Author Topic: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska  (Read 230402 times)

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Offline Valmont

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #240 on: February 16, 2005, 05:27:22 PM »
So, curiousOne..... I can infer you know AgrBear's identity...Would you mind sharing?......
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Valmont »
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Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #241 on: February 16, 2005, 05:30:50 PM »
I emailed Bear just now, as I have an email address for her. I told her that we all hope she is ok and to get well soon and that we miss her on the boards! :)

Offline Georgiy

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #242 on: February 16, 2005, 07:49:22 PM »
Good on you Helen! I too hope she will be OK.  :(

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #243 on: February 16, 2005, 11:00:12 PM »
Quote
Hi All--

Jeremy, where will you be posting the age progressed photos, in this thread or will you start a new one?

Thanks,

Sarah


It's up to the FA. When everything's ready I'll foreward them to him and he can decide what works best for the forum.

Jeremy

Offline Forum Admin

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #244 on: February 17, 2005, 09:08:42 AM »
CuriousOne,
PLEASE extend Bob's and my personal wishes for a speedy and safe recovery to Bear, and our hope to see her back here with her honeyjar soon!

Jeremy, that is fine with me, i'll look at the pics and decide the easiest way to put them up.

FA

Offline Annie

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #245 on: February 17, 2005, 09:17:35 AM »
Get well soon bear!

Thanks Jeremy and FA.

Offline CuriousOne

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #246 on: February 17, 2005, 11:16:22 AM »
I have extended our get well wishes to bear. She said with the modern tech of using a lap top, she'll be back soon and said to say thanks to everyone's nice words and concern. And, remember, "Be respectful to each other." & as bear often tells us "Back to the topic."  :)

Quote

It's certainly not the same as Northern Russia but it can still be considerate. My family if from that region, Odessa to be exact, so I know about that :).  



In Nov. what is the average snow fall around Odessa?

I can't wait to see the pictures of the aging process!!!



Curious One
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by CuriousOne »

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #247 on: February 17, 2005, 08:03:39 PM »
Quote
In Nov. what is the average snow fall around Odessa?


Maybe not in November, but definitely in December snow is very possible, even probable. But November would not be unheard of.The Odessa climate is nothing like the Crimea which is a lot warmer from what I understand, even though both are on the Black Sea, it is more like the Northeast in the US...

Offline chintz22

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #248 on: February 18, 2005, 08:15:47 AM »
Hi All,

Many thanks Jeremy and FA--can't wait to see the photos!

Also, add my wishes for Bear's speedy recovery.

Best,

Sarah

Offline AGRBear

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #249 on: February 18, 2005, 10:18:08 AM »
I want to thank everyone for sending me such nice words about having a speedy recovery.

Although I moved rather slowly,  I did reach my computer room this morning and started to read all my PMs.  I can't possibly answered them all today.  But,  I will.  I thank them and those who posted on the forum.

Thank you Curious One for letting everyone know about my surprise visit to the hospital last Sat..  

SOOOOOOOooooooo, what is this about Penny leaving???

I leave for a week and I discover we have another unhappy camper.

Not Good.

I'll have to go back and read the thread and I'll be back with my thoughts.

AGRBear :-/
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by AGRBear »
"What is true by lamplight is not always true by sunlight."

Joubert, Pensees, No. 152

Offline AGRBear

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #250 on: February 18, 2005, 11:46:33 AM »
Quote
I'm not sure if this is the right thread to put this on, but I wanted to bring up a curious aspect of AA's story (What? ??? Just one? ???)

I've often wondered what triggered AA/FS's mental illness. I wasn't often awake in Psych class :-[
, but I seem to recall that a person inherited a tendancy toward schizophrenia, and not the actual disease. (Provided that's what she had, of course!) Whether or not you became schizophrenic depended on other factors (trauma, environment) in your life.  
Just for the sake of argument, let's accept that AA/FS was basing her story of the "Tchaikowskis" off of her own family, the Schankowskis. She tells us that she slept with a member of that family, and bore a child by him. This seems an odd type of relationship to have with a member of your own family.
So, in a round about way, is she telling us there was incest in the Schankowski family? Symptoms like those of AA have been recorded in victims of molestation> They become something greater in their own minds in order to rise above a situation.

So what does everyone else think? Of course, it's a terrible crime to accuse someone of, so I'm not accusing any member of the Schankowski family, as there is no proof. But, it would make sense for her to want to wipe her family from her mind after an event like this. Especially if she was told to surpress it. It would make sense.

To borrow from Bear, I will close the trapdoor now. I have to get to my  Mandarin study group!    


It appears this remark about "incest" is the start of the situation.

I can just imagine what went through Penny's mind when she saw this "theory".  

I'm not sure how this popped into jermeny's head but hey,  I have all kinds of theories popping into my head all the time.  That said,  I assume Penny wasn't too please with this kind of "theory"  which isn't a very pleasant one.  And,  these kinds of  "theories" would turn off any FS family member if they saw them.  Since Penny is trying to locate and talk to the family, and, this kind of "theory" is presented then....  Well,  I don't suppose this would go over very well with the family members.   And, if this is a turn-off then the family won't answer questions....  Like a snowball rolling down a snowy hill.....  that ends up smashing into a tree at the bottom of the hill, kind of scenario.

