Author Topic: INVESTIGATION OF THE ROMANOV REMAINS HAS BEEN REOPENED  (Read 73307 times)

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Offline Lochlanach

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Re: INVESTIGATION OF THE ROMANOV REMAINS HAS BEEN REOPENED
« Reply #75 on: December 29, 2015, 09:24:09 AM »
Another update: "ROMANOV FAMILY: GRAND DUCHESS AND TSAREVICH REMAINS IN CUSTODY OF RUSSIAN ORTHODOX CHURCH": http://www.theromanovfamily.com/romanov-family-remains-have-been/

I would hope that , if they get a good enough sample ,  they will be comparing not only the Y DNA of Alexander III to Nicholas and Alexei ,  but also the autosomal DNA . One or the other would be enough to establish the familial link , but both would be ideal  .
For Marie/Anastasia, compare autosomally with Alexander , and also repeat the analysis done several years ago to compare her autosomal DNA with N and A , and her mtDNA with Alix (improved reading with better technology than in the past ?)  . Nothing less will do.

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Re: INVESTIGATION OF THE ROMANOV REMAINS HAS BEEN REOPENED
« Reply #76 on: December 29, 2015, 09:38:59 AM »
There is never a need to "re test" a DNA test that has already been done.  The science is exactly the same and there are never and "different" results, especially when a match has already been proven.  If you do not understand this, then you do not understand how DNA testing works. DNA testing only gets MORE conclusive with advances, but that does not decrease the fact that a match has already been proven.

It is a waste of time and money to do another DNA test because nothing will ever be different.

Offline wakas

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Re: INVESTIGATION OF THE ROMANOV REMAINS HAS BEEN REOPENED
« Reply #77 on: December 29, 2015, 04:41:23 PM »
I agree with everything you said, FA. Doing another DNA test is pointless.
After death, there is not death, but life.

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: INVESTIGATION OF THE ROMANOV REMAINS HAS BEEN REOPENED
« Reply #78 on: December 29, 2015, 04:43:20 PM »
Same here.. I keep saying that it would have been so much nicer if this money was used to help the many needy people in Russia... But what else is new. Politics never changes.

Offline wakas

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Re: INVESTIGATION OF THE ROMANOV REMAINS HAS BEEN REOPENED
« Reply #79 on: December 29, 2015, 04:44:39 PM »
Well said, Helen. This is so true.
After death, there is not death, but life.

Offline DNAgenie

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Re: INVESTIGATION OF THE ROMANOV REMAINS HAS BEEN REOPENED
« Reply #80 on: December 29, 2015, 04:59:50 PM »
Quote
There is never a need to "re test" a DNA test that has already been done.  The science is exactly the same and there are never and "different" results, especially when a match has already been proven.  If you do not understand this, then you do not understand how DNA testing works. DNA testing only gets MORE conclusive with advances, but that does not decrease the fact that a match has already been proven.

It is a waste of time and money to do another DNA test because nothing will ever be different.
That only applies if the test is done from the same samples as previously, using the same technique. I thought the question that needed to be settled was whether the previous samples were from the relevant people, so it was the sampling that needed to be redone and DNA retested, possibly by newer methods, not the original DNA tests on the original samples.

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Re: INVESTIGATION OF THE ROMANOV REMAINS HAS BEEN REOPENED
« Reply #81 on: December 29, 2015, 06:13:05 PM »
Quote
There is never a need to "re test" a DNA test that has already been done.  The science is exactly the same and there are never and "different" results, especially when a match has already been proven.  If you do not understand this, then you do not understand how DNA testing works. DNA testing only gets MORE conclusive with advances, but that does not decrease the fact that a match has already been proven.

It is a waste of time and money to do another DNA test because nothing will ever be different.
That only applies if the test is done from the same samples as previously, using the same technique. I thought the question that needed to be settled was whether the previous samples were from the relevant people, so it was the sampling that needed to be redone and DNA retested, possibly by newer methods, not the original DNA tests on the original samples.

No the previous tests already MATCH and establish who they are.  If the samples weren't from the "relevant" people, how could they have matched the Romanov family DNA exactly?


