Author Topic: Where were the guards situated in the Palace during captivity?  (Read 5527 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline historyfan

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 624
    • View Profile
Where were the guards situated in the Palace during captivity?
« on: November 27, 2013, 10:03:43 PM »
I do apologize if this has been covered, but I've searched up, down, backwards and forwards for two days and haven't found anything.

Does anyone know where the guards were billeted in the Alexander Palace during March-August 1917, while they were guarding the Imperial family under house arrest? What rooms - or, if they were basement rooms, how were they accessed?

Offline Sarushka

  • Moderator
  • Velikye Knyaz
  • *****
  • Posts: 6489
  • May I interest you in a grain of salt?
    • View Profile
Re: Where were the guards situated in the Palace during captivity?
« Reply #1 on: November 28, 2013, 07:19:39 PM »
I don't know either, but my first instinct would also be the basement.
THE LOST CROWN: A Novel of Romanov Russia -- now in paperback!
"A dramatic, powerful narrative and a masterful grasp of life in this vanished world." ~Greg King

Offline Michael HR

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 645
  • Imperial Corps Des Pages
    • View Profile
Re: Where were the guards situated in the Palace during captivity?
« Reply #2 on: December 01, 2013, 09:17:04 AM »
What a good question!
Remembering the Imperial Corps Des Pages - The Spirit of Imperial Russia


Offline Kalafrana

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 2859
    • View Profile
Re: Where were the guards situated in the Palace during captivity?
« Reply #3 on: December 01, 2013, 02:14:25 PM »
Interesting point. Until then there had been the Palace Guard on duty there, and they presumably had barracks in the vicinity. As a parallel, units doing public duties at Buckingham Palace and St James's Palace are accommodated at Wellington Barracks, on one side of St James's Park.

Could those guarding the Imperial Family at this time have taken over the barracks of the Palace Guard?

Ann

Offline historyfan

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 624
    • View Profile
Re: Where were the guards situated in the Palace during captivity?
« Reply #4 on: December 01, 2013, 08:26:34 PM »
I'd always assumed the guards spent all their time inside the palace! Could it be they actually "lived" offsite?


Offline Rodney_G.

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 840
  • an angel .....and the best of them
    • View Profile
Re: Where were the guards situated in the Palace during captivity?
« Reply #5 on: December 02, 2013, 05:43:33 PM »
I suspect some were quartered within the Palace, though never in the IF areas. Perhaps some few in the basement, though I rather think not. As with any guard assignment as prevailed  at the AP, there was a rotation of men and posts, and there were nearby barracks. Also, throughout the  period of the IF house arrest at the Palace, there still remained some deference to the Romanovs' former status and their personal space, so to speak,at least indoors, and at least among the higher political authorities , like even Kerensky, who made decisions on  these things.
Rodney G.

Offline historyfan

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 624
    • View Profile
Re: Where were the guards situated in the Palace during captivity?
« Reply #6 on: December 02, 2013, 08:41:21 PM »
It makes sense, now that there's been discussion, that the guards would have been billeted at the barracks.

But they did have "break rooms" of a sort inside the palace, didn't they? Sources (ie Massie) make numerous references to loud and drunken behaviour by the guards, heard (although not seen) by the family and their retinue after-hours. Were those maybe in the basement?

Offline Kalafrana

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 2859
    • View Profile
Re: Where were the guards situated in the Palace during captivity?
« Reply #7 on: December 03, 2013, 04:10:34 AM »
In the British forces, you have a guardroom (normally a building), which serves three functions. First, it is the place where people entering and leaving camp book in and out. Second, it acts as a base for those on guard duty (it has a room with beds). Third, it usually has cells for those serving short periods of detention.

So yes, there would be some sort of guardroom in the Alexander Palace or its grounds, where off-duty soldiers could engage in loud and drunken behaviour (remember that discipline in the Russian army broke down after the February Revolution).

Ann

Offline historyfan

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 624
    • View Profile
Re: Where were the guards situated in the Palace during captivity?
« Reply #8 on: December 03, 2013, 09:15:38 AM »
So now I need to find out where that was. Thanks, everyone!

Offline Joanna

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 1150
  • Winter Palace Research
    • View Profile
    • Winter Palace Research
Re: Where were the guards situated in the Palace during captivity?
« Reply #9 on: February 19, 2017, 01:43:56 PM »
A Century Past - Alexander Palace & Tsarskoe Selo

https://winterpalaceresearch.blogspot.ca/2017/02/a-century-past-alexander-palace.html

I think the second photograph with the guards and sentry box is the right hand corner of the family wing with the fence that straddled across the courtyard to the other wing. Any thoughts?

Joanna

Offline lilianna

  • Graf
  • ***
  • Posts: 294
  • I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
    • View Profile
Re: Where were the guards situated in the Palace during captivity?
« Reply #10 on: February 19, 2017, 02:31:32 PM »
Есть книга Яковлева "Охрана царской резиденции". 1928 год. В книге есть все комнаты охраны и комнаты, где был телефон  для охраны.
В книге  написано, что во дворец можно было войти только через Кухню и по тоннелю.

There is a book Yakovlev "Protection of the royal residence." 1928. The book has all the security room and the room where the telephone was for protection.
The book says that the palace could only enter through the kitchen and down the tunnel.

Offline lilianna

  • Graf
  • ***
  • Posts: 294
  • I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
    • View Profile
Re: Where were the guards situated in the Palace during captivity?
« Reply #11 on: February 19, 2017, 02:32:13 PM »
There is a book Yakovlev "Protection of the royal residence." 1928. The book has all the security room and the room where the telephone was for protection.
The book says that the palace could only enter through the kitchen and down the tunnel.

Offline Sanochka

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 233
    • View Profile
Re: Where were the guards situated in the Palace during captivity?
« Reply #12 on: February 19, 2017, 08:47:40 PM »
From what I've read, there were guards posted in the basement, particularly under under Nicholas & Alexandra's bedroom.  Every noise was recorded - including the sound of Alexandra's toilet being flushed upstairs.  When she learned of this, Alexandra - always painfully timid about her bathroom habits - refrained from using the bathroom until an hour when she knew there were no guards below.