Author Topic: Another ebay helmet?  (Read 6856 times)

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georgecl

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Another ebay helmet?
« on: March 24, 2005, 12:44:23 PM »

Offline Coldstream

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Re: Another ebay helmet?
« Reply #1 on: March 24, 2005, 01:16:46 PM »
I would say that it is an example of a spiked helmet worn by the Corps of Pages until the end of the monarchy.  The Model year I leave up to the other experts.  I personally feel that the style is of the Alexander II or Alexander III period.  The earlier Russian "Pickelhaubes" were rather high in the crown as were their Prussian counterparts.  The spiked helmet was discontinued for the line regiments after the Crimean War (1853-1856) although, I believe, the Guard infantry regiments continued to wear it until Alexander III issued new uniform regulations.  Most of the Russian Army adopted the French style kepi after the Crimean debacle.

Coldstream (AKA William McCaughey)

Offline Thomas B. LeMay

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Re: Another ebay helmet?
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2005, 06:00:58 PM »
I would have to disagree on this one.  In my humble opinion this is not a helmet for the Corp des Page. The crown on the chinscales and the engraving on the visor are most consistent with a helmet for a Major General period of AII.  The liner and chinscales are not correct for the piece.  I do not like the quality of casting in regard to the eagle and suspect the star has been added to enhance the item.  You would have to examine it in person as to the quality of the workmanship which for an officer of this rank should be of the highest quality.

With respect,

Brad LeMay
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by atlantis »
Thomas B. LeMay
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Offline Michael_Doubrovin

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Re: Another ebay helmet?
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2005, 06:33:26 PM »
Well made item! I'm really impressed with the constantly growing quality of copies from St. Petersburg. Even hundred years after the Imperial time we have skillfull craftsmen. A serious reason to be proud!  ;D  ;D  ;D

Offline Thomas B. LeMay

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Re: Another ebay helmet?
« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2005, 06:49:34 PM »
Good Evening Misha,

Glad to see your input.  Sent you an email earlier which perhaps you have already recieved.  How is the research on the Guard Lancers coming.

With my warmest regards,

Your friend,

Brad
Thomas B. LeMay
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georgecl

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Re: Another ebay helmet?
« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2005, 08:17:31 PM »
Thanks to all..Sure a nice looking piece I Knew it would be "too good to be true"..
Yes they are doing a much better job at fabricating stuff nowadays.

Oh well ill keep looking..

thanks
George

Offline Thomas B. LeMay

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Re: Another ebay helmet?
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2005, 09:46:51 PM »
I was attempting to be diplomatic with my original post.  The bottom line is that I would not consider it for my collection nor would Misha.  I can send you an email photograph of an original if you are interested.  Not sure how to attach it to the post itself.

Brad
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Offline Vladik

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Re: Another ebay helmet?
« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2005, 10:56:16 AM »
Dear, Mr. LeMay:

If it's possible can I have the picture of the helmet too.  :o

Vlad.podgorny@verizon.net

Thanks in advance,

Vlad.

georgecl

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Re: Another ebay helmet?
« Reply #8 on: March 25, 2005, 10:59:24 AM »
Hi Brad,  

That would be Great..
I'm tring to find a good example of a Imp Russian leather Helmet any period.  But Just junk on ebay, and I dont Know enough about them at this point to jump in. :-[

My email fast connection is georgel@healdsburgprinting.com

Thanks again
George

Offline Vladik

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Re: Another ebay helmet?
« Reply #9 on: March 25, 2005, 11:07:25 AM »
To George: reading these posts and from my own experience, 90% of the Russian Imperial orders/medal/badges on Ebay are fakes and most certainly 99% of anything that deals with uniforms are certainly fakes, so be careful. >:( >:(

P.S. Just to prove a point here's a guy with "iffy" >:(stuff, I'm sure Mr. LeMay and Mr. Doubrovin will find this shako an obvious fake
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6521270093&ssPageName=MERC_VI_RSCC_Pr4_PcY_BID_Stores
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Vlad143 »

Offline Mr._Panaev

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Re: Another ebay helmet?
« Reply #10 on: March 25, 2005, 03:59:06 PM »
Cheers to all!!!

