Author Topic: Ella and her foster children Marie Pavlovna and Dmitri  (Read 139287 times)

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Offline Svetabel

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Re: Ella and her foster children Marie Pavlovna and Dmitri
« Reply #345 on: October 26, 2007, 11:56:42 PM »
He did not think that what the coronation diaster came, KK was shocked by the way Serge handle things.

He was shocked but that did not mean he turned away in disgust.

Offline Svetabel

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Re: Ella and her foster children Marie Pavlovna and Dmitri
« Reply #346 on: October 27, 2007, 12:00:05 AM »
  Considering that their are many more things in the bowels of the Kremlin in regards to the  IF, it is likely that somebody may just find something in those regards.  Not to exonerate him for what he proved by his actions that he was truly responsible for.  But maybe to understand his pscyhe and what was the force that drove him.  I hope that someday we will also find more writings by Ella as well.  Though this seems doubtful as she may have burned her correspondence just as her sister did. But it would be nice to hear Ella's side of things.

I am looking forward to the second volume of GD Sergei's bio in Russian with the extracts from his diaries of the 1880s years. The 1st volume is very good.

Offline ashanti01

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Re: Ella and her foster children Marie Pavlovna and Dmitri
« Reply #347 on: October 28, 2007, 03:33:46 AM »
  Considering that their are many more things in the bowels of the Kremlin in regards to the  IF, it is likely that somebody may just find something in those regards.  Not to exonerate him for what he proved by his actions that he was truly responsible for.  But maybe to understand his pscyhe and what was the force that drove him.  I hope that someday we will also find more writings by Ella as well.  Though this seems doubtful as she may have burned her correspondence just as her sister did. But it would be nice to hear Ella's side of things.

I am looking forward to the second volume of GD Sergei's bio in Russian with the extracts from his diaries of the 1880s years. The 1st volume is very good.

Really? I really need to learn how to read Russian. If I may ask, did the first volume have any extracts from his diaries and if it did, did it give you a different view of him? I always thought that if one could view his letters or diaries one could have more of an insight as to what type of man he really was. Sergei is by far one of the most intresting GD of his time.

Offline Svetabel

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Re: Ella and her foster children Marie Pavlovna and Dmitri
« Reply #348 on: October 28, 2007, 07:10:20 AM »
  Considering that their are many more things in the bowels of the Kremlin in regards to the  IF, it is likely that somebody may just find something in those regards.  Not to exonerate him for what he proved by his actions that he was truly responsible for.  But maybe to understand his pscyhe and what was the force that drove him.  I hope that someday we will also find more writings by Ella as well.  Though this seems doubtful as she may have burned her correspondence just as her sister did. But it would be nice to hear Ella's side of things.

I am looking forward to the second volume of GD Sergei's bio in Russian with the extracts from his diaries of the 1880s years. The 1st volume is very good.

Really? I really need to learn how to read Russian. If I may ask, did the first volume have any extracts from his diaries and if it did, did it give you a different view of him? I always thought that if one could view his letters or diaries one could have more of an insight as to what type of man he really was. Sergei is by far one of the most intresting GD of his time.

Yes, the 1st volume has a lot of extracts from Sergei's diaries of the 1860-1870s years. I shared my impressions here :

http://forum.alexanderpalace.org/index.php/topic,8930.45.html

http://forum.alexanderpalace.org/index.php/topic,8930.60.html

Offline ashanti01

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Re: Ella and her foster children Marie Pavlovna and Dmitri
« Reply #349 on: October 28, 2007, 12:12:02 PM »
Thanks !!!

Offline Svetabel

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Re: Ella and her foster children Marie Pavlovna and Dmitri
« Reply #350 on: September 30, 2008, 01:29:25 PM »
Ella with her friends/courtiers and GDss Maria P. and GD Dmitriy P.



Look, Ella is leaning onto Maria P., and her hand (it's barely seen though) is around Maria's waist. Unusual picture meaning their relationship.

Offline Eric_Lowe

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Re: Ella and her foster children Marie Pavlovna and Dmitri
« Reply #351 on: September 30, 2008, 02:05:46 PM »
Marie looked pissed. She looked spoiled to me.

