Author Topic: Your Personal Opinons on Survival and Claimants  (Read 47453 times)

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rskkiya

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Re: Your Personal Opinons on Survival and Claimants
« Reply #15 on: July 29, 2005, 08:49:18 PM »
no survivors.

Offline Inquiring_Mind

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Re: Your Personal Opinons on Survival and Claimants
« Reply #16 on: July 29, 2005, 08:59:18 PM »
If I had  to pick a story....I would accept the Perm story. I am only picking a "story". But of all the nonsense of the testimonies from the killers..

My thoughts..the czar and the heir died by execution and the women were transported.

Alex didn't survive the stress..no one needed to shoot her. She lost her son and her husband.

Maybe....AN got away...I think if anything they found her and beat her to death.

The others were either killed or died from flu or pneumonia. Mistreatment or depression.

My possibly theory "IF" they didn't all die in the cellar.
I chose the road less traveled and now...where the heck am I????

Offline Margarita Markovna

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Re: Your Personal Opinons on Survival and Claimants
« Reply #17 on: July 29, 2005, 09:10:19 PM »
Keep us posted, Finelly, you seem to have a lot of interesting and valuable thoughts on the subject!

Mgmstl

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Re: Your Personal Opinons on Survival and Claimants
« Reply #18 on: July 29, 2005, 10:06:24 PM »
I believe that there is a very minimal if any chance at all that anyone survived.  Alexis's chances were less than the others because of hemophilia.

The two missing bodies are an issue, which does not make this any easier.  Those bodies are most likely Alexis & Anastasia.

So I think there is minimal if any chance of survival the only reason a daughter could have survived is the shield of jewels the daughters wore, but chances are no one survived the execution.

Offline Elisabeth

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Re: Your Personal Opinons on Survival and Claimants
« Reply #19 on: July 30, 2005, 02:10:41 AM »
No one could have survived. When the Bolsheviks couldn't shoot any more, because the room had filled up with smoke, they resorted to bayonets. When the bayonets didn't work, they resorted to rifle butts. The condition of the bones that were found in Pig's Meadow was so pitiable - the facial bones alone completely smashed - that one of the Russian forensic experts who helped exhume them said she was made physically ill by the sight. She had never before seen human remains that had sustained such extensive damage.

So I find it impossible to believe that any member of the IF could have left the Ipatiev House alive. The fact that two skeletons are missing means nothing in the larger historical sense, because history is not a court of law and the principle of "beyond reasonable doubt" doesn't apply. Historians consider all the evidence and come up with the solution they find that best fits the facts at hand. 99% of professional historians have concluded that all the Romanovs died on the night of July 16-17, 1918. Having carefully examined this case from all angles, I have to agree with them.  
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Elisabeth »
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Offline Annie

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Re: Your Personal Opinons on Survival and Claimants
« Reply #20 on: July 30, 2005, 08:19:03 AM »
As much as I would LIKE to believe someone survived, they did not.

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Re: Your Personal Opinons on Survival and Claimants
« Reply #21 on: July 30, 2005, 09:11:15 AM »
Take what Elisabeth said, and add the fact that there was only one time at all when the 2 bodies could have gone missing (see FOTR, Greg and Penny did a super job of really nailing down the timeline). It was miles out into the Siberian forest, very few people around. Alexei could never have survived even moderate injury given the BEST medical care then. Given virtually zero medical care at that place and time, zero possibliltity of survival. As for a missing Grand Duchess, clearly at least injured by stabbing, possibly a bullet, beatings for sure and trauma for being manhandled as a corpse, WHO could have provided A) decent medical care B) a secure and secret hiding place C) Food, clothing, bathing etc. D) kept TOTALLY secret from both the WHITES who came in later (and would have been THRILLED to have a GD alive) or the Bolsheviks (who would have been THRILLED to kill her and her saviors on the spot) E) During a time when everyone was denouncing their neighbors in a society where EVERYONE knew all the business of their neighbors F) nursing her back to health G) secretly getting her OUT  of Bolshevik controlled Russia H) hiding her for still more years without ANYONE hearing about her or attempting to contact her family.

Follow the logical baby-steps of any "suvivor" story. The infinitely small possiblity of each step must be multiplied by the number of steps to reach the genuine "probability" factor of being possible. You get a number so hugely small it is zero.

FA

Offline Margarita Markovna

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Re: Your Personal Opinons on Survival and Claimants
« Reply #22 on: July 30, 2005, 03:25:21 PM »
I agree with FA (and others) that no one survived. I like to look at the stories of the survivors but really I'm pretty sure that everyone died that night. I don't know who I think AA is but I know that she wasn't AN. I think she is most likely FS.

Offline Laura Mabee

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Re: Your Personal Opinons on Survival and Claimants
« Reply #23 on: July 30, 2005, 04:32:46 PM »
Nope

Offline Margarita Markovna

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Re: Your Personal Opinons on Survival and Claimants
« Reply #24 on: July 30, 2005, 06:47:05 PM »
Nope, she's not FS? This is a personal opinion thread, not a thread to discuss whether or not she was or wasn't. There are other threads for that. I had kinda hoped this thread would jsut be opinions. :)

Offline RealAnastasia

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Re: Your Personal Opinons on Survival and Claimants
« Reply #25 on: July 30, 2005, 08:24:39 PM »
You already know my personal opinion... ;) ;D I believe that someone survived there...And in opposition to Annie, I don't personnally want that anyone survived. It would have been much better that all of them died together. If I would have been one of OTMA, I would have liked to dead right there, in the Ipateiv house, along with my beloved ones. Surviving would have been unbearable for me after the murder . Besides, all pretenders life was so sad. Nothing romantic in my opinion...Quite the opposite!  :'(

Who survived? Why...you'll know. I think that Anastasia survived and maybe, Alexei, if he didn't die right after the murder. Some people believed that all wounds bring the hemophiliac persons to the death. Really not. One of the Independence Heroes from Argentina, Don Martín Miguel de Güemes was an hemophiliac (in the XVIII and early XIX Century, long before Alexei), and he was the General of Northern Troups against the Spanish royalist. He was wounded more than once, and suffered a lot. He had quite serious wounds, but only one killed him...the less serious of them. A shot in the bottom. So hemophilia is  a very difficult issue to analyze here.

Well...I think that Anastasia and Alexei must have survived. And my personal opinion about the Ipatiev House's Massacre is that we didn't know all about it. We must keep studying the "Romanov Final Chapter". I guess that perhaps in some years, we'll know a little bit about this subject.

RealAnastasia.

Finelly

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Re: Your Personal Opinons on Survival and Claimants
« Reply #26 on: July 30, 2005, 08:54:37 PM »
I think Laura's response of "nope" was to the question of whether anyone survived.

Offline Laura Mabee

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Re: Your Personal Opinons on Survival and Claimants
« Reply #27 on: July 30, 2005, 11:16:27 PM »
Quote
I think Laura's response of "nope" was to the question of whether anyone survived.

Thank you, that was my intention... No I don't believe in any survivors. Sorry for the confusion

Offline Lanie

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Re: Your Personal Opinons on Survival and Claimants
« Reply #28 on: July 31, 2005, 01:45:22 AM »
No survivors.  There is no logical reason to believe there could have been any, considering what happened.  IMO Tatiana Nikolaevna is the "missing" daughter.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Lanie »

Offline clockworkgirl21

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Re: Your Personal Opinons on Survival and Claimants
« Reply #29 on: July 31, 2005, 02:18:25 AM »
I don't believe anyone survived, either. I really wish they could have gotten away, but they did not.