Author Topic: The children of Maria II of Portugal  (Read 46485 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline DonaAntonia

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 139
    • View Profile
Re: The children of Maria II of Portugal
« Reply #75 on: April 19, 2009, 06:36:47 PM »
19 Century print with Portugal's Kings and rulling Queens. The last pictured are Maria Anna's mother Queen Maria II, her husband King consort Fernando and Maria Anna's 2 brothers: Kings Pedro V and Luis.



«I am sometimes afraid of being so attached to my Country.
Only now, after leaving, do I realize how much I love the Portuguese.»
 
Princess Antonia (letter to her brother, King Luiz, 1887)

Offline DonaAntonia

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 139
    • View Profile
Re: The children of Maria II of Portugal
« Reply #76 on: April 22, 2009, 08:22:04 PM »
Maria Ana on a 1859 Portuguese print.



«I am sometimes afraid of being so attached to my Country.
Only now, after leaving, do I realize how much I love the Portuguese.»
 
Princess Antonia (letter to her brother, King Luiz, 1887)

Offline Jose II

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 124
    • View Profile
Re: The children of Maria II of Portugal
« Reply #77 on: April 23, 2009, 12:40:13 PM »
It is true. The death of Prince Albert of Saxony is just one of the many skeletons the Miguelist subbranch of the Braganzas has in the closet. It never was sorted out, but it implied that the eldest son of the second Miguel was substituted by his younger brother Duarte, who was upgraded to «heir». He later married an American lady.


DonaAntonia, may I ask you if you have some more pictures of Maria Anna's sons Maximilian and Albert? They are absolutely rare.

Poor Albert fell off his horse while he had been on a maneuver in Wolkau, Saxony. He was severely wounded and died, before his father Georg arrived. He was 25 years old.



Is it sure he died in a  military maneuver?  Wikipedia (ok, not always the best source) says he died  of injuries sustained in a carriage crash caused by Prince Miguel of Braganza. Which is the truth?

There we go again.

As Marie-Charlotte states, Pr. Albert died from a horse fall while in military manoeuvres.

But you seem to prefer the Wikipedia article where, after spilling the poison, it even states that the causes were never cleared out and the Prince was never taken to any court .

It is not true that the Prince had to resign his military ranks or posts.
Remember that when WW1 broke, he was an officer of the austrian army , something IIRC you blamed him for...

And that episode with Pr.Albert did not make him resign in favour of D.Duarte Nuno who was born 7 years after Albert's death...
If he was to resign for that, he could have resigned in favour of Infante D.Francisco José.

Offline DonaAntonia

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 139
    • View Profile
Re: The children of Maria II of Portugal
« Reply #78 on: April 24, 2009, 03:47:47 PM »
It is true. The death of Prince Albert of Saxony is just one of the many skeletons the Miguelist subbranch of the Braganzas has in the closet. It never was sorted out, but it implied that the eldest son of the second Miguel was substituted by his younger brother Duarte, who was upgraded to «heir». He later married an American lady.


DonaAntonia, may I ask you if you have some more pictures of Maria Anna's sons Maximilian and Albert? They are absolutely rare.

Poor Albert fell off his horse while he had been on a maneuver in Wolkau, Saxony. He was severely wounded and died, before his father Georg arrived. He was 25 years old.



Is it sure he died in a  military maneuver?  Wikipedia (ok, not always the best source) says he died  of injuries sustained in a carriage crash caused by Prince Miguel of Braganza. Which is the truth?

There we go again.

As Marie-Charlotte states, Pr. Albert died from a horse fall while in military manoeuvres.

But you seem to prefer the Wikipedia article where, after spilling the poison, it even states that the causes were never cleared out and the Prince was never taken to any court .

It is not true that the Prince had to resign his military ranks or posts.
Remember that when WW1 broke, he was an officer of the austrian army , something IIRC you blamed him for...

And that episode with Pr.Albert did not make him resign in favour of D.Duarte Nuno who was born 7 years after Albert's death...
If he was to resign for that, he could have resigned in favour of Infante D.Francisco José.

But no, José! Francisco (Franz) was a homossexual (a scandal by the day's standards) and also sexually promiscuous. Read the British press of the period, as not all the titles answered generously to the family's request to have the matter «erased».
Franz was caught «in the very act of sodomy» during King Edward VII's coronation!


«I am sometimes afraid of being so attached to my Country.
Only now, after leaving, do I realize how much I love the Portuguese.»
 
