Author Topic: Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska Part 4  (Read 43718 times)

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Offline zackattack

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska Part 4
« Reply #285 on: January 27, 2007, 02:41:14 PM »
...[in poart]...

I also contacted Julian Knott, the film maker originally responsible for the DNA tests. I thought that no scientist would be stupid enough to go ahead with these tests if they thought that there was any chance that FS and Gertrude might not be related along the maternal line. He replied that this certainly was not brought up at the time of the tests. He questioned several members of the family, and was given a full family tree, as well as documents relating to the birth of FS and Gertrude.

....           


This information about Julian Knotts is important and I for one am delighted you search into these details and have reported this to us at this time.  Would Julian Knotts be willing to share the family tree of FS  and provide a copy of Gertrude's birth or baptismal record? 


AGRBear

Don't see why not, but that would be up to him. Like MP Remy, The Kliers, and the Schankosky family, he has had to deal with several mentally ill people (or people that live in deep denial)  who harrass him on this subject.  ButI can't remember if it was Mr. Knott that gave me the family tree, or MP Remy...ugh  I also had the address of the Notary in Germany who witnessed the blood transfer somewhere....

ALSO  I think that MP Remy's archives would be a wonderful asset to this website. He has just about everything Anna Anderson. But, that would be up to the FA.

Ra-Ra Rasputin, if I give you Julian Knott's email address, would you like to try to get in touch with him? I'm just way to busy.

P.S.
Thank you for the good wishes Penny and "Denise"! This "corspe" is up to his "old tricks again!" It gave me a good laugh,   

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska Part 4
« Reply #286 on: January 27, 2007, 05:41:54 PM »
Thank you Zack Attack for the interesting info. Especially this

Quote
worried that Margarita would be prosecuted for Franciska's activities

That makes perfect sense, doesn't it? Of course the family would still be afraid of that, and as you also mentioned, 'embarrassed.' This is why they don't speak out more about her. It's a shame they don't, it would stop a lot of outrageous theories from going around.

Offline zackattack

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska Part 4
« Reply #287 on: January 27, 2007, 09:58:40 PM »
Thank you Zack Attack for the interesting info. Especially this

Quote
worried that Margarita would be prosecuted for Franciska's activities

That makes perfect sense, doesn't it? Of course the family would still be afraid of that, and as you also mentioned, 'embarrassed.' This is why they don't speak out more about her. It's a shame they don't, it would stop a lot of outrageous theories from going around.

Thanks Cornholio

Looking through one of my old email accounts, I did find one of the emails Julian Knott sent to me. I do apoligize for any lapses in memory. Here is part of his email to me:


Further to my email to you of yesterday, last night I discovered I
have
 more materials at home than I thought.

 Carl Maucher's address is:

 XXXXXXX
 XXXXXXX
 XXXXXXX
 Germany

 (Remember he doesn't speak at English).

 I previously said something to you which was wrong. He did NOT know
 Anna Andersen was his relation, but he did know he had a missing
 great
 aunt.

 He was living with his aunt Margarete Ellerik at the same address.

 Margarete Ellerik wouldn't give us a blood sample. She was worried about being

 held liable for Franzisca's activities.  But she did give

 a sample to Philip Remy (the German TV producer I mentioned in my
email
 of yesterday).

 The FSS who did the main DNA tests got Carl Maucher's mtDNA.
 Margarete's mtDNA was got by a Dr Ginther at Berklee. The scientists
 compared their results, and they were the same.

 Maucher's blood taking was supervised by a local notary:

 Gerhard Sayer
 XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

 It was all filmed also.

 Maucher explained the family tree as this.

 Franzisca had 5 siblings: Maria-Juliana, gertrud, Walter, Felix,
 Valerian. (One more than previously documented I think).

 Gertrud's children were:

 1. Another Gertrud m. Maucher
 Carl Maucher's mother.

 2, Hedwig Lander
She was alive, but wouldn't give us a blood sample.

