Author Topic: Rasputin's prediction  (Read 55595 times)

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Offline nena

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Re: rasputin letter
« Reply #90 on: February 01, 2009, 03:02:56 PM »
Sorry for refreshing this old thread, but I have to add.

1916 letter:

I write and leave behind me this letter at St. Petersburg. I feel that I shall leave life before January 1st.

I wish to make known to the Russian people, to Papa, to the Russian Mother and to the children, to the land of Russia, what they must understand. If I am killed by common assassins, and especially by my brothers the Russian peasants, you, Tsar of Russia, have nothing to fear, remain on your throne and govern, and you, Russian Tsar, will have nothing to fear for your children, they will reign for hundreds of years in Russia. But if I am murdered by boyars, nobles, and if they shed my blood, their hands will remain soiled with my blood, for twenty-five years they will not wash their hands from my blood. They will leave Russia.

Brothers will kill brothers, and they will kill each other and hate each other, and for twenty-five years there will be no nobles in the country. Tsar of the land of Russia, if you hear the sound of the bell which will tell you that Grigory has been killed, you must know this: if it was your relations who have wrought my death then no one of your family, that is to say, none of your children or relations will remain alive for more than two years. They will be killed by the Russian people...I shall be killed. I am no longer among the living.
Pray, pray, be strong, think of your blessed family.

7 Dec 1916


Did Rasputin indeed wrote famous 1916 letter to Tsar in which he stated that if he is dead, then Imperial Russia will come to end, and nobody of his family will not live longer than 2 years.

But sure he wrote telegram to Tsar and Tsarina during Spala crisis in 1912, full of hope for Little Tsarevich:

Little one will not die

Of course he didn't. Because - he would never invoke to Tsar or Tsarina in that way, as '...you, Russian Tsar...'. Only rumors were made about that letter, an most probably someone else wrote it. Anyway, his handwriting was not perfect, and he began to learn writing lately, since he consider that his minds should be published.

His diary, 'Moe Misli' ('My minds'):



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Offline scrybe13

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Re: Rasputin's prediction
« Reply #91 on: February 21, 2009, 12:11:03 PM »
Has it ever occurred to any of you that history is generally written by the ruling aristocracy, and not the common man?  Indeed there is much in Simanovitch's memoirs (which I have translated in full, into English) which is substantiated by Russia's own historian, Edvard Radzinsky. The most important of these historical facts concerns the huge numbers of unjustly imprisoned Jews who were freed due to Simanovitch's contact with Rasputin, not to mention the many pogroms that were averted, due to Rasputin's intervention by pleading with the tzar.  One must not forget that Russia was incredibly anti-Semitic, and still is, to a large extent.  It is true that Jews were confined to living in certain areas and that there were quotas as to how many could attend various schools and universities.  Simanovitch and Rasputin helped overcome such obstacles for many Jews.  But, of course, Russian history would have Rasputin be evil, having been on the side of the underdog.  Whether or not the predictions are true is a moot point, and insignificant compared to the social issues they were dealing with.
Quote
I have a copy of the original French version of Simanovich's "Memoirs". I translated much of it, hoping perhaps to post an online version. However, it frankly is virtually all made up, self serving, and scurillous in an attempt to sensationalilze and create scandal.  There is almost no genuine fact or insight to be gained from it.  In just the first ten pages, he portrays Nicholas as a hard-drinking, wife beating philanderer and Alexandra as an hysterical drunken sexual predator! Sadly for history, he seems to have nothing genuine to add to Rasputin facts. I have absolutely no doubt that he fabricated that "prediction".

I have been very interested in how Rasputin has been painted in Russian history and from the view point of his personal secretary, which obviously must be in some conflict. I would greatly enjoy reading what you have translated if that is possible. Have you managed to put it on line to be viewed?  
« Last Edit: August 07, 2012, 10:25:15 AM by Alixz »

Offline Forum Admin

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Re: Rasputin's prediction
« Reply #92 on: February 21, 2009, 12:21:00 PM »
The answer is that the Simanovich book is total fiction, therefore of no historical value for the contents therein, as it is just made up stuff to sell books. I have no intention of putting a word of it out there for anyone to accidentally believe to be accurate.

Offline Imperial_Grounds

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Re: Rasputin's prediction
« Reply #93 on: February 22, 2009, 02:09:21 PM »
In my opinion the letter is forgery, it is almost impossible that it is true, therefore I not believe Rasputin ever wrote such a letter. Ofcourse it makes up a sensational and mythic storie, and it tells well in a dramatic form, knowing what happened after his death, but that does not mean it is true. I do not believe it, and probably never will.
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Offline nena

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Re: Rasputin's prediction
« Reply #94 on: February 22, 2009, 03:05:34 PM »
You are completely right, Rasputin never wrote that famous 1916 letter before death.

