Author Topic: A New AU fic - title, ideas, help with accuracy?  (Read 2613 times)

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Offline Превед

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Re: A New AU fic - title, ideas, help with accuracy?
« Reply #60 on: October 04, 2017, 03:54:39 PM »
I also have a list of possible husbands for Tatiana and Maria! Here is the lists!

Tatiana:
Philipp Albrecht, Duke of Württemberg (George Philipp Albrecht Carl Maria Joseph Ludwig Hubertus Stanislaus Leopold Herzog von Württemberg, 14 November 1893–17 April 1975)
Surprisingly, that's it. Wikipedia can only take me so far.

As an author you are probably interested in knowing that he has already been used as a literary model already: He is the inspiration for Jewish Hans Schwarz's aristocratic high school infatuation Konradin von Hohenfels in Fred Uhlman's brilliant, haunting short autobiographical novel "Reunion" from 1971. (Read it! It is so sad and beautiful!)  In reality Uhlman and the Duke met as university students, but many assume the inspiration is Claus von Stauffenberg, because of how the novel ends. But Philipp Albrecht didn't die resisting Hitler's tyranny, although he was a passive opponent of the Nazis.

Interestingly the enormous social and racial divide between the Jew Hans Schwarz, with roots in an Eastern European ghetto or shtetl, is stressed in contrast with Konradin's mother, who is an unnamed anti-Semitic, icy Slavic princess. (Not a Romanov, but a Polish princess, whereas Philipp Albrecht's mother was in reality an Austrian archduchess -  the sister of Franz Ferdinand with his Slavic duchess.)

In the novel their adolescent romantic friendship develops in the classroom of an elite high school in Stuttgart where the wall shows the imprint of two pictures that used to hang there before the WW1: Those of Philipp Albrecht's cousin the King of Württemberg and Emperor Wilhelm II. A very poignant image of Weimar Germany!

Speaking of the characters haunting Weimar Germany and shadows of the past: Do you plan any references to the two sons Bathildis does not get as a fictional character - and their comital Platen-Hallermund brides, with their links to the estate in Holstein where Franziska Schanzkowska worked?
« Last Edit: October 04, 2017, 04:02:11 PM by Превед »
Березы севера мне милы,—
Их грустный, опущённый вид,
Как речь безмолвная могилы,
Горячку сердца холодит.

(Афанасий Фет: «Ивы и березы», 1843 / 1856)

Offline Превед

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Re: A New AU fic - title, ideas, help with accuracy?
« Reply #61 on: October 04, 2017, 04:18:12 PM »
BTW a perfect (or disastrous!) match for melancholic Olga would have been the tragic Grand Duke Adolf Friedrich VI of Mecklenburg-Strelitz. Yes, 15 years her senior, but a fellow tortured soul and a bachelor untill his suicide. The same goes for his six years younger brother Duke Karl Borwin, if he didn't die in a duel 20 years old, also with regard to Tatiana.

And of course - in alternative history everybody would love to see one of OTMA married to one of the sons of Friedrich Karl of Hesse-Cassel-Rumpenheim, chosen King of Finland and thus one of OTMA as Crown Princess and eventually Queen of all Finland, Carelia and in particular Virolahti Bay.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2017, 04:37:51 PM by Превед »
Березы севера мне милы,—
Их грустный, опущённый вид,
Как речь безмолвная могилы,
Горячку сердца холодит.

(Афанасий Фет: «Ивы и березы», 1843 / 1856)

Offline GDSophie

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Re: A New AU fic - title, ideas, help with accuracy?
« Reply #62 on: October 05, 2017, 10:30:52 AM »
BTW a perfect (or disastrous!) match for melancholic Olga would have been the tragic Grand Duke Adolf Friedrich VI of Mecklenburg-Strelitz. Yes, 15 years her senior, but a fellow tortured soul and a bachelor untill his suicide. The same goes for his six years younger brother Duke Karl Borwin, if he didn't die in a duel 20 years old, also with regard to Tatiana.

And of course - in alternative history everybody would love to see one of OTMA married to one of the sons of Friedrich Karl of Hesse-Cassel-Rumpenheim, chosen King of Finland and thus one of OTMA as Crown Princess and eventually Queen of all Finland, Carelia and in particular Virolahti Bay.

Prince Wolfgang of Hesse-Kassel was a year older than Tatiana, and the Crown Prince. A perfect match for a Russian Grand Duchess, especially one who was the daughter of the most powerful man in the world.
'Give my love to all who remember me' - Olga Nikolaevna

Offline Kalafrana

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Re: A New AU fic - title, ideas, help with accuracy?
« Reply #63 on: October 05, 2017, 11:19:19 AM »
I note that Wolfgang survived until 1989, which is perhaps a mite too recent for you to use him - there will be people alive who knew him.

If you want a Hesse Cassel, there were two elder brothers killed in the First World War, Friedrich Wilhelm and Maximilian, born in 1893 and 1894 respectively.

They were all nephews of the Kaiser as well as great-grandsons of Queen Victoria, so very well connected.

