Author Topic: Princess Tatiana Yusupova, younger sister of Zenaida Yusupova  (Read 83585 times)

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Offline Annie

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Re: Princess Tatiana Yusupova, younger sister of Zenaida Yusupova
« Reply #45 on: October 16, 2007, 11:20:22 AM »
Mandie and Ex-Princess- of course it's right she had four kids in five years, that's what we're saying happend. The 'big deal' is that Ferrand's book states she had three dead sons before Nicholas was born and that was impossible, unless Zenaida was an unwed teen mother! This is why we were discussing it, and using Felix's quote to back up what really happened. Look back on the last page and you'll see how it started.

I think what happened is that when Felix said his mother had 3 sons before him, two of whom died in infancy, the writer of the book somehow misconstrued that to mean she had 3 dead sons before Nicholas, which was incorrect.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2007, 11:22:34 AM by Annie »

Offline ashanti01

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Re: Princess Tatiana Yusupova, younger sister of Zenaida Yusupova
« Reply #46 on: October 16, 2007, 11:48:46 AM »
You have to wonder how sad of time it must been for Zenaida during the late 1880's. She loses two baby sons's then finally has Felix who lives, but then loses her only sister, Tatiana.  :(   

Offline Annie

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Re: Princess Tatiana Yusupova, younger sister of Zenaida Yusupova
« Reply #47 on: October 16, 2007, 12:15:07 PM »
Yes, so sad, and those were supposed to be her prime years for going to balls and having fun. Maybe that's why she didn't have any more kids after Felix, she was tired of being pregnant and thought they might die anyway.

Offline ashanti01

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Re: Princess Tatiana Yusupova, younger sister of Zenaida Yusupova
« Reply #48 on: October 16, 2007, 12:27:27 PM »
That could be it, but I do remember reading somewhere among these threads that there were some health issues involved. Either way, it seemed that Zenaida must have know she wouldn't be having any more children past Felix, given how disappointed she was at the fact that he wasn't a boy. Yet, in the long run she was devoted to her two boys just as they were devoted to her. Hence the reason the death of Nicholas was so devestating to her.

Offline Annie

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Re: Princess Tatiana Yusupova, younger sister of Zenaida Yusupova
« Reply #49 on: October 16, 2007, 01:11:23 PM »
Felix also mentioned that after the birth of one of the babies who died, she nearly died, and was almost dead when Father John Kronstadt came and healed her. For whatever reason, she knew Felix was the last baby. When I first read that, I thought it was because she was old. But finding out she was only 25 at his birth, I wondered why she didn't try at some time for another child.

It's a 'bad' thing to bring up, I know, but I have heard that in the old days in some aristocratic families, even in the US, the couple would be sexually active only long enough produce the needed heirs, then the woman would retire to a private bed and leave the husband to his mistresses. Of course this was not true in every case, it certainly wasn't for N and A, but this does seem like one situation it might have had something to do with it.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2007, 01:14:23 PM by Annie »

Offline ashanti01

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Re: Princess Tatiana Yusupova, younger sister of Zenaida Yusupova
« Reply #50 on: October 16, 2007, 01:43:41 PM »
Ok...I hope I don't get in trouble for going off topic but here it goes.

Zenaida and Felix did have two seperate bedrooms and granted that Felix did have a staircase that lead to her bedroom, but who knows how often he used it. Also, one must also remember that some time ago Greg King posted that there had been some information that stated that Felix Sr had a male lover. Okay, this could be just rumor, but you most also think that perhaps he did have a lover on the side to turn to when he realized he couldn't turn to Zenaida, since she couldn't risk having children. Then again perhaps they had birth control of some sort, but then this is all specalution which leads me back to only known fact here, Zenaida knew there would be no more babies after Felix.

They did have a relationship which although odd to some, seemed to work for them. By all accounts they were devoted to each other, and Zenaida did chose him over all other suitors, and believe she had more than enough suitors to chose from. Although Felix wrote that his mother would perhaps have been happier with a different sort of man, I don't think she was miserable in the marriage, but perhaps not as fulfilled due to their different personalities.

Here's another thing. Zenaida may have known that Felix would be her last child, but she must have also feared attempting for another one because not only was her life on the life, but the added anxiety that even if she and the infant lived, that the 'Yussupov' curse may take her child away later on. This seemed to be a fear she appeared to have for both her surviving sons, therefore had she had more children, more than likely she would have been suffering over the possible fate of each child. Sad situation all around, and in end she only ended up with one son living past 26.

Offline loulia

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Re: Princess Tatiana Yusupova, younger sister of Zenaida Yusupova
« Reply #51 on: October 16, 2007, 02:38:24 PM »
I'm sorry, I follow you a bit out of topic but your post make me thin: birth control exist at this time? I can hardly imagine so except the method which consist in counting the day between periods. It's not a safe method at all. Does anyone know more about it?
we live in a beautiful world, let's protect it

Offline Annie

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Re: Princess Tatiana Yusupova, younger sister of Zenaida Yusupova
« Reply #52 on: October 16, 2007, 03:15:11 PM »
the method which consist in counting the day between periods. It's not a safe method at all.

