Author Topic: Count Louis Philippe de Paris (1838-94) and his family  (Read 105517 times)

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Offline Grace

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Re: Count Louis Philippe de Paris (1838-94) and his family
« Reply #30 on: March 18, 2006, 08:25:57 PM »
I have never personally read anything which said Bertie was not in favour of the union.

Theo Aronson's book says regarding Helene and Eddy that "the Prince of Wales was only too thankful to see his wayward son showing an interest in marriage at all...".

He apparently also suggested that Helene be allowed to remain a Roman Catholic provided she gave an understanding that the children would be brought up in the Anglican Church.

However, you're right ( ;))when you say that the petition did go as far as the Pope, as Helene went to Rome to consult him, to no avail.  :(

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Re: Count Louis Philippe de Paris (1838-94) and his family
« Reply #31 on: March 19, 2006, 06:26:59 AM »
Does anyone know why the Pope disapproved? In the past, Pope's had been very amenable about things like this.
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Re: Count Louis Philippe de Paris (1838-94) and his family
« Reply #32 on: March 19, 2006, 09:17:00 AM »
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Does anyone know why the Pope disapproved? In the past, Pope's had been very amenable about things like this.


Hélène's father, the Count of Paris, very much opposed the match so I guess it was easy for the Pope to agree with him.

Offline imperial angel

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Re: Count Louis Philippe de Paris (1838-94) and his family
« Reply #33 on: March 19, 2006, 07:21:04 PM »
Yes, it seems both her father as well as the pope opposed the marriage. I am sure it was easy for them to agree. I am sure Prince Eddy's parents did want him to marry a strong, responsible Princess as Helene undoubtedly was. However, for the political reasons mentioned, as well as the fact that English Princes are not supposed to marry Catholics, it is unlikely to have been seriously considered. Even a former Catholic Princess might have been unpopular in England, given it was still the late 19th Century.  Anyway, I am sure there are photos of them, if not published ones.

Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Count Louis Philippe de Paris (1838-94) and his family
« Reply #34 on: March 22, 2006, 08:10:17 AM »
Agneschen--what is the name of the book you refer to? That is a great picture!
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Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Count Louis Philippe de Paris (1838-94) and his family
« Reply #35 on: March 22, 2006, 08:19:10 AM »
Quote
I have never personally read anything which said Bertie was not in favour of the union.

Theo Aronson's book says regarding Helene and Eddy that "the Prince of Wales was only too thankful to see his wayward son showing an interest in marriage at all...".

He apparently also suggested that Helene be allowed to remain a Roman Catholic provided she gave an understanding that the children would be brought up in the Anglican Church.

However, you're right ( ;))when you say that the petition did go as far as the Pope, as Helene went to Rome to consult him, to no avail.  :(


It seems that Bertie soured on the match much quicker than the rest of the family once it was made apparent the religious & political difficulties would be insurmountable. He was more pragmatic in this than his romantic wife who believed that love would triumph despite the obstacles. It has shades of the Vicky/Moretta/Sandro affair--the mother & prospective bride encouraging the match despite opposition while the potential groom seemed to grasp the outcome quicker and begin to detach. The affair stretched out for roughly a year and for many it was apparent it would not come off after so much time had elapsed with no positive movement.
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Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Count Louis Philippe de Paris (1838-94) and his family
« Reply #36 on: March 22, 2006, 08:23:24 AM »
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Does anyone know why the Pope disapproved? In the past, Pope's had been very amenable about things like this.


Most Roman Catholic princesses did not renounce their religion--at least in modern times. It was even a requirement for many Catholic monarchs to marry a Catholic princess or a non-Catholic who converted--like Ena of Battenberg did. Perhaps in the distant past there had been more examples as Popes were more political and could occasionally be 'convinced' (usually in the form of political favor) to countenance a match but even then it was unusual. That's why Catholic princesses tended to marry within a relatively small number of royal houses or kept their religion (ala Marie Orleans when she married Waldemar) and made a agreement to raise the children Catholic (or like Marie again, raised at least the daughter in the faith).

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Offline imperial angel

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Re: Count Louis Philippe de Paris (1838-94) and his family
« Reply #37 on: March 22, 2006, 08:29:33 AM »
That is true. The Pope was unlikely to encourage a Catholic Princess to change her religion if it wasn't for any political purpose. And in this case the political purpose was non existent, so he woudn't have encouraged her. In past centuries, popes had been more allowing of this sort of thing, for only political reasons. But this was never true in the Helene of Orleans case, anyway.Once time passed without anything happening, as another poster rightfully said, then the idea of this match was gone. Religious differences where why royalty married in relatively small circles-protestant and catholic.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by romanov_fan »

Agneschen

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Re: Count Louis Philippe de Paris (1838-94) and his family
« Reply #38 on: March 22, 2006, 09:41:19 AM »
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Agneschen--what is the name of the book you refer to? That is a great picture!


Mon Album de Famille by Prince Michel of Greece - a WONDERFUL photobook on the Orléans family but rather rare & usually very expensive. One of my favourite books about royalty.

Offline José

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Re: Count Louis Philippe de Paris (1838-94) and his family
« Reply #39 on: March 22, 2006, 12:22:03 PM »
Are there any photos of Hélène with her 2nd husband, col. Campini ?

Offline Marc

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Re: Count Louis Philippe de Paris (1838-94) and his family
« Reply #40 on: March 22, 2006, 04:42:37 PM »

Offline Marc

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Re: Count Louis Philippe de Paris (1838-94) and his family
« Reply #41 on: March 22, 2006, 04:43:21 PM »
This schould be the portrait of Helene...

Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Count Louis Philippe de Paris (1838-94) and his family
« Reply #42 on: March 22, 2006, 05:40:51 PM »
It is--it's one of the many portraits which can be found in Royalties of the Word. I discussed the book in the Pictures of WII and His Family thread in the Hohenzollerns for anyone who wants more info.

Thanks for the title Agneschen. If only one's budget was as big as one's wish list.  :)
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Agneschen

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Re: Count Louis Philippe de Paris (1838-94) and his family
« Reply #43 on: March 22, 2006, 07:50:44 PM »
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If only one's budget was as big as one's wish list.  :)

Very true (sigh) ... My "to buy later" list keeps growing in the most atrocious way !
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Agneschen »

Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Count Louis Philippe de Paris (1838-94) and his family
« Reply #44 on: April 09, 2006, 12:51:05 PM »
From an old magazine c.1894:

"Italy seems destined to have the most beautiful royal woman of the period for her queen. The successor to Her Majesty Margherita may very probably be Helen of Orleans...It is whispered that the Princess Helen will never be completely satisfied with her fate, as she cannot forget her first love, the late Duke of Clarence, whom she was prevented from marrying...If the Duke of Aosta succeeds King Umberto, or his cousin the prince of Naples, whom many believe to be doomed to an early grave, the legitimists will have good reason for setting up a wail at the degeneracy of the blood royal, for Aosta is only half royal; his mother, who left him large estates in Italy and Belgium, was a commoner, a Cisterna of the house of Merode....The Duke of Aosta is quite a handsome young felllow...He is an entertaining talker, an excellent sportsman, and an army officer of genuine merit; in short, he possesses almost all of the qualities that should make a young girl happy. If he does not speedily succeed in effacing the memory of the Duke of Clarence from Helen of Orleans' heart, it will not be his fault.'
They also serve who only stand and wait--John Milton
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