Author Topic: Maria's letters & notes  (Read 99433 times)

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Offline Tsarina_Liz

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Re: Maria's letters & notes
« Reply #15 on: January 28, 2006, 08:44:52 PM »
Fudgsicles!   >:(  This is getting really frustrating.  
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Offline Lanie

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Re: Maria's letters & notes
« Reply #16 on: January 29, 2006, 12:41:05 AM »
I'm looking through A Lifelong Passion right now.  I think in FOTR they were assuming since they are taking what Alix had said in a note to Maria and assuming Maria wrote notes to Alix talking about how she felt unloved.

Offline Margarita Markovna

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Re: Maria's letters & notes
« Reply #17 on: January 29, 2006, 01:26:36 PM »
Quote
Thanks for the link, Ritka, but the ones Liz is looking for are not there. We're looking for two letters from March of 1910 -- the ones referred to (but, alas! not quoted) in FOTR as being indicative of poor relations between Alix and her daughters.

Thanks Sarushka. As I said, I haven't read her letters yet, so I wasn't sure if they were there or not..

Offline Elisabeth

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Re: Maria's letters & notes
« Reply #18 on: January 29, 2006, 01:40:40 PM »
I think Maria's letter to her mother on this particular occasion is not available in English translation (although, interesting to contemplate, it probably was originally written in English). At any rate, A Lifelong Passion only quotes Alexandra's response to Maria's letter (see pages 330-31). BTW, interesting to note, this was only three days after Tatiana wrote a very desperate, placating letter to Alexandra, begging her mother to forgive her for some seemingly major transgression. Presumably she had said something negative about Rasputin to Sophie Tiutcheva, the governess who was subsequently dismissed for her negative attitude towards the "holy" man. Tatiana: "I am so afread that S.I. [Tiutcheva] can speak to Maria about our friend some thing bad. I hope our nurse will be nice to our friend now. Please tell Papa that I also ask him my pardon," etc., etc.

It sounds as if Alexandra had her hands full that particular week!!! But it also sounds as if she had been ill and not in direct contact with any of her children. One crisis after another, and Alexandra just kept writing letters...  
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Offline Sarushka

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Re: Maria's letters & notes
« Reply #19 on: January 30, 2006, 08:45:51 AM »
Quote
I think Maria's letter to her mother on this particular occasion is not available in English translation (although, interesting to contemplate, it probably was originally written in English).

Have you seen the letter in Russian, Elisabeth? I can read Russian, and would gladly translate!
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Offline Elisabeth

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Re: Maria's letters & notes
« Reply #20 on: January 30, 2006, 10:06:35 AM »
Sorry, Sarushka, I haven't been able to locate it anywhere, either in Russian or English. Maybe it simply has never been published.
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Offline Tsarina_Liz

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Re: Maria's letters & notes
« Reply #21 on: January 30, 2006, 11:59:09 AM »
Well, I give up.  I can't find it.  I've even tried getting in contact with GARF to see where they had been published.
Hindsight is 20/20.  When the myopic haze of of the present is lifted by the march of time we see it clearly as the past.  Sociology, psychology, anthropology.  They are all means of understanding that which came before.  History cannot stand alone.

Offline matushka

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Re: Maria's letters & notes
« Reply #22 on: February 05, 2006, 04:26:02 PM »
Sarushka, see Divny Svet, I think the Tatiana's letter is there. I am pretty sure I read it in this book.

Offline snugglemummy

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Re: Maria's letters & notes
« Reply #23 on: February 06, 2006, 12:15:35 AM »
We don't actually know the full extent of Alexandra's response to Maria's letters. For all we know, she could have written those replies and had a face-to-face talk with her daughter about her issues. I myself often write notes to my daughter to emphasise points in our conversations about delicate matters. I imagine Alexandra, who was very much into writing intimate letters to her friends and family, may have felt even more inclined to do so.

It is also possible that Maria only wrote one letter to her mother, and the second one FOTR claimed does not even exist - Alexandra's second letter may have been a follow-up to an actual conversation. That may be why it can not be found.

I thought FOTR was great in general, but the section which criticised Alexandra's parenting aggravated me because we can not say what really went on. We can not judge a situation based on a couple of letters. Infact, when I read Alexandra's notes I personally thought they were lovely and showed her great interest in Marie's situation, and that she was aware of what was going on with her daughters emotions. I also felt they were part of an ongoing conversation.

