Author Topic: Floorplans of the Alexander Palace  (Read 189781 times)

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Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: Floorplans of the Alexander Palace
« Reply #45 on: October 14, 2005, 03:37:25 PM »
By "entresols" do you mean the lofts that were in the large room on the first floor that was used as a family room (it had been divided into two parts after WWII), and which connected to Nicholas's New Study (where the hallway now is)?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by helenazar »

Offline Douglas

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Re: Floorplans of the Alexander Palace
« Reply #46 on: October 14, 2005, 04:27:15 PM »
  Helen:  

In the United States we would use the  fancy word 'mezzanine' rather than 'entresol' to describe these spaces between the first and second floors.  Some of these appear to be open to the first floor and some may have been closed off.

Today one would generally  use dotted lines, cut slashes, and various thickness of  lines to show clearly what  is above, middle and below.  Or one could have a seperate sheet of drawings for each floor level.   It is a bit tricky to show all of this on just one plan sheet.  

Yes, Bob, it does appear that the person who prepared the drawings used the first floor plan to clarify the situation of the various mezzanine floors within the palace. Very interesting, indeed.

Also one does not enter the tunnel to the kitchen from the room next to the exterior wall of the basement but you enter the tunnel from the room that is to the right of the descending stairs that are shown on the plan.

The kitchen tunnel is actually  what might be considered a second basement level.

Are we having fun or what.

Douglas
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Douglas »

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: Floorplans of the Alexander Palace
« Reply #47 on: October 14, 2005, 05:14:36 PM »
Quote
 Helen:  

 In the United States we would use the  fancy word 'mezzanine' rather than 'entresol' to describe these spaces between the first and second floors.  Some of these appear to be open to the first floor and some may have been closed off.


Hmmm... I am wondering if I am thinking of something totally different. I saw some pre-WWII pictures of what some of the rooms on the first floor looked like before they were reconstructed - including the family room (Maple Room?), and it had a huge loft, sort of like the one in the restored Nicholas's New Study:



Is this what is being referred to as "entresol" or "mezzanine", or something totally different? Thanks again!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by helenazar »

Offline Douglas

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Re: Floorplans of the Alexander Palace
« Reply #48 on: October 14, 2005, 06:02:53 PM »
Yes, Helen , the photo you post is exactly what we are talking about when we use the term mezzanine or entresol.

Actually I have never heard the word 'entresol' before today.

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: Floorplans of the Alexander Palace
« Reply #49 on: October 14, 2005, 06:13:48 PM »
Quote

 Actually I have never heard the word 'entresol' before today.


I think it's French, but I thought it meant "attic"...

Quote
Yes, Helen , the photo you post is exactly what we are talking about when we use the term mezzanine or entresol.


I guess I call it a "loft"  :D. In any case, yes there was a mezzanine or a loft in the Maple Room, which I think is the official name for the family Room. The loft was taking up the space where the hallway now is. The hallway was the extention of the Maple Room and the ceiling in the hallway is where the loft was. And it somehow connected to the Empresses Boudoir if I remember correctly, and from there to Nicholas's New Study which had the same type of a loft. And this is how the Empress used to sneak to Nicholas's study unseen, and hid in the loft to listen in on his conversations with the officials  ;).



Offline Douglas

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Re: Floorplans of the Alexander Palace
« Reply #50 on: October 14, 2005, 07:17:41 PM »
Helen:

The plans show  that if one were in the Maple Room [part of the Empress's domain] you could easily access the New Study  [the domain of the Tsar] by going up the stairs inside the Maple Room which leads to an upper hallway [New Study Balcony].  Once you are in the  New Study Balcony [which is directly above the main hallway of the first floor] you then have access to  the Tsars' 'New Study'.   All very Byzantine and exotic.

* Yes, 'entresol' is French and means ' a space between the first and second floors.  Sol = floor.  entre = between.

That's the language lesson for today!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Douglas »

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: Floorplans of the Alexander Palace
« Reply #51 on: October 14, 2005, 09:00:13 PM »
Quote
Helen:

The plans show  that if one were in the Maple Room [part of the Empress's domain] you could easily access the New Study  [the domain of the Tsar] by going up the stairs inside the Maple Room which leads to an upper hallway.  Once you are in the short mezzanine hallway [which is directly above the main hallway of the first floor] you then have access to the mezzanine inside  the Tsars' 'New Study'.  
 