 3. Margarete
 Who lived with Carl Maucher & gave Philip Remy a blood sample

 4. Magdalene m. Weber
 Had a son called Herbert Weber, who was very
 helpful to us, and in fact introduced us to Carl
 Maucher.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2007, 10:04:22 PM by zackattack »

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska Part 4
« Reply #288 on: January 28, 2007, 08:01:19 AM »
Looking through one of my old email accounts, I did find one of the emails Julian Knott sent to me. I do apoligize for any lapses in memory. Here is part of his email to me:


Further to my email to you of yesterday, last night I discovered I
have
 more materials at home than I thought.

 Carl Maucher's address is:

 XXXXXXX
 XXXXXXX
 XXXXXXX
 Germany

 (Remember he doesn't speak at English).

 I previously said something to you which was wrong. He did NOT know
 Anna Andersen was his relation, but he did know he had a missing
 great
 aunt.

 He was living with his aunt Margarete Ellerik at the same address.

 Margarete Ellerik wouldn't give us a blood sample. She was worried about being

 held liable for Franzisca's activities.  But she did give

 a sample to Philip Remy (the German TV producer I mentioned in my
email
 of yesterday).

 The FSS who did the main DNA tests got Carl Maucher's mtDNA.
 Margarete's mtDNA was got by a Dr Ginther at Berklee. The scientists
 compared their results, and they were the same.

 Maucher's blood taking was supervised by a local notary:

 Gerhard Sayer
 XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

 It was all filmed also.

 Maucher explained the family tree as this.

 Franzisca had 5 siblings: Maria-Juliana, gertrud, Walter, Felix,
 Valerian. (One more than previously documented I think).

 Gertrud's children were:

 1. Another Gertrud m. Maucher
 Carl Maucher's mother.

 2, Hedwig Lander
She was alive, but wouldn't give us a blood sample.

 3. Margarete
 Who lived with Carl Maucher & gave Philip Remy a blood sample

 4. Magdalene m. Weber
 Had a son called Herbert Weber, who was very
 helpful to us, and in fact introduced us to Carl
 Maucher.

Thanks, jeremy. Hopefully this will finally put an end to the unfounded "half-sister" speculations (I doubt it though  ;)). Of course there is always a possibillity (as usual) of... you know... a conspiracy!   :o

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska Part 4
« Reply #289 on: January 28, 2007, 08:48:02 AM »
Penny and Greg gave us this information over a year ago.

I gave it, again, on this page of this thread, already.

Curious One, last years or was it longer,  had contacted Dr. Ginther and had gotten directly from him what he on on the samples he had in reguards to the AA tests.

I can find what he told Curious One about not wanting to know how the people were related because he didn't want to know,  if'd you like me to repeat his words exactly. 

Remember: Most people believe that Gertrud, nee Schanzkowska, Ellrich is the full sister of Franziska Schanzkowka [FS], however, we do not have a birth or death certificate which tells us that Gertrud and FS had the same mother or father, Anton Schanzkowska.  Gertrude was raised as a sibling in FS's father's home.
 
CHART of Anton SCHANZKOWKSY (Sansowski, Chanskowski...):     
     
Anton Schanzkowsky  b. (unknown)  d. (unknown) m. (1) to 1890 to Josefina Peek   
 Issue:
     1. or more.... [unknown]   
   
     
Anton Schanzkowsky m. (2) 1894  to  Marianna Wiscek b. 1866.   Marriage ended in divorce abt 1910/1912.  Both remarried.  [Mother remarried to ___NN___]     
     Issue:   
    2. Martin Christian S. b. 16 November 1895   
    3. Franziska S.  b. 16 December 1896 [date from Penny]  also listed in some books as  22 December 1896, baptized 24 December 1896   
     *  Gertrude b. poss. 1898 
    4.  Michael S.  b. 16 December 1899   
    5.  Valerian S.  (AKA Walther) b. 25 April 1901   
    6.  Felix S. b. 17 February 1903   
    7. Juliane Marianna S. (AKA Maria Juliana) b. 30 April 1905   
   
 
Anton Schanzkowsky m. (3??) to  ___NN3___     
 Issue:     
   1. [unknown]     
  ------
NOTES 
*Gertrude S.'s official birthdate unknown and place in families above is at this time is not known, however, Gertrude did tell people her birthdate was 1898 which would place her fourth between FS and Michael.

