and, in the presence of my wife, the Baroness Marie Karlovna Kleist, she asked me to protect her and to emphasize her rights.  I told her that I was at her disposal, provided that she reply quite frankly to my questions, I asked for her first who she was.  The response was adamant: She was the Grand Duchess Anastasia Nicolaiievna, the youngest daughter of the Emperor Nicholas II.  Next, I asked for her to give her account of the slaughter of the Imperial family and how she was able to save herself.  I obtained the following response:

   Yes I was present at the time of the slaughter of the Imperial family, and, when the slaughter began, I hid myself behind the back of my sister Tatiana who was killed by a blow (shot). Next, I received some blows (shots) and lost consciousness.  When I regained consciousness I was located with the family of a soldier who had saved me.  Then  with a female relative of the soldier and I left for Romania; and when this last one died (in Romania), I travelled to Germany alone; I had the intention to live hidden due to the fear of being followed and to earn my living by working.  I did not have any money, but I possessed some jewels; I sold them, and with this money I arrived here.

   All these trials deeply shook me, so that, for a moment, I lose all hope to see the arrival of better days.  ALthough knowing Russian, I avoid speaking it, for this language evokes in me extremely painful memories, the Russians treated us so poorly, me and my parents (family).

   The Grand Duchess Anastasia Nicolaiievna consented to confirming all that she had said to me in the presence of General Schulmann.  She equally agreed to invite, for recognition and identification, Prince Dolgorukov, who was in the service of Her Majesty the Dowager Empress Marie Feodorvna, whose arrival in Berlin was expected soon.

   July 1922, the young person that I took from the Dalldorf asylum at my place confirmed adamantly, for the second time to me, Arthur Gustavovitch Kleist, that she was the Grand Duchess Anastasia Nicolaievna.  She added:

    Of all of my close relatives, I would want to see the Grand Duchess Xenia first.

   I liked this aunt a lot, and I am sure that she will recognize me better then the other aunts, although I do not understand why other persons who have known me well beforehand do not recognize me now.

   My aunt Xenia Alexandrovna often called me "Astouchka", and when I have recalled this name to her, she will no longer have doubt of my identity.

   This is the reason I will write to Xenia Alexandrovna a letter that I will pray you send to her.

   After that, the one who called herself Grand Duchess Anastasia Nicolaievna declared that in fact, being in Romania, she had, due to the advice of her companion, tried all means to alter her facial features.  She received, from an intermediary, this person who died in Romania, a device (apparatus), that she used on her face and succeeded a little in changing the form of her nose and mouth.
(Signed) Baron Klesit

   August 4 1922, Zenaiide Sergueiievna Tolstoii communicated, to me, Arthur Gustavovitch, Baron Kleist, that which follows:  August 2 years ago, the one that calls herself the Grand Duchess Anastasia Nicolaiievna communicated to  me that she was saved hands of the bolsheviks by the Russian soldier Alexander Tschaiikovski.  It was with the family of the latter, consisting of his mother Marie, his sister Veronica, twenty-eight years old, and of his brother Serge (younger than his sister), and herself, Anastasia Nicolaiievna, arrived to Bucharest (Romania), where she remained until 1920.

   She bore Tschaiikovski's child, a boy that must now be almost three years old.  The child has black hair like his father, as are were his eyes.  The Tschaiikosvki family lived in a street situated close to a train station: It was, probably, the street "Swienti Voevosi", she does not remember the house number.  In 1920, Tschaiikovsi was attacked in a Bucharest street; he died from his injuries.  Then Anastasia Nicolaiievna, without warning anyone, flees Bucharest and arrived in Berlin.  Here she takes a room in a small boarding house, close to the train station, in Friedrichstrasse.  Anastasia Nicolaiievna does not remember the name of the boarding house.  Next, Anastasia Nicolaiievna declared that her child remained with the Tschaiikovski family, and she prayed to have him returned to her as fast as possible.

(Signed) Baron Kleist][/i]
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« on: November 28, 2007, 09:54:56 PM »
Kransnoeselo Offline
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August 10, 1922, I Arthur Gustavovitch Kleist, questioned the Unknown one who I had taken from the Dalldorf asylum to my house and who called herself the Grand Duchess Anastasia.  She confirmed, in general, the declaration of Zenaiide Sergueiievna Tolstoii, and adds the following:

   I arrived in Bucharest at the end of 1918.  I got married to Alexander Tschaikovski, January 18, 1919, according to the Catholic rite, in a Catholic church situated not far from the place and house where I lived in Bucharest.  I do not remember the name of the church or the name of the priest who married us.

   Before my marriage, I converted to Catholicism, but now I want to again return to the Orthodox church. December 5, 1918,  I had a son who was baptized according to the Catholic rite by the same priest who married us.

   My name was listed as Anna Romanska (sic); on the marriage certificate which was in possession of my husband.  My son was baptized in January 1919; I do not remember the date.  He was given the name Alexis.

