Author Topic: Prince Tomislav of Yugoslavia  (Read 26296 times)

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Offline pablo

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Re: Prince Tomislav of Yugoslavia
« Reply #15 on: April 19, 2005, 04:32:22 PM »


 Spanish,"La familia de la reina Sofia" or in English "Queen Sofia's Family"

 Regards

Offline Alex_for_King

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Re: Prince Tomislav of Yugoslavia
« Reply #16 on: May 26, 2005, 07:03:44 AM »
Quote from: pablo   Sorry by the especulation,but,she was lesbian according to the book by Ricardo Mateos Sainz de Medrano.
[/quote


Hey Pablo, you are going around all Royal Forums and telling everyone that Mignon was a lesbian.

First, nobody has ever heard that before and then this guy comes and publishes it in a book and now it's supposed to be true?? And you post that "truth" on all Royal Forums.

Mignon gave 3 wonderful sons to Alexander. No way was she a lesbian. Iam deeply, deeply insulted that you say that about MY Queen, the Queen that did so much for her people. If you were here I'd punch you in the face!

I guess someone wants to put a bad name to a wonderful woman. A woman that has given all of her being to helping her people - the children, the orphans of war, the invalids, the pensioners, the homeless, the poor etc. Queen Marie of Yugoslavia was a wonderful woman, noble at heart and loved by the people.

There is NO WAY that she was a lesbian. Back in those days it was unthinkable. How on Earth would she allow to give 3 children to Alexander... there is no proof that she was a lesbian, no proof that she had any affairs with women... and now this guy publishes it out of the blue.

Please quote exactly what the author said.

I am deeply angered and insulted.  >:( >:( >:(

For me, Queen Marie will always be special...

Tomislav is the legitimate son of King Alexander and Queen Marie, and Queen Marie was NOT a lesbian.

Stop spreading those lies on Royal forums.

Offline Alex_for_King

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Re: Prince Tomislav of Yugoslavia
« Reply #17 on: May 26, 2005, 07:24:30 AM »
Pablo,

You have gone out of line. I am sick of what you are doing on many Royalty forums. I demand an apology from you. Either you apologize for insulting the feelings of many Serbs whom adore and respect Queen Marie, or you quote exactly what the so-called author said in his so-called book.

Here is why Queen Marie was NOT a lesbian:

1. Marie was a religious, God fearing person.

2. Back in those days, gays and lesbians did not parade about in the streets. Those that were gay or lesbian had to keep it to themselves for as long as they lived. Hardly anyone would admit that or even say it, not even to the closest of family. These gay or lesbian thoughts were private, so how would anyone know what someone thinks in his or her head?

3. History has written that Marie gave 3 beautiful boys to Alexander. A lesbian would probably not have children or would have 1, just to give the male heir to the throne and fullfill her main duty as Queen.

4. In the thousands of history books worldwide, nobody has ever come across this "news". I think this is all baloney, in order to discredit the Karadjordjevic royal family and perhaps even to gain publicity of that book and increase its sales.

So far, my arguments indicate that Marie was NOT a lesbian and so, please stop insulting MY Queen, the Queen that I love and adore and who will be enshrined in the memory of the Serbian people as one of the greatest humanitarian workers in its history.

Not even the communists made such monstrous lies. Believe me, the communists have used all sorts of lies about our Royal Family, for 60 years, but you, Pablo, you are the WORST.

If you were here you would NOT be talking about my Queen and insulting my people and my country's history like that. I am tryly angry right now!  >:( >:( >:(

Offline Marc

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Re: Prince Tomislav of Yugoslavia
« Reply #18 on: May 26, 2005, 07:34:14 AM »
Please Alex,calm down!We both know this was not true...I mean that she was lesbian!Don't know about Pablo's other activities,I mean on other boards,but in this case,he said ''acording to a book'' witch means he read something!I posted several times something witch I read in some book,but in the end some things were not true,so,of course,a book in not a reliable source these days...Please,don't get insulted,just put your own reasons for opposite opinion!Thanks

Offline LisaDavidson

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Re: Prince Tomislav of Yugoslavia
« Reply #19 on: May 26, 2005, 02:00:31 PM »
I know that for some, including our Alex For King, to say that Queen Marie of Yugoslavia was a lesbian would make her a "bad woman". Not everyone shares this opinion, and possibly Pablo is one of these people - as am I. So, Alex, please understand that it is possible no insult was intended towards your queen.

