Author Topic: How accurate is the movie "Mary Queen of Scot  (Read 26176 times)

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Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: How accurate is the movie "Mary Queen of
« Reply #30 on: January 21, 2005, 10:42:37 AM »
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 The recently shown (on cable) Mary and Elizabeth (hosted and written by David Starkey) was great - hope everyone gets to see that too.  He's also done programmes on Mary and Edward Tudor - again, brilliant.

 Katieann, do you know if these programs can be purchased on VHS or DVD? I caught the "Elizabeth" alone program with David Starkey but not the "Mary and Elizabeth" and not "Mary and Edward", didn't even know they were on, but would love to see them!

Offline Martyn

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Re: How accurate is the movie "Mary Queen of
« Reply #31 on: January 22, 2005, 11:47:33 AM »
The David Starkey programemes were okaybut had one flaw - David Starkey.  Can't abide the man.  Puts too much personal spin on history and spits venom like a wildcat.  There is only one TV historian who is worse - Simon Schama, utterly utterly boring with a dreadful voice and a delivery that he imagines is interestingly intellectual - oh it is enough to induce a coma!
If we are going to have history on TV, why would anyone want to look at the distinctly unappealing likes of David Starkey or Simon Schama?  Get the thing written by historians and get some dishy actor/gorgeous actress with integrity to front or narrate.  That way we get accuracy and eye candy - who can complain about that?
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Re: How accurate is the movie "Mary Queen of
« Reply #32 on: January 22, 2005, 11:51:12 AM »
Martyn, have you seen 'Deadringers' version of Simon Schama? Absolutely spot on!  

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: How accurate is the movie "Mary Queen of
« Reply #33 on: January 22, 2005, 03:05:56 PM »
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... why would anyone want to look at the distinctly unappealing likes of David Starkey or Simon Schama?  
 

I always get those two confused!  ;D They have kind of a similar affect ... Oh, I don't really mind them that much, as long as I am interested in the subject matter.

Offline KatieAnn

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Re: How accurate is the movie "Mary Queen of
« Reply #34 on: January 24, 2005, 08:52:08 AM »
Helen

David Starkey's written/narrated a couple of other "Royal" programmes:  The Six Wives of Henry VIII, Elizabeth I, and one called Monarchy which goes through some of the well-knows (or notorious) Royals through the ages.  they're all available from Amazon UK on DVD format.  Don't know about Edward and Mary though - haven't seen anything about a release for those programmes.

I also agree with Martyn though - Both Simon Sharma and David Starkey leave a lot to be desired in the delivery of the programme.  WHAT they said was interesting, but HOW they said it ... blah!!  Maybe if the programmes were narrated by Kenneth Branagh or Patrick Stewart; or Jane Lapotaire or Judi Dench it would have been much better - but these guys made me want to sit up straight, face front, and take notes for the quiz that would surely follow!
Kathleen

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: How accurate is the movie "Mary Queen of
« Reply #35 on: January 24, 2005, 09:05:52 AM »
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 Maybe if the programmes were narrated by... Patrick Stewart !


YES!!!  ;D

Offline Martyn

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Re: How accurate is the movie "Mary Queen of
« Reply #36 on: January 24, 2005, 01:11:14 PM »
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Martyn, have you seen 'Deadringers' version of Simon Schama? Absolutely spot on!  


I haven't seen that but I can well imagine.  Simon Schama and David Starkey have very differing approaches to the presentation of history.  The latter presents it like some bitter old dowager relating the latest society gossip; the former like some antiquated University tutor who once was trendy about twenty years ago.....If I am not mistaken Simon Schama's 'The History of Britain' scarcely covered the reign of Elizabeth I, for some unknown reason......
I would prefer all history programmes to be narrated by Sam West (son of Timothy West and Prunella Scales) as his voice is like liquid gold.....
'For a galant spirit there can never be defeat'....Wallis Windsor

'The important things is not what they think of me, but what I think of them.'......QV

Offline AGRBear

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Re: How accurate is the movie "Mary Queen of
« Reply #37 on: January 24, 2005, 02:35:41 PM »
Looks like everyone is drifting away from the movie "Mary Queen of Scots" ....   I think a movie should be listed as being historical accurate or inaccurate.  I find it annoying when I have to explain to my grandchildren what really happened.  Trouble is,  I'm not sure how one would accomplish a list.  Look at us here on this thread how we disagree on many subjects.  Oh well,  guess I'll just keep on explaining how I precieve the history of Mary Queen of Scots should be and let the artist, writter and directors continue as they have been.....  

AGRBear
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by AGRBear »
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Offline Martyn

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Re: How accurate is the movie "Mary Queen of
« Reply #38 on: January 24, 2005, 02:49:12 PM »
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Looks like everyone is drifting away from the movie "Mary Queen of Scots" ....   I think a movie should be listed as being historical accurate nor inaccurate.  I find it annoying when I have to explain to my grandchildren what really happened.  Trouble is,  I'm not sure how one would accomplish a list.  Look at us here on this thread how we disagree on many subjects.  Oh well,  guess I'll just keep on explaining how I precieve the history of Mary Queen of Scots should be and let the artist, writter and directors continue as they have been.....  

AGRBear



I don't understand what you mean 'a movie should be listed as being historical accurate nor inaccurate'....Who would supply this definition anyway?
Let's talk about David Starkey some more - I really can't stand him...!
'For a galant spirit there can never be defeat'....Wallis Windsor

'The important things is not what they think of me, but what I think of them.'......QV

Offline Robert_Hall

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Re: How accurate is the movie "Mary Queen of
« Reply #39 on: January 24, 2005, 03:23:22 PM »
Unless a film is presented as a documentary- why should it be listed as anything other than it was intended to be ? Entertainment and perhaps artistic expression. People who expect more from that media should probably stay with libraries and find their "truths" there rather than rely on stage or screen.
Life may not be the party we expected, but while we are here, might as well dance..

