Author Topic: The Legacy of Nicholas II  (Read 14498 times)

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Offline anna

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The Legacy of Nicholas II
« on: August 08, 2004, 04:48:34 PM »
This peace conference was held on Palace Huis den Bosch in The Hague in 1899. The conference was requested by Nicholas II, to discuss rules to limit warfare and attempt arms limitations. 26 countries attended. On this occasion Nicholas presented an album to Queen Wilhelmina. The second meeting was in 1907 called by Theodore Roosevelt, 44 countries attended.

These conferences were the best way to handle international problems. World War I prevented the next meeting.
Were these meetings successful? I couldn't find anything Nicholas mentioning this in letters or diary. Not even an note of his journey to Holland. Did he attend the second meeting?
As these conferences were so important to solve international problems, why couldn't they prevent War?

Anna
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Offline anna

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Re: The Legacy of Nicholas II
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2004, 10:23:43 AM »
Hi Harald,

Thanks for answering my questions. An article about  the "Kurhaus/Scheveningen" in saturdays newspaper ..Algemeen Dagblad.. said Nicholas actually stayed there during Peace conference. So it must have been the Russian Delegation staying at the hotel.

Though it's a pity he never visited Holland, speaking of  famlily relations between the two countries. Maybe we were not important enough on political view, being neutral and too petite.

Anna
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Offline kaatje

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Re: The Legacy of Nicholas II
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2004, 11:18:04 AM »
Though I can't be certain of this without actually looking this up, the reason the peace conferences could'nt do anything to stop WW1, is because:

1. The conferenc was set up to resolve disagreements between 2 countries, who were prepared to follow such rules that were given to them

2. No country could be forced to attend and cooperate, and the outcome was not legally binding, it was so to speak a gentleman's agreement.

3. Solving wars dos not seem to be part of it's agenda, most often it is minor disputes and it doesn't seem to have helped with any subsequent wars either

This though is what I gathered when I visited the place last year, and got a guided tour.

Katie

Offline anna

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Re: The Legacy of Nicholas II
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2004, 05:35:26 PM »
Kaatje,

Yes unfortunately they couldn't prevent war, but this was the forthcoming result:quote from an article on the web:

The conferences were very important : they gave an
important impetus to the development of the humanitarian right, established the permanent court of arbitration and gave the beginning to the establishment of the people association, the permanent Court of Justice (arbitration) and the continuators of it: the United Nations and the international Court of Justice.

Anna
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Offline kaatje

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Re: The Legacy of Nicholas II
« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2004, 08:58:45 AM »
Anna,

Yes I agree with you, without the Peace palace many seemingly small, petty arguments between countries may have progressed further along the road to war.

Katie

Offline RichC

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Re: The Legacy of Nicholas II
« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2007, 02:34:39 PM »
What is the legacy of Nicholas II?  How did his occupying the Russian throne for 22 years at the beginning of the 20th century change the world?

Anyone care to comment?

Offline Belochka

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Re: The Legacy of Nicholas II
« Reply #6 on: March 18, 2007, 06:05:13 AM »
What is the legacy of Nicholas II?  How did his occupying the Russian throne for 22 years at the beginning of the 20th century change the world?

Anyone care to comment?

Without a doubt it would have to be Nikolai II's proposal before the world stage in 1898 to limit arms and for the attainment of world peace.

That initiative paved the way for the Hague Conferences to be convened and at which all European States had participated. Russia called for the first two Conferences, in 1899 and then in 1907.

To recognize Nikolai's direct imput the proceedings were convened on the day of his birthday May 6/18, 1899.

The setting up of a Court of Arbitration at the Hague and the adoption of a number of agreements that were ratified must be considered to be Nikolai II's legacy on the international stage.

These Conferences defined the future rules in formulating international law. Thus Nikolai's sincere initiative had far reaching implications which remain with us today.

Thank you for the question.

Margarita
  :)
 
« Last Edit: March 18, 2007, 06:09:39 AM by Belochka »


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Offline mr_harrison75

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Re: The Legacy of Nicholas II
« Reply #7 on: March 18, 2007, 09:43:37 AM »
Well, he also set in motion the massive industrialization of Russia, and introduced (unwillingly perhaps, but I think he felt, at the bottom of his heart, that it was the right thing to do, but at the same time, he was still very much conflicted with his idea of autocratic Russia) democracy in Russia.