Family of Gertrude S.'s
 
Gertrud, nee Schanzkowska,  Ellrick children were: 
 
........1.  Gertrud[e]  Ellrick m. ___NN__Maucher 
................... Issue: 
...................   1)  +Carl Maucher's mother 
 ........2. Hedwig Ellrick m.
 _NN_ Lander 
 ........3. +Margarete  Ellrick  ( Who lived with Carl Maucher) 
 ........4. Magdalene Ellrick m. _NN_  Weber
...................Issue:
................... 1)Herbert Weber 
 
Notes:
+ tested DNA / mtDNA

[...in part...]

*
Quote
... [ in part]....
I personally reviewed copies of all the marriage, birth and baptismal records known to exist in May 2000, plus information taken from Pomerm after removal from their original Parishes (Catholic). At that time, there were no time line records for Gertrude Ellerick. which had been the goad for my investigation carried out in Europe.

When time permits, I will see what my notes show.

However, since that date many records have been consolidated from the provinces in Poland into a national archive, and it is possible that Records showing the time line place of Gertrude can now be established.

That said, if one checks also, in those periods (time-line), the "descent" of the father's status and what appeared to be a reputation for philandery, a plausible question arises as to whether he was required to "take in" a child from an outside affair. It is quite far-fetched to consider, but did happen in those communities.

......

In one of Penny Wilson's post she confirmed the fact that Gertrude's birth and her baptismal certificates have not been found in the same area that FS and the siblings by Anton S.'s second wife were found.

I was not able to find Gertrude's birth and baptismal certificates.

AGRBear


On another forum, Peter Kurth confirmed the fact that Gertrude's birth and her baptismal certificate has not been found.

I've been doing genealogy since 1970s and have dug through records in
 the area known as Poland.  In my latest search,  I have not found Gertrude's records.  I have used different spellings of the last name.  I have looked in other villages .....  No luck.

AGRBear

So,  my request is,  since I and others were not able to find Gertrude , nee S., Ellrich's birth or death certificate,  that I'd very much like to see a copy of it.

The birth certificate will give the name of both parents.  The baptismal entry into the church records  willl give the name of both parents, God parents and witnesses and sometimes the names of the people who were present which usually incluces grand parents, aunts, uncles, cousins and a good friend or two.....

I am mainly interested in finding the family background of Gertrude's mother.

Thanks.

AGRBear
« Last Edit: January 28, 2007, 08:57:37 AM by AGRBear »
"What is true by lamplight is not always true by sunlight."

Joubert, Pensees, No. 152

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska Part 4
« Reply #290 on: January 28, 2007, 08:55:21 AM »

.....[in part]....

I also contacted Julian Knott, the film maker originally responsible for the DNA tests. I thought that no scientist would be stupid enough to go ahead with these tests if they thought that there was any chance that FS and Gertrude might not be related along the maternal line. He replied that this certainly was not brought up at the time of the tests. He questioned several members of the family, and was given a full family tree, as well as documents relating to the birth of FS and Gertrude. Gertrude was still alive at the time of the DNA tests and, interesting side note, Gertrude's daughter Margarita was supposed to be the original blood donor. However, both Gertrude and Margarita were worried that Margarita would be prosecuted for Franciska's activities if there was a match, so she refused to donate blood. Carl Maucher volunteered instead. 

..... 

I made your words in bold where you talked about the documents relating to the brith of FS and Gertrude.

AGRBear
"What is true by lamplight is not always true by sunlight."

Joubert, Pensees, No. 152

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska Part 4
« Reply #291 on: January 28, 2007, 09:10:32 AM »
Dr. Ginther's letter to Curious One is found on the thread Questions to Ask Dr. Ginther

http://forum.alexanderpalace.org/index.php/topic,2987.0.html

Page2

Post #24


AGRBear
"What is true by lamplight is not always true by sunlight."

