Author Topic: 101 Reasons AA was not Anastasia Nikolaevna  (Read 21229 times)

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Offline clockworkgirl21

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Re: 101 Reasons AA was not Anastasia Nikolaevna
« Reply #15 on: August 12, 2005, 03:09:57 AM »
Didn't Anna Anderson write a book? I've read it, but can't remember it that well. I think that's where she wrote about how she smashed her finger in the train door, but it was really Maria. But maybe I don't know what I'm talking about.  :P

jeremygaleaz

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Re: 101 Reasons AA was not Anastasia Nikolaevna
« Reply #16 on: August 12, 2005, 09:34:49 AM »
Quote
Again...This is not a thread to argue about reasons. But I'm only saying this: "Is Tchaikovsky a so common name in Russia? This seems a joke but, Romanov is a more, more common name than Tchaikovsky. As for Tchaikovsky...It is not a name of Polish roots? Maybe I'm wrong, but I think I read somewhere that the musician Tchaikovsky was of Polish heritage?

RealAnastasia


The name does have Polish roots, but has come to be associated with Russia.  

Offline AGRBear

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« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by AGRBear »
"What is true by lamplight is not always true by sunlight."

Joubert, Pensees, No. 152

Offline RealAnastasia

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Re: 101 Reasons AA was not Anastasia Nikolaevna
« Reply #18 on: August 12, 2005, 06:42:59 PM »
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Didn't Anna Anderson write a book? I've read it, but can't remember it that well. I think that's where she wrote about how she smashed her finger in the train door, but it was really Maria. But maybe I don't know what I'm talking about.  :P


You must be meaning the Von Nida 's book: "I, Anastasia" (or "I am Anastasia", it depends if you are in the States or in England) Anna Anderson didn't write a book. She had no skills as a writer. Von Nida wrote it using the first person, "I" as if AA herself would have wrote it.

RealAnastasia.

Offline RealAnastasia

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Re: 101 Reasons AA was not Anastasia Nikolaevna
« Reply #19 on: August 12, 2005, 07:00:52 PM »
37- AA indentified Alexandra's room wrongly seeing some Tsarkoe Selo photos that appeared in a magazine (Pierre Gilliard: "La Fausse Anastasie"; Castelot; Decaux)

38- Gilliard claimed that AA copied Anastasia's signature many times, until she was able to sign like the Grand Duchess. (Pierre Gilliard; Castelot; Decaux)

39- Gilliard claimed that AA's teeth were not broken by pistol butts, as she said, but otherwise. Teeth smashed by a pistol but, are close one to another. AA had lost many teeth all over her mouth. (Pierre Gilliard; Castelot)

40- AA mistook Shura Tegleva with Olga Alexandrovna herself (Pierre Gilliard; Castelot)

41- AA had not the same voice than Anastasia (Pierre Gilliard)

42- She was reluctant to submit to medical test (André Castelot; Alain Decaux)

More to come!

RealAnastasia.

P.S: I recall that this is a thread to note "reasons". The fact we post them, would no mean that we share them. Here they are and we must write them here. But, of course, all these deserves and MUST be duscussed. Bear opened already a thread, to discus the reasons we are writing in this one: 101 reasons AA was not GD Anastasia. Who wants to open another ones for the other similar threads: "101 Reasons to AA was FS"; "101 Reasons to AA was not FS"; and "101 Reasons to AA was GD Anastasia". Bear opened "101 Reasons to AA was not GD Anastasia".


Offline stepan

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Re: 101 Reasons AA was not Anastasia Nikolaevna
« Reply #20 on: August 13, 2005, 05:19:23 PM »
The imperial dentist Serge Kastritsky examined casts of AA´s teeth brought to him by George von Leuchtenberg. He said it was impossible it could be G D Anastasia´s teeth.

Offline etonexile

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Re: 101 Reasons AA was not Anastasia Nikolaevna
« Reply #21 on: August 13, 2005, 06:32:10 PM »
And yet...some will believe..... ::)

Offline RealAnastasia

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Re: 101 Reasons AA was not Anastasia Nikolaevna
« Reply #22 on: August 13, 2005, 11:44:17 PM »
I don't want to seem mean or something, but don't forget to NUMBER your reasons. The dentist is the reason number "43". You must also quote the source of your quote, for people could go and read it. I know you read it in Peter Kurth, so, I note it. And you must be more precise in your quotes too: the dentist doctor DIDN'T said AA teeth doesn't match with AA ones. He only said that AA teeth were in bad condition, and that him, as an imperial dentist couldn't have left a Grand Duchess Teeth in such a bad condition. He also stated that he didn't recall him treating GD Anastasia's teeth. It's different that the reasons you stated.

And fot those who spoke about "those who still believes", AGAIN I repeat: We must quote here all the reasons we knows about AA being not Anastasia but that doesn't mean that we share what other people said about AA. In fact, some of these reasons are found fake when analyzing them. Too many people lied speaking about this case, and now we REALLY KNOW they lied. This is the facts we must discuss AFTER the 101 reasons in all AA threads are done, not here. I don't believe many of the reasons some people gave for her not being AA and other reasons are contradictory or we may discuss them to found an answer. But when I write that  "Once AA crossed her as a Roman Catholic", I 'm not saying I believe this is the truth, (for other people said she didn't do this). Is this clear or not?

