Author Topic: Alexander I/Nicholas I - Illigetimate Children  (Read 13665 times)

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Offline Dominic_Albanese

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Alexander I/Nicholas I - Illigetimate Children
« on: July 04, 2005, 04:28:23 PM »
I didn't know until recently that Alexander I had a number of illigetimate children.  I've read that he had as many as 9 of them.  I also read that Nicholas I had one child outside his marriage (something that is hard for me to get my mind around, frankly).  Anyway, I have the following source for the children and mothers:

http://www.genealogy.euweb.cz/oldenburg/oldenburg9.html#A66

That seems to conflict with other information I've read.  Has anyone seen a comprehensive list of the women and children that both men had outside their marriage?

thanks
dca

Offline hikaru

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Re: Alexander I/Nicholas I - Illigetimate Children
« Reply #1 on: July 05, 2005, 01:17:22 AM »
In the Hermitage exhibition , there are several letters from the hidden daughter of Alexandr I with Naryshkina to Alexandr . Letters were written in English.
She called him  " My dear Papa".

Offline hikaru

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Re: Alexander I/Nicholas I - Illigetimate Children
« Reply #2 on: July 05, 2005, 01:22:34 AM »
According  to the one russian book,
Alexandr had only 2 illegitimate children . Both of the were the Naryshkina's children.
One - daughter Sofia , One - son E.D. Naryshkin ( maybe he is son, maybe not)

Nicholas had 2 illegitimate children ( about whom the historians know for sure):
1. Son Nikolay Isakov
2. Dughter Iosefina Kobervein ( daughter of him and one Sweden Lady in Waiting)

Offline Fay

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Re: Alexander I/Nicholas I - Illigetimate Children
« Reply #3 on: July 05, 2005, 06:22:52 AM »
Wow, up till now I knew only about Alexander's Sofia. Thanks for enlightening me ;D

Offline Dominic_Albanese

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Re: Alexander I/Nicholas I - Illigetimate Children
« Reply #4 on: July 09, 2005, 03:23:17 PM »
Hikaru - do you know if there is a reliable source on legitimate and illigitimate romanov births?  It seems to me that the Romanov family archives would have had some record - public probably for the legitimate and non-public, locked in a closet somewhere  :D a list of all the illigitiamte children through the years.  There must have been hundreds of them.  Those Romanov's were a 'fruitfull' bunch after all..  :o

dca

David_Pritchard

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Re: Alexander I/Nicholas I - Illigetimate Children
« Reply #5 on: July 09, 2005, 10:23:31 PM »
I do remember that one of the grand dukes, possibly Alexander's youngest brother Mikhail Pavlovich, had an illegitimate daugther in the first half of the 19th century who married one of the Counts Bobrinsky.

DAP

Offline imperial angel

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Re: Alexander I/Nicholas I - Illigetimate Children
« Reply #6 on: April 12, 2006, 10:47:28 AM »
The counts Bobrinsky, were themselves illegitimate descendants of Catherine the Great, and her first lover named Gregory, so I suppose that was a natural match! Whatever happened to Alexander I's illegetimate son, anyway? His daughter died at 18 after suffering from tuberclosis for years, according to the book Imperial Legend. He was devastated by this I guess, because he was close to her. Do any portaits of her survive?

Offline Carolath Habsburg

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Re: Alexander I/Nicholas I - Illigetimate Children
« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2010, 10:19:39 AM »
Sorry to bump  this topic but i didnt find another place to make my question : Can an illegitimate son/daughter of a Gd or Tsar have noble privileges? as other illegitimate kids of  other royal houses?. Thanks in advanced!

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Naslednik Norvezhskiy

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Re: Alexander I/Nicholas I - Illigetimate Children
« Reply #8 on: October 20, 2010, 02:16:27 PM »
Can an illegitimate son/daughter of a Gd or Tsar have noble privileges? as other illegitimate kids of  other royal houses?.
Sure, but it doesn't happen automatically. They would have to be granted name, arms and nobility.


Offline Carolath Habsburg

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Re: Alexander I/Nicholas I - Illigetimate Children
« Reply #9 on: October 20, 2010, 02:18:07 PM »
Thank you! Now i can explain to this lady that its possible


Courtesy of Grand Duchess Ally

"...Пусть он землю бережет родную, А любовь Катюша сбережет....". Grand Duchess Ekaterina Fyodorovna to Grand Duke Georgiy Alexandrovich. 1914

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Naslednik Norvezhskiy

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Re: Alexander I/Nicholas I - Illigetimate Children
« Reply #10 on: October 20, 2010, 02:21:14 PM »
Thank you! Now i can explain to this lady that its possible.

Ah, one of that "species". Well you can tell her that it's extremely unlikely that illegitimate offspring would receive the name Romanov (which BTW is a common Russian surname). Not even Romanovsky, that was reserved for morganatic offspring.

aleksandr pavlovich

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Re: Alexander I/Nicholas I - Illigetimate Children
« Reply #11 on: October 20, 2010, 03:10:50 PM »
Attention:  Reply #9 and "Katenka":   Though I stand gladly to be corrected, I am quite certain that I have heard this "Christine" woman's story before, IMO, on this forum perhaps two years ago.  As I recall it, she and her "sister" (who also posted, but I have forgotten her name) likewise claimed association with the family "Obolensky", that her greatgrandfather had the first and middle names of "Aleksander Nicholas," and had allegedly represented Russia in some capacity in the USA.  She and her sister claimed to be direct descendants of "Nicholas II" at first, (but admitted that it was a typo when it was pointed out) and then corrected themselves to say that they were directly descended from the Emperor Nicholas I.  They could never provide documentation, and I recall suggesting that surely the Obolensky family records still existed for reference, since it appeared that there was no known documented trace of their greatgrandfather being an "Imperial" Romanov.   If I'm not mistaken, they left in "a huff," since no one accepted their claim/s, and went to some smaller, more "receptive" board.   Regards,  AP.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2010, 03:34:34 PM by aleksandr pavlovich »

Offline Carolath Habsburg

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Re: Alexander I/Nicholas I - Illigetimate Children
« Reply #12 on: October 20, 2010, 05:35:08 PM »
Actually all that happened  this year and the topic about that claim is still on the claimants section, if someone wants to see it

Courtesy of Grand Duchess Ally

"...Пусть он землю бережет родную, А любовь Катюша сбережет....". Grand Duchess Ekaterina Fyodorovna to Grand Duke Georgiy Alexandrovich. 1914

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aleksandr pavlovich

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Re: Alexander I/Nicholas I - Illigetimate Children
« Reply #13 on: October 20, 2010, 07:37:01 PM »
Attention "Katenka" and your Reply # 12:    Ah, yes!  I see now that it was begun in August of 2009.  Many thanks for your kind response.  Regards,  AP.

Offline Carolath Habsburg

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Re: Alexander I/Nicholas I - Illigetimate Children
« Reply #14 on: October 21, 2010, 05:35:46 AM »
You welcome! For what it seems this lady is still messing up and changing constantly her story.

Courtesy of Grand Duchess Ally

"...Пусть он землю бережет родную, А любовь Катюша сбережет....". Grand Duchess Ekaterina Fyodorovna to Grand Duke Georgiy Alexandrovich. 1914

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