Joubert, Pensees, No. 152

Offline zackattack

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska Part 4
« Reply #292 on: January 28, 2007, 05:23:21 PM »
Looking through one of my old email accounts, I did find one of the emails Julian Knott sent to me. I do apoligize for any lapses in memory. Here is part of his email to me:


Further to my email to you of yesterday, last night I discovered I
have
 more materials at home than I thought.

 Carl Maucher's address is:

 XXXXXXX
 XXXXXXX
 XXXXXXX
 Germany

 (Remember he doesn't speak at English).

 I previously said something to you which was wrong. He did NOT know
 Anna Andersen was his relation, but he did know he had a missing
 great
 aunt.

 He was living with his aunt Margarete Ellerik at the same address.

 Margarete Ellerik wouldn't give us a blood sample. She was worried about being

 held liable for Franzisca's activities.  But she did give

 a sample to Philip Remy (the German TV producer I mentioned in my
email
 of yesterday).

 The FSS who did the main DNA tests got Carl Maucher's mtDNA.
 Margarete's mtDNA was got by a Dr Ginther at Berklee. The scientists
 compared their results, and they were the same.

 Maucher's blood taking was supervised by a local notary:

 Gerhard Sayer
 XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

 It was all filmed also.

 Maucher explained the family tree as this.

 Franzisca had 5 siblings: Maria-Juliana, gertrud, Walter, Felix,
 Valerian. (One more than previously documented I think).

 Gertrud's children were:

 1. Another Gertrud m. Maucher
 Carl Maucher's mother.

 2, Hedwig Lander
She was alive, but wouldn't give us a blood sample.

 3. Margarete
 Who lived with Carl Maucher & gave Philip Remy a blood sample

 4. Magdalene m. Weber
 Had a son called Herbert Weber, who was very
 helpful to us, and in fact introduced us to Carl
 Maucher.

Thanks, jeremy. Hopefully this will finally put an end to the unfounded "half-sister" speculations (I doubt it though  ;)). Of course there is always a possibillity (as usual) of... you know... a conspiracy!   :o

The conspiracy probably also involves the people who are still trying to make us believe that the world is flat.  ::) ;)
« Last Edit: January 28, 2007, 05:45:13 PM by zackattack »

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska Part 4
« Reply #293 on: January 28, 2007, 05:29:54 PM »
Penny and Greg gave us this information over a year ago.

I gave it, again, on this page of this thread, already.

Curious One, last years or was it longer,  had contacted Dr. Ginther and had gotten directly from him what he on on the samples he had in reguards to the AA tests.

I can find what he told Curious One about not wanting to know how the people were related because he didn't want to know,  if'd you like me to repeat his words exactly. 


So,  my request is,  since I and others were not able to find Gertrude , nee S., Ellrich's birth or death certificate,  that I'd very much like to see a copy of it.

The birth certificate will give the name of both parents.  The baptismal entry into the church records  willl give the name of both parents, God parents and witnesses and sometimes the names of the people who were present which usually incluces grand parents, aunts, uncles, cousins and a good friend or two.....

I am mainly interested in finding the family background of Gertrude's mother.

Thanks.

AGRBear
[/quote]

No you don't Bear, Penny Wilson gave you part of that information, the rest comes from me, courtesy of Julian Knott. Butgiven how you're history of giving out false information through misquotes and "creative editing",  I'm not surprised by your statement that it came only from her.

Why do you always want someone else to do your work for you? Go for it. Contact Julian Knott, contact MP Remy, contact the Schankowsky family. But, given you tendancy to believe that something is a fact because Penny Wilson said so, and that you still do not seem to understand that Gertrude's birth certificate actually isn't important.   I highly doubt finding Gertrud's birth certificate will clear your mind of "doubt". For I'm sure the following week there will be a thread entitled : THEORY OF GERTRUDE'S BIRTH CERTIFICATE BEING FORGED-IS QUEEN ELIZABETH II RESPONSIBLE? 

« Last Edit: January 28, 2007, 05:39:02 PM by zackattack »

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska Part 4
« Reply #294 on: January 28, 2007, 05:32:38 PM »

.....[in part]....