Offline Lochlanach

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Re: INVESTIGATION OF THE ROMANOV REMAINS HAS BEEN REOPENED
« Reply #82 on: December 30, 2015, 05:24:05 AM »
There is never a need to "re test" a DNA test that has already been done.  The science is exactly the same and there are never and "different" results, especially when a match has already been proven.  If you do not understand this, then you do not understand how DNA testing works. DNA testing only gets MORE conclusive with advances, but that does not decrease the fact that a match has already been proven.

It is a waste of time and money to do another DNA test because nothing will ever be different.
No that is not my point . I understand DNA testing and how genetic inheritance works , particularly regarding the IF ( although it is clear many on here and elsehwere do not). The previous testing was conclusive - only the credulous or the self-interested would seek to rubbish them. My point is , they have decided to analyze  the IF's remains again ,  and test Alexanders remains - so why not subject them all to the most rigorous testing possible , not just to establish their identity again , but to fully explore their genomes and wring as much information out of them as possible, while you have the final chance - they are of huge historical importance after all. This likely goes well beyond the remit of the labs conducting the analysis unfortunately. As for the cost , well governments spend/waste billions per year , much of it on questionable causes at home and abroad. Analyzing a few genomes in a relatively shallow way is unlikely to break the bank.

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: INVESTIGATION OF THE ROMANOV REMAINS HAS BEEN REOPENED
« Reply #83 on: January 02, 2016, 07:54:25 AM »
.. test Alexanders remains - so why not subject them all to the most rigorous testing possible , not just to establish their identity again , but to fully explore their genomes and wring as much information out of them as possible, while you have the final chance - they are of huge historical importance after all...

This would be very nice, but this is not their goal. Their goal is to retest everything to prove or disprove the authenticity of the remains, which they still question.

Offline Helen_Azar

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Offline Lochlanach

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Re: INVESTIGATION OF THE ROMANOV REMAINS HAS BEEN REOPENED
« Reply #85 on: January 02, 2016, 12:54:35 PM »
.. test Alexanders remains - so why not subject them all to the most rigorous testing possible , not just to establish their identity again , but to fully explore their genomes and wring as much information out of them as possible, while you have the final chance - they are of huge historical importance after all...

This would be very nice, but this is not their goal. Their goal is to retest everything to prove or disprove the authenticity of the remains, which they still question.

Yes exactly . They could so much more.

Offline Lochlanach

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Re: INVESTIGATION OF THE ROMANOV REMAINS HAS BEEN REOPENED
« Reply #86 on: January 02, 2016, 01:25:38 PM »
Update: http://www.theromanovfamily.com/romanov-family-remains-update-new-study-may-take-three-years/

Well I was cynical to begin with regarding the motives behind this 'new investigation' but now ..... Two to three years ? To extract DNA from just two sets of remains , and compare them to the other remains for identification purposes? Who comprises this ROC team of experts examining the remains?  Even if they are starting from scratch, the whole process should take closer to two to three months than to two to three years. I have a feeling however that the ROC wlll drag this out as long as they can , maybe even until 2018 when they can declare the remains valid and bury them on the centenary of the Romanovs deaths.  The Russian regime is allowing the ROC its moment in the sun and may well indulge them .They may even deliberately fudge the testing. I hope I am proved wrong and just being pessimistic.  Anyway , aren't the secular authorities finished with the remains and presenting their results this month ?

Offline Geniebeanie

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Re: INVESTIGATION OF THE ROMANOV REMAINS HAS BEEN REOPENED
« Reply #87 on: April 07, 2016, 04:52:31 PM »
Have there been any results in the comfirmation on the remains of Nicholas and Alexander.  I am referring to the DNATest done earlier this year?

Offline Romanov_Fan19

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Re: INVESTIGATION OF THE ROMANOV REMAINS HAS BEEN REOPENED
« Reply #88 on: April 07, 2016, 06:00:11 PM »
What about  Alexander I  The Romanov  Legend of  Feodor

Offline Превед

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Re: INVESTIGATION OF THE ROMANOV REMAINS HAS BEEN REOPENED
« Reply #89 on: April 08, 2016, 09:54:38 AM »
What about  Alexander I  The Romanov  Legend of  Feodor

See this hread: Emperor Alexander I vs Fedor Kuzmitch - a mystery
Берёзы севера мне милы,
Их грустный, опущённый вид,
Как речь безмолвная могилы,
Горячку сердца холодит.

(Афанасий Фет: Ивы и берёзы, 1843 / 1856)