Author Topic: Jewels of the Habsburgs  (Read 75112 times)

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Offline Olga

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Jewels of the Habsburgs
« on: January 17, 2005, 07:20:31 AM »
I recall reading about the Empress of Austria's black diamond tiara. It sounds beautiful. Are there any photos of it?


Offline Martyn

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Re: Jewels of the Habsburgs
« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2005, 07:55:34 AM »
I think that Brian posted a picture of her wearing it in the Elizabeth thread - or at least we talked about it.  Brian really is the expert on Elizabeth and her jewels...
'For a galant spirit there can never be defeat'....Wallis Windsor

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Offline brnbg aka: liljones1968

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Re: Jewels of the Habsburgs
« Reply #2 on: January 17, 2005, 03:19:44 PM »
the following is an excerpt from THE MARTYRDOM OF AN EMPRESS, and refers to a state ball given at the Hofburg on the occasion of the visit of the new tsar & tsarina (Nicky & Alix) to Vienna:

     "all eyes were immediately turned upon the lovely austrian sovereign....her toilette was a vision of severe elegance, chic, and perfection of taste.
      the endless fan-shaped train and bodice were of softest, most shimmering black-velvet, veiled with black-silk gauze, embroidered with pearl-hearted black violets.     on her proud head sparkled a diadem of black pearls & black diamonds, whence fell to the very hem of the court mantle a transparent veil of black gauze powdered with jet.      around the shapely marmorean neck hung row after row of softly gleaming black pearls interspersed with brilliants, and she carried in her hand a sheath of russian and neopolitan violets, tied with jet-embroidered black streamers, to which was fastened an enormous black marabout fan adorned with a crown of diamonds.    on her left shoulder was attached the stern-kreuz decoration, also in diamonds."



    paints a wonderfully vivid picture, doesn't it?

btw, THE MARTYRDOM  OF AN EMPRESS is a very odd book, to say the least.    no author is listed.....anywhere.     at all.

however, there is an introduction --- and one may infer from that (well, sort of), that a lady by the name of Elizabeth Clare Prophet (born: elizabeth clare wulf) was the author.     but nowhere on any of the pages does she say so.    what she does say, however, is that she's the reincarnation of the empress Elisabeth of Austria!

regardless, if you can get past that[/i], it's not a bad book.   written in (or about) 1981, it contains more descriptive passages than most of the biographies out there.
"when i die, i hope i go like my grandfather --
peacefully in my sleep; not screaming & in terror,
like the passengers in his car."

-- anonymous
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Offline Martyn

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Re: Jewels of the Habsburgs
« Reply #3 on: January 18, 2005, 06:14:24 AM »
That does sound like an interesting book!  So she says that she is the reincarnation of the Empress?  How splendid!  Do you know Brian if her descriptions are accurate, or is there a possibilty that they are embellished?
BTW, I have to say that I am not a fan of black diamonds.  They just look like jet to me and certainly don't have the appeal of natural diamonds (or other colours for that matter)....
'For a galant spirit there can never be defeat'....Wallis Windsor

'The important things is not what they think of me, but what I think of them.'......QV

Offline Martyn

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Re: Jewels of the Habsburgs
« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2005, 05:30:46 PM »
Quote
.
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btw, black diamonds are natural diamonds (well, they used to be --- before the advent of man-made diamonds).  

natural diamonds (read: real diamonds) can, and do, occur in almost every color of the rainbow (and even into the grey-scale) --- from colorless to black .   also, if a black diamond looks like jet, it's not a very good diamond.    



