Author Topic: Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse, Princess of Great Britain  (Read 145098 times)

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Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse, Princess of Great Britain
« Reply #30 on: August 03, 2004, 01:16:59 PM »
No, Bertie was clean-shaven and not so portly in his wedding, plus Arthur is too old for an 1863 picture. Plus Alice was 8 mos pregnant with Victoria. Perhaps Helena's wedding in 1866/68?
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Offline Angie_H

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Re: Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse, Princess of Great Britain
« Reply #31 on: August 03, 2004, 02:18:11 PM »
Edward & Alexandra were married March 10, 1862

Alice & Ernest were married July 1, 1862

I think the pic was taken for Edward's wedding

http://www.btinternet.com/~sbishop100/alicegar.jpg
This pic looks like it was taken the same day
Angie

Offline Martyn

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Re: Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse, Princess of Great Britain
« Reply #32 on: August 04, 2004, 07:29:00 AM »
Elisa, here is the passage from Jerrold Packard's book that discusses Alice's wedding.  On p.103 he writes
"Osborne was where Victoria's early mourning had been carried out.  Long a central symbol of happinesss for Alice and her sisters and brothers, it had now been transformed by the Queen's command into a kind of seaside mausoleum.  But there Victoria felt safest from prying eyes, and it was at this shrine to her husband's memory that she decided that Alice's wedding would be celebrated.
Not exactly celebrated, but rather performed.  The widow would allow none of the usual happiness associated with a wedding to supersede her grief, regardless of the effect this would have  on the bridal couple.  Victoria rationalised the ceremony as essentially a religious rite rather than an occasion for revelry.  And except for the white of Alice's wedding gown, the event that transpired bore far more the hallmarks of a wake than those of a wedding."
On page 104 he continues
"A photograph of Alice taken that morning shows her draped in an elaborate white gown hemmed with orange blossom, with still more of that fragrant flower crowning her head and shoring up a Honiton lace veil.  But her face couldn't hide a sadness that seemed to speak more of tragedy than it did the beginning of a newly wedded life."
How sad.
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Offline Martyn

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Re: Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse, Princess of Great Britain
« Reply #33 on: August 04, 2004, 07:44:19 AM »
Hre is some more information concerning Alice's wedding dress taken from "The Royal Wedding Dresses" by Nigel Arch and Joanna Marschner (p.58).
"She (Pss Alice) wore a 'half-high dress with a deep flounce of Honiton lace, a veil of the same and a wreath of orange blossom and myrtle'.  It was a simple style and not embellished with a court train.  Queen Victoria later confided to her daughter , the Princess Royal (Vicky), that the wedding of 'poor Alice' had been 'more like a funeral'.
By contrast, at Bertie and Alix's wedding on 10th March 1863 at Windsor,'Princess Alice wore a dress of violet silk, trimmed with her wedding lace; from her shoulders streamed a court train of violet velvet trimmed with ermine which, as Queen Victoria explained, 'Beloved Mama (the late Dss of Kent) had worn at Vicky's wedding'."
The earlier photo shows Alice wearing a court train (which were definitely not worn at her wedding)and the tiara that was a gift upon her marriage from her mother.  Trains were worn by the Royal Family at Bertie's wedding but not I think at Helena's in 1866 (did Alice actually attend Helena's wedding or was Hesse actually in the throes of the war with Prussia?)
Apart from this, the style of the dress and train is probably no later than 1866 in that photo.
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Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse, Princess of Great Britain
« Reply #34 on: August 04, 2004, 11:57:11 AM »
Quote
Edward & Alexandra were married March 10, 1862

Alice & Ernest were married July 1, 1862

I think the pic was taken for Edward's wedding

http://www.btinternet.com/~sbishop100/alicegar.jpg
This pic looks like it was taken the same day
Angie

No, this was definitely not Edward's wedding day.
I don't know why that photo is often referred to as Edward's wedding day. It's at least 4 years later since he was only beginning to grow that *ugly* beard (nothing like his later nice one) around the time they already had Eddy & George. Plus, Louis didn't have a beard until a couple of years after his wedding and both he and Edward look to be wearing German uniforms (esp. Edward who is wearing a Hussar uniform, I believe). Perhaps it was for a German occasion and not even a British one?  Maybe the girl's confirmation? The only other British wedding Alice was alive for was Helena's in 1866 (which fits Bertie's ugly beard time frame). Plus, as I said, Arthur was just a youngster at E&A's wedding. That's the one where he and Leopold were supposed to watch young William of Prussia and he bit their legs and caused other mischief.

« Last Edit: April 22, 2009, 01:12:40 AM by Svetabel »
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Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse, Princess of Great Britain
« Reply #35 on: August 04, 2004, 12:29:23 PM »
Here is a photo of the aquamarine tiara that Alice is wearing in the photo. I think it later went to Ella and then was sold.

« Last Edit: April 22, 2009, 01:13:25 AM by Svetabel »
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Offline Lisa

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Re: Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse, Princess of Great Britain
« Reply #36 on: August 04, 2004, 12:39:43 PM »
I thought it was this one...



« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Lisa »

Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse, Princess of Great Britain
« Reply #37 on: August 04, 2004, 09:41:45 PM »
Quote
I thought it was this one...






Eek! You're right.  :-[ There goes my reputation down the tubes. I don't know where my brain was. I even skimmed by the one you posted when I was looking for the tiara.
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Offline Martyn

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Re: Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse, Princess of Great Britain
« Reply #38 on: August 05, 2004, 08:22:12 AM »
Just to clarify something that I wrote earlier.  Neither Vicky nor Alice attended Helena's wedding in 1866 due to the Austro Prussian war in which the two sisters found themselves on opposite sides.
In the photo that Grandduchessella posted that shows Alice and Ludwig, Alice seems to be wearing the outfit that I described earlier as her toilette for Bertie's wedding; her husband is wearing Garter robes.  The earlier photo shows Alice wearing quite a different dress and train.  
I wonder what the occasion was?  Oh no, this could well be the beginning of another what/who is this photo quest (like the "Who are these Grand Duchesses?")!
'For a galant spirit there can never be defeat'....Wallis Windsor

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Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse, Princess of Great Britain
« Reply #39 on: August 05, 2004, 03:32:48 PM »
Quote
He??? I got TOTALLY confused now  :-/

Which photo was taken on which occasion  ???


I think he means the one shown with Arthur, Bertie, Louis and Alice which had been ID'd as Bertie's wedding but isn't and subsequently the photo of just Alice & Louis where he's in Garter robes (whereas he's in a different uniform and bearded in the previous). Alice looks similar in both. I think Martyn's getting at the question of what were the occasions? They weren't for Bertie or Helena's wedding so what were they? The one with just Alice & Louis could've been Bertie's wedding (Louis is still unshaven so it predates 1866 and he's wearing the robes of the garter so it's an English event, Alice was heavily pregnant but it could've been camoflouged I guess but photographed?) The former with the obvious 'prop' background--could it have been taken in Germany? Is that perhaps the Schloss the background's in front of?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by grandduchessella »
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Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse, Princess of Great Britain
« Reply #40 on: August 05, 2004, 09:09:50 PM »
DIAMOND LEAVES AND FLOWER TIARA





Is this the Hesse tiara that was destroyed when the horrible Ostend crash occured?
« Last Edit: April 22, 2009, 01:14:17 AM by Svetabel »
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Offline Ilana

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Re: Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse, Princess of Great Britain
« Reply #41 on: August 05, 2004, 09:13:29 PM »
Victoria and Ella of Hesse attended Helena's wedding because they were both staying with Queen Victoria at this time.
So long and thanks for all the fish

Offline Martyn

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Re: Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse, Princess of Great Britain
« Reply #42 on: August 06, 2004, 03:27:14 AM »
I'm sorry if I made too much confusion with discussing the clothes in these photos.
Grandduchessella I think is right in suggesting that the photo of Alice and Louis alone is an English event (due to the Garter robes worn by the latter)  I do think that the outfit that Alice is wearing in this photo is the one that was described as having been worn for Bertie's wedding.
As for the other occasion, it is quite difficult to say where it might have taken place.  Can anyone think of any important royal functions that might have taken place between 1862 and 1866 that might have comprised an assembly of royal relatives and necessitated the wearing of court dress?
With regard to the tiara and the plane crash, I believe that Alice's diamond wedding tiara is still in existence.  The tiara that was actually involved in the plane crash was the one that had been specifically made for Onor, as a gift from Ernie.  This tiara has a lattice work design of lapis(?) and diamonds and is rather lovely in its understated design.  Onor had taken this jewel with her on the flight to England as she intended it as a wedding gift for the bride, later Pss Margaret of Hesse.  The tiara survived the terrible crash, still in its fitted case; it is illustrated in Geoffrey Munn's wonderful book.
'For a galant spirit there can never be defeat'....Wallis Windsor

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Offline leslie

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Re: Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse, Princess of Great Britain
« Reply #43 on: August 09, 2004, 02:20:45 PM »
This is only my second message to this discussion board (although I am a frequent lurker) so I hope I don't make a fool of myself with this answer.  I was checking some of my books at home (Hessian Tapestry, Life at the Court of Queen Victoria, the letters between the Queen and the Crown Princess of Prussia) and it looks like Princess Alice and Prince Louis were in England during June and July of 1867, right after the Paris Exhibition.  The Sultan (can't remember of which country) had an official visit to England during that time.  There are several references in the above books that indicate Princess Alice presided over several official functions.  Perhaps the photograph was taken during one of those functions.  

Offline nerdycool

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Re: Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse, Princess of Great Britain
« Reply #44 on: August 11, 2004, 12:39:56 AM »
In the first photo, it says it was taken in 1865. So if she were pregnant, she would be carrying Irene. I personally think it's a good possibility that she was pregnant since there was very little time between Ella and Irene.
I think Alice is sitting in the picture Grandduchessella posted... but who knows? She could have been pregnant. Maybe if we knew when it was taken, or who she was in mourning for, then maybe we could guess.
But in all, I think it would be hard to tell with her. At Bertie's wedding, there's a picture of her at 8 months with Victoria, and she didn't look pregnant at all.