Author Topic: Personal Attributes of Nicholas II  (Read 199867 times)

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Offline Mike

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Re: Personal Attributes of Nicholas II
« Reply #30 on: August 11, 2004, 05:47:53 AM »
[size=10]Some background for Russian men nude-bathing together:[/size]

The old Russian army was staffed almost completely by peasant guys. They were accustomed to bathing in traditional village wet-steam baths and them immersing - nude of course - into a nearby creek ot pond. All enlisted men were marched, usually on Saturdays, to a public bath where hundreds of men bathed together. In summer every army unit would use any opportunity to rinse men and horses in whatever mass of water was available - river, lake or sea bay. Officers always participated in such mass bathing exercises, including young grand dukes and other aristocrats who were junior or middle-rank officers in guards regiments.

Bathing suits at that time were known only to the upper class. A view of an officer in such a stripped suit would become a perpetual joke to his soldiers and to the whole regiment, while displaying his bare bottom parts was by no means unusual or embarassing.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Mike »

Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Personal Attributes of Nicholas II
« Reply #31 on: August 11, 2004, 09:09:57 AM »
Quote
Perhaps QV felt this way: Intimacy with one's partner . . . no prob! But, with regards to anything the servants must take care of . . . keep it discreet!And from what I've read about Alexandra, I think she was of a similar mindset. She and Nicholas are usually so restrained in their photos,* but we know that Nicholas and Alexandra were very passionate in private. * The one exception being that very funny photo of the two of them kissing, with Xenia and Sandro kissing nearby, and Olga A. standing between them with a goofy expression on her face!


I love that photo! I have it and am trying to find a .jpg copy since mine is .bmp. This reminds me of a QV anecdote re: her granddaughter Thora. Noticing her granddaughter's decolletage, she had her place a flower or something in it reminding her 'of the footmen, dear'. I guess from their vantage point standing behind the family at dinner it could've been a nice view otherwise.  ;)
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Offline koloagirl

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Re: Personal Attributes of Nicholas II
« Reply #32 on: August 12, 2004, 03:06:11 PM »
 :o :o
May I ask a foolish question please?  The infamous "bare bottom" picture.....is it in the Yale
Library photo albums?  I know I have seen it in
the past ( :o ::)) but can't remember if it was in them or not.....reading your posts has made me wish to view it again!! ( :o :o)

Thank you in advance....you all are so great...I am so very grateful I have found this board of people who are interested in something that people have always thought I was foolishly interested in.  Now I know that I am not so alone!  Wonderful thing, the internet!

Janet R.     :-*
Janet R.

Offline Eurohistory

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Re: Personal Attributes of Nicholas II
« Reply #33 on: August 13, 2004, 09:18:04 AM »
I think that there is nothing infamous about this photo.  It was a custom for Russians to bathe naked, without maliciousness, a natural act...thankfully they were not as prudish as we have become in these days.  Although I am always surprised to see many of our fellow Americans trek to Greece every summer and unclothe at the beach without any trouble.

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Offline Annie

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Re: Personal Attributes of Nicholas II
« Reply #34 on: August 13, 2004, 09:44:36 AM »
I agree with Alexandra, I would dress myself too. Not only would I not want anyone to see me naked, I would find it humiliating to have another person dress me like a baby! I can't understand why that was considered such a privilege. Now of course they'd need help with those ball costumes and getting fixed up fancy, but just to have somebody dress me out of the bath, no thanks! I just don't get the nude bathing thing either. The guys I know won't even shower at the YMCA because they are all open stalls. If you want to bathe together, okay, but there should also be divided stalls for those who desire their personal privacy. The women have that, so should the men.

Offline Michelle

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Re: Personal Attributes of Nicholas II
« Reply #35 on: August 13, 2004, 03:06:28 PM »
Actually, at our YMCA, the women's showers DON'T have any doors!  It's all out in the open!! :o  :P  I absolutely HATE showering there if I go swimming in one of their pools!  Not because I think I'm fat or anything, it's just that I don't really like being totally bare for the whole world to see my privates  :-[  :P