   In August 1919, my husband, Alexander Tschaiikovski was injured on a street in Bucharest having been shot, and died three days later.  He was buried in a Catholic cemetery in Bucharest.  (Signed) Baron Kleist ]



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« on: November 28, 2007, 10:09:35 PM »
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Here is a passage about a letter Clara Peuthert had written to Princess Irene with regards to Anna. I had never read elsewhere that Clara claimed Anna told her that after being rescued in Ekaterinburg she travelled to Romania then to Paris and then to Berlin.  One naturally asks why she would say she went to Paris (which one would have to go through Germany (or Italy) to get to Paris  from Romania? Pierre Gilliard believed that Anna had gotten the idea from an Illustrated Berlin newspaper which claimed that Anastasia had escaped and was said to be in Paris.  Thus if we believe what Clara wrote to Princess Irene Anna apparently adopted this story only to discard it (like much of these early stories) later. Note that within this passage are a few sentences which I could not accurately translate.  From my best estimation Clara writes that Anna told her that while in Berlin she was in a automobile with people in order to change into some other clothes so as not to be recognized only to be thrown out of the car and into the Landwher canal where she ended up being rescued by the police.  I have included the orginal French within the text. Perhaps someone more experienced with the language could assist in an accurate translation.

 

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« on: November 28, 2007, 10:10:18 PM »
Kransnoeselo Offline
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And here is the passage
[It is necessary to grant special interest to the declarations that the patient gave to Ms. Peuthert and that she recorded in a letter that is addressed to Princess of Prussia, August 23, 1922. (Princess Irene of Prussia, sister of the Empress of Russia)

   I wrote in February to the Grand Duke Hesse-Darmstadt that there resides in Dalldorf asylum a young lady who says she is the Grand Duchess Anastasia Nicolaiievna Romanov.

   As I often saw this young lady in photographs during her in her youth, and during a stay which I did in Russia, I promised to get her out of this place where she is living (utterly) abandoned.

   She related to me, that at the time of the assassination of the Imperial family, she received injuries to her hand and behind her ear, then was knocked to the floor, upon which she fainted.  A mere soldier, named Tschaiikovski, took her and hid her.  HIs mother and his sister cared for her.  But when it was noticed that a corpse was missing a search was undertaken to find the soldier; the family who was taking care of Anastasia was in danger and fled to Bucharest.   As this young lady was alone in the world and the name Romanov could endanger her, Anastasia, then seventeen years old, married the soldier whose family formerly belonged to Polish nobility.  Anastasia gave birth to a son that carried the name of Alexis.  They lived in Bucharest for a certain period of time, I think about two years, then the family's hideout was discovered; Anastasia's husband was injured by a bullet which struck his lungs; he was brought back seriously injured to the house, where he died, due to the continuous blood loss he suffered.

   As a living relative of Anastasia on her mother's side, as sister of the Tsarina, you will understand and forgive that Anastasia, abandoned by all, was not able to have a marriage of her own blood.  This is the biggest concern of the unfortunate one to know how you will accept this thing, especially her Grand Mother.   This onoe seems besides to be her enemy and wants to take advantage of the assassination of the emperor to govern.  This is the reason why Anastasia does not want to emphasize her rights as the Grand Duchess although she is.  It is necessary to act with a lot of prudence.  I pray you come see this lady.  I photographed her last week; though they cannot be very useful, since the young lady is at the moment very sick.  She was transported from the Dalldorf asylum to the house of Baron Kleist, who mixed this matter with his own goals and interests and wants to be her only advisor.  This is the reason why the lady left this family under a ruse in order to quietly reflect on what she should do.

   When Your Highness was this be visiting at Potsdam, the baron did not allow that the young lady to speak to you.  I insistently ask that you come to see her at once; only you can prove the truth.  Currently, this lady is with a good family, but it is not necessary that the Baron know it.  I will reveal you then where she is located.

   The young lady does not want one to say that she is the Grand Duchess, or Mrs Tschaiikovsi, for when those who followed her discovered the hideout of her family to Bucharest, she had to flee again.   She tried to loose their track leaving first to Paris where she knows a Baron Taube.  From Paris, she came to Berlin.  She was scarcely there for eight days when someone recognized her.  One evening,   "dans une automobile, on l'a endormie, on lui a enlevé ses vêtements pour lui en mettre d'autres, et on l'a jetée, toujours endormie," in a lake by the zoo.  When she was drug out, it was believed that she had tried to commit suicide, and was driven to the Elisabeth hospital.  As she is not known in Warsaw under the name Tschaiikovski, she was transferred to the Dalldorf asylum.  It is absurd to believe that this lady, who fled Bucharest in the middle of so many difficulties to save her life, wanted to commit suicide here, in Berlin.  Only a madman would concede that.  This lady has a firm will to live, (as shown by the fact that) she has already spent three years without her son.

   I ask therefore that you take this matter seriously and to examine (to see) if all of this is true.  The current situation cannot go on much longer, since more than six months have passed without anyone being concerned for this lady.

She lives like a poor creature!  With the highest consideration, (Signed) Marie-Clara Peuthert
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