Author Topic: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska  (Read 238176 times)

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Adele Chatelain

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #75 on: July 28, 2004, 10:18:22 AM »
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Adele,

The mtDNA was isolated from two different sources and the results were identical. Even if the DNA was contaminated, it would not match Franciska Shankowska's nepew, which it did. I am a scientist and I understand DNA results very well. There is absolutely no way that two different labs would contaminate two different samples in the exact same way way as to get the same results... Carbon testing is different from DNA... Sorry  :(


Thanks for this information (and you don't have to be 'sorry'; I wasn't looking for any 'right or wrong' to this topic.  I really don't have any opinion about it, one way or the other, actually; but I do enjoy exploring possibilites.  --Adele

Offline Michelle

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #76 on: July 28, 2004, 08:16:51 PM »
A lot of you might think that I am just plain blinded by wishful thinking, but I have to disagree that AA looked nothing like Anastasia.  A lot of the pictures I have seen are VERY convincing, however there are those others that definitely don't help her claim in the looks department.  A lot of times when I see both AA's and Anastasia's pics held up together, they look almost identical, and there are even those certain pictures where she reminds me quite a bit of Anastasia's sister, Tatiana (however nowhere near as gorgeous, which would make sense considering in my opinion Anastasia was not at all a beauty like her three sisters).  Infact I've seen pictures of Olga that are a dead ringer for Tatiana (sorry I'm getting off on a tangent  8) ).  However I've seen pictures of numerous people in my lifetime where a person looks completely different in each picture.  I'm sure this must've been the case with AA/Anastasia (assuming they were the same person).  I don't know but it just boggles my mind that the DNA came out to pin her down as FS.  Something smells fishy to me. . .  :-/

Offline Abby

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #77 on: July 28, 2004, 08:18:43 PM »
but i think she looks more like FS than Anastasia - I know we only have one picture to base this on, but she does.

Offline Annie

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #78 on: July 28, 2004, 08:22:08 PM »
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I don't know but it just boggles my mind that the DNA came out to pin her down as FS.  Something smells fishy to me. . .  :-/


From what I've heard, as early as the 1930's Franzika's siblings had recognized her as their missing, mentally ill sister and were trying to tell people but not all listened. Since the possibility of her being FS was there for so long, and there was no other clue to her identity,  of course that was going to be the first thing checked in a DNA test.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Annie »

Offline Abby

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #79 on: July 28, 2004, 08:28:13 PM »
Good point Annie. FS also had a disappearance timeline that matched Anna Anderson's, and this became evident after police and investigators tracked down all the missing persons of that time and decided that FS would be a good candidate. I think there was a time when Anna Anderson ran away from one of her benefactress' homes, and this coincided with the re-appearance of Fransizka at one of her friend's homes in Poland.

However I have read by Anna Anderson's supporters that Fransizka was documented at a hospital in Berlin or something in the 1920's, when there is proof that Anna Anderson was at a different place altogether.

I don't know what to beleive!  ???

Offline Michelle

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #80 on: July 29, 2004, 08:13:23 PM »
Yes, that is true, Abby.  Except I believe I read in The Riddle of Anna Anderson and The Romanovs: The Final Chapter that Anna Anderson had actually appeared sometime in January 1920 (I don't have my book with me here at the moment so I could have the date wrong) and FS was accounted for at that time near her home, and reported missing in February 1920 (again the date might be wrong).  AA couldn't have been in two places at once.  It just doesn't make sense.  :-/

rskkiya

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #81 on: July 29, 2004, 08:18:03 PM »
Michelle
I think that your dates " January /February 1920" are incorrect.  You might want to check them...
R.

Offline Michelle

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #82 on: July 29, 2004, 08:55:35 PM »
I tried to look up this info as best I could, for I don't own The Riddle of Anna Anderson by Peter Kurth (I read it when I borrowed it from the library about a year ago), and I've been skimming through The Romanovs: The Final Chapter, and for some reason I can't find where I read it (and no it's not because I had initially made it up  ::) ).  I KNOW I read it in the latter book, and it's making me mad that I can't find it!  >:(  Oh well.  I'll keep looking (however lazy I may be  ;) ;D )

Offline stepan

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #83 on: July 31, 2004, 04:33:45 PM »
Anna Anderson appeared the 17 of february 1920 when she jumped into the Landwehr canal in Berlin. Franziska disappeared around the same time though itīs not clear the exact date.  It seems that her landlady, the wingenders waited some time before reporting her missing to the police.

Offline Annie

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #84 on: July 31, 2004, 04:57:06 PM »
1920? As much as I've seen and read on this subject, including both Kurth's and Lovell's books, I never noticed it was that early. I thought it was more into the mid 20's she appeared. If it was early 1920, to me that gives even less of a scant possibility her face had 'changed'- that was only a year and a half after Ekaterinburg. She was 17 when she vanished and eighteen and a half when found? Nahhh, either the date is wrong, or it's even more and more unlikely AA was Anastasia.

Also, wasn't FS like 3 or 4 years older than the real Anastasia?

Offline LisaDavidson

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #85 on: July 31, 2004, 10:21:48 PM »
Franziska was born in 1896, and Anastasia in 1901.

"Anna Anderson" was first identified in early 1920.

I have never placed great store in someone looking like the IF as evidence per se - there are too many instances of unrelated people who look alike and related people who don't.

Offline Alexa

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #86 on: August 01, 2004, 09:28:05 AM »
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"Anna Anderson" was first identified in early 1920.


I thought she wasn't identified as AN for several years, and was known as "Frau Unbekannt" (Mrs. Unknown) until she revealed her claim of being AN and that until then, she didn't speak.

Alexa
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Alexa »

Offline Annie

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #87 on: August 01, 2004, 09:45:09 AM »
That would explain it then!


Offline LisaDavidson

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #88 on: August 01, 2004, 12:06:07 PM »
Alexa and Annie:

There is a difficulty in what to call the woman who was fished out of the canal. I thought you understood this.

Greg King has chosen to call her "Anastasia Manahan" even though this was not her name until the last years of her life. I find this acceptable and often use it myself.

More often than not. I call her "Anna Anderson" a name that dates from the late 1920's. Again, this name is just as acceptable as "Anastasia Manahan", because we all know to whom it refers - which is after all, the function of any name.

I do not call her "Anastasia" out of respect for the Grand Duchess. I do not call her "Franziska" out of respect for our friend Peter Kurth.

I find other appellations to be needlessly cumbersome and confusing - don't you? So, when I use either "Anna Anderson" or "Anastasia Manahan", I am referring to the woman fished out of the Berlin canal in 1920. Okay?

Offline Annie

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Re: Anastasia Claimant - Anna Anderson a.k.a Franziska Schanzkowska
« Reply #89 on: August 01, 2004, 12:20:31 PM »
Okay :) I think of her as AA mostly because of the book "The Riddle of AA". Mrs. Manahan is what she was later in life, and when I heard of her and got interested. She lived less than 100 miles from me! So while I respect that as her name and identity, AA seems to be more of the definition most people use and understand so that's usually what I type (in fact, I never used "AA" until I started posting here and saw others doing it) But you are right.

http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=8468&pt=Anastasia%20'Anna'%20Anderson-Manahan

Here is a site that shows her grave. In all the messages left for her, some are sweet, some are very rude, and some say RIP no matter who she was. One person put up a little picture of a kitty and said, "I don't know who you are, but I know that you loved cats." I love cats too. I heard when she died she owned many cats. So, regardless of who she was, she will always be a good person to me for the love she gave to cats. :)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Annie »