Offline Mandie, the Gothic Empress

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Re: Ella and her foster children Marie Pavlovna and Dmitri
« Reply #352 on: September 30, 2008, 03:15:18 PM »
Ha ha, she a spoiled Princess. not happy if having everything they want. such a pity *rolling eyes* 

Nice Pix Sveta! you always have great ones  and so kind to share with us.  :D

Offline Eric_Lowe

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Re: Ella and her foster children Marie Pavlovna and Dmitri
« Reply #353 on: September 30, 2008, 06:52:19 PM »
Yes. Even her Aunt Marie (Grand Duchess George) wrote she was a bit spoilt.

Offline Svetabel

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Re: Ella and her foster children Marie Pavlovna and Dmitri
« Reply #354 on: October 01, 2008, 12:50:26 AM »
"Spoilt" is not the correct word for MP's situation. She was a foster child, mother died, father was distant and with his 2nd family...MP was more embittered than spoilt, and thus all her conflicting emotions.

Offline Thomas_Hesse

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Re: Ella and her foster children Marie Pavlovna and Dmitri
« Reply #355 on: October 01, 2008, 03:30:27 AM »
Are any of the people in the group identyfied? The younger lady looks very much like the children's gouverness Mrs Fry. The elder one seems to be Masha Wassilshtchikova.

Meine Kaiserin

Offline Eric_Lowe

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Re: Ella and her foster children Marie Pavlovna and Dmitri
« Reply #356 on: October 02, 2008, 10:10:13 AM »
I think you may be right.

True, but I think Dimitri came out less conflcted as far as his relationship with Ella was considered. I said spolit because new evidence proved that Marie was actually quite looking forward to her marriage to Wilhelm of Sweden. She later blamed Ella (unfairly) pushed her into it. That is what I said about her "spoilt" meaning her inability to take responsibility of her life. Her later relationships shown that too...

Offline Svetabel

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Re: Ella and her foster children Marie Pavlovna and Dmitri
« Reply #357 on: October 03, 2008, 01:02:40 AM »
Are any of the people in the group identyfied? The younger lady looks very much like the children's gouverness Mrs Fry. The elder one seems to be Masha Wassilshtchikova.



The elder really could be Maria Wasiltchikova, but I don't think the younger is Mrs Fry, who was an old lady then. There is a photo of her with MP and DP in the early 1890s and she looks rather old.

Offline Eric_Lowe

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Re: Ella and her foster children Marie Pavlovna and Dmitri
« Reply #358 on: October 03, 2008, 09:38:48 AM »
Yes...That makes sense. Who was the younger woman then. A lady in waiting ?

Offline LenelorMiksi

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Re: Ella and her foster children Marie Pavlovna and Dmitri
« Reply #359 on: October 05, 2008, 01:07:03 AM »
Marie Pavlovna admits in her memoirs that she looked forward to setting up her own house and being independent.  She also barely knew Wilhelm- unlike her Aunt Ella who was in love with Serge before she married him.  What she regrets is that Ella favored the marriage knowing that the couple were strangers to each other.  Her father was angry when he found out about the marriage- imagine your sister-in-law agreeing to have your teenage daughter married to a man she barely knows.  Arranged marriage may have been common at that time, but not in that particular family.  All of Ella's sisters chose their own husbands, and Ernie married his cousin (albeit reluctantly) who he had known all his life.  One of the reasons Ernie and Victoria Melita got married was because other people pushed them into it. Marie Pavlovna simply went along with her aunt's plan and imagined a better life ahead of her.  Like any teenager, the idea of being grown-up and independent was enticing.  I'm not sure why Ella thought it would be a good idea for her niece to marry someone she barely knew.  I think maybe she should have opposed the marriage until they got to know each other better.  That's what foster parents are supposed to do- make sure rash teenagers don't go out and marry their first boyfriend, not plan the marriage.  Ella made a mistake, and so did Marie Pavlovna. 
Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse:  "Each year brings us nearer to the Wiedersehen [reunion with the dead], though it is sad to think how one's glass is running out, & how little good goes with it, compared to the numberless blessings we receive.  Time goes incredibly fast."