There, sorry, rave over!
Sarah.

Offline observer

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Re: Maria's letters & notes
« Reply #24 on: June 19, 2006, 12:09:21 PM »
Hey everybody, does anoyone know if this letter has been translated and where I could find an English version? Or does anoyone think they could translate it themself?

I've been working on it but I'm very, very new to the Russian and there's quite a few places I got lost.

Thank you!

[ch1052][ch1099] [ch1078][ch1080][ch1074][ch1077][ch1084] [ch1090][ch1080][ch1093][ch1086], [ch1075][ch1091][ch1083][ch1103][ch1077][ch1084] [ch1087][ch1086]-[ch1087][ch1088][ch1077][ch1078][ch1085][ch1077][ch1084][ch1091] [ch1076][ch1074][ch1072] [ch1088][ch1072][ch1079][ch1072] [ch1074] [ch1076][ch1077][ch1085][ch1100]. [ch1055][ch1086][ch1075][ch1086][ch1076][ch1072] [ch1089][ch1090][ch1086][ch1080][ch1090] [ch1093][ch1086][ch1088][ch1086][ch1096][ch1072][ch1103], [ch1101][ch1090][ch1080] [ch1076][ch1085][ch1080] [ch1073][ch1099][ch1083] [ch1076][ch1086][ch1074][ch1086][ch1083][ch1100][ch1085][ch1086] [ch1089][ch1080][ch1083][ch1100][ch1085][ch1099][ch1081] [ch1084][ch1086][ch1088][ch1086][ch1079]. [ch1040] [ch1091] [ch1042][ch1072][ch1089] [ch1085][ch1072][ch1074][ch1077][ch1088][ch1085][ch1086][ch1077] [ch1077][ch1097][ch1077] [ch1090][ch1077][ch1087][ch1083][ch1072][ch1103] [ch1087][ch1086][ch1075][ch1086][ch1076][ch1072]? 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[ch1052][ch1072][ch1088][ch1080][ch1103].

Offline observer

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Re: Maria's letters & notes
« Reply #25 on: June 19, 2006, 12:20:18 PM »
Hey everybody, does anoyone know if this letter has been translated and where I could find an English version? Or does anoyone think they could translate it ?
I've been working on it but I'm very, very new to the Russian and there's quite a few places I got lost.

Thank you!

[ch1052][ch1099] [ch1078][ch1080][ch1074][ch1077][ch1084] [ch1090][ch1080][ch1093][ch1086], [ch1075][ch1091][ch1083][ch1103][ch1077][ch1084] [ch1087][ch1086]-[ch1087][ch1088][ch1077][ch1078][ch1085][ch1077][ch1084][ch1091] [ch1076][ch1074][ch1072] [ch1088][ch1072][ch1079][ch1072] [ch1074] [ch1076][ch1077][ch1085][ch1100]. [ch1055][ch1086][ch1075][ch1086][ch1076][ch1072] [ch1089][ch1090][ch1086][ch1080][ch1090] [ch1093][ch1086][ch1088][ch1086][ch1096][ch1072][ch1103], [ch1101][ch1090][ch1080] [ch1076][ch1085][ch1080] [ch1073][ch1099][ch1083] [ch1076][ch1086][ch1074][ch1086][ch1083][ch1100][ch1085][ch1086] [ch1089][ch1080][ch1083][ch1100][ch1085][ch1099][ch1081] [ch1084][ch1086][ch1088][ch1086][ch1079]. [ch1040] [ch1091] [ch1042][ch1072][ch1089] [ch1085][ch1072][ch1074][ch1077][ch1088][ch1085][ch1086][ch1077] [ch1077][ch1097][ch1077] [ch1090][ch1077][ch1087][ch1083][ch1072][ch1103] [ch1087][ch1086][ch1075][ch1086][ch1076][ch1072]? 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[ch1050][ch1072][ch1082] [ch1074][ch1089][ch1077] [ch1101][ch1090][ch1086] [ch1082][ch1072][ch1078][ch1077][ch1090][ch1089][ch1103] [ch1076][ch1072][ch1074][ch1085][ch1086] [ch1073][ch1099][ch1083][ch1086]. [ch1055][ch1088][ch1072][ch1074][ch1076][ch1072]? [ch1053][ch1091] [ch1084][ch1085][ch1077] [ch1087][ch1086][ch1088][ch1072] [ch1082][ch1086][ch1085][ch1095][ch1072][ch1090][ch1100]. [ch1042][ch1089][ch1077][ch1075][ch1086] [ch1093][ch1086][ch1088][ch1086][ch1096][ch1077][ch1075][ch1086] [ch1078][ch1077][ch1083][ch1072][ch1102] [ch1042][ch1072][ch1084] [ch1080] [ch1082][ch1088][ch1077][ch1087][ch1082][ch1086] [ch1042][ch1072][ch1089] [ch1080] [ch1044][ch1072][ch1083][ch1102] ([ch1076][ch1086][ch1095][ch1100] [ch1047]. [ch1057]. [ch1058][ch1086][ch1083][ch1089][ch1090][ch1086][ch1081]) [ch1094][ch1077][ch1083][ch1091][ch1102]. [ch1042][ch1089][ch1077][ch1084] [ch1042][ch1072][ch1096][ch1080][ch1084] [ch1089][ch1077][ch1088][ch1076][ch1077][ch1095][ch1085][ch1099][ch1081] [ch1087][ch1088][ch1080][ch1074][ch1077][ch1090].