I also contacted Julian Knott, the film maker originally responsible for the DNA tests. I thought that no scientist would be stupid enough to go ahead with these tests if they thought that there was any chance that FS and Gertrude might not be related along the maternal line. He replied that this certainly was not brought up at the time of the tests. He questioned several members of the family, and was given a full family tree, as well as documents relating to the birth of FS and Gertrude. Gertrude was still alive at the time of the DNA tests and, interesting side note, Gertrude's daughter Margarita was supposed to be the original blood donor. However, both Gertrude and Margarita were worried that Margarita would be prosecuted for Franciska's activities if there was a match, so she refused to donate blood. Carl Maucher volunteered instead. 

..... 

I made your words in bold where you talked about the documents relating to the brith of FS and Gertrude.

AGRBear

Don't know why. But I'll also type in bold too, just for the fun of it. Write to Carl Maucher and ask him for whatever documents he might have. I'm not involved in any AA research at the moment. Would you like his address?

IF  I remember anything more, find any of my old notes, are need to make any correction due to faulty memory, I will be happy to share it with everyone here on the forum.
« Last Edit: January 28, 2007, 05:43:33 PM by zackattack »

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska Part 4
« Reply #295 on: January 28, 2007, 08:13:16 PM »


No you don't Bear, Penny Wilson gave you part of that information, the rest comes from me, courtesy of Julian Knott. Butgiven how you're history of giving out false information through misquotes and "creative editing",  I'm not surprised by your statement that it came only from her.

Why do you always want someone else to do your work for you? Go for it. Contact Julian Knott, contact MP Remy, contact the Schankowsky family. But, given you tendancy to believe that something is a fact because Penny Wilson said so, and that you still do not seem to understand that Gertrude's birth certificate actually isn't important.   I highly doubt finding Gertrud's birth certificate will clear your mind of "doubt". For I'm sure the following week there will be a thread entitled : THEORY OF GERTRUDE'S BIRTH CERTIFICATE BEING FORGED-IS QUEEN ELIZABETH II RESPONSIBLE? 



You recieved the information from Julian Knott and are telling me that you  place it somewhere here on the forum first.  That  is great!  Evidently I didn't recall that you had done so or  just didn't realize it.  So sorry.  I'll be more than happy to give where  credit is due.  I just remembered Penny's chart..

I have not mentioned the missing Gertrude's birth or baptismal certificate as being a theory.  I've never seen it.  Nor have I found it  and from what I had understood,  until your post,  was that  no one else has either.   Your post is the first time I heard that  Julian Knott has it.  I certainly have not suggested  that Julian Knotts has  "FORGED"  a birth certificate or any other docutment.  Where did you ever get that silly idea?

E-mail me and I'd be more than happy to contact Julian Knott or anyone else you'd care for me to speak to directly.

If I have ever mistquoted ANYONE  at ANYTIME,  I will apologize and correct my errors.  Always have and always will. 

I really don't care where the truth takes me,  I'm just enjoying the journey.

 

AGRBear
« Last Edit: January 28, 2007, 08:21:48 PM by AGRBear »
"What is true by lamplight is not always true by sunlight."

Joubert, Pensees, No. 152

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska Part 4
« Reply #296 on: January 28, 2007, 08:30:18 PM »


Don't know why. But I'll also type in bold too, just for the fun of it. Write to Carl Maucher and ask him for whatever documents he might have. I'm not involved in any AA research at the moment. Would you like his address?

IF  I remember anything more, find any of my old notes, are need to make any correction due to faulty memory, I will be happy to share it with everyone here on the forum.

Yes,  please,  I'd like to write directly to Carl Maucher.   So,  yes,  I'd like his address.

Thank you very much.

I  will never  fault anyone for a  honest  faulty memory since   I'm 65 and  know full well that  memory doesn't   get better.  If you thought I was mocking you or being critical,  I'm sorry.

AGRBear
"What is true by lamplight is not always true by sunlight."

