Author Topic: Rasputin's Murder  (Read 145584 times)

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Re: Rasputin's Murder
« Reply #30 on: September 18, 2004, 09:37:45 AM »
Mr. Cullen,
Welcome to the Forum, and many thanks for telling us about your work.  Any idea when Discovery Channel will be airing it for us in America? Should you be so inclined, we would love to have your article after publishing for a page in our Archives, or perhaps an original piece for us.
Either way, we are so please you have joined us.
FA

Offline Genevieve

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Re: Rasputin's Murder
« Reply #31 on: September 20, 2004, 12:21:59 AM »
About the aspirin it was on the history chanel.   The doctors thought that aspirin was a wonder drug and
ordered it for Alexie.   That made Alex bleed more.  Rasputin did not trust the drug and told his mother not to give it to him.  Thus the bleeding stopped and it appeared a miracle cure by Rasputin.

Offline Belochka

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Re: Rasputin's Murder
« Reply #32 on: September 20, 2004, 01:37:20 AM »
The aspirin incident is not a recent revelation. It was detailed in d'Encausse's book Nicholas II at p 147, which she wrote in 1996.

Unfortunately very few other writers have given much attention to this more plausible explanation in alleviating Alexei's times of crisis.


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Re: Rasputin's Murder
« Reply #33 on: September 20, 2004, 08:16:37 AM »
Belochka

You are right about the aspirin not being a new revelation -- however it was a new one for me (sad ignorant little creature wimpering in the corner...hmmmnhmmmn :'() LOL .
It had not been mentioned in any recent posts that I was aware of so  when I found it, I mentioned it in passing on another thread.
I wonder if Alix would have had the same devotion to the "prayers" of Rasputin had she realized the properties of aspirin and its affect on her son.

I look forward to the Discovery program and hope that it may be shown in the barbaric west...(Umurikuh!)  

R
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by rskkiya »

Offline LisaDavidson

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Re: Rasputin's Murder
« Reply #34 on: September 20, 2004, 04:29:33 PM »
Mr. Cullen - where have you looked for photos of  Lazovert or Shutokin? I ask because I have a full shelf of Rasputin books. But, if you've already looked at the books published about GER, there is no point in my cracking them open to look for these men's photos.

Offline Belochka

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Re: Rasputin's Murder
« Reply #35 on: September 20, 2004, 10:58:39 PM »
Quote
I wonder if Alix would have had the same devotion to the "prayers" of Rasputin had she realized the properties of aspirin and its affect on her son. R


I strongly doubt that Alix was open to understanding that any apparent alleviation of Alexei's condition was anything other than spiritual. She was desperate, and knowing that no medical intervention would have been successful, other than pain minimization, there was no other explanation as far as she was concerned.

It is not unrealistic to believe that Rasputin gave Alix instructions to discard the Aspirin because it was a manufactured pharmaceutical product, a form of medical intervention of which he was ignorant, coming from a primitive Siberian village. Afterall the use of home remedies was the more traditional practice where he came from.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Belochka »


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Re: Rasputin's Murder
« Reply #36 on: September 21, 2004, 09:06:33 AM »
Bella Belochka  ;)

A very good point regarding Rasputins ignorance of the properties of aspirin...
 If only these properties had been known at that time --I gather that aspirin's tendency to thin the blood was  not understood until the 1970s.

R

Offline Belochka

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Re: Rasputin's Murder
« Reply #37 on: September 21, 2004, 09:43:36 PM »
Hi rskkiya,

Yes it was around that time when pharmacologists began to understand how Aspirin actually worked in the body.

Many decades before (in the 1940's I believe), it was noted that Aspirin helped cardiac patients to survive for longer periods, by reducing the risk of heart attacks (myocardial infarction) in patients with unstable angina.

While Aspirin's therapeutic efficacy as an anti-coagulant was only appreciated many decades later. The key was that Aspirin prevented platelets to coagulate in the bloodstream.

Unknowingly, Alexei's doctors administered the new wonder drug Aspirin, without understanding that this medication was detrimental in persons who suffered from blood disorders such as Hemophilia. Its use lead to prolonged bleeding times and increased the risk of hemorrhages, which is exactly what happened to Alexei.

Rasputin ->No Aspirin = bleeding diminished


No magic, no spiritual intervention, just simple Pharmacology! ;)  
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Belochka »


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Re: Rasputin's Murder
« Reply #38 on: September 22, 2004, 10:42:58 AM »
In the book “Genetics” by Morton Jenkins, published by Hodder Headline, 1998, you can read:

“The cyanide`s (CN) incapability to rapidly kill Rasputin, suggests that he was a mutant because his stomacal glandules don`t segregated hydrochloric acid (HCl). For the majority of people the HCl reacts with CN to produce the letal acid hydrogen cyanide (HCN).”

If so, Rasputin wasn`t something evil, he was a MUTANT (in the genetic sense, of course)!  :o

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Re: Rasputin's Murder
« Reply #39 on: September 22, 2004, 03:29:34 PM »
Sergio

Thanks for that information, but I had read that the reason that the cyanide didn't kill Rasputin was because there was no cyanide...the chemist felt anxious and replaced the crystals with some harmless stuff at the last moment ... I could be wrong -tho ...too bad that the body cannot be exhumed and examined for cyanide.

I dont think that the initial autopsy found anything about poison.

R

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Re: Rasputin's Murder
« Reply #40 on: October 13, 2004, 06:24:37 PM »
I think you have to be very skeptical of that initial autopsy. He was killed by the establishment because of his power and the last thing they wanted to do was to create a legend by his death which would  happen if the rumers of his physical vitality and strength proved to be true. In effect it doesn't seem to have mattered anyway. By any measure a man of incredible personal power and physical strength.

What do you think was the source of his strength?

I believe it was a combination of desire,belief and lack of any restaint.  Power many of us might possess if it we not for our socialization.


Offline Belochka

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Re: Rasputin's Murder
« Reply #41 on: October 16, 2004, 01:53:27 AM »
Quote
too bad that the body cannot be exhumed and examined for cyanide.

I dont think that the initial autopsy found anything about poison. R


Unfortunately no toxicology assays were conducted when Rasputin's remains were examined macroscopically. [Ref: p 697 in Gregori Rasputin without Myths and Legends Elvira Vatala, 2000, Armada press, Moscow (Russia language)]

The 'cyanide' story will continue unabated, because it does create a nice myth! The simple truth is that we will never really know. ;)


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Re: Rasputin's Murder
« Reply #42 on: October 16, 2004, 08:33:26 AM »
Bella Bellochka!

Thanks for both the information and the book recomendation about Rasputin --I will look for it asap!
I stand corrected about the poison! :)
R

Offline Belochka

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Re: Rasputin's Murder
« Reply #43 on: October 16, 2004, 11:12:19 PM »
Bonjour rskkiya!

The unique feature about the book which I quoted is that it comprises diary extracts, letters and memoir exerpts from high officials, including members of the Imperial Court - N. & A. and Anna Virubova. In fact all the people who were directly or indirectly interested in Rasputin are included. There are police protocols, Gendarmerie notes which also include comments made by members of the Ministry of Internal Affairs. Relevant material taken from Kerensky's Extraordinary Commission enquiry of 1917 are also added.

There are a many photographs inserted towards the back of the book.

I hope that you can obtain your own copy and enjoy it as much as I have.  :D

A book worth having IMHO! :D
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Belochka »


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Re: Rasputin's Murder
« Reply #44 on: October 17, 2004, 09:24:47 PM »
I think Rasputin had what we would refer to today as "crazy strength."