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Alixz

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Re: Rasputin's prediction
« Reply #95 on: August 07, 2012, 10:27:30 AM »
Just bumping this up as it has become a center of discussion in  another thread.

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Offline Inok Nikolai

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Re: Rasputin's Last Letter to Aleksandra
« Reply #96 on: January 12, 2014, 12:36:09 PM »
Well, drat!

I misremembered -- this isn't Rapsutin's last letter  :-[
According to Alexandrov (who is frankly not to be trusted at all with the captions in his book) this is the letter Rasputin wrote to the Imperial couple at the beginning of WWI.


I'll nose through my other books and see if I've got a photo of his last letter elsewhere...

For the record, the original of this pre-W W I letter is now found in the Beinecke Library of Yale University.
http://brbl-dl.library.yale.edu/vufind/Record/3817075

The donor stated that he bought it directly from G. E. Rasputin's daughter herself soon after the Revolution.
According to his account, the Imperial Family had returned the letter to Rasputin's family while they were in Tobolsk.

A photograph of it appears in Sokolov's book too.

Inok Nikolai




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Offline Inok Nikolai

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Re: Rasputin's prediction
« Reply #97 on: June 26, 2014, 03:36:06 PM »
RE: The other notes supposedly by Rasputin

Tatiana Mironova’s book, Iz-pod lzhy [From Under the Lie], printed in Moscow in 1994, contains some pertinent passages on Rasputin’s famous notes.

Without necessarily accepting the tendentious premises of T. L. Mironova’s open defense of G. E. Rasputin, one can, nevertheless, find her observations on the notes written by him to be of interest, since her philological credentials seem to be legitimate.

The Russian Wikipedia article and the biographical blurb on the cover of her book state that:
Tatiana L. Mironova graduated from the Philology Department of Moscow State University. For fifteen years she has taught Church-Slavonic at the St. Tikhon Institute in Moscow. She is the author of a text book on Church-Slavonic which has been reprinted several times. She has a Doctorate in Philology, is a corresponding member of the International Slavonic Academy of Science, a Russian author, and a member of the Writers’ Union of Russia. She is said to be an expert on original written sources in Church-Slavonic and Old Russian.

http://ru.widipedia.org/wiki/Миронова,_Татьяна_Леонидовна

http://www.rusprav.org/biblioteka/Mironova_Nikolai_II_and_Rasputin/Iz-pod_lzhy_text.html

The originals of the two documents which she considers are found in the Russian State Library, in Moscow: РГБ (Russian State Library), f. 251, op. 25, d. 61.
They are two letters purportedly written by G. E. Rasputin to the editors of the Russian newspaper Russkoe Slovo. In analyzing their contents, T. Mironova makes the following observations:

1) While the author of these letters strives to give them the appearance of letters written by someone who is poorly educated, semi-literate, and not used to writing, he nevertheless betrays himself by forming certain individual characters quite correctly, and in a manner usually taught in a gymnasia — high school, i.e., he lapses into his usual handwriting.

2) If these two letters are compared with undisputedly genuine documents in G. E. Rasputin’s handwriting, then it becomes quite evident that these are forgeries.

3) In addition, several of the individual characters were initially written properly, but then scribbled over again to “correct” them and make them appear more crudely formed.

4) The artificial “muzhik” style of the letters reflects the peasant dialects of Western Great Russia or Byelorussia, not that of G. E. Rasputin’s native western Siberia. And the style is even lower and more ungrammatical than Rasputin’s own.

5) From a linguistic and stylistic point of view, those two fabrications are not very successful, and they betray the hand, not of philologist or writer, but most likely of a journalist.

[I. N. — That is not to imply that all the notes attributed to Rasputin are forgeries.]

But T. Mironova then goes on to pose a very intriguing question: How many similar notes floating around the salons and offices of St. Petersburg were actually written by G. E. Rasputin? And who among the many recipients of such notes knew Rasputin personally, or were familiar with his handwriting?

I cite all this not in order to exonerate G. E. Rasputin, but to suggest that perhaps it would be naïve not to realize that many people might have stooped to scrawling such notes on scraps of paper simply to further their own personal affairs, or — on the part of the revolutionaries — to discredit the Imperial family and government.
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Offline GeorgePe

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Re: Rasputin's prediction
« Reply #98 on: August 08, 2014, 03:20:32 AM »
Predicting the future by monks or even the Archbishop Theophan of Poltava was common practice at that time. The Archbishop was the tutor of the Tsar’s children and introduced Rasputin to the Royal Family by the way, although he denied it later.
List the predictions 1 to 10 and then choose 3 or 4 that came true and presto, he predicted the future. ;)