Author Topic: Palace of Princess Olga Paley and Grand Duke Pavel  (Read 30244 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Joanna

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 1299
  • Winter Palace Research
    • View Profile
    • Winter Palace Research
Palace of Princess Olga Paley and Grand Duke Pavel
« on: April 10, 2004, 11:13:59 PM »
Does anyone know the location of Grand Duke Paul's and Princess Paley's dacha in Tsarskoye Selo? There is reference to it in Ambassador Paleologue's memoirs and Princess Paley's autobiography but I have never been able to ascertain where it is or have seen photographs.

Joanna

Offline Antonio_P.Caballer

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 533
    • View Profile
Re: Palace of Princess Olga Paley and Grand Duke Pavel
« Reply #1 on: April 10, 2004, 11:26:17 PM »
hello Joanna,
The Paley palace is near the Tsarkoe Selo Luteran church, in the same road, if i remember well. It was designed in french style but was not finished in detail due to the first world war(the french workers returned to France). I have a tourist guide on it from the short time just after the revolution that it was opened as a museum and have also its floorplan and photographs of the rooms. Please wait until tomorrow and i will give you all the information about its history. I´m in Spain and it´s  6.00 a.m.!!!
Best regards!

Offline Antonio_P.Caballer

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 533
    • View Profile
Re: Palace of Princess Olga Paley and Grand Duke Pavel
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2004, 08:54:37 AM »
Happy easter for you too Joanna!
I´m doing it quickly and quoting from russian,french and english so please forgive any mistake....
Olga Valerinovna Karnovich (was granted the title of Princess Paley by Nicholas in 1915)  had lived in exile with the Grand Duke Paul in Paris up to 1912, when they were allowed to return to Russia. The Princess comissioned the palace in that year and was done in french style, inspired by their former residence in Boulogne-sur-Seine. The palace was not finished(although they settle down and was fully furnished, i suppose the only thing lacking are the ceiling paintings...) becayse of the outbreak of the wwi, and the french artisans were repatriated in 1914. The princess was very proud of this fact, as i recall the following anecdote:
 Being under house arrest in September 1917 a soldier said her:
   "And to think that all these fine dwellings have sprung up on our backs, at the sweat of our brows..."
  She then answered proudly:
    "You are mistaken. This house was built and decorated by French workmen. You would never have been able to do so well."
    After many searches and the grand duke imprisonment they had to move to the nearby cottage belonging to Grand duke Boris in 9 January 1918.
In this same month the palace was opened as "Museum of the People"(twice a week people could visit it), a measure taken by Alexander Polovtsov and Georges Loukomsky to save it from the looting that the nearby Vladimir Palace had already suffered. The princess cooperated on this task and shew her house to the comission sent for this purpose. The outstanding french art collection was then saved and she was even offered by the bolsheviki to be the curator and to live there in some service rooms. She hesitated and finally declined the offer, not wanting to have nothing to do with the same people that had arrested her husband and were ruining her country.
 Afterwards the palace was nationalised.
 My guide book dates from that short period the palace was opened. I say short because it worked from 1918 up to 1926. In June-July 1929 the collection was sold by auction in London. The princess tried to stop the sale but was unable. She posed sadly in the uction showroom sitting by her beloved clavecin, formerly belonging to Queen Marie Antoinette.
 
      ...I will continue...
     
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Antonio_P.Caballer »

Offline Antonio_P.Caballer

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 533
    • View Profile
Re: Palace of Princess Olga Paley and Grand Duke Pavel
« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2004, 09:38:34 AM »
From 1926 up to 1941 it was used as House for Politic instruction of the Party(translated from russian), and then it was occupied by the spanish Blue Division during the war years right until 1944.
After the war the palace was neglected( abandoned) until it was reconstructed in 1952 to house some war institutions through the following years.
Now it´s the War Engine-Technical University(again from the russian).
 During the reconstruction work the palace was altered in its exterior decoration that was changed into the a generic and typical russian classical look, with a four columned portico and a third floor added were formerly were the characteristic attic (mansard in french and spanish). Although the palace lost any reminiscence to the french chateau architecture and decoration, the basic structure of the building remains.
 The time the palace was a musem  only those receptions rooms of the ground floor(private rooms where somehow banned from the public view in communist times, for example the Alexandria cottage bedroom was never restored to its former appearance).
 There were therefore twelve rooms to be seen:
   1- Vestibule
    2-Gallery
    3-Circular hall
    4-Grand Duke Paul´s cabinet
    5-Library
    6-Princess´cabinet
    7-Oak room
    8-Great salon
    9-Concert hall
  10-White Dinning room
  11-Small Dinning room
  12-Chinese room

I will send the plan for posting.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Antonio_P.Caballer »

Offline Forum Admin

  • Administrator
  • Velikye Knyaz
  • *****
  • Posts: 4665
  • www.alexanderpalace.org
    • View Profile
    • Alexander Palace Time Machine
Re: Palace of Princess Olga Paley and Grand Duke Pavel
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2004, 10:17:35 AM »
Again, our thanks to the wonderful Antonio!! muchos gracias !!