Yes, that sounds right, Doug. I have all this in my notes somewhere from when I talked to the curator at the AP for my research study, but I have to dig through them. But I do remember that it was something like this. When they showed me around, they even let me go up the stairs about half way in Nicholas's study to see what it looked like upstairs (the part where Alexandra sneaked to listen in :D).

Offline ChristineM

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Re: Floorplans of the Alexander Palace
« Reply #52 on: October 15, 2005, 06:10:24 AM »
In the corridor, it is still possible to see where the ceilling was lowered to accommodate the passage between the Maple Room and the New Study.    

I have been in the New Study entresol.   There is a door which would have led to the passage.   I imagine this has been shut off given the Maple Room entresol has been destroyed.

tsaria

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: Floorplans of the Alexander Palace
« Reply #53 on: October 15, 2005, 11:59:05 AM »
Quote
In the corridor, it is still possible to see where the ceilling was lowered to accommodate the passage between the Maple Room and the New Study.    
tsaria


Yes, that's right.

Offline Vladimir_V.

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Re: Floorplans of the Alexander Palace
« Reply #54 on: October 15, 2005, 01:01:01 PM »
The translation of the names the mezzanine rooms:

1. The Aleksandra’s Wardrobe (not extant)
2. The Tsar`s Wardrobe (not extant)
3. The Bathroom (not extant)
4. The room of the Tsar`s valet (not extant)
5. The room of the wardrobe mistress (not extant)
6. The Balcony of the Maple Room (not extant)
7. The Balcony of the Tsar`s New Study (extant)
8. The room for the Aleksey`s things
9. The room of the Maria Fyodorovna`s wardrobe mistress
10. The Maria Fyodorovna`s Wardrobe
11. The room of the servants
12. The room of the servants
13. The room of the Elizabeth Fyodorovna`s servant
14. The room of the duty officer’s help (in Russian: sluzhitel dezhurnogo fligel-ad`yutanta)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Vladimir_V. »

Offline Douglas

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Re: Floorplans of the Alexander Palace
« Reply #55 on: October 15, 2005, 06:06:20 PM »
Hi Vlad:

Thank you for posting the key to the mezzanine!  Room number  8 must have been a treasure chest of toys.

Douglas

Offline Douglas

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Re: Floorplans of the Alexander Palace
« Reply #56 on: October 15, 2005, 07:11:11 PM »

Bob writes:
  I was just reviewing the Entresols plan and was curious as to why it was showing window openings in these rooms.  My speculation is that whom ever drew up the plan used either the first or second floor plan and just drew in the rooms in reference to the other floors.
I ve looked at pictures of the palace exterior and there are certainly no windows shown between floors 1 and 2.
Strange, huh?
Bob G

Doug here:

There actually are little windows in some of the mezzanine rooms.  If you look carefully at some exterior photos you can see that the upper half of the tall two storey  windows are divided into a lower solid panel and an upper window for the mezzanine room.

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Douglas »

Offline Reco

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Re: Floorplans of the Alexander Palace
« Reply #57 on: October 16, 2005, 01:09:23 AM »
The entresols (between the first floor and the second floor) and the translation of the names the mezzanine rooms from Vladimir_V.




Offline pers

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Re: Floorplans of the Alexander Palace
« Reply #58 on: October 16, 2005, 09:40:34 AM »
Vladimir,

Could you please post the main floor of the Alexander Palace as it appears in this book?  It is probably exactly the same as the one on the website, but just for the sake of the scale that appears at the bottom of the plans.

Also can you make out whether the scale is in feet or arshin or sazhen or meters?

Thank you SO MUCH in advance.  I really want to say that it is wonderful that you are so kind to share all of this with us lesser mortals!

Offline brnbg aka: liljones1968

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Re: Floorplans of the Alexander Palace
« Reply #59 on: October 16, 2005, 12:22:00 PM »
Quote
Brian

The book has the plans of the AP, the Kitchen building, the pavilions and one cross-section of the AP.
There are also many photographs (porcelain, paintings, jewels), but the quality of the print is low.



i, just now, noticed that you mentioned "jewels".    what sort of jewels are pictured in the book?   i'm curious because i was under the impression that whatever jewels may have been left behind had been removed to moscow by the time of the books publication.    i'm intrigued....  
"when i die, i hope i go like my grandfather --
peacefully in my sleep; not screaming & in terror,
like the passengers in his car."

-- anonymous
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