So,  what do we have left?  A theory.  Nothing more and nothing less.

Let us all make that perfectly clear.  No one has any evidence of incest.  

As far as we know,  Anna Anderson and FS are two different people who somehow became linked during a trial in the 1960s, then, again, through DNA in the 1990s.

To some,  the DNA seem to prove that Anna Anderson and FS were one in the same.  But, that was putting the cart in front of the horse, so-to-speak.  What the DNA test shows is:  AA is related to Karl Maucher who's grandmother Gertrude was either sister or half sister to FS.  That is all the test can prove.

As for the remark about AA sleeping with other family members,  please,  you have to take yourself into another time period and a different way of living to view this accuately.  People in those days didn't do things the way we do them today.  A bed was a place everyone who could fit slept.  The adults and kids.  Family was family.  Sometimes a friend shared the bed where it was warm....  A bed was better than the floor, especially in autumn and winter when the nights grew cold.....  

Now,  I believe this thread was suppose to be about proving Anna Anderson's story.

Annie asked about the long trip from Ekaterinburg to Bucharest some 2,000 plus miles and if it was possible.

I thought it was.

I asked about the weather around Odessa in Nov. .  Helen replied that sometimes it snows but not always.... in Nov. .

The map I placed is far too small.  I'm going to make a larger one so I'll be back.

Please,  play nice while I'm away.

AGRBear
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by AGRBear »
"What is true by lamplight is not always true by sunlight."

Joubert, Pensees, No. 152

Offline Elisabeth

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #251 on: February 18, 2005, 02:35:29 PM »
I think it's bizarre that the issue of incest was ever raised in the case of Anna Anderson. There's nothing to indicate that she was a victim of incest, aside from a handful of symptoms that are indicative of a whole host of different psychiatric disorders. People have to understand, that (no offense intended) psychiatrists themselves half the time don't know what they're dealing with. If a patient doesn't present outright as overtly and obviously schizophrenic (and where on earth is the evidence that AA was ever schizophrenic??!!??) or manic-depressive, they're really in the dark most of the time. It's not unknown, in fact quite common, for patients to present with symptoms that overlap. Psychiatry is still in its infancy in terms of what we know about the human brain and its relation to nature vs. nurture. We can't start drawing conclusions in areas where even the professionals would (or should) be cautious about doing so, especially given our incredible lack of clear information about Anna Anderson's background.
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Offline AGRBear

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #252 on: February 18, 2005, 03:44:28 PM »
Odessa [red dot]
\



I'm trying to get this map bigger but for some reason "bucket" is fighting the size .....

Anyway,  this is a little larger.

I asked around about the weather which is west of Odessa and around the Black Sea, and, I'm told that Dec. can be cold but not necessarily with a lot of snow in certain years.

And, the roads between some of the villages along the Rumanian border and across the border were not well kept.  There were few bridges.  I guess this was to help keep the people in and out of Russia at that time.

I don't know about the trains.

Nor do I know exactly what was under the German army's control at that time.  I'm told they were in the area and didn't leave until after the Treaty was signed between Germany and Russia.  And, much of this area then ended up as being part of Rumania.  I don't think we need the exact dates.

And Elisabeth is right about mental illness.  There is so little understood about the subject at this time.  And trying to make some kind of diagnois about AA's  or FS's mental health is like trying to catch the wind with your hands.  


AGRBear
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by AGRBear »
"What is true by lamplight is not always true by sunlight."

Joubert, Pensees, No. 152

Offline jolie

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #253 on: February 19, 2005, 12:41:06 AM »
NO ONE drew ANY conclusions ie) incest!   It was a "possibility" for her behavior.  

It amazes me that that of ALL the crazy theories thrown around on this board, that somehow THIS possibility is cause for a spanking.

If Penny left over this, it wasn't because of the theory, it was because posters didn't cave into her trantrums.  

Ya'll come up with the CRAZIEST tales and then act all HORRIFIED because a researcher didn't like what was said.  

Check the thread and see who caused the discord.    

Sheesh..........a mountain out of a molehill.  

So some people are doing research......does that have to stifle ideas???    

Bear, if you REALLY believe that there are boundaries for possibilities, then you wouldn't have anything to post!  

I'll probably be kicked off for saying this, but I see too much favoritism here among posters and those that suck up to "celebrities" whether they are credible or not.

I sometimes wonder if the reason some people get so upset is because THEY never considered a "possibility" that was discussed here..........or maybe the "possibility" came to close to the truth.    Or maybe it just doesn't "jive" with their own theory.

Helen and Jeremy behaved honorably.  They don't need to be chastised for throwing around a "maybe".  You all do it ALL THE TIME.

btw, Bear, I'm glad you are feeling better!  Take care and don't over-do!  I prayed for you this past week along with everyone else here.

Flame away.

jolie


IlyaBorisovich

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #254 on: February 19, 2005, 08:13:22 AM »
There's always the possibility that Penny's departure was on the advice and/or instruction of either her publisher or her lawyer, as a result of her being threatened with litigation here.  Just a thought.

Ilya