[ch1052][ch1072][ch1088][ch1080][ch1103].

Offline Sarushka

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Re: Maria's letters & notes
« Reply #26 on: June 19, 2006, 12:29:58 PM »
Do you have a date for the letter -- even an approximate one? I've made myself a database of my collection of the imperial family's letters from exile, so if you have a date, I can look it up and see if it's been translated.
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Offline grandduchess_42

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Re: Maria's letters & notes
« Reply #27 on: June 19, 2006, 01:13:44 PM »
We live silently, we walk still two times a day. Weather costs good, these days were strong enough frost. And at you probably still warm weather? I envy, that you see the wonderful sea! Today we went to 8 o'clock in the morning to impoverish. So we are always pleased, when us start up in church, certainly this church to compare it is impossible with our cathedral (1), but all the same it is better, than in a room. Now all we sit at themselves in a room. Sisters too write, dogs run and ask on knees. Often I recollect Tsarskoe Selo and cheerful concerts in an infirmary; remember, how it was amusing, when wounded men danced; also we recollect walks in [ch1055][ch1072][ch1074][ch1083][ch1086][ch1074][ch1089][ch1082] and your small crew, morning prodrivings by your house. As all this seemed for a long time. The truth? Well it is time to me to finish. All good I wish you and it is strong you and [ch1044][ch1072][ch1083][ch1102] (daughter Z.S.Tolstoj) the whole. All yours intimate greetings. Maria.
So keep me awake for every moment
Give us more time to be this way
We can't stay like this forever
But I can have you next to me today
. Josh Groban .

Offline observer

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Re: Maria's letters & notes
« Reply #28 on: June 19, 2006, 03:56:20 PM »
Hey!

Yes, a date wouldv'e been helpful. It seems I chopped it off in my haste to cut and paste. I think it was one of the letters from Tobolsk that I found in a link from one of the threads here.

Thanks for the translation. I'm assuming the awkwardness of phrase stems from the difficulties of Russian to english translation and is not attributable to just poor grammar on the part of the GD. But I'm very new at this.

Did you translate yourself or is there somewhere I can go to find this stuff?

David_Pritchard

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Re: Maria's letters & notes
« Reply #29 on: June 19, 2006, 04:15:14 PM »
Thank you for the translation. A bit literal though. I will try to improve upon your work, there are a few mistranslated words..

We live quietly, still taking walks twice in a day. The weather remains good, these days had a rather strong frost. And with you, probably still warm weather? I envy, that you can see the marvellous sea! Today we went to Mass at 8 o'clock in the morning. Well we are always pleased when we begin (the day) in church, certainly this church is impossible to compare to our cathedral, but all the same it is better, than being in a room║. Now all we do is sit by ourselves in a room║. The sisters write also, the dogs run and beg. Often I think about Tsarskoe Selo; the cheerful concerts in the infirmary; remember how it was so amusing when the wounded men danced; we also think about the walks at Pavlosk and your small carriage, morning (carriage) drives past your house. How all this seems a long time ago, true? Well it is time for me to finish. I wish all the good and strength for you and Dalya's▓ entire well being.

With intimate greetings, yours,

Maria.


║ The word room might also be interpreted to mean 'indoors'.
▓ The daughter of Z.S.Tolstoy.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by David_Pritchard »