Ann

Offline Превед

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Re: A New AU fic - title, ideas, help with accuracy?
« Reply #64 on: October 05, 2017, 12:55:31 PM »
Oh, and do note that the Hesse-Cassel-Rumpenheims' estate Panker in Holstein is only 20 km from Friederikenhof / Weissenhaus, where Franziska Schanzkowska worked and Bathildis's actual sons' extended in-laws, the Counts Platen-Hallermund, lived
Березы севера мне милы,—
Их грустный, опущённый вид,
Как речь безмолвная могилы,
Горячку сердца холодит.

(Афанасий Фет: «Ивы и березы», 1843 / 1856)

Offline GDSophie

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Re: A New AU fic - title, ideas, help with accuracy?
« Reply #65 on: October 05, 2017, 05:21:12 PM »
I also have a list of possible husbands for Tatiana and Maria! Here is the lists!

Tatiana:
Philipp Albrecht, Duke of Württemberg (George Philipp Albrecht Carl Maria Joseph Ludwig Hubertus Stanislaus Leopold Herzog von Württemberg, 14 November 1893–17 April 1975)
Surprisingly, that's it. Wikipedia can only take me so far.

As an author you are probably interested in knowing that he has already been used as a literary model already: He is the inspiration for Jewish Hans Schwarz's aristocratic high school infatuation Konradin von Hohenfels in Fred Uhlman's brilliant, haunting short autobiographical novel "Reunion" from 1971. (Read it! It is so sad and beautiful!)  In reality Uhlman and the Duke met as university students, but many assume the inspiration is Claus von Stauffenberg, because of how the novel ends. But Philipp Albrecht didn't die resisting Hitler's tyranny, although he was a passive opponent of the Nazis.

Interestingly the enormous social and racial divide between the Jew Hans Schwarz, with roots in an Eastern European ghetto or shtetl, is stressed in contrast with Konradin's mother, who is an unnamed anti-Semitic, icy Slavic princess. (Not a Romanov, but a Polish princess, whereas Philipp Albrecht's mother was in reality an Austrian archduchess -  the sister of Franz Ferdinand with his Slavic duchess.)

In the novel their adolescent romantic friendship develops in the classroom of an elite high school in Stuttgart where the wall shows the imprint of two pictures that used to hang there before the WW1: Those of Philipp Albrecht's cousin the King of Württemberg and Emperor Wilhelm II. A very poignant image of Weimar Germany!

Speaking of the characters haunting Weimar Germany and shadows of the past: Do you plan any references to the two sons Bathildis does not get as a fictional character - and their comital Platen-Hallermund brides, with their links to the estate in Holstein where Franziska Schanzkowska worked?

The two sons Bathildis had in real life will be mentioned only briefly as guests to Olga and Edward's wedding, they'll have the same names but different mother. They're lives don't actually change except different features and a different mother (most likely a Princess that didn't marry in real life will be chosen to fill in).

I've decided Tatiana will marry Igor in mid August 1916, like I explained on the last page. Grand Duchess Elizabeth will die in a car crash in late December 1916, leaving Vera and George in their care.

All I need now is Alexei, Maria and the two fictional sons Dmitri and Constantine's possible husbands/brides.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2017, 05:32:26 PM by GDSophie »
'Give my love to all who remember me' - Olga Nikolaevna

Offline TimM

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Re: A New AU fic - title, ideas, help with accuracy?
« Reply #66 on: October 06, 2017, 06:13:05 AM »
Yeah, you're almost good to go here.
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Offline GDSophie

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Re: A New AU fic - title, ideas, help with accuracy?
« Reply #67 on: October 18, 2017, 07:10:50 PM »
Alexei Nikolaevich + Princess Helen of Greece and Denmark (Empress Elena Constantinovna of Russia)
Olga Nikolaevna (Catherine Alexandra Victoria Olga, Princess of Wales and Queen of England) + Edward, Prince of Wales
Tatiana Nikolaevna (HI&RH Grand Duchess Tatiana, Princess of Russia) + Prince Igor Konstantinovich
Maria Nikolaevna (Maria Mountbatten, Countess Mountbatten of Burma) + Louis Mountbatten
Anastasia Nikolaevna (Crown Princess Anastasie, Duchess of Brabant) + Prince Leopold, Duke of Brabant
Dmitri Nikolaevich + Princess Elizabeth of Greece and Denmark (Grand Duchess Ekaterina Nikolaevna of Russia)
Constantine Nikolaevich + Princess Ileana of Romania (Grand Duchess Maria Alexandrovna of Russia)

Look good?

(While looking for royals I noticed that Prince Philip looks a lot like his uncle and Elizabeth's father, Prince Nicholas of Greece).
« Last Edit: October 18, 2017, 07:18:15 PM by GDSophie »
'Give my love to all who remember me' - Olga Nikolaevna

Offline Kalafrana

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Re: A New AU fic - title, ideas, help with accuracy?
« Reply #68 on: October 19, 2017, 10:44:01 AM »
Hm, Elizabeth of Greece and Denmark would be Elizaveta Nikolaievna rather than Ekaterina Nikolaievna.

will she and the fictitious Dimitri Nikolaievich have a happy marriage?