Brian I do apologise.  I didn't really express myself terribly well in my last post.  I have only seen a few examples of modern pieces of jewellery that were set with black diamonds and I have to say that they did not impress me.  You are of course right to state that real diamonds may occur in any colour; I should really have said that I am fondest of the purest whitest variety (quite partial to canary diamonds as well).....So good black diamonds should not look like jet?  Can you tell me what they should look like?  Are they opaque?
That diadem of Sissi is really quite an event......
'For a galant spirit there can never be defeat'....Wallis Windsor

'The important things is not what they think of me, but what I think of them.'......QV

Offline brnbg aka: liljones1968

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Re: Jewels of the Habsburgs
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2005, 02:47:01 AM »
.
.
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i may owe you an apology....  but this is what i understood to be the case:

a "good, high-quality, natural black diamond should be deep black in color, but still have a certain "clarity" (i've always understood this to mean it should be sort-of translucent or maybe be a "watery" black.   whereas, poor quality black diamonds (especially those that have been irradiated in order to achieve a black color) look more like onyx and can be quite porous (and thus difficult to perfectly facet).


(( mind you, any (or all) of the above could be wrong. ))  ;)
"when i die, i hope i go like my grandfather --
peacefully in my sleep; not screaming & in terror,
like the passengers in his car."

-- anonymous
.

Offline Martyn

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Re: Jewels of the Habsburgs
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2005, 05:38:10 AM »
Quote
.
.
.
i may owe you an apology....  but this is what i understood to be the case:

a "good, high-quality, natural black diamond should be deep black in color, but still have a certain "clarity" (i've always understood this to mean it should be sort-of translucent or maybe be a "watery" black.   whereas, poor quality black diamonds (especially those that have been irradiated in order to achieve a black color) look more like onyx and can be quite porous (and thus difficult to perfectly facet).


(( mind you, any (or all) of the above could be wrong. ))  ;)


I've had a little chat this morning with a friend of mine who is a jeweller and he gave me abit of information about black diamonds.
Apparently black diamonds in their natural state are a dark, often brownish colour, full of inclusions and black spots. Because of these inherent flaws, modern stones are treated to render them completely opaque and to all intents  and purposes the only appreciable difference between black diamonds and jet, is the way in which the stones are cut and polished; diamonds can be cut and facetted in different ways to jet due to the natural hardness of the stone.  Jet, being more fragile in character, must perforce be treated differently.  Overall, this results in increased glitter factor as it is possible to create many more facets with black diamonds, which then reflect the light.....
Brian, does this fit in with your understanding of black diamonds (I am not a gemmologist....)?
'For a galant spirit there can never be defeat'....Wallis Windsor

'The important things is not what they think of me, but what I think of them.'......QV

Offline Martyn

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Re: Jewels of the Habsburgs
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2005, 06:40:45 AM »
She sounds like a fascinating person in her own right this Mrs Marguerite Cunliffe-Owen, and perhaps the fit subject for a book herself?
Basically Goula, are you suggesting that this woman really had no first and knowledge of the Habsburg court and Empress and that her reminiscences are largely embellished versions of common knowledge at the time?
'For a galant spirit there can never be defeat'....Wallis Windsor

'The important things is not what they think of me, but what I think of them.'......QV

Offline brnbg aka: liljones1968

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Re: Jewels of the Habsburgs
« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2005, 11:10:51 PM »
Quote

I've had a little chat this morning with a friend of mine who is a jeweller and he gave me abit of information about black diamonds.
Apparently black diamonds in their natural state are a dark, often brownish colour, full of inclusions and black spots. Because of these inherent flaws, modern stones are treated to render them completely opaque and to all intents  and purposes the only appreciable difference between black diamonds and jet, is the way in which the stones are cut and polished; diamonds can be cut and facetted in different ways to jet due to the natural hardness of the stone.  Jet, being more fragile in character, must perforce be treated differently.  Overall, this results in increased glitter factor as it is possible to create many more facets with black diamonds, which then reflect the light.....
Brian, does this fit in with your understanding of black diamonds (I am not a gemmologist....)?




i think one of the main things i was mistaken about is the general desire for opaqueness.     i'd gotten that completely backwards, i guess.   actually, i think i may have gotten all of it wrong.    but now,
at least, i can ditch my wrong 2nd-hand info.

thanks very much!  
"when i die, i hope i go like my grandfather --
peacefully in my sleep; not screaming & in terror,
like the passengers in his car."

-- anonymous
.