Worked fine for me!  ;) :-[

Quote
(by ashanti)the added anxiety that even if she and the infant lived, that the 'Yussupov' curse may take her child away later on.

That is a good idea. Maybe she thought the babies had died because of it, and worried any other children might. Then she had to wait and hope it wouldn't take one of her sons, which of course it did, at least by her beliefs. I also think this could be why Felix, Bebe, and Xenia Sfris only had one child each. Tatiana, the latest in line, now has two, hopefully the curse is gone and both will have long happy healthy lives. I think so!

Offline loulia

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Re: Princess Tatiana Yusupova, younger sister of Zenaida Yusupova
« Reply #53 on: October 16, 2007, 03:43:01 PM »
didn't work at all for me! :-[
we live in a beautiful world, let's protect it

Offline ashanti01

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Re: Princess Tatiana Yusupova, younger sister of Zenaida Yusupova
« Reply #54 on: October 16, 2007, 10:11:34 PM »
the method which consist in counting the day between periods. It's not a safe method at all.

Worked fine for me!  ;) :-[

Quote
(by ashanti)the added anxiety that even if she and the infant lived, that the 'Yussupov' curse may take her child away later on.

That is a good idea. Maybe she thought the babies had died because of it, and worried any other children might. Then she had to wait and hope it wouldn't take one of her sons, which of course it did, at least by her beliefs. I also think this could be why Felix, Bebe, and Xenia Sfris only had one child each. Tatiana, the latest in line, now has two, hopefully the curse is gone and both will have long happy healthy lives. I think so!

The saddest thing was it was really getting close to the Yussupov line dying out. While officially the family name died out with Felix, in truth it died with Zenaida who was the last of her line.

Here's a thought...or question rather..

If Tatiana Youssupov had lived long enough to marry and have children, would they have inherited the Yussupov name also?? Or would Nicholas, her father, have only requested the special permission for Zenaida since she was the oldest? Remember he submitted a petition due to the fact he was the last Yussupov, however the request was still pending at the time of his death, so he must have submitted it after Tatiana died, realizing that his only hope for the name to continue would be through his grandsons. Was it possible for both daughters to pass the Yussupov name to their offspring?

Offline Mandie, the Gothic Empress

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Re: Princess Tatiana Yusupova, younger sister of Zenaida Yusupova
« Reply #55 on: October 17, 2007, 07:09:31 AM »
Mandie and Ex-Princess- of course it's right she had four kids in five years, that's what we're saying happend. The 'big deal' is that Ferrand's book states she had three dead sons before Nicholas was born and that was impossible, unless Zenaida was an unwed teen mother! This is why we were discussing it, and using Felix's quote to back up what really happened. Look back on the last page and you'll see how it started.

I think what happened is that when Felix said his mother had 3 sons before him, two of whom died in infancy, the writer of the book somehow misconstrued that to mean she had 3 dead sons before Nicholas, which was incorrect.

I see, thanks. :)

Offline Nadya_Arapov

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Re: Princess Tatiana Yusupova, younger sister of Zenaida Yusupova
« Reply #56 on: May 25, 2008, 07:55:41 PM »
I'm sorry, I follow you a bit out of topic but your post make me thin: birth control exist at this time? I can hardly imagine so except the method which consist in counting the day between periods. It's not a safe method at all. Does anyone know more about it?

Yes, birth control did exist at the time. Obviously, the choices weren't as many and varied as they are now, but it did exist. Condoms were available in the late 19th century Europe and so were cervical caps.

Offline Paola

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Re: Princess Tatiana Yusupova, younger sister of Zenaida Yusupova
« Reply #57 on: March 24, 2009, 03:30:57 AM »
Princess Tatiana Nikolayevna Youssoupoff 1866-1888 is buried at Archangelskoye

Is she buried in the the Yussupov vault there? And is it open to public?

Offline ashanti01

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Re: Princess Tatiana Yusupova, younger sister of Zenaida Yusupova
« Reply #58 on: March 24, 2009, 10:33:25 AM »
Princess Tatiana Nikolayevna Youssoupoff 1866-1888 is buried at Archangelskoye

Is she buried in the the Yussupov vault there? And is it open to public?

Tatiana's grave is open to the public. A picture of her grave was posted somewhere on the thread some time ago...I'll try to find it .


Offline Paola

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Re: Princess Tatiana Yusupova, younger sister of Zenaida Yusupova
« Reply #59 on: March 24, 2009, 10:38:46 AM »
Thanks ashanti01. I would appreciate and  I would like to see the picture. Iam very interested in Tatiana and her short life and somehow mysterious death.