He also pushed for the completion of the Transsiberian railroad, which was not a little thing...

By the way, I was reading a book by Hélène Carrère d'Encausse (a French historian specialized in Russian History) called Nicholas II, an interrupted transition, which speaks volumes about the legacy of Nicholas II, especially changes in State matters, society and economy, to be brief, modernization of Russia.

I was left thoughtful after having read that book, because we generally imagine (and are told) that Russia was in total chaos during his rule, but it wasn't the case at all; basically, it was a race between his reforms and the revolutionnaries seizing power, and until 1910, he had the upper hand, but he made some serious mistakes that gave the advantage to socialists and revolutionnaries...and effectively stopping the transition, until the end of communist Russia.

Nicholas II was not as inept as we would think...all in all, a very interesting read!

Offline Kurt Steiner

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Re: The Legacy of Nicholas II
« Reply #8 on: March 18, 2007, 03:46:52 PM »
Very interesting information, indeed! I didn't know that Nicholas was so essentil at the Hague Conferences. Shame on me.

Offline Belochka

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Re: The Legacy of Nicholas II
« Reply #9 on: March 18, 2007, 07:26:49 PM »
... By the way, I was reading a book by Hélène Carrère d'Encausse (a French historian specialized in Russian History) called Nicholas II, an interrupted transition, which speaks volumes about the legacy of Nicholas II, especially changes in State matters, society and economy, to be brief, modernization of Russia.

I was left thoughtful after having read that book ...

Nicholas II was not as inept as we would think...all in all, a very interesting read!

I completely agree with you!  d'Encausse is probably the fairest book to read about Nikolai II along with Dominic Lieven's informative book.

Margarita
:)


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Offline Binky

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Re: The Legacy of Nicholas II
« Reply #10 on: March 23, 2007, 02:38:46 PM »
Well, he also set in motion the massive industrialization of Russia, and introduced (unwillingly perhaps, but I think he felt, at the bottom of his heart, that it was the right thing to do, but at the same time, he was still very much conflicted with his idea of autocratic Russia) democracy in Russia.

He also pushed for the completion of the Transsiberian railroad, which was not a little thing...

By the way, I was reading a book by Hélène Carrère d'Encausse (a French historian specialized in Russian History) called Nicholas II, an interrupted transition, which speaks volumes about the legacy of Nicholas II, especially changes in State matters, society and economy, to be brief, modernization of Russia.

I was left thoughtful after having read that book, because we generally imagine (and are told) that Russia was in total chaos during his rule, but it wasn't the case at all; basically, it was a race between his reforms and the revolutionnaries seizing power, and until 1910, he had the upper hand, but he made some serious mistakes that gave the advantage to socialists and revolutionnaries...and effectively stopping the transition, until the end of communist Russia.

Nicholas II was not as inept as we would think...all in all, a very interesting read!

What happened in 1910?  Didn't a lot of people revolt in 1905 and make Nicholas do some things he didn't want to.  I heard one time that Alexandra and Nicholas mother were crying when Nicholas let the Duma open and that he didn't really wnat to do it but they didn't let him chose about it.  Becuase they had a revolution in 1905 not 1910 when I think Nicholas thought every thing was okay.  And I don't know what it means about the end of communist Russia.  I think Nicholas had been killed a long time by then.

Offline mr_harrison75

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Re: The Legacy of Nicholas II
« Reply #11 on: March 23, 2007, 10:22:10 PM »
Ok, I think the author meant that, although he didn't want to have a Douma, Nicolai II was stuck with it, and had to rule Russia with the Douma in mind, so because he gave democracy to the people, and things were going better, with a Douma, he took the advantage over the revolutionaries (I'm keeping it simple, the book was going into much more details).

I said 1910, but in fact, it's more 1911, especially with Stolypin's death; he was the only man who could influence the Tsar into making more good than bad decisions; the man was efficient. But after that, the Tsar fell back to old ministers and bad decision making, and the advantage fell back to the revolutionnaries, who didn't miss their chance...