Offline Martyn

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Re: Jewels of the Habsburgs
« Reply #9 on: January 22, 2005, 05:45:02 AM »
Quote



i think one of the main things i was mistaken about is the general desire for opaqueness.     i'd gotten that completely backwards, i guess.   actually, i think i may have gotten all of it wrong.    but now,
at least, i can ditch my wrong 2nd-hand info.

thanks very much!  


Hey listen mister, I am the one who makes the mistakes!  Keep posting your wonderful images and if we share our information as we do, we won't go too wrong!
'For a galant spirit there can never be defeat'....Wallis Windsor

'The important things is not what they think of me, but what I think of them.'......QV

Offline Martyn

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Re: Jewels of the Habsburgs
« Reply #10 on: January 22, 2005, 05:55:16 AM »
Goula, that really is fascinating stuff about the 'martyrdom' book and its putative author - quite a mystery all in all.
Do keep us posted if you find out anything more....
'For a galant spirit there can never be defeat'....Wallis Windsor

'The important things is not what they think of me, but what I think of them.'......QV

Offline Merrique

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Re: Jewels of the Habsburgs
« Reply #11 on: April 09, 2005, 07:13:48 PM »
I have searched this site and the internet and so far have come up with nothing.So I thought I'd put the question here since we have so many people here with so much knowledge.

Does anyone have any good color pictures of Sissi's jewels?Expsecially her diamond spiked tiara.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Don't knock on Death's door....ring the doorbell and run.He hates that.:D

Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Jewels of the Habsburgs
« Reply #12 on: April 09, 2005, 08:14:42 PM »
the famous Winterhalter portrait is probably the most well-known illustration of her in jewelry--she wears her famous diamond stars in her hair. Sissi tended to like simpler hair ornaments it seems, probably to draw attention to her justly celebrated lustrous hair.

« Last Edit: January 22, 2010, 02:04:59 AM by Svetabel »
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Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Jewels of the Habsburgs
« Reply #13 on: April 09, 2005, 08:30:07 PM »
from Danjels' site

EMPRESS ELISABETH´S IVY PARURE

Tiara of ivy leaves with square-cut emerald berries.
Made by Kochert for the Empress Elisabeth in 1878.

The 18th century brooche of Maria Theresa had been divided into 11 pieces in 1800 and in 1811 remade into a parure, consisting of tiara, necklace and corsage. This parure was dismantled bu Köchert between 1875 and 1878 to make a new parure consisting of a diadem, corsage, two bracelets, necklace and 2 brooches.

The necklace: Designed and executed by Alexander Köchert in 1875 with stones form the 18th century corsage. It contained emeralds, 109 carats; diamonds, 178 carats and 708 diamond rosettes.

The bracelets: These too were intirely conceived and executed by Alexander Köchert in 1876. The diamonds and emeralds were taken from a replica of the coronation robe of the Holy Roman Emperors.

The corsage: Also designed and executed entirely by Alexander Köchert in 1877 with stones from the old corsage. The stones used are: 114 carat central emerald, 4 emeralds, 45 carats; diamonds, 120 carats; and 382 diamond rosettes

The diadem: The 1811 diadem had already been altered in 1847, 1856 and again in 1864. In 1878 Alexander Köchert was commissioned to create a new one using the leaves, the diamonds and the emeralds. It contained 15 emeralds, 63 carats; 1478 diamonds, 272 carats and 2456 diamond rosettes. 10 Years later, in 1888, Heinrich Köchert was asked to alter the diadem againadding more emeralds.

The parure was sold in 1918, current whereabouts unknown.


« Last Edit: January 22, 2010, 02:05:32 AM by Svetabel »
They also serve who only stand and wait--John Milton
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Offline Merrique

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Re: Jewels of the Habsburgs
« Reply #14 on: April 09, 2005, 08:49:34 PM »
GDSElla you are a gem!That is exactly what I was looking for.I wonder if there are any pictures of what Sissi's lovely jewels would look like today,and what happened to them.
Don't knock on Death's door....ring the doorbell and run.He hates that.:D