Also understand that, for centuries, gay and lesbian royals were to one degree or another forced to live personal lives that were not in accordance with their preferences. Many of these people sired or gave birth to children out of a sense of duty - and in some cases out of a desire to have children - while remaining gay or lesbian in their hearts. This, in my opinion, would have been an act of personal heroism on their parts.

That said, I don't know of any conclusive evidence that Mignon was lesbian. It has been published in books that she was, but I say the jury is still out at the moment.

Offline Alex_for_King

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Re: Prince Tomislav of Yugoslavia
« Reply #20 on: May 27, 2005, 01:20:16 AM »
[quote author=Marc
Please Alex,calm down!We both know this was not true...I mean that she was lesbian!Don't know about Pablo's other activities,I mean on other boards,but in this case,he said ''acording to a book'' witch means he read something!I posted several times something witch I read in some book,but in the end some things were not true,so,of course,a book in not a reliable source these days...Please,don't get insulted,just put your own reasons for opposite opinion!Thanks[/quote]


Sorry. I got a bit carried away with my emotions. On other Boards, Pablo would drop in a conversation about Queen Marie and say something like - "excuse me for dropping in, but Queen Marie was a lesbian according to a book..." and then everyone starts talking about that, instead of the real issue - what Queen Marie had done for her people and how the people loved her.

And when I saw that happen here again, I simply got infuriated.

Once again I apologize to all of you good folks for my outburst. Please forgive me.

Offline Alex_for_King

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Re: Prince Tomislav of Yugoslavia
« Reply #21 on: May 27, 2005, 01:32:53 AM »
[quote author=LisaDavidson I know that for some, including our Alex For King, to say that Queen Marie of Yugoslavia was a lesbian would make her a "bad woman". Not everyone shares this opinion, and possibly Pablo is one of these people - as am I. So, Alex, please understand that it is possible no insult was intended towards your queen.
quote]

Dear Lisa,

I know there is that whole liberal concept in the West, but here in Serbia we are still not ready to accept that concept. We are a patriarchal society, not as much as before, of course, but we still are, and our Church has very strong issues regarding homosexuality.

Just when the people of Serbia are rediscovering their Royals, their history, in a positive light, after 60 years of communism, things like - "oh, you know, your most beloved Queen of the modern era was a lesbian" would totally turn off any desire to re-establish the Monarchy. Particularly since there is NO PROOF that Queen Marie was a lesbian, but the damage is done just by saying it.

I have nothing against homosexuals, I have seen them hold hands in the streets (in Canada), well, the world seems to be going that way, they seem to be getting more attention in the media, in politics etc, but here in Serbia we are still not ready for that kind of stuff, being appraised in public, although we have homosexuals, of course.

We come from different societies and backgrounds. Ours is a bit more Christian while the West seems to have lost its Christianity. I do not wish to get into a religious, moral or political debate... everyone should live a life they see fit, but I am just saying, we come from different countries, different backgrounds, religions, etc.

What irritates me is when people say things that they have no proof of. I can say I had lunch with a Martian, I can have someone print it, but that does not mean it's true.

Cheers.

Offline TampaBay

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Re: Prince Tomislav of Yugoslavia
« Reply #22 on: May 27, 2005, 08:44:10 AM »
Quote


That said, I don't know of any conclusive evidence that Mignon was lesbian. It has been published in books that she was, but I say the jury is still out at the moment.


Lisa,

If we are extending "courtesy" to Prince Charles of Wales then the same "courtsey" must be extended to Queen Marie of Yugoslavia.  Unlike Prince Charles Mignon is no longer with us and therefore cannot defend herself.  Mignon's alledged sex life had no dynastic implications and therefore does not belong on this forum.

If we must discuss someones sex life that has no Dynastic implications then please tell all AP Forum members they have permission to discuss my sex life down to the last worthless and minute detail.

TampaBay


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Offline LisaDavidson

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Re: Prince Tomislav of Yugoslavia
« Reply #23 on: May 28, 2005, 01:36:00 AM »
Quote

Lisa,

If we are extending "courtesy" to Prince Charles of Wales then the same "courtsey" must be extended to Queen Marie of Yugoslavia.  Unlike Prince Charles Mignon is no longer with us and therefore cannot defend herself.  Mignon's alledged sex life had no dynastic implications and therefore does not belong on this forum.

If we must discuss someones sex life that has no Dynastic implications then please tell all AP Forum members they have permission to discuss my sex life down to the last worthless and minute detail.

TampaBay




TB: As moderator of this part of the Forum, I am not going to exclude discussion of any Balkan royal's sexuality. The Prince of Wales' sexuality has no place on the Balkan Royals' area of the Forum except very peripherally, and actually, with tongue in my cheek, neither does yours, no matter how interesting it may be.

