Author Topic: Elizabeth I.  (Read 53377 times)

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Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: Elizabeth I.
« Reply #15 on: July 20, 2005, 11:13:55 AM »
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In saying she didn't resemble her mother, I meant in her characteristics, not so much her appearance.
 

Oh yes, I knew what you meant, BlueT. I was responding to Finelly's post.

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I cannot see any character trait which she shared with Anne. Can anyone else?  


I can see many traits the mother and the daughter had in common. Both Anne and Elizabeth liked reading books and learning, both had musical talents and loved dancing, both wrote poetry, both were witty and flirtatious, and both had hot tempers and sharp tongues!   :P  ;D


rskkiya

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Re: Elizabeth I.
« Reply #16 on: July 20, 2005, 11:28:51 AM »
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Myabe she should have disposed of her teeth as well - weren't they all rotten?  ;D
In saying she didn't resemble her mother, I meant in her characteristics, not so much her appearance. I cannot see any character trait which she shared with Anne. Can anyone else?  

Eating sugar was a sign of wealth - so in that respect having bad teeth was a status symbol... also considering her age - this sort of thing was not unusual... (Mary had very few real teeth when she was crowned.)

I think that both Anne B and Henry were terribly proud and willful people so she got her nature from both of them, she was a flirt (both) and witty (both) but her political turn on faith - "I won't ask so you (catholics) wont rebel" ;)  :-X well sort of... :-X
I think that Anne was religiously more pragmatic, while Henry was really down deep very Catholic in his attitude if not in his declaration.
Lizzie kept everyone guessing and would have declaired herself a hindu if it were politically expedient!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by rskkiya »

Offline lexi4

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Re: Elizabeth I.
« Reply #17 on: July 20, 2005, 02:04:54 PM »
One of her poems
Written on a Wall at Woodstock


             1 Oh Fortune, thy wresting wavering state
             2 Hath fraught with cares my troubled wit,
             3 Whose witness this present prison late
             4 Could bear, where once was joy's loan quit.
             5 Thou causedst the guilty to be loosed
             6 From bands where innocents were inclosed,
             7 And caused the guiltless to be reserved,
             8  And freed those that death had well deserved.
             9 But all herein can be nothing wrought,
           10 So God send to my foes all they have thought.
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely, in a pretty and well preserved body; but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming, "Wow ---- What a ride!!!"

Mgmstl

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Re: Elizabeth I.
« Reply #18 on: July 20, 2005, 07:49:52 PM »
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IMO, Elizabeth looks amazingly like her mother, and only inherited her father's coloring.




Her personality, I think was a combination of both her parents, with lots of "hindsite 20/20" thrown in!  ;)




Helen if I can find the death mask of Elizabeth of York there is also a resemblance between the two.

PssMarieAmelie

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Re: Elizabeth I.
« Reply #19 on: July 20, 2005, 08:22:16 PM »
I am not a big fan of Elizabeth I, but I think she demands respect(rightly) from most people. Me for one.

bluetoria

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Re: Elizabeth I.
« Reply #20 on: July 21, 2005, 06:33:15 AM »
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Lizzie kept everyone guessing and would have declaired herself a hindu if it were politically expedient!


;D Yes, I agree. I think she was probably the most religiously tolerant monarch of the age and it is, as I wrote on another thread, a great pity that the Pope decided to excommunicate her. Had he not done so, there would have been far greater freedom of religion in England...and fewer martyrs.

I am still intrigued about her real thoughts about her mother. I do not know that she did anything to try to restore her 'image' - perhaps she felt that would have been disloyal to her father.
It would be interesting too to know her real views of Mary. It sometimes seems that they were both so wary of one another that it prevented them from being close, but I always feel that they did care about one another & each recognized the raw deal that the other had had through their father's frequent dropping of wives!

Offline ilyala

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Re: Elizabeth I.
« Reply #21 on: July 21, 2005, 07:21:07 AM »
i think henry 4th of france was also a very tolerant monarch, but he lived in a lot less tolerant country so he couldn't exercise his tolerance as much...

i also think that no matter her personal opinion, elizabeth had to cherish her mother's memory publicly, because she was her mother :). hurting her mother's memory would have led to hurting her own image.
'loving might be a mistake, but it's worth making'
ilya


Offline Tsarfan

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Re: Elizabeth I.
« Reply #22 on: July 23, 2005, 01:03:38 PM »
I often think of Elizabeth I and Abraham Lincoln as similar in a key regard -- both were complex mixes of strengths and weaknesses who arrived on the scene at a time of crisis when their particular strengths were desperately needed and their particular weaknesses were not fatal.

Both assumed power surrounded by considerable doubts about their rights and abilities to rule.  Many Englishmen and most continental Europeans viewed Elizabeth as illegitimate.  Lincoln took the presidency with less than 40% of the popular vote and amid widespread conviction that he had neither the experience nor the political capital to be effective.