Princess Antonia (letter to her brother, King Luiz, 1887)

Offline Jose II

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 124
    • View Profile
Re: The children of Maria II of Portugal
« Reply #79 on: April 25, 2009, 01:36:44 PM »
First of all:

You've said that D.Miguel had to renounce in favour of D.Duarte Nuno because of the Saxony incident.
Which was never prooved as Wikipedia recognizes.
The Saxony incident happened in 1900, and D.Duarte Nuno was born in 1907.

As to D.Francisco, all I read about his eventual homossexuality was in Wikipedia.
Which press mentioned the incident ? Why on earth would he be in London for Edward VII's coronation as the obvious invited would be his Bragança-Saxe-Coburg cousins ?
If he really was homossexual, despite the scandal that fact ment in the early 20th century, that was not cause for his being outranked from the succession line.  -  Read the commentaries from the Legitimists about him, further down.
Many kings and princes were homossexual: Ludwig II of Bavaria comes to mind. As well as Ferdinand of Bulgaria.
Kaiser Willelm II was very near those "circles", The duke of Clarence, and so many other minor royals.
At the time there was not such gutter-press as today where a homossexual king or crown prince would be crucified despite that comes into the "political incorrectness".

From Malcolm Howe "The Braganza Story"
" Prince Francisco José fought with the Austrian troops and died in 1919 from pneumonia (I guess that soon enough Wikipedia will say it was from AIDS) on the isle of Ischia, near Naples, whilst still a prisonner of war, captured by the Italians"

(Wonder if the Duke of Porto, living also in Naples, ever met his prisonner cousin)

"He, of all the descendants of D.Miguel I, most resembled his grand-father, the King, in his physicall appearance and had also inherited the musical talents of the Braganzas.
His mother had died when he was two years old, and he was brought up by his aunt Infanta D. Maria Anna, before his father married again.
When in 1893 she married the Hereditary Grand-Duke of Luxembourg, Francisco José, at the age of 13, composed the nuptial march for the wedding.
The family always called by the portuguese diminutive of his name "Chico".
He was the joy of their home and became an indefatigable traveller.
His communicative kindness and effusive happiness made the Legitimists regard him as the most esteemed of their Princes, with all the qualities and defects of the Portuguese race.
He supposrted his brother at his wedding in 1909 and they were together in Galizia offering their swords to Paiva Couceiro to fight in both the 1911 and 1912 incursions."

D.Franscisco was also a bullfights aficionado and he was himself a bullfighter.

Offline DonaAntonia

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 139
    • View Profile
Re: The children of Maria II of Portugal
« Reply #80 on: April 25, 2009, 09:29:27 PM »
First of all:

You've said that D.Miguel had to renounce in favour of D.Duarte Nuno because of the Saxony incident.
Which was never prooved as Wikipedia recognizes.
The Saxony incident happened in 1900, and D.Duarte Nuno was born in 1907.

As to D.Francisco, all I read about his eventual homossexuality was in Wikipedia.
Which press mentioned the incident ? Why on earth would he be in London for Edward VII's coronation as the obvious invited would be his Bragança-Saxe-Coburg cousins ?
If he really was homossexual, despite the scandal that fact ment in the early 20th century, that was not cause for his being outranked from the succession line.  -  Read the commentaries from the Legitimists about him, further down.
Many kings and princes were homossexual: Ludwig II of Bavaria comes to mind. As well as Ferdinand of Bulgaria.
Kaiser Willelm II was very near those "circles", The duke of Clarence, and so many other minor royals.
At the time there was not such gutter-press as today where a homossexual king or crown prince would be crucified despite that comes into the "political incorrectness".

From Malcolm Howe "The Braganza Story"
" Prince Francisco José fought with the Austrian troops and died in 1919 from pneumonia (I guess that soon enough Wikipedia will say it was from AIDS) on the isle of Ischia, near Naples, whilst still a prisonner of war, captured by the Italians"

(Wonder if the Duke of Porto, living also in Naples, ever met his prisonner cousin)

"He, of all the descendants of D.Miguel I, most resembled his grand-father, the King, in his physicall appearance and had also inherited the musical talents of the Braganzas.
His mother had died when he was two years old, and he was brought up by his aunt Infanta D. Maria Anna, before his father married again.
When in 1893 she married the Hereditary Grand-Duke of Luxembourg, Francisco José, at the age of 13, composed the nuptial march for the wedding.
The family always called by the portuguese diminutive of his name "Chico".
He was the joy of their home and became an indefatigable traveller.
His communicative kindness and effusive happiness made the Legitimists regard him as the most esteemed of their Princes, with all the qualities and defects of the Portuguese race.
He supposrted his brother at his wedding in 1909 and they were together in Galizia offering their swords to Paiva Couceiro to fight in both the 1911 and 1912 incursions."

