Author Topic: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part II  (Read 204731 times)

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Offline Martyn

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Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part II
« Reply #30 on: August 18, 2004, 12:44:30 PM »
Queen Victoria adored Fritz and I think that he was very fond of her.
Am I right in thinking that he could be a bit of a snob, particularly about the Battenbergs?  I know that he did try to back Vicky with Moretta's desperate wish to marry Sandro, but I am sure that he wasn't keen on Beatrice marrying Liko.............( Could be wrong - usually am...)
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'The important things is not what they think of me, but what I think of them.'......QV

Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part II
« Reply #31 on: August 18, 2004, 07:00:29 PM »
Fritz could be a bit of a snob, but considering he was a Hohenzollern, he was a model of enlightenment. QV was put out by his attitude towards the Beatrice/Henry marriage--I forget her exact quote, but it was a pretty scathing smack. He did support Moretta's marriage later on to Sandro, but probably due to Vicky's influence over him.
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Offline Martyn

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Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part II
« Reply #32 on: August 19, 2004, 09:56:51 AM »
Just to go back to Fritz a moment.  Rereading  the "Louis and Victoria" ( a bit too deferential for my taste), I have just got to Louis and Victoria's betrothal and it would seem that Fritz and the rest of the Hohenzollerns were against the match due to the inequality in status.  The only people who were really in favour of it appear to have been Bertie, who loved Louis and Q.Victoria who loved Victoria and was fond of Louis.
I suppose Fritz was enlightened compared to the rest of the Junker minded Hohenzollern, but I must admit to being surprised about his attitudes towards the Battenbergs.
Vicky seems to have been just like her mother and adored a love match...................
'For a galant spirit there can never be defeat'....Wallis Windsor

'The important things is not what they think of me, but what I think of them.'......QV

Offline Karentje

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Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part II
« Reply #33 on: September 25, 2004, 03:31:42 AM »
I just read on the forum that some people believe that Vicky, Queen Victoria's eldest daughter, suffered from porphyria. I was very much surprised at this information. I admire Vicky immensely and I have read quite a lot about her, but I never came accross anything that would imply that she suffered from porphyria. Or else I don't remember, though I'm sure information like that would stick. Could anyone please tell me more about this or tell me where I could find reliable information on the subject?
I'd be ever so grateful!

Karentje

Offline Annushka

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Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part II
« Reply #34 on: September 25, 2004, 10:06:53 AM »
I saw that, too. In the reading that I have doen so far on Vicky I have not seen anything to suggest it either.  Does anyone know where this idea came from and why they feel it may be true?

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Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part II
« Reply #35 on: September 25, 2004, 12:35:51 PM »
The book Purple Secret by John Rohl is all about this subject. It goes through various illness and medical complaints (physical & mental) that Vicky, Charlotte and Feodora suffered throughout their lives--and it's quite a litany. These forms the basis of the theory of porphyria based on the symptoms, etc...They exhumed Charlotte's body but it's been awhile since I read the book so I can't remember what tests were done and the result. I'll try and find the book. Rohl and colleagues commissioned DNA analysis on Charlotte’s bones and discovered an error in her genetic code (& possibly Feodora’s) and concluded that this error could’ve possibly been related to her symptoms. I’m not a scientists so I started to get a little lost in some of the DNA discussions though. It had quite a lot of medical jargon in it. Some of the symptoms recited on behalf of all 3 women are just wince-inducing. It’s about the only thing I ever saw that made me feel sorry for Charlotte (and may in fact have contributed in part to her behavior). Feo is the saddest story though. In addition to her horrible upbringing, she suffered many physical ailments and later spent time in and out of institutions. She eventually committed suicide by placing her head in an over in 1945. She had no children so the trail basically ends there. There has also been some speculation about other descendants of QV suffering (including her son Alfred and daughters Alice & Louise and even Empress Alexandra).  It’s based on anecdotal evidence though and no physical tests have been done to back it up.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by grandduchessella »
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Offline Annushka

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Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part II
« Reply #36 on: September 25, 2004, 08:08:50 PM »
What about Vicky's son Willy?  He was definitely strange mentally.  of any of the family, I would vote for him to have Porphiria.