Historians usually have to deal with analyzing people's behaviors who are no longer with us. I try to be fair when writing about the "dearly departed" but not everyone is so constrained.

As to the whole "Mignon was gay" issue, my overall direction to the Forum is - lighten up. No one can prove this, the lady is dead, so it's just speculation. But, people saying she might have played for a certain team might not be intending to insult her or her memory.

Offline TampaBay

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Re: Prince Tomislav of Yugoslavia
« Reply #24 on: May 28, 2005, 07:53:08 AM »
Quote

TB: As moderator of this part of the Forum, I am not going to exclude discussion of any Balkan royal's sexuality. The Prince of Wales' sexuality has no place on the Balkan Royals' area of the Forum except very peripherally, and actually, with tongue in my cheek, neither does yours, no matter how interesting it may be.

Historians usually have to deal with analyzing people's behaviors who are no longer with us. I try to be fair when writing about the "dearly departed" but not everyone is so constrained.

As to the whole "Mignon was gay" issue, my overall direction to the Forum is - lighten up. No one can prove this, the lady is dead, so it's just speculation. But, people saying she might have played for a certain team might not be intending to insult her or her memory.


Lisa,

You are correct!  However, you and I are are from stable countries.  It is easy to forget (when you live in the UK & USA) that other members of this forum are still building and re-building their countries and see their former monarch's as one of many keys to construction of democracy.

I personally make every effort to refrain from publicly discussing any Royal "Fairy Tales" because it does not effect a person's ability to lead, reign or rule.

I am sorry and apologize herewith if I in any way presented the idea that I was in any way requesting censorship or curtailment of free speech.  

TampaBay



« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by TampaBay »
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Offline L.

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Re: Prince Tomislav of Yugoslavia
« Reply #25 on: July 30, 2005, 02:49:31 PM »
  Alex for King, Tampa Bay, you are complite right! Mignon was NOT lesbian! That is nonsense!

Offline Marlene

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Re: Prince Tomislav of Yugoslavia
« Reply #26 on: July 30, 2005, 04:40:25 PM »
Alex,  

That Mignon was probably bi-sexual is not news, nor it is shocking.  A percentage of the population is gay.  It's genetic.  The late Prince Paul was certainly gay.  

Being gay or Lesbian does not diminish who a person is, nor does it diminish Mignon's devotion to Serbia.  (but she was not a good mother, and, sadly, did not know how to relate to her children, especially after exile.  She was largely estranged from Peter, for example.  In her later years, in England, Mignon, always a bit eccentric, was far more mannish in appearance and dress, and she shared her small home with another woman.  

But it doesn't change who she was.   Not at all.  
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Offline Marlene

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Re: Prince Tomislav of Yugoslavia
« Reply #27 on: July 30, 2005, 04:41:45 PM »
Quote
Princess Margarethe von Baden with her daghter Princess Katharina of Yugoslavia,who later married Dezmond de Silva,who is a solisitor of Queen Elisabeth II...




Desmond de Silva is NOT THE QUEEN'S SOLICITOR.  For one thing, he is a barrister, and he is QC - Queen's counsel, but this does not mean he is the queen's lawyer. which I explained before.
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Offline TampaBay

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Re: Prince Tomislav of Yugoslavia
« Reply #28 on: August 01, 2005, 07:14:48 PM »
Quote
Alex,  

That Mignon was probably bi-sexual is not news, nor it is shocking.  A percentage of the population is gay.  It's genetic.  The late Prince Paul was certainly gay.  

Being gay or Lesbian does not diminish who a person is, nor does it diminish Mignon's devotion to Serbia.  (but she was not a good mother, and, sadly, did not know how to relate to her children, especially after exile.  She was largely estranged from Peter, for example.  In her later years, in England, Mignon, always a bit eccentric, was far more mannish in appearance and dress, and she shared her small home with another woman.  

But it doesn't change who she was.   Not at all.  


Marlene,

Which "late Prince Paul" are you referring to?

TampaBay
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Offline Marlene

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Re: Prince Tomislav of Yugoslavia
« Reply #29 on: August 01, 2005, 09:54:44 PM »
Quote

Marlene,

Which "late Prince Paul" are you referring to?

TampaBay


Prince Paul of Yugoslavia, married to Princess Olga of Greece, and one of three regents for King Peter.  He was bi-sexual as was his brother in law, the duke of Kent.
Author of Queen Victoria's Descendants,
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