Author Topic: Ambassador Zahle and the "Zahle Papers"  (Read 23821 times)

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Offline Belochka

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Re: Ambassador Zahle and the "Zahle Papers"
« Reply #45 on: January 24, 2008, 05:26:22 AM »
Claims that Anderson was Grand Duchess Anastasia are highly embarrassing at best and blatantly absurd showing a distinct lack of knowledge of historical and scientific matters at worst. Give it a rest please and take up a matter which is actually connected with Russian historical fact.

Indeed Mrs Manahan was a person who never held a place in Russian history. The entire episode was created in the West.

Perhaps her appearance could be better viewed as amusing rather than embarrassing for the soviets?

Margarita


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Offline Annie

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Re: Ambassador Zahle and the "Zahle Papers"
« Reply #46 on: January 24, 2008, 12:26:35 PM »
Claims that Anderson was Grand Duchess Anastasia are highly embarrassing at best and blatantly absurd showing a distinct lack of knowledge of historical and scientific matters at worst. Give it a rest please and take up a matter which is actually connected with Russian historical fact.

Indeed Mrs Manahan was a person who never held a place in Russian history. The entire episode was created in the West.

Perhaps her appearance could be better viewed as amusing rather than embarrassing for the soviets?

Margarita




Yes, the Russians must have had quite a laugh at the gullible Western Europeans and Americans being taken in by the fraudulent Polish peasant when they knew the whole time the real Anastasia died in 1918!

Offline Puppylove

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Re: Ambassador Zahle and the "Zahle Papers"
« Reply #47 on: January 24, 2008, 12:49:06 PM »
Annie, maybe I need to step away from the boards, but in your last post you sound exactly like Dmitri!

Yes, shame on the West for the creation and perpetuation of this myth. It's just a footnote in Russian history (does it deserve a footnote?) If Lenin is the plague bacillus, then AA is like hives or hemorrhoids, an annoyance, hard to ignore while it's happening, but a relief when it's over.
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Offline Forum Admin

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Re: Ambassador Zahle and the "Zahle Papers"
« Reply #48 on: January 24, 2008, 02:04:13 PM »
Bob was told years ago when Russia was still the Soviet Union that it was well known that the Soviet government aided and abetted the Anastasia myth because it caused confusion and dissension among the emigre White Russian community.

A Russian government official told me that the KGB (whatever it was at the time) actively promoted the FS is Anastasia myth because it caused divisions in the White Russian community and confused the succession to the throne.  In the 1920's the situation of the Soviet Union was still precarious and they used any means possible to combat their enemies abroad.  They knew from the outset that FS was a fraud - obviously.  Therefore, they did not see her as a threat but an opportunity to cause trouble.  There were many Soviet agents at the time who have never been revealed, who knows what players in this story could have been working for the Bolsheviks by choice or coercion.

Offline Annie

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Re: Ambassador Zahle and the "Zahle Papers"
« Reply #49 on: January 24, 2008, 03:06:11 PM »
Bob was told years ago when Russia was still the Soviet Union that it was well known that the Soviet government aided and abetted the Anastasia myth because it caused confusion and dissension among the emigre White Russian community.

A Russian government official told me that the KGB (whatever it was at the time) actively promoted the FS is Anastasia myth because it caused divisions in the White Russian community and confused the succession to the throne.  In the 1920's the situation of the Soviet Union was still precarious and they used any means possible to combat their enemies abroad.  They knew from the outset that FS was a fraud - obviously.  Therefore, they did not see her as a threat but an opportunity to cause trouble.  There were many Soviet agents at the time who have never been revealed, who knows what players in this story could have been working for the Bolsheviks by choice or coercion.

Berenberg-Gossler, the opposing (anti-AA) attorney in the 50's AA case, said the same thing.

Offline Richard_Schweitzer

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Re: Ambassador Zahle and the "Zahle Papers"
« Reply #50 on: January 24, 2008, 04:01:24 PM »
I would like to ask the FA if he removed my last post to this thread, which replied to statements in his post #34.

Yes

No


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Re: Ambassador Zahle and the "Zahle Papers"
« Reply #51 on: January 24, 2008, 04:22:55 PM »
Yep, Da, oui, Si, ja, uh huh, yeppirs. sim, hai.

Offline Annie

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Re: Ambassador Zahle and the "Zahle Papers"
« Reply #52 on: January 24, 2008, 04:31:04 PM »
Bob was told years ago when Russia was still the Soviet Union that it was well known that the Soviet government aided and abetted the Anastasia myth because it caused confusion and dissension among the emigre White Russian community.

A Russian government official told me that the KGB (whatever it was at the time) actively promoted the FS is Anastasia myth because it caused divisions in the White Russian community and confused the succession to the throne.  In the 1920's the situation of the Soviet Union was still precarious and they used any means possible to combat their enemies abroad.  They knew from the outset that FS was a fraud - obviously.  Therefore, they did not see her as a threat but an opportunity to cause trouble.  There were many Soviet agents at the time who have never been revealed, who knows what players in this story could have been working for the Bolsheviks by choice or coercion.

Berenberg-Gossler, the opposing (anti-AA) attorney in the 50's AA case, said the same thing.

Here's what Berenberg-Gossler said:


"When the Berlin wall fell in 1989 and the east opened up the contents of certain secret archives were made known to historians all over the world," Dr. Von Berenberg-Gossler reports, "proving that Lenin had been extraordinarily interested in dividing the tsarist emigration. This is why Lenin deliberately supported "Miss Unknown" as much as he could, financially and otherwise, after she was pulled from the canal in Berlin in the early 20's. Its been found Lenin had a complete file on the Anastasia case in Moscow. I had already assumed this was the case during the course of the legal procedure I was leading in this matter. I even shared my suppositions with the court; however, I was not in a position to prove them at the time."


(I hadn't posted this before in fear AGRBear would find a way to bolster her theory of a CHEKA plant)

I wonder, if this was the case, was Lenin the person described as 'very high up' who forbid AA being charged with fraud after her ID as FS by Ernie's detective?

Judging by what Bob posted, I would say it was a sure bet the Russians knew for sure AA was a fake.

I also thought this part was interesting:


"She is the last of her kind," Dr. Von Berenberg-Gossler says, "the advent of DNA technology now makes it impossible for unscrupulous persons to make such fraudulent claims, the truth is a simple scientific procedure away. Had it been available earlier the world would never have heard of Franziska Schanzkowska, or the others who claimed to be Romanoff survivors".



source:

http://www.serfes.org/royal/rememberingAnnaAndersonii.htm
« Last Edit: January 24, 2008, 04:38:43 PM by Annie »

Offline Annie

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Re: Ambassador Zahle and the "Zahle Papers"
« Reply #53 on: January 24, 2008, 04:40:51 PM »
Annie, maybe I need to step away from the boards, but in your last post you sound exactly like Dmitri!



I'll take that as a compliment! Please don't step away, it's so good to have 'new blood' in the discussion around here. Please stay!

Offline Puppylove

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Re: Ambassador Zahle and the "Zahle Papers"
« Reply #54 on: January 24, 2008, 06:33:11 PM »
Annie, since I agree completely with both of you, of course it was a compliment! Back to the Zahle papers....

I was just about to ask for a translation of FA's post, thank God I re-read it and spared myself the embarrassment!
"The censor's sword pierces deeply into the heart of free expression." Earl Warren

"...and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free." John 8:32