Holly
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Offline Karentje

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Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part II
« Reply #37 on: September 26, 2004, 04:25:38 AM »
Willy was quite a stranger character indeed  ;), I don't know if he had porphyria, but I think he's a far likelier candidate than his mother! He had his own rather strange vision of himself and the world, which resulted in a complete denial of reality - especially when reality made him look bad :P
The breakdowns Willy had also remind me of those his great-uncle, George IV, suffered from too. And there is reason enough to suppose the 'Prince of Pleasure' had porphyria.
Whether Willy had porphyria or not, he sure had issues, one has only to read some of the letters he wrote his mother during his puberty:

"I have again dreamt about you, this time I was alone with you in your library, when you stretched forth your arms & pulled me lower to your chair so that my head rested on your left arm. Then you took off your gloves...& laid your hand gently on my lips, for me to kiss it. [...]In 8 days we will come to Berlin & then what I dreamt about we will do in reality when we are alone in your rooms without any witnesses."

Willy apparently had some trouble dreaming about his mother in a solely platonic manner.

Karentje

Offline Olga

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Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part II
« Reply #38 on: September 26, 2004, 08:08:14 AM »
Quote
It goes through various illness and medical complaints (physical & mental) that Vicky, Charlotte and Feodora suffered throughout their lives--and it's quite a litany. Some of the symptoms recited on behalf of all 3 women are just wince-inducing. .


What sort of symptoms were they?

Offline Louise

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Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part II
« Reply #39 on: September 26, 2004, 08:48:55 AM »
While Willie was arrogant, willful,  and had what may be considered delusions of grandeur (probably not in the clinical sense) I don't believe that he suffered from porphyria. I can't recall a single statement or have I read anything on him that would indicate that. With the propaganda floating around during and after the war about him, I'm sure that would have been floated out if there had been any iota of truth.

Here is a quick link to a site on porphyria, so that people can get a better understanding of what the disease entailed.

http://www.porphyriafoundation.com/about_por/index.html


Louise
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Offline Annushka

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Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part II
« Reply #40 on: September 26, 2004, 09:50:07 AM »
I do think that Willy seems more likely than Vicky to have suffered from the disease.  But, his problems could also have stemmed from brain damage from his difficult birth.  

Holly
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Offline AGRBear

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Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part II
« Reply #41 on: September 26, 2004, 06:18:50 PM »
Which symtoms do you think were Empress Frederick's:
"confusion, hallucinations and / or seizures" ?

AGRBear


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Offline MarquisAnthony

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Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part II
« Reply #42 on: September 28, 2004, 09:46:22 AM »
Charlotte definitely suffered from the illness. Willy just had a bratty personality. Although I did read in Victoria's Daughters Karentje's quote and find it disturbing, I still feel as though several of his negative traits were personality defects ;)

Has their ever been any question as to whether or not QV's hibernation after Albert's death as being a form of the disease? Her intense desire to hide from the public and face2face interraction with the gov't ie - her not opening Parliment for years after his death.
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Offline Annushka

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Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part II
« Reply #43 on: September 28, 2004, 09:51:34 AM »
I can't agree with you on Willy just being bratty.  I think there was a definite mental illness there.  But, from Porphiria, brain damage, I just don't know.

You have a very good point on QV,  going into hibernation for so many years is abnormal.  Almost like agoraphobia.  Particularly the part about not wanting people to look at her.

Holly
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Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part II
« Reply #44 on: September 28, 2004, 03:50:40 PM »
Quote
Charlotte definitely suffered from the illness. Willy just had a bratty personality. Although I did read in Victoria's Daughters Karentje's quote and find it disturbing, I still feel as though several of his negative traits were personality defects ;)
It seems that Queen Victoria suffered a rather sever nervous breakdown after Prince Alberts death.  She was so shaken by this it took sometime for her to recover.  Also remember she was still suffering from her mother's death the Duchess of Kent earlier that year.  And if you read accounts of her behaviour during that time it appears she had a possible breakdown there.  So Her Majesty was an emotional mess.  No disrespect
intended.
Has their ever been any question as to whether or not QV's hibernation after Albert's death as being a form of the disease? Her intense desire to hide from the public and face2face interraction with the gov't ie - her not opening Parliment for years after his death.