D.Franscisco was also a bullfights aficionado and he was himself a bullfighter.



Maybe you think I have googled the Absolutist Braganzas to find the skeletons they hide inside the closet. But in fact I do not need to. I have not seen anything about Franz of Braganza in Wikipedia.

I don't doubt he liked bullfights, since his father and grandfather both did enjoy them beyond anything else. About the rest, I think you can just read the newspapers of the period. I am not at all shocked Franz (or anybody, for  that matter) was homossexual. He was entitled to. But since you genuinely think I made it up or saw it in Wikipedia, I'll also tell you that, by today's standards, he was not a homossexual (nothing wrong with that) but a pedophile. He was always caught with teenage boys.

If you still do not believe me, please read the Royalist António Feijó.
His letters to Luis de Magalhães are published (by Imprensa Nacional, 2004).
In the letter dated February 1912 (page 413, volume 2), he wrote:

(as we are off topic here, I think it is better to go on on the «Who is indeed the person who can be called Duke of Braganza» thread. I'll post the translated letter in there. My excuses to readers of this topic: you'll just have to browse the last page of the next thread).



«I am sometimes afraid of being so attached to my Country.
Only now, after leaving, do I realize how much I love the Portuguese.»
 
Princess Antonia (letter to her brother, King Luiz, 1887)

Offline DonaAntonia

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 139
    • View Profile
Re: The children of Maria II of Portugal
« Reply #81 on: April 25, 2009, 10:48:17 PM »
Here is Maria Anna amongst her family, from a photo montage I have scanned from a book on King Carlos. From top to bottom:

King Fernando and Queen Maria II (her parents), Queen Maria Pia, baby Carlos and King Luis, Prince Joao, King Pedro V and Queen Stephanie followed by Prince Fernando (all dead between 1859 and 1861). Bottom: Antonia, Maria Anna and Augusto.



«I am sometimes afraid of being so attached to my Country.
Only now, after leaving, do I realize how much I love the Portuguese.»
 
Princess Antonia (letter to her brother, King Luiz, 1887)

Offline Marie Valerie

  • Graf
  • ***
  • Posts: 489
  • Erzherzogin von Österreich (1868-1924)
    • View Profile
Re: The children of Maria II of Portugal
« Reply #82 on: April 05, 2014, 11:14:24 AM »
The Royal family of Saxony after Maria Anna's death. You can see her picture (as well as that of Maria Josepha) to mark her presence.







I see King Albert, Queen Carola, Crownprince Georg and Mathilde but who are the princes?

Offline José

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 645
    • View Profile
Re: The children of Maria II of Portugal
« Reply #83 on: July 21, 2014, 12:11:51 PM »
I know it is Wikipedia but the english article on Infante D. Afonso, Duke of Oporto, claims that his engagement to ADss Valerie of Habsburg was publicized but short time later she refused to marry him, allegedelly due to the influence of Infanta D.Maria Theresa, ADss Karl-Ludwig, who nurtured the idea that Valerie would be the ideal bride for her widower brother D.Miguel II.

In the end she did not marry any of the cousins..

Is there any proof of this engagement to D.Afonso and was it ever made public ?


Offline José

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 645
    • View Profile
Re: The children of Maria II of Portugal
« Reply #84 on: November 04, 2014, 01:40:46 PM »
I know it is Wikipedia but the english article on Infante D. Afonso, Duke of Oporto, claims that his engagement to ADss Valerie of Habsburg was publicized but short time later she refused to marry him, allegedelly due to the influence of Infanta D.Maria Theresa, ADss Karl-Ludwig, who nurtured the idea that Valerie would be the ideal bride for her widower brother D.Miguel II.

In the end she did not marry any of the cousins..

Is there any proof of this engagement to D.Afonso and was it ever made public ?




Still no news ?

Offline José

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 645
    • View Profile
Re: The children of Maria II of Portugal
« Reply #85 on: October 05, 2016, 07:27:02 AM »
No news yet ?