This is my shako and despite of what some say -- I provide 1000% authenticity guarantee and will refund your money in full should an independent expertise (Sotheby's, Christie's, Batterfield, Gelos, etc) prove otherwise. Please check my feedback on 1600 transactions on eBay as assurance.  

http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback&userid=mr.panaev&ssPageName=STRK:ME:UFS

With all my respect, Now I would like to know what qualifies poster "Vladik" as an expert in identifyling Russian Imperial Uniforms? Talk is cheap, I can provide at reference from at least a dozen of sattisfied collectors who purchsed genuine Imperial items from me.

I assume you would say this hat is fake too ??? ?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=2287000236

If you care to look, you will find associated positive feedback on eBay for this transaction.

By the way, I am helping to sell a small collection of Russian Headgear (Yes, all 1000% genuine and guaranteed as such). I will gladly e-mail you or post here images. Sincerely, Dmitry (My real name)  ;)

Offline Mr._Panaev

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Corps De Pages helmet
« Reply #11 on: March 25, 2005, 04:25:34 PM »
As of Corps De Pages helmet. Here is a link to a photo showing the real thing:


http://www.level60.com/ebay/ammo/corpes_de_pages_ref.jpg

This is a photo of Guards General's Helmet (note no St. Andrew Star -- it was only implemented in 1909):

http://www.level60.com/ebay/ammo/guards_general_ref.jpg

The photo is from a brand new book: "Five Centuries of Russian Military Uniform."

I have this book available for sale and highly recommend it:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6521473391

Dmitry
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Mr._Panaev »

Offline Thomas B. LeMay

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Re: Another ebay helmet?
« Reply #12 on: March 25, 2005, 07:50:41 PM »
Dear Sirs (including Mr. Paneav),

I really have no personal motives in the discussion but will add the following comments.  First of all, the helmet in question has absolutely nothing to do with the Corp des Page and reference to this is irrelevant.  The comment about the Generals helmet only having a Guard star added in 1909 is incorrect.  First of all, this model helmet was not used at all during the reign of AIII or NII and as to the Guard star, these were used well before the date quoted.  The seller may well believe that this piece is completely genuine but in my opinion it certainly has a number of inconsistencies.  Please see my prior notes for specifics.  The Pavlovski piece looks OK with the exception of the star which is clearly not period to the helmet.  The remainder of the piece presents no problems at least from picture but must be examined in person.

I have been collecting Imperial militaria for a very long time and know most of the other knowledgeable collectors.  Gerard Gorokhoff in Paris is a very close friend and we visit each other frequently.  The last time I was in France, he actually had a catalog from a business in Moscow who were producing high quality copies of Imperial pieces.  Collectors who are not knowledgeable must be very careful and also note that the auction houses really have little expertise in this area.

With that being said, I must state that I have looked at a number of the items Mr. Paneav has had for sale in the past.  Some have been absolutely fine and not everything is necessarily problematic.  All dealers will occasionally have questionable pieces but keep in mind that they may not be knowingly trying to deceive the buyer.  They are often advised by their own sellers and simply market the items as part of their business.

I hope that these comments are taken constructively,

With my regards,

Brad LeMay
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by atlantis »
Thomas B. LeMay
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Offline Michael_Doubrovin

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Re: Another ebay helmet?
« Reply #13 on: March 25, 2005, 10:26:22 PM »
My dear Dmytry, please, tell me more about 1000% authentity of your St. Petersburg lancers tschapka.

Offline Robert_Hall

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Re: Another ebay helmet?
« Reply #14 on: March 25, 2005, 11:14:26 PM »
Personally, I am happy to buy good quality reproductions, as long as that is what I am paying for. So  such a provider would be welcome to me.

However, where does one find a good reference or source for palace livery ? Not necessarily military related.
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