Author Topic: Klementiy Nagorniy  (Read 70679 times)

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Offline RealAnastasia

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Re: Klementiy Nagorniy
« Reply #105 on: May 08, 2009, 11:05:27 PM »
I hope that this idea won't die. It is easy to be loyal when you have shared in the rewards or inherited your position. Nagorny was an ordinary Russian, he like Deverenko could read the handwriting on the wall. It would have been so easy for Nagorny to follow his comrades example, because after all he was from the prolateriat. I always remember Thomas More's conversation with the Duke of Norfolk from a "Man for All Seasons", when Thomas stood up for principle when none of the nobility had the courage to. I think why I see Nagorny differently, is that it would have been so easy for him to walk away and go back to his family. I don't think the Czar or Czarina, much less the children would have blamed him. He had a whole other life and whole other family. He chose honor and I think love. I think his wife and children had every reason to be proud of him, another "Man for all Seasons."

I strongly second that. Nagorny must have his share of glory, since he had his share of honor with the Imperial Family.

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Offline CorisCapnSkip

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Re: Klementiy Nagorniy
« Reply #106 on: May 17, 2009, 03:35:59 AM »
I think that Nagorny must be praized for what he did for Alexei, as well as Trupp, Demidova, Kharitonov and Doctor Botkin, who died along with the Imperial Family.Maybe, people will laugh at me, but I think that these retainers must be canonized, as well as the Tsar and his family.They died only for being faithful to them.

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What happened to the bodies?  Were all of them found?  Were those that were found turned over to any remaining relatives, or buried together?

Offline Tina Laroche

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Re: Klementiy Nagorniy
« Reply #107 on: May 17, 2009, 03:59:18 AM »
I think that Nagorny must be praized for what he did for Alexei, as well as Trupp, Demidova, Kharitonov and Doctor Botkin, who died along with the Imperial Family.Maybe, people will laugh at me, but I think that these retainers must be canonized, as well as the Tsar and his family.They died only for being faithful to them.

RealAnastasia.

What happened to the bodies?  Were all of them found? Were those that were found turned over to any remaining relatives, or buried together?

The bodies of NAOTMAA, and the bodies of the four servants have been found, if that's what you meant. :-\ I don't know what happened with the servants' bodies though. :-|

Offline nena

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Re: Klementiy Nagorniy
« Reply #108 on: May 17, 2009, 04:44:50 AM »
I think I have read bodies were found by the Whites. (of Nagorny and Sednev).

I may be highly wrong, I sense.  :-[
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Offline Olga Maria

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Re: Klementiy Nagorniy
« Reply #109 on: June 27, 2009, 06:03:17 AM »

Amazing colored fotos  by the most wonderful Yelena Aleksandrovna. Endless thank you very much!

Offline Sarushka

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Re: Klementiy Nagorniy
« Reply #110 on: June 27, 2009, 07:41:57 AM »
Nope. That's Derevenko.
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Offline Father Gregory

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Re: Klementiy Nagorniy
« Reply #111 on: August 13, 2009, 04:20:26 PM »
I am confused.  Nagorny is frequently photographed with Alexei and a heavy man with a mustache.  I thought this was his other sailor-nanny Derevenko.  Is he same person as Dr. Vladimir Derevenko, Alexei's surgeon?

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Re: Klementiy Nagorniy
« Reply #112 on: August 13, 2009, 04:58:27 PM »
The two "Deverenko" individuals prominent in the Heir's life are two different people.   AP

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Re: Klementiy Nagorniy
« Reply #113 on: August 13, 2009, 05:24:39 PM »
Reply to "nena" post # 16:    I would be interested in your source.  To my knowledge, I have never seen information about the identification and recovery (by the Whites) of the bodies of K. Nagorny and Sednev past their demise.  After execution, Nagorny probably ended up in an unmarked grave and undoubtedly I. Sednev as well.  Regards,  AP
« Last Edit: August 13, 2009, 05:54:42 PM by aleksandr pavlovich »

Offline nena

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Re: Klementiy Nagorniy
« Reply #114 on: August 15, 2009, 07:10:05 PM »
Vladimir Derevenko was indeed Alexei's surgeon, father of Kolya Derevenko, Heir's closest friend. Kolya died in 2003 (some sources say earlier, in the end of 90s). He accompanied IF in their Tobolsk imprisonment, he left in August of 1917 with family to Tobolsk.