Do you want the truth, or my side of the story ?- Hank Ketchum.

Offline Janet_W.

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Re: How accurate is the movie "Mary Queen of
« Reply #40 on: January 24, 2005, 03:28:58 PM »
I saw one installment of the David Starkey series at a friend's home (haven't had TV reception at my own place for four years) and while I found the subject fascinating--of course!--and the treatment of interest, I also found Starkey annoying. Alistar Cooke was wonderful at providing ironic narrative, and I've also appreciated Janet Suzman's voiceovers. Judi Dench? Another great voice and non-annoying presence.  But Starkey reminded me of David Frost, who has always reminded me of Charles Dickens' Uriah Heep.

Katharine Hepburn hated playing the role of Mary Stuart and frequently stated in later years that she found Mary to have been a dunce. I found the film of interest, both for its subject and star, but far prefer most of Hepburn's other films to Mary of Scotland. The Vanessa Redgrave film I enjoyed very much, but not for accuracy . . . for the wild romanticism of the thing. Glenda Jackson at the time admitted that her original Elizabeth R was being "prettied up" for film, and of course she was right. As for the meeting that supposedly occurs between these two women? Well, I've never had a problem with it. This is, after all, drama. And the screenwriter has found it intriguing to bring them together--a sort of "what if" that many of us on this discussion board have played with the Romanovs. Most people who care about history know that the meeting never took place--or that it was exceptionally unlikely  ;)--and if they don't already know, they'll read about the truth in their independent research. But this type of thing is a sort of exercise, and for those of us who are interested in the personalities involved . . . well, why not? Elizabeth and Mary were fascinated with each other, shared ancestors, and were charismatic women who could rally powerful support. Plus, the film's  end is also the historically correct end: Mary is executed. Now, if the film had decided to put Mary on a ship on its way to America, where she ended up becoming Pochantas's best friend, and then the two of them traveled across the Louisiana Purchase and wrote journals about seeing the Pacific Ocean . . . now, that I might object to!  ;D

Offline Elisabeth

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Re: How accurate is the movie "Mary Queen of
« Reply #41 on: January 24, 2005, 03:30:53 PM »
I have to agree with Robert and Janet. Artists should be allowed some poetic license. Otherwise think of all the great art that would never have been created - for example, all of Shakespeare's historical plays.
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Offline AGRBear

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Re: How accurate is the movie "Mary Queen of
« Reply #42 on: January 24, 2005, 07:09:31 PM »
I am the last person who wants  "historical police".  All I meant   was,  it's too bad the movies can't be given a gold star for being "historicaly accurate".  One can be creative with the truth of history.   And give a "yellow star" to a movie that is not "historical accurate" and if it deserves, then give it all the Oscars for best acting, best script, best wardrobe,  because it was GREAT entertainment.  So,  please,  ease up on me people.   ;D.

{Sigh

Back to the movie Mary Queen of Scot.

AGRBear

PS  I wish they sold honey pots in movie lobbies but I'll never get that wish either.... :-[
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by AGRBear »
"What is true by lamplight is not always true by sunlight."

Joubert, Pensees, No. 152

Offline Martyn

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Re: How accurate is the movie "Mary Queen of
« Reply #43 on: January 25, 2005, 07:00:01 AM »
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I am the last person who wants  "historical police".  All I meant   was,  it's too bad the movies can't be given a gold star for being "historicaly accurate".  One can be creative with the truth of history.   And give a "yellow star" to a movie that is not "historical accurate" and if it deserves, then give it all the Oscars for best acting, best script, best wardrobe,  because it was GREAT entertainment.  So,  please,  ease up on me people.   ;D.

{Sigh

Back to the movie Mary Queen of Scot.

AGRBear

PS  I wish they sold honey pots in movie lobbies but I'll never get that wish either.... :-[


Honestly, do we have to put everything in categories?  Besides which can you imagine the rows about deciding whether something was historically accurate or not?  Its bad enough on here....And what if someone were to make a film that dealt with a theory that the IF had escaped death in Ekaterinburg - imagine the performance over the way that would be categorised!
As for selling honey in cinemas - make do with popcorn like the rest of us!
'For a galant spirit there can never be defeat'....Wallis Windsor

'The important things is not what they think of me, but what I think of them.'......QV

Offline KatieAnn

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Re: How accurate is the movie "Mary Queen of
« Reply #44 on: January 25, 2005, 10:11:13 AM »
Chipping in my tuppence worth here.  I think historical movies SHOULD be accurate.  Why not?  Why make a movie about Mary, Elizabeth, Nicholas II, the Kaiser, American Civil War, the Moon Landings etc and not tell the truth about them - is it because they (without the spice from Hollywood) would be too dull?  You have no idea how some sections of the Press in the UK reacted to the film U571.  They were practically calling for heads to roll - particularly as a few of the men who DID grab the Enigma machine from the German sub and got it back to land along with its code books were still very much alive at the time.

If you're going to make an historical film - make it accurate.  Elizabeth didn't meet Mary in real life - so what could be added by making it happen on celluloid?  Mary's life (and Elizabeth's) were interesting and detailed enough without adding dollops of fiction to it.

As I said in an earlier post, this is a pet peeve of mine, and I'm sorry to go on at length but it is something I feel strongly about.  I'm British (Scots by birth) and I get really annoyed when someone starts retelling MY history the way THEY want it done!!!
:)
Kathleen