Offline Antonio_P.Caballer

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 533
    • View Profile
Re: Palace of Princess Olga Paley and Grand Duke Pavel
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2004, 10:35:42 AM »
 
The interior decoration reminds me of some Newport mansions from the Silver Age like The Elms or Rosecliff, specially the vestibule, although in a less luxurious scale.
 The prevailing style is Louis XV-XVI. I´m sorry to say that in my opinion this delicate style do not fit completely the enormous rooms and would look better in rooms half the size as you can see in Marie Antoinette´s private rooms in Versailles or the Petit Trianon. Russian´s scale is far bigger...
 The furniture was mainly done new to match the different rooms although there were of course many exquisite pieces from the grand duke´s collection.
In the photographs you´ll see everything but any question you have i´ll try to answer as well as i can.
 The numbers in the plan is the real tour the people followed when visiting the palace.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Antonio_P.Caballer »

Offline Joanna

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 1299
  • Winter Palace Research
    • View Profile
    • Winter Palace Research
Re: Palace of Princess Olga Paley and Grand Duke Pavel
« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2004, 02:52:10 PM »
Thank you so much Antonio ! and also to Forum Admin for posting the plan !

I have today found a photo of the exterior with the colonades. And there was a new book published last year. Was this the book you have Antonio?

Joanna

Offline BobAtchison

  • Moderator
  • Knyaz
  • *****
  • Posts: 896
    • View Profile
    • The Alexander Palace
Re: Palace of Princess Olga Paley and Grand Duke Pavel
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2004, 03:10:44 PM »
Here is a bad picture of the facade from before the revolution.

Bob


Offline Antonio_P.Caballer

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 533
    • View Profile
Re: Palace of Princess Olga Paley and Grand Duke Pavel
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2004, 03:41:48 PM »
Quote
Thank you so much Antonio ! and also to Forum Admin for posting the plan !

I have today found a photo of the exterior with the colonades. And there was a new book published last year. Was this the book you have Antonio?

Joanna


Hello Joanna,

Are you in Russia? I have many books. One of them is perhaps which you have. Did your book have the plan? The plan comes from a new russian book i bought last summer. All the other information comes from the antique guide and other books.

Offline Antonio_P.Caballer

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 533
    • View Profile
Re: Palace of Princess Olga Paley and Grand Duke Pavel
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2004, 04:01:50 PM »
Hey Joanna!
That´s the book! so then you have the plan already,haven´t you? The quality of the photographs from this book are poor and suspect that were taken frome the same guide i own.

Offline Joanna

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 1299
  • Winter Palace Research
    • View Profile
    • Winter Palace Research
Re: Palace of Princess Olga Paley and Grand Duke Pavel
« Reply #10 on: July 22, 2004, 12:15:05 PM »
Here is a photograph by Chausseau-Flaviens of Grand Duke Paul and Princess Paley. I wonder if this was taken at their dacha in Tsarskoye Selo! Can anyone identify if the daughter is Natalie or Irene?

http://www.geh.org/ar/chus/russia/m197501112243_ful.html#topofimage

Joanna

Offline Antonio_P.Caballer

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 533
    • View Profile
Re: Palace of Princess Olga Paley and Grand Duke Pavel
« Reply #11 on: July 22, 2004, 12:35:07 PM »
Hello Joanna, the girl is Irene. The photo was taken in Petersburg in 1914, but i don´t now for sure the exact place...

Offline Mike

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 1326
    • View Profile
    • Erast Fandorin Museum
Re: Palace of Princess Olga Paley and Grand Duke Pavel
« Reply #12 on: July 22, 2004, 03:07:41 PM »
Quote
The photo was taken in Petersburg in 1914

Grand dukes never wore top hats while in SPb, only their military uniforms. The only exception could be on their way abroad or from abroad (i.e. from the palace to a railway station, or vice versa).

The Tsarskoselskaya Gazeta has once published an article on the book "Around the Princess Paley's Palace", including a more or less modern photo. It's interesting that the Naval Construction Engineering School (the name has changed several times) had occupied a part of the Alexander Palace before moving, in 1954, to the Paley Palace.

Offline Antonio_P.Caballer

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 533
    • View Profile
Re: Palace of Princess Olga Paley and Grand Duke Pavel
« Reply #13 on: August 04, 2004, 09:06:02 PM »
Quote
Grand dukes never wore top hats while in SPb, only their military uniforms. The only exception could be on their way abroad or from abroad (i.e. from the palace to a railway station, or vice versa).



Hello Mike,

I said they were in Petersburg because that was the footnote of the book where i first saw that photograph. Mistakes of this kind, i mean photo´s locations, are quite frequently found. Anyway, they are about to take a carriage, so it´s likely they were going to the railway station...but, of course, i cannot say that for sure :)

Offline Svetabel

  • Moderator
  • Velikye Knyaz
  • *****
  • Posts: 4883
    • View Profile
    • http://svetabella.livejournal.com/
Re: Palace of Princess Olga Paley and Grand Duke Pavel
« Reply #14 on: September 02, 2004, 04:40:23 AM »
Interesting....In russian edition of "Education of a Princess" this photo was marked:"Grand Duke Pavel with his wife and daughter on the stairs of his mansion in Paris"...