Author Topic: Tobolsk house  (Read 43101 times)

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Offline AGRBear

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Re: Tobolsk house
« Reply #15 on: April 01, 2005, 06:08:57 PM »
Hikaro,

I know I've said this about your other posts that your information is very interesting but I've never really said why.  I think it's marvelous that you can tell us what is presently being taught to you at this time about your own history.

Those of us living outside of Russia and no longer have family in Russia,  are out of touch of what is occuring in Russia.  Yes, we have newspapers.  But, reading your posts tell us more than any newspaper can ever tell us.

This time, you're telling us a book which is in Russian which I'd never be able to read, so, again, thanks.

I hope you continue to inform us and thank you for being you.
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Back to the topic of the Tobolsk House.

Over on the Impatiev House under a different thread called Where is It, it is suggested that the diagram drawn in Gibbes and Summers and Mangold book is not the Tobolsk House but the Impatiev House.  So, I'm bringing the diagram over here to see what others think.

Benard said this floor plan is the Impatiev House:

Quote
...[in part]....



Below is the floor plan, or so it says, of the Tolobsk House which is found in THE FILE ON THE TSAR p. 256 which is listed as Fig. 51.  The comment reads:  "Groundplan of the Governor's House at Tobolsk, where the Romanovs were held through the winter of 1917.  It was prepared for sending with a coded plea for help from the tsarina to the Brirish royal family."

It could be the Impatiev House if turned upside down, which I did.  But I don't know if it is or if the floor plan is similar to that of the Tobolsk Housse.  




It is a very poor quality and so I had to adjust so everyone could see it.

On p. 90 of  Gibbes THE HOUSE OF SPECIAL PURPOSE  is the same floor plan under which it states:  "Sketch plan of the Governor's House kept with Gibbes's drafts of the letter to Miss Jackson.  Was it a concealed cry for help?"

What does everyone think?  Impatiev House?  Tobolsk House?

AGRBear
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by AGRBear »
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Offline Daniel Briere

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Re: Tobolsk house
« Reply #16 on: April 02, 2005, 10:38:42 AM »
Gibbes sent the letter, to which the plan was attached,  on December 15, 1917 (from Tobolsk then). Although the layout of the house does look similar to the Ipatiev House, there are some major differences; for instance, the corner room has only one window on each side, as the Ipatiev House had two.

Very cleverly drafted by the Empress, the letter has some information about the layout of the town of Tobolsk and the Governor’s mansion compound, the sentry posts, the schedule of the IF – including when they went out to Church – and a description of the house. The kind of information a rescue party woud need. The reference to David (the Prince of Wales) and his parents was obviously meant for Miss Jackson to understand that Gibbes had written on behalf of the Empress who wanted her to forward it to the King and Queen in the hope they could attempt something to free them. If it wasn’t the case, what would have been the point of adding a floorplan to some very practical information?

This leads me to believe that by then the IF must have felt that after the Bolshevik Coup their safety could be in  jeopardy. To me this letter and plan is obviously a coded plea for help.
Daniel Briere

Offline AGRBear

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Re: Tobolsk house
« Reply #17 on: April 02, 2005, 11:29:59 AM »
Anyone have the floor plan, other than Gibbes', of the Tobolsk House?

AGRBear
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Offline Reco

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Re: Tobolsk house
« Reply #18 on: July 10, 2005, 01:43:30 AM »
Tobolsk Governor's House


Offline Rijio

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Re: Tobolsk house
« Reply #19 on: July 10, 2005, 08:14:36 AM »
Quote
Tobolsk Governor's House



hmm "La maison où les souverrains sont prisonniers de leurs sujets"
that's a pretty good sentence!  ::)

Offline lexi4

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Re: Tobolsk house
« Reply #20 on: July 10, 2005, 10:48:48 AM »
Quote
Gibbes sent the letter, to which the plan was attached,  on December 15, 1917 (from Tobolsk then). Although the layout of the house does look similar to the Ipatiev House, there are some major differences; for instance, the corner room has only one window on each side, as the Ipatiev House had two.

Very cleverly drafted by the Empress, the letter has some information about the layout of the town of Tobolsk and the Governor’s mansion compound, the sentry posts, the schedule of the IF – including when they went out to Church – and a description of the house. The kind of information a rescue party woud need. The reference to David (the Prince of Wales) and his parents was obviously meant for Miss Jackson to understand that Gibbes had written on behalf of the Empress who wanted her to forward it to the King and Queen in the hope they could attempt something to free them. If it wasn’t the case, what would have been the point of adding a floorplan to some very practical information?

This leads me to believe that by then the IF must have felt that after the Bolshevik Coup their safety could be in  jeopardy. To me this letter and plan is obviously a coded plea for help.


Very informative Daniel, thank you. Does anyone know if the letter ever reached the King and Queen?
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Offline Georgiy

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Re: Tobolsk house
« Reply #21 on: July 10, 2005, 05:21:49 PM »
You will notice in the latest posted photo, two of the Tsar's daughters are standing on the balcony.

Offline Baby Tsarevich

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Re: Tobolsk house
« Reply #22 on: July 13, 2005, 06:02:13 PM »
Quote


View of the house of governor in Tobolsk taken during Romanov captivity. People at balconi is one of otmaa great duchess. (photo from Gilliard Book)


Can you please repost that picture? ??? Its not showing up, I would really want to see it!

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Offline RealAnastasia

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Re: Tobolsk house
« Reply #23 on: July 13, 2005, 07:43:49 PM »
Me neither! I can't saw it... :-/

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Offline Georgiy

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Re: Tobolsk house
« Reply #24 on: July 13, 2005, 09:07:47 PM »
It is the one that Reco has posted, and Rijio quoted.

Offline lexi4

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Re: Tobolsk house
« Reply #25 on: July 13, 2005, 09:21:27 PM »
I had to look closely, but I see them.
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely, in a pretty and well preserved body; but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming, "Wow ---- What a ride!!!"

Offline Baby Tsarevich

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Re: Tobolsk house
« Reply #26 on: July 13, 2005, 10:16:33 PM »
ooo I see it now, how can you tell if there's someone on the balcony ??? :-/

I wonder who took that picture ???

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Offline Robert_Hall

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Re: Tobolsk house
« Reply #27 on: July 13, 2005, 10:35:29 PM »
Who was the "governor" of Tobolsk and where did he go when the IF came in ?
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Offline Georgiy

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Re: Tobolsk house
« Reply #28 on: July 13, 2005, 11:37:10 PM »
Maybe he got thrown out when the Tsarist Empire fell. On the other hand - while they lost a Governor, they gained "The Governess"!

Offline DonaAntonia

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Was this picture hanging at the Tobolsk house?
« Reply #29 on: April 16, 2009, 03:40:53 PM »
I have seen a detail from a photograph of the living room in the Tobolsk house, and there seems to be a picture of the Czar and Alexei hanging on a wall that looks remarkably like this one. I don't seem to find it now, doing a search on Tobolsk here in the Forum. But maybe someone has info on this: was this picture hanging there in 1917/18?
Thanks.



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