But, another one, Derevevnko (I forgot his name and patronymic, will have to take a look around) was Alexei's nanny (’matros’, ’diadka’) who cared about him. I think Penny Wilson gave a lot of information about him here, but not so much his known about his fate.

AP, what a pity. My mistake. Well, he was killed in the end of June of 1918, somewhere out of Ekaterinburg (Climent Grigorievich Nagorny). I don't know why I told that their bodies were found. Probably during Sokolov’s investigation, they might have tried to find out something. Again, I  am not sure.  It seems to remain one of numerous mysteries to us.

After execution, Nagorny probably ended up in an unmarked grave and undoubtedly I. Sednev as well.  Regards,  AP

That was my point exactly, I was going to say the same. Sorry for making any confusion, I will look for more details.
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Offline bkohatl

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Re: Klementiy Nagorniy
« Reply #115 on: July 30, 2010, 11:55:27 AM »
I suggested sometime ago that an effort be undertaken to remember Klementy Nagorny. From all the evidence that I've seen he was a loyal and devoted Russian soldier, who served his Tsar honorably. He was also a loyal friend to the Royal Family while under arrest at Tsarskoe Selo, Tbolsk and Yekaterinberg.
I have always understood the actions of Deverenko, though the ultimate betrayal if Anna Vyrubova is to be believed, they are practical and allowed him to survive.

I remember what Harry Truman said in 1947 when he integrated the American Military. A delegation of Generals, Admirals and retired officers came to him to argue against it. After they left, Harry Truman said that while he listened to them, respectfully,  he absolutely did not agree with them.
His job as President was to do what was right, and, he did.
What Deverenko did what was practical; what Nagorny did what was right and he deserves to be remembered for that. And aren't there enough monuments to men and women of marginal or questionable virtue, that we can mark the life and death of a man who served his country with honor, was loyal to those who gave him friendship and respect, even when it would be much easier not to. If I were a descendant of one of his children, I would be proud to lay claim to his legacy.
And such a man deserves to be remembered. I do.

Offline LisaDavidson

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Re: Klementiy Nagorniy
« Reply #116 on: September 05, 2010, 11:20:28 AM »
.
I would love to see a rememberance of Klementy Nagorny, who sacrificed his life for the Imperial Family.

Unfortunately, there is still alot of bad scholarship out there which is largely responsible for your bad opinion of the Sailor Derevenko. It is most likely that Vurubova's story about him was untrue, and he was in fact denied permisssion to accompany the family to Tobolsk, and died fighting the Bolsheviks in 1919.

Offline RealAnastasia

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Re: Klementiy Nagorniy
« Reply #117 on: September 05, 2010, 11:52:02 PM »
Me too. I wish Nagorny could be remembered in some way. He was a good, loyal man. He died for his Emperor and deserves a monument. Truly.

RealAnastasia.

Offline Kalafrana

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Re: Klementiy Nagorniy
« Reply #118 on: September 06, 2010, 05:13:06 AM »
I agree. I have said elsewhere that there should be a monument to those who went to Ekaterinberg and were killed separately from the Imperial Family. I don't think any of them has a known grave.

Ann

Offline Ausmanov

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Re: Klementiy Nagorniy
« Reply #119 on: October 17, 2010, 04:44:18 PM »
you could always do something small scale. Even if its just a plaque or engravement on your property or local area, or perhaps a street name.
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