The transition from feodal Russia to modern Russia begun by Alexander II, and continued by Nicholas II was effectively stopped by the Russian revolution, and the (chaotic) modernization of the country only resumed with the end of communist Russia...
« Last Edit: March 23, 2007, 10:27:36 PM by mr_harrison75 »

TheAce1918

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Re: The Legacy of Nicholas II
« Reply #12 on: March 28, 2007, 10:41:07 AM »
Well, he also set in motion the massive industrialization of Russia, and introduced (unwillingly perhaps, but I think he felt, at the bottom of his heart, that it was the right thing to do, but at the same time, he was still very much conflicted with his idea of autocratic Russia) democracy in Russia.

He also pushed for the completion of the Transsiberian railroad, which was not a little thing...

By the way, I was reading a book by Hélène Carrère d'Encausse (a French historian specialized in Russian History) called Nicholas II, an interrupted transition, which speaks volumes about the legacy of Nicholas II, especially changes in State matters, society and economy, to be brief, modernization of Russia.


100% agree.  I would also have to say that his legacy has made him one of Russia's more recognizable and popular subjects in recent memory.

Another author who has covered the legacy of Nicholas II is Marc Ferro, his works are very in-depth and always good reads.  ;)

Offline Inok Nikolai

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Re: The Legacy of Nicholas II
« Reply #13 on: January 27, 2012, 05:25:43 PM »

Without a doubt it would have to be Nikolai II's proposal before the world stage in 1898 to limit arms and for the attainment of world peace.

That initiative paved the way for the Hague Conferences to be convened and at which all European States had participated. Russia called for the first two Conferences, in 1899 and then in 1907.

To recognize Nikolai's direct imput the proceedings were convened on the day of his birthday May 6/18, 1899.

The setting up of a Court of Arbitration at the Hague and the adoption of a number of agreements that were ratified must be considered to be Nikolai II's legacy on the international stage.

These Conferences defined the future rules in formulating international law. Thus Nikolai's sincere initiative had far reaching implications which remain with us today.

Thank you for the question.

Margarita
  :)
 

U. S. President Harding and Secretary of State Hughes agree with that evaluation of Tsar Nicholas II, and they quoted the Emperor at length when opening a similar conference in 1921.

See Google books:
http://tinyurl.com/6uo86es
(pp. 4-5)

Address of Charles E. Hughes, Secretary of State of the United States,
and American Commissioner to the Conference of Limitation of Armament, on Assuming the Duties of Presiding Officer at the Conference
Washington D. C.
November 12, 1921


“...The proposal to limit armament by an agreement of the Powers is not a new one, and we are admonished by the futility of earlier efforts. It may be well to recall the noble aspirations which were voiced twenty-three years ago in the imperial rescript of His Majesty the Emperor of Russia. It was then pointed out with clarity and emphasis that:

‘The intellectual and physical strength of the nations, labor, and capital are for the major part diverted from their natural application and unproductively consumed. Hundreds of millions are devoted to acquiring terrible engines of destruction, which, though to-day regarded as the last word of science, are destined tomorrow to lose all value in consequence of some fresh discovery in the same field. National culture, economic progress. and the production of wealth are either paralyzed or checked in their development. Moreover, in proportion as the armaments of each Power increase, so do they less and less fulfill the object which the Governments have set before themselves. The economic crises, due in great part to the system of armaments a l’outrance and the continual danger which lies in this massing of war materials, are transforming the armed peace of our days into a crushing burden, which the peoples have more and more difficulty in bearing. It appears evident, then, that if this state of things were prolonged it would inevitably lead to the calamity which it is desired to avert, and the horrors of which make every thinking man shudder in advance. To put an end to these incessant armaments and to seek the means of warding off the calamities which are threatening the whole world — such is the supreme duty which is to-day imposed on all States.'

It was with this sense of obligation that His Majesty the Emperor of Russia proposed the Conference, which was ‘to occupy itself with this grave problem’ and which met at The Hague in the year 1899.”

инок Николай

Offline Inok Nikolai

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Re: The Legacy of Nicholas II
« Reply #14 on: January 27, 2012, 05:26:43 PM »

And the American business magazine Success, established in 1897, even put Tsar Nicholas II's picture on its cover in 1899 on the occasion of the Hague Conference:




With this text on p. 372:

The Czar’s Peace Conference

An Autocrat Whose Aim is to Benefit and Improve Humanity Without Fostering Anarchy

On the