Elizabeth played her initial hand brilliantly by defying expectations and holding off on forming a government until she had a clear read of the political lay of the land as the dust settled around Mary's death.  When she finally did, it was an assemblage that did not tip observers off to her true views of contentious issues.  Lincoln employed the equally-brilliant tactic of forming his first Cabinet largely of people who had run against him for the nomination.  It gave him access to their talent and experience, it gave them a stake in the game he was about to play, and it allowed him to keep his eye on them.

In times when factional strife had reached extremes of violence, both Elizabeth and Lincoln displayed in heroic proportions what we today call "emotional intelligence".  They were deeply anchored in their personal convictions, but they displayed clear understanding of the viewpoints of all adversaries.  Consequently, they both avoided moral absolutes in choosing their positions.  Elizabeth, while a committed Protestant, famously said that she did not desire a window into her subjects' souls and that the choice of religion should be a matter of personal conscience -- almost unheard of in an age of state religions.  Lincoln, while something short of a racial egalitarian, personally abhorred slavery, but he was extremely flexible in his political handling of it.  As with Elizabeth, his goal was to restore peace to a splintered nation, and he was willing to keep slavery intact, to abolish it altogether, or to land in between in order to keep his country intact.

Both were notoriously indecisive.  Elizabeth drove her councillors to distraction by chronic delays on key matters, preferring instead that they first attempted to settle issues among themselves.  In fact, she generally preferred not to make a decision until it became unavoidable.  Lincoln likewise procrastinated on taking authority away from his designates, giving them all possible berth before stepping in.  His procrastination in removing McClellan probably prolonged the Civil War considerably.  But they both happened to live in times when passions were so overheated and issues so intractable that no one person -- even a monarch or a president -- had any chance of prevailing through his or her own will alone.  Their instincts to "empower" their subordinates had the effect of encouraging talented people of different persuasions both to employ their talents and to develop personal loyalty to them, thereby extending their reach far beyond their own abilities.

Elizabeth was not a flawless monarch.  But I cannot imagine one better suited to the throne for England's launch into the modern age.  


Offline lexi4

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Re: Elizabeth I.
« Reply #23 on: July 23, 2005, 10:55:37 PM »
Tsarfan,
I had never made that comparison. But you are right. Your points are well written and the comparisons you draw are factual. It shed a different light on the two for me. Thank you for your efforts. It is for posts like this that I am here. You made me think.
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely, in a pretty and well preserved body; but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming, "Wow ---- What a ride!!!"

Offline Louis_Charles

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Re: Elizabeth I.
« Reply #24 on: July 24, 2005, 12:16:08 PM »
Tsarfan,

What an interesting post, and a comparison that had never occured to me. But it is right on the money.

Simon a/k/a Louis_Charles
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Offline emeraldeyes

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Re: Elizabeth I.
« Reply #25 on: July 27, 2005, 03:21:47 PM »
I have always admired Elizabeth's 'guts'.  She acted so decisively, and although she may have had private doubts about some of her actions, she never let herself appear vulnerable.  She knew that any weakness she showed to the men around her would be exploited to her detriment.  
I also love the way she always referred to herself as a 'prince'.  And what is that quote about being her 'father's daughter'?

An intelligent Hell would be better than a stupid paradise.  - Victor Hugo


Offline palimpsest

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Re: Elizabeth I.
« Reply #26 on: December 17, 2005, 11:42:19 AM »


This is a undated photo of an oil painting of British monarch Queen Elizabeth I by painter John Bettes. (AP Photo)
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Offline palimpsest

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Re: Elizabeth I.
« Reply #27 on: December 17, 2005, 11:44:11 AM »


Portrait of England's Queen Elizabeth I, part of an exhibit "A Decade of Collecting - Celebrating 10 Years of Acquisitions 1990-1999" that is on display at Washington's Folger Shakespeare Library through Nov. 25, 2000. (AP Photo/Folger Shakespeare Library)
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Offline palimpsest

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Re: Elizabeth I.
« Reply #28 on: December 17, 2005, 11:45:48 AM »


Virginia first lady Roxane Gilmore stands in front of the newly renovated portrait of Queen Elizabeth I in the Governor's Mansion, Wednesday, Oct. 17, 2001, in Richmond, Va. When curators began cleaning the painting during a 2 1/2-year restoration, they found that profound, often harmful, alterations had been made to the painting through the centuries. A new background had been added, a chair had been added, a cross had been added, and the queen's right hand was repositioned. (AP Photo/Richmond Times-Dispatch, Alexa Welch Edlund)
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Offline palimpsest

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Re: Elizabeth I.
« Reply #29 on: December 17, 2005, 11:49:18 AM »


A letter by Britain's Queen Elizabeth I expressing her outrage at the imprisonment of Mary Queen of Scots, at a pre-sale photocall in London, Thursday, Oct. 23, 2003, the letter is estimated to fetch 60,000-90,000 pounds, US$ 93,600-140,400 when it is auctioned as part of the Harry and Brigitte Spiro collection of English Historical Documents sale on Dec. 3, 2003. (AP Photo/Richard Lewis)
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