Author Topic: The Yusupov fortune before 1917 - richer than Romanovs?  (Read 31852 times)

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james_h

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Re: The Yusupov fortune before 1917 - richer than Romanovs?
« Reply #45 on: November 10, 2005, 12:43:19 PM »


I've clearly offended you, for that I appologise.

I must make a distiction however, I did not call you personally,  "Borderline Daft" merely your opinion. I've not once insulted you personally.

In any forum there is rarely consensus of opinion, yet you seem angry. I'll not contribute further to this discussion it's making me really uncomfortable.

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Re: The Yusupov fortune before 1917 - richer than Romanovs?
« Reply #46 on: November 12, 2005, 09:38:10 AM »
I pulled this over from another thread on this very subject:

According to Jacques Ferrand, Felix made a list in 1962 (re printed in his book) of just the real estate propeties they held before the Revolution and their values at the time. The total just for these properties is just over 50,000,000 gold rubles. This does not include factories, income, the theatre, art, silver, jewels etc etc. A rough modern figure would be perhaps $750 million to 1 billion. Ferrand states the family fortune before 1900 was the equivalent of $500,000,000 in gold in 1900 dollars. That would again be the equivalent of perhaps 7.5-10 BILLION US$ today. Not a trifling sum in any event.

Just found this for some comparison: The Imperial Court's expenses (The Minister of the Court's entire expenses)for the Coronation year of 1896 was only 13 million rubles. Construction of the Trans-Siberian railway, the whole thing, cost 86 million rubles. So, put that in perspective...

Offline AkshayChavan

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Re: The Yusupov fortune before 1917 - richer than Romanovs?
« Reply #47 on: November 12, 2005, 03:30:11 PM »
Could you please tell me where can i find this list which felix made in 1962? In which book is this in?

james_h

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Re: The Yusupov fortune before 1917 - richer than Romanovs?
« Reply #48 on: November 12, 2005, 08:28:08 PM »
Try to put the Yusupov fortune into historical perspective by comparing Princess Zinaida Yusupova's net worth at the time of the revolution with the Russian Empires GNP at that same time.

I suspect it is worth more, much much more, than USD$7.5 Billion - USD$10 Billion today.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by james_h »

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Re: The Yusupov fortune before 1917 - richer than Romanovs?
« Reply #49 on: November 13, 2005, 11:40:44 AM »
"Les Princes YOUSSOUPOFF & les comtes SOUMARKOFF ELSTON" by Jacques Ferrand, Paris 1991.


Offline TampaBay

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Re: The Yusupov fortune before 1917 - richer than Romanovs?
« Reply #50 on: November 25, 2005, 07:05:44 AM »
Does anyone know how much GD Marie received annually as a "dowry/allowance" from "Russia" upon her marriage to Alfred of Edinburgh.  I would really like to know hom much $$$ the "Richest Princess" in the world really had.

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Offline Marc

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Re: The Yusupov fortune before 1917 - richer than Romanovs?
« Reply #51 on: December 20, 2005, 06:56:32 PM »
Sorry,this might be off topic,but I read that the ''heir'' of Stroganov wealth or better some parts that could be colected after the wars is a german Baroness Helene von Ludinghausen who borrowed some works of art to some museum in Netherlands(I think) for exibition...

Offline AkshayChavan

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Re: The Yusupov fortune before 1917 - richer than Romanovs?
« Reply #52 on: December 21, 2005, 01:32:14 PM »
I found interesting sentences in Zenaida's letters to Felix. At end of one of the letters she writes

"I have been all over Yalta in search of presents to put on to the Christmas Tree. One can really get everything, but the prices are so outrageous that we have decided to ask you to bring the presents with you. For instance, a cigar-holder which used to cost fifteen roubles at Morozov, costs here forty-three roubles. "

                                   Can someone please explain this? Why would the richest woman in russia have problem buying christmas gifts? I find this very strange


Offline TampaBay

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Re: The Yusupov fortune before 1917 - richer than Romanovs?
« Reply #53 on: December 22, 2005, 12:56:39 PM »
Quote
I found interesting sentences in Zenaida's letters to Felix. At end of one of the letters she writes

"I have been all over Yalta in search of presents to put on to the Christmas Tree. One can really get everything, but the prices are so outrageous that we have decided to ask you to bring the presents with you. For instance, a cigar-holder which used to cost fifteen roubles at Morozov, costs here forty-three roubles. "

                                    Can someone please explain this? Why would the richest woman in russia have problem buying christmas gifts? I find this very strange



Zenaida was not a spendthrift by any stretch of the imagination.  Though she aquired many highly valuable  fine "things and stuff", she new the value of a rouble.  

Unlike most of the Grand Dukes and Grand Duchesses, Zenaida understood money.