Thank you for being so gentle and to read with patience, my long and boring posts. I'm also grateful to people who made humourous remarks and keep those threads, a little dry and not too hilarious, alive and interesting.

RealAnastasia.

P.S: REMEMBER: 43...

Offline Annie

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Re: 101 Reasons AA was not Anastasia Nikolaevna
« Reply #23 on: August 18, 2005, 06:20:05 AM »
Quote

That makes mine at number 45 then.
I believe why AA was cremated when she died was because so that no one could ever discover that she was not AN but they eventually did by DNA


Another thing I have thought of too. She was raised a devout Russian Orthodox, and they oppose cremation.

And if she were really Anastasia, wouldn't she want her body presevered, considering what had happened to the others? This is a clue that shows me not only was she not AN (of course she wasn't) but that even in her old age, she knew it.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Annie »

Offline Georgiy

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Re: 101 Reasons AA was not Anastasia Nikolaevna
« Reply #24 on: August 18, 2005, 04:24:28 PM »
Annie, if she were Anastasia, she wouldn't want her body preserved, as Orthodoxy does not allow embalming.

Blanche, all Orthodox Christians, be they Russian, Greek, Serbian, Japanese, Romanian, Arab etc cross themselves in the following way, which incidentally was the way the Roman Church also crossed themselves until the last crusade:

"In the name of the Father" touching the head
"And of the Son" touching near the navel
"And of the Holy Spirit" touching first the right shoulder then the left.

We don't go from head to chest, because that makes the cross upside-down. We use our right hand for crossing with. Our thumb is joined to our index and middle fingers, symbolising the Trinity. Our ring and middle fingers are closed onto our palm. The two fingers representing the divinity and humanity of Christ; they are folded down onto our palm to symbolise that He came down from Heaven.

Mgmstl

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Re: 101 Reasons AA was not Anastasia Nikolaevna
« Reply #25 on: August 18, 2005, 04:29:47 PM »
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I have two questions:

1. Do they cross themselves in the Russian Orthodox religion?

2. How did they manage to get AA's DNA if she was cremated?



Blanche there was a piece of tissue in storage at the Martha Jefferson Hospital in Charlottesville, VA.  from a previous operation,  for details see the other survivor threads.   From that sample the dna sample was obtained.

Offline Annie

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Re: 101 Reasons AA was not Anastasia Nikolaevna
« Reply #26 on: August 18, 2005, 05:29:59 PM »
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I have two questions:

1. Do they cross themselves in the Russian Orthodox religion?


Witnesses are said to have seen AA cross herself the Catholic way (which is opposite of the Orthodox way)


Offline AGRBear

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Re: 101 Reasons AA was not Anastasia Nikolaevna
« Reply #27 on: August 18, 2005, 06:50:57 PM »
Please, please, please,  remember to number your  101 reasons as you post.

I have set up a Discussion 101 Reasons AA was not GD Anastasia and so we need to keep all of these things in some kind of order.

http://hydrogen.pallasweb.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=anastasia;action=display;num=1123861894

You can use your "modify button" and incert the number and then post same message.

I'll thank everyone, now,  because I'm sure you'll want to  cooperate.

AGRBear
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by AGRBear »
"What is true by lamplight is not always true by sunlight."

Joubert, Pensees, No. 152

Offline RealAnastasia

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Re: 101 Reasons AA was not Anastasia Nikolaevna
« Reply #28 on: August 18, 2005, 07:34:48 PM »
43- She was sometimes too reiterative speaking about who she was: for example, she would say "I'm your Tsar Daughter", in a very haughy manner. The Tsarina would never teach their daughter to speak like this. The girls were always very polite when they asked for things to their servants. AA called poor Harriet Rathlef, the woman who fighted so har for her "A Servant", and a "Lett" (Peter Kurth; Harriet Von Rathlef; James Blair Lovell)

45- After her father death,  one of the Baron Von Kleist's daughters said that AA was not Anastasia . Her mother still believed that AA was the lost GD, but the woman said with a certain disdain, that her mother was plainly crazy (Peter Kurth; Dominique Auclères)

46-Some witnesses claimed that AA manners were not "royal". They saw her cleaning her mouth with the napkin and even her nose (Peter Kurth)

47-Pierre Gilliard claimed that AA confounded some of the rooms of Alexander Palace with other rooms for she read wrong infos in a magazine (Pierre Gilliard: "La Fausse Anastasie")

48-When doctors in Dalldorf asked her who she was and she finally spoke, she said in a not very sure way: "I'm a worker" (Peter Kurth)

RealAnastasia.

Offline RealAnastasia

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Re: 101 Reasons AA was not Anastasia Nikolaevna
« Reply #29 on: August 18, 2005, 07:42:24 PM »
Just a little word: Why an Orthodox would not change his/her religion? AA always said that she had not the same beliefs than her "mother", that she didn't believe in the same God than her any more. "God let me alone"-she said to Harriet Rathlef- God punished me. Why? What I did to deserve that?" She wasn't an Orthodox any more and she said it more than once, even if she participed in some Orthodox services in Seeon, with the Leuchtenbergs. She was more close to the antroposophie believs than to Orthodox ones.

But in this thread, we are supposed to said that AA was not Anastasia, and we must demonstrate it. You know it's againts what I really think, but I must search for all the arguments who shows that she was not AN.

RealAnastasia.