Joubert, Pensees, No. 152

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska Part 4
« Reply #297 on: February 04, 2007, 08:51:49 PM »
Thank you Zack Attack for the interesting info. Especially this

Quote
worried that Margarita would be prosecuted for Franciska's activities

That makes perfect sense, doesn't it? Of course the family would still be afraid of that, and as you also mentioned, 'embarrassed.' This is why they don't speak out more about her. It's a shame they don't, it would stop a lot of outrageous theories from going around.

I did find another email. In this one I asked him if there were any private family papers, such as letters, in which family members discussed Anna Anderson as one of their own. I also asked him about the fate of FS's siblings, Gertrude and Felix. That's when I found out Gertrude had still been alive at the time of the DNA tests. I also asked why Mr. Webb had not given a blood sample. He was, after all, just as closely related as Carl Maucher:

XXXX


 From memory, I don't think there were any papers. They weren't that
kind of family. Of course there are German court papers which are
archived somewhere, although I seem to remember they are very hard to
access.

I don't know what happened to Felix or Gertrude. Gertrude was old an
ill 10 years ago so I think the explanation is obvious.

I can't remember why Mr Webb didn't give a blood sample.

 

Offline zackattack

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska Part 4
« Reply #298 on: February 04, 2007, 08:57:07 PM »


No you don't Bear, Penny Wilson gave you part of that information, the rest comes from me, courtesy of Julian Knott. Butgiven how you're history of giving out false information through misquotes and "creative editing",  I'm not surprised by your statement that it came only from her.

Why do you always want someone else to do your work for you? Go for it. Contact Julian Knott, contact MP Remy, contact the Schankowsky family. But, given you tendancy to believe that something is a fact because Penny Wilson said so, and that you still do not seem to understand that Gertrude's birth certificate actually isn't important.   I highly doubt finding Gertrud's birth certificate will clear your mind of "doubt". For I'm sure the following week there will be a thread entitled : THEORY OF GERTRUDE'S BIRTH CERTIFICATE BEING FORGED-IS QUEEN ELIZABETH II RESPONSIBLE? 



You recieved the information from Julian Knott and are telling me that you  place it somewhere here on the forum first.  That  is great!  Evidently I didn't recall that you had done so or  just didn't realize it.  So sorry.  I'll be more than happy to give where  credit is due.  I just remembered Penny's chart..

I have not mentioned the missing Gertrude's birth or baptismal certificate as being a theory.  I've never seen it.  Nor have I found it  and from what I had understood,  until your post,  was that  no one else has either.   Your post is the first time I heard that  Julian Knott has it.  I certainly have not suggested  that Julian Knotts has  "FORGED"  a birth certificate or any other docutment.  Where did you ever get that silly idea?

E-mail me and I'd be more than happy to contact Julian Knott or anyone else you'd care for me to speak to directly.

If I have ever mistquoted ANYONE  at ANYTIME,  I will apologize and correct my errors.  Always have and always will. 

I really don't care where the truth takes me,  I'm just enjoying the journey.

 

AGRBear

You just did it again Bear. You know darn well that I never said that you said Julian Knott forged Gertrude's birth certificate. You just made that up. Besides which, the person to contact is Carl Maucher, not Julian Knott. My memory was incorrect and Mr. Maucher had the information, not Julian Knott.


Offline zackattack

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska Part 4
« Reply #299 on: February 04, 2007, 09:00:06 PM »


Don't know why. But I'll also type in bold too, just for the fun of it. Write to Carl Maucher and ask him for whatever documents he might have. I'm not involved in any AA research at the moment. Would you like his address?

IF  I remember anything more, find any of my old notes, are need to make any correction due to faulty memory, I will be happy to share it with everyone here on the forum.

Yes,  please,  I'd like to write directly to Carl Maucher.   So,  yes,  I'd like his address.

Thank you very much.

I  will never  fault anyone for a  honest  faulty memory since   I'm 65 and  know full well that  memory doesn't   get better.  If you thought I was mocking you or being critical,  I'm sorry.

AGRBear

Apology accepted Bear, but there are alot more people on this board you should be apologizing to. And I do hope your words about faulty memory are sincere.  However, knowing your tendancy to misquote in the name of "fun"  I can't in good faith give you Carl Maucher's address. You'll just have to get it from another source.