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« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by TampaBay »
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Offline lancashireladandre

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Re: The Yusupov fortune before 1917 - richer than Romanovs?
« Reply #54 on: December 23, 2005, 11:19:39 AM »
Quote
I found interesting sentences in Zenaida's letters to Felix. At end of one of the letters she writes

"I have been all over Yalta in search of presents to put on to the Christmas Tree. One can really get everything, but the prices are so outrageous that we have decided to ask you to bring the presents with you. For instance, a cigar-holder which used to cost fifteen roubles at Morozov, costs here forty-three roubles. "

                                    Can someone please explain this? Why would the richest woman in russia have problem buying christmas gifts? I find this very strange


Zenaida like many rich people didn't like to be overcharged just because she was rich....Although this is not exactly on this thread, the Princesses' Christmas gifts were lavish, Cartier was one source and Prince Serge Obolensky would remember going to the Moika palace - and indeed other aristocratic homes-with suitcases to carry the booty home  !!!

Offline AkshayChavan

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Re: The Yusupov fortune before 1917 - richer than Romanovs?
« Reply #55 on: December 27, 2005, 02:49:35 PM »
We have heard a lot about the Yussupov business empire. But little is known about who created it and how large was it. While reading the book “THE BEGINNINGS OF RUSSIAN INDUSTRALIATION” by William J Blackwell of Princeton University, I came across interesting info on Yussupovs. In the chapter “NOBLES AS ENTREPRENUER AND INVESTOR” , he writes about the Yussupov and Sheremetev families. I wish to share this info with other members of this forum. It will help us understand the Yussupov and Sheremetev finances.

On page 202, He writes:

“ The Sheremetevs with over 2,00,000 serfs were the greatest landlords of old Russia. Nikolai Petrovich Sheremetev and his son Dimitri Petrovich Sheremetev , had no interest in either state or military service or in increasing their wealth . They were grands seignuers of the old school whose primary occupation , economically speaking was to spend their family fortune. The father concentrated in building palaces wile the son found religious solace in extravagant philanthropy. Apart from their eccentricities and obsessions, both spend largest amount of their annual income on maintenance of the household. These were constant and increasing costs , which absorbed most of the Sheremetev money unproductively , since little attempt was made to amortize the debts or cut back on foreign teachers and their expensive salaries. Bulk of the Sheremetev income came from the obrok of their empire of peasants. In 1859, this amounted to 589,000 roubles out of a total annual income of 702,000 roubles. The pittance gained from sale of produce testifies to lack of commercialization of Sheremetev agriculture in pre-reform period.”

On page 203, he writes about the Yussupovs :

“The Iusupov budgets during the early 19th century present interesting contrasts and resemblances to those of Prince Kurakin and Count Sheremetev. Unlike his contemporaries, Boris Nikolaevich Iusupov, who ruled the family domains during the reign of Nicholas I  was the most entrepreneurial of the great Russian magnates. More than any other wealthy Russian landlord, the Iusupovs attempted to industrialise their estates and derived a major part of their income from their factories. On the other hand they consumed with an extravagance that can only be called magnificent. They borrowed with equal flourish.By the beginning of nineteenth century , the Iusupov holdings constituted a kind of agrarian empire. In 1806, 198 villages , in 9039 sq miles of property (222,143 desiatinas ) where 17,239 serfs served the family interest. A central and local hub was created to rule this empire. At the hub were Moscow and St Petersburg chancelleries , which sent out inspectors to regional administrations. The center for Iusupov administration in Ukraine was a major economic center in itself, a town of 2,320 inhabitants with shops, warehouses, factories, mills, barracks, administrative buildings,a tavern and a hospital.The cost of this administration was great but it did not even begin to match the personal expenses of Nikolai Borisovich Iusupov, a retired dignitary of Catherinean era. To finance his kingly scale of living , Iusupov bought estates , borrowed money, mortgaged serfs but above all he built factories. From first third of nineteenth century , from 25 to 50 % of Iusupov income came from these estate factories. These factories produced wool for the government , but also silk for consumer market. Attempts were made to increase production by introducing modern machinery. Boris Nikolaevich Iusupov succeeded to family estates in 1830’s. His soviet historian has classified him as “Landlord Entrepreneur” who quit the state service in 1837 to devout himself entirely to his properties , who was interested in making money and who introduced many reforms in Iusupov administration.”

This answers a lot of questions about where the Yussupov finances came from. It is sad so little is known about Prince Boris Nikolaevich Yussupov. I believe he must have been a great man.


Offline Annie

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Re: The Yusupov fortune before 1917 - richer than Romanovs?
« Reply #56 on: December 27, 2005, 09:55:58 PM »
Felix's daughter Bebe married into the Sheremetev family.

Offline lancashireladandre

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Re: The Yusupov fortune before 1917 - richer than Romanovs?
« Reply #57 on: December 28, 2005, 03:33:52 AM »
Boris of course inherited a substantial fortune from his mother,the Potemkin heiress Tatiana as well as the vast fortune of his father.According to Felix he left his entire estate to his wife Zenaida Ivanovna.

Offline hikaru

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Re: The Yusupov fortune before 1917 - richer than Romanovs?
« Reply #58 on: December 28, 2005, 03:42:58 AM »
Boris Nikolaevich Yusupov is very famouse, indeed.

Offline AkshayChavan

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Re: The Yusupov fortune before 1917 - richer than Romanovs?
« Reply #59 on: December 29, 2005, 05:43:09 PM »
The above passage talks about a major industrial town in Ukraine owned by the Yussupovs. Does anyone have an idea which town is he talking about?