Ann


Offline GDSophie

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Re: A New AU fic - title, ideas, help with accuracy?
« Reply #69 on: October 19, 2017, 11:42:20 PM »
Hm, Elizabeth of Greece and Denmark would be Elizaveta Nikolaievna rather than Ekaterina Nikolaievna.

will she and the fictitious Dimitri Nikolaievich have a happy marriage?

Ann



I mixed up Bathildis Russian Orthodox name with Elizabeth's, yes it would be Elizaveta.

Dmitri & Elizabeth-along with Olga & fictional Edward and Leopold & Anastasia-were already in love and will have happy marriages.

Alexei & Helen and Tatiana & Igor see each other more as friends, which is why Alexei and Helen only have one child and why Tatiana and Igor don't have any biological children of their own.

Maria and Louis' marriage is one sided, with Louis adoring his wife and Maria-only friendly and appreciating her husband as her cousin and friend-secretly not being happy with their marriage. The only thing they connect with is their children.

Constantine and Ileana, however, is another thing entirely. Constantine is sad that Ileana is more emotionally isolated and has trouble connecting thanks to her upbringing, while Ileana is envious of the happy childhood her husband had. Nevertheless they help with committees and attend balls, and also help raise their two daughters with a traditional Romanov upbringing.

And just for fun, their children:

Alexei & Helen:
1. Tsarevich Ivan Alexeevich
Olga & Edward:
1. Princess Anna
2. Princess Marie
3. Princess Beatrice
Maria & Louis (the children were given the title of Prince/ss with HRH titles on the behest of Nicholas):
1. Prince George Mountbatten
2. Princess Alice Mountbatten
3. Princess Elizabeth Mountbatten
4. Princess Louise Mountbatten
5. Princess Victoria Mountbatten
6. Princess Tatiana Mountbatten
7. Princess Helena Mountbatten
Leopold & Anastasia:
1. Princess Josephine Christine
2. Princess Clementine Marie
3. Prince Nicolas
4. Prince Philippe
5. Prince Alexis
6. Princess Charlotte Esmeralda
Dmitri & Elizabeth:
1. Grand Duchess Maria Dmitrievna
2. Grand Duke Nicholas Dmitrievich
3. Grand Duchess Anastasia Dmitrievna
4. Grand Duke Alexei Dmitrievich
5. Grand Duke Grigory Dmitrievich
Constantine & Ileana:
1. Grand Duchess Olga Constantinovna
2. Grand Duchess Sofia Constantinovna
« Last Edit: October 19, 2017, 11:46:10 PM by GDSophie »
'Give my love to all who remember me' - Olga Nikolaevna

Offline TimM

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Re: A New AU fic - title, ideas, help with accuracy?
« Reply #70 on: October 20, 2017, 12:23:18 AM »
Quite a good cast you've assembled here.
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Offline Kalafrana

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Re: A New AU fic - title, ideas, help with accuracy?
« Reply #71 on: October 20, 2017, 02:15:09 AM »
Some big families here - Louis and Marie with 9 children!

Ann

Offline GDSophie

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Re: A New AU fic - title, ideas, help with accuracy?
« Reply #72 on: October 20, 2017, 04:22:39 PM »
Some big families here - Louis and Marie with 9 children!

Ann

I think Marie would actually want a big family with lots of children so seven like the amount Xenia had were made just for her. Leopold and Anastasia, a Catholic royal family, would usually have lots of children but Anastasia would put a stop if it went over six, I think. Dmitri and Elizabeth have five because Alexei and Helen only have one (Nicholas wants to keep the throne away from the Vladmirovich line) and Constantine and Ileana stop after two.

Quite a good cast you've assembled here.

I believe during the book-which spans between 1909 to 1929-only Anna (1916), Marie (1918), Ivan (1919), Beatrice (1920), George (1921), Josephine-Christine (1922), Alice (1922), Maria (1923), Elizabeth (1924), Clementine-Marie (1924), Nicholas (1925), Louise (1926), Nicolas (1926), Olga (1926), Anastasia (1927), Sofia (1928), Philippe (1928), Alexei (1929) and Tatiana (1929) are born, with Tatiana's birth drawing the book to an end including the start of the Great Depression.

The only ones not born and who are mentioned in the ending chapter are Alexis (1930), Helena (1931), Grigory (1932) and Charlotte-Esmeralda (1935).

Although with small roles and cameos if you will, only Anna, Marie, Ivan, Beatrice, George, Josephine-Christine, Alice and Maria have any significant roles as by the end of the book they will be 13, 11, 10, 9, 8, 7, 7, 6, and 5 respectfully. Half of the book taking place in England-Anna, Marie, Beatrice, George and Alice-and the other half taking place in Russia after/before Ivan and Maria are born.
'Give my love to all who remember me' - Olga Nikolaevna

Offline TimM

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Re: A New AU fic - title, ideas, help with accuracy?
« Reply #73 on: October 20, 2017, 06:35:42 PM »
Sounds like you're having fun making this.
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