Offline Robert_Hall

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Re: Personal Attributes of Nicholas II
« Reply #36 on: August 14, 2004, 11:29:49 PM »
Actually, this whole business of having maids dressoneself goes back to the days of high court etiquette under the Bourbons at Versailles and the Habsburgs in Vienna.
It was an actual state occaision togo to bed [coucher] and wake & bathe [levee] assisted not by maids, but by noble ladies "granted" the privilage. It was a grave matter of rank & privilage, the queen's underwear going through a whole line of noble ladies while she stood there freezing! This was done "in public" i.e. the state bedroom, access to watch being by rank or bribe.
It was actually a bit of a joke, as normally, after "officially" retireing, the queen [or king] would move from the hyge, cabopied state bed to more comfy quartes.
I understand this was all a way to keep the troublesome nobles at court and  from causing trouble. By the time this evolved to our "era' these tasks had been relegated to maids & valets. Performing the same functions in "stead" of whomever had the actual "right" to do it. Obviously it was cumbersome & time consuming way to get some sleep. Also, remember even at this period, bathing was still not really an everyday occurence for most people. {I could see why not in the old days} Alexandra's generation had pretty much dropped all this, but the titles remained, mistress of this & that.  As in any age though, the sticklers for "tradition" would protest.
Communal bathing, at least among men, was not only common, but often the only way for men to socialize without form & formality. Bath houses were also very traditional.
I do not know about women, but for boys, common showering starts with the first gym class at school in all cases I know of.  Especially in team sports. Then [if the route is taken] the military, on to gym as adults. No big deal.
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Re: Personal Attributes of Nicholas II
« Reply #37 on: September 15, 2004, 04:21:16 PM »
About King George V tattoo:

"The King also had a few tattoos on his arms which he had gotten done during his days in the navy. After becoming King, he would never allow them to been seen in public again."

From Wikipedia.

P.S.:

Offline James1941

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Re: Personal Attributes of Nicholas II
« Reply #38 on: September 29, 2004, 02:06:48 PM »
At various times Anna Annderson mentioned that "her father" had tattoos and described them. For her detractors this was proof that she was an imposter as they maintained the Tsar had no tatoos. However, these were usually people who were not that intimate with the imperial family. Some of her supporters, who were in more of a position to know, supported her claim that  the Tsar had tattoos and described them also as proof that she was the real Anastasia. Just another mystery in the fascinating story of this woman.

Offline James1941

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Re: Personal Attributes of Nicholas II
« Reply #39 on: January 19, 2005, 08:14:21 PM »
There is also a photograph of Alexei and the young Prince Igor Constantinovich (who was murdered at Alapaievsk) laying in shallow water on the bank of a river near army headquarters in Mogilev during WWI.
Both are nude. Alexei is staying with the Tsar in the Governor's house and Igor was one of the Tsar's aide de camps. It may be this picture is associated with the one of Alexei being washed off from a bucket by Dervenko. Anyone have more info.

Offline Mandie, the Gothic Empress

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Re: Personal Attributes of Nicholas II
« Reply #40 on: January 20, 2005, 09:29:01 PM »
I heared that in Russian Court, Swimming nude was ok,..I have seen pics of Alexei and Nicholas nude  :-X,..it a little weird for me,.. I don't save Nude pics of N and Lex, that would be just nasty if I did,..

Plus: I "HATE" seeing nude pics. I know it the human body. but still... I don't like or want to swim nude with others. at all..

Offline otmafan

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Re: Personal Attributes of Nicholas II
« Reply #41 on: January 20, 2005, 09:40:42 PM »
Quote
I heared that in Russian Court, Swimming nude was ok,..I have seen pics of Alexei and Nicholas nude  :-X,..it a little weird for me,.. I don't save Nude pics of N and Lex, that would be just nasty if I did,..

Plus: I "HATE" seeing nude pics. I know it the human body. but still... I don't like or want to swim nude with others. at all..


It was so common in that day that nobody really paid attention, i guess. it is still a little unusual though.

Offline Georgiy

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Re: Personal Attributes of Nicholas II
« Reply #42 on: January 21, 2005, 03:48:51 PM »
Yes, it was the normal way of swimming. No one would have batted an eyelid. (OK, well maybe some might have).
I suspect in other countries, or indeed, in mixed bathing, covering up would have been de riguer.

Offline Elisabeth

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Re: Personal Attributes of Nicholas II
« Reply #43 on: January 21, 2005, 04:33:11 PM »
When I first read the subject heading of this thread, I thought you were referring to something entirely different. Those of you who have read carefully Venyamin Alekseyev's book on the murder of the Romanovs will know what I mean. But I'm not going to go into details because to do so might be considered morbid or prurient by some.
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Offline AGRBear

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Re: Personal Attributes of Nicholas II
« Reply #44 on: January 21, 2005, 07:58:18 PM »
Let's take this into it's time period.

The bathing suits made were of cotton material.

The material aborbed water and grew very heavy.

Heavy material does not give the greatest sensation when trying to swim.

Heavy material, like swimming trunks, just slipped down so why wear them if they ended up around the knees?

There wasn't any spedo in those days.

Also, in those days, swimming was another way of bathing.

Nudity among men was taken in stride, it was the women, I assume,  who were the shy ones, more Victorian in attitude.....

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« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by AGRBear »
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