Author Topic: Lopukhin-Demidov  (Read 22646 times)

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Offline rpalmgre

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Re: Lopukhin-Demidov
« Reply #15 on: December 26, 2015, 02:57:17 PM »
The agnatic line of the Demidov Princes of San Donato went extinct with the death of the 4th Prince in 1943. I'm not sure if this means that the Counts Demidovs also are extinct

There has never existed any Counts of the House of Demidov. Those that did not have a princely title were and still are untitled Russian nobility. That is why both Nikolai Demidoff and Natalia Demidoff are just untitled Russian lesser nobility.

The San Donato line was granted a grand-ducal Tuscan comital title, a few years before they were made Tuscan princes. So I guess that one too has died out.

Yes but that was for the San Donato line. I was thinking about the line of the House of Demidoff to which the present day Prince Lopukhin-Demidov belong. They have never been granted a Russian comital title. Therefore the son and daughter of His Serene Highness The 4th Prince Lopukhin-Demidov are untitled Russian nobility.

Offline Demidoff

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Re: Lopukhin-Demidov
« Reply #16 on: February 27, 2016, 04:04:19 AM »
Hi,

I am wondering if the Prince of San Donato line truly has expired.  There may be a ray of hope in the form of the Dournoff family (spelling?).   I have the document granting the Tuscan title of Prince of San Donato to Anatole N. Demidoff on his marriage to Princess Mathilde Bonaparte in Florence dating to the 1840's.  There is a reference for the title, Prince of San Donato, to also transmit down the family of the Dournoffs (spelling?).   Anatole's father, Nicholas Demidoff, had a sister, Maria, that married Peter Dournoff so this family also are cited as legitmate heirs to the title of Prince of San Donato.    If this is of interest to you then I am fine to return with more accurate detail, references, and spelling after I retrieve the historical records.

Kind regards, Alexandre

Offline Превед

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Re: Lopukhin-Demidov
« Reply #17 on: February 27, 2016, 06:50:54 AM »
Hi,

I am wondering if the Prince of San Donato line truly has expired.  There may be a ray of hope in the form of the Dournoff family (spelling?).   I have the document granting the Tuscan title of Prince of San Donato to Anatole N. Demidoff on his marriage to Princess Mathilde Bonaparte in Florence dating to the 1840's.  There is a reference for the title, Prince of San Donato, to also transmit down the family of the Dournoffs (spelling?).   Anatole's father, Nicholas Demidoff, had a sister, Maria, that married Peter Dournoff so this family also are cited as legitmate heirs to the title of Prince of San Donato.    If this is of interest to you then I am fine to return with more accurate detail, references, and spelling after I retrieve the historical records.

I presume this clause of cognatic inheritance would be applicable if the line of the first prince, Anatole Demidoff, was extinct. The fourth and last (male-line) prince, Anatole (died 1943) had three daughters and the two youngest, Eugénie (married Gerber) and Aurore (married Giraud), had descendants. If the title could pass through female lines I would presume, from the general principles of West European nobiliary law, that it would pass to their descendants before it passed to the descendants of the first prince's sister.

The Dournoff family you are thinking of is evidently better known as Durnovo: See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Durnovo

Березы севера мне милы,—
Их грустный, опущённый вид,
Как речь безмолвная могилы,
Горячку сердца холодит.

(Афанасий Фет: «Ивы и березы», 1843 / 1856)

Offline Превед

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Re: Lopukhin-Demidov
« Reply #18 on: February 27, 2016, 07:19:17 AM »
I have the document granting the Tuscan title of Prince of San Donato to Anatole N. Demidoff on his marriage to Princess Mathilde Bonaparte in Florence dating to the 1840's.  

The Russian Wikipedia, citing a noble genealogical source in Russian, says that the second prince, who succeeded his uncle, had the originally Tuscan title bestowed / confirmed by the King of Italy in 1872 with only male-line inheritance. This would then imply that the first, grand-ducal Tuscan creation, whatever its terms, had expired upon the first holder's childless death. This would also mean that the title went extinct in 1943.

See Wikipedia: Князь Сан-Донато

« Last Edit: February 27, 2016, 07:21:11 AM by Превед »
Березы севера мне милы,—
Их грустный, опущённый вид,
Как речь безмолвная могилы,
Горячку сердца холодит.

(Афанасий Фет: «Ивы и березы», 1843 / 1856)

Offline rpalmgre

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Re: Lopukhin-Demidov
« Reply #19 on: March 04, 2016, 03:25:19 AM »
The Princely family of San Donato of the House of Demidov is extinct.

What interests me is the still existing Princely family of Lopukhin-Demidov of the House of Demidov.

Offline rpalmgre

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Re: Lopukhin-Demidov
« Reply #20 on: April 04, 2016, 02:17:38 AM »
Does anyone here know if The 4th Prince Lopukhin-Demidov live also in Russia or some other country than here in Finland?

Offline rpalmgre

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Re: Lopukhin-Demidov
« Reply #21 on: April 21, 2017, 07:17:25 AM »
Does anyone here know if The 4th Prince Lopukhin-Demidov live also in Russia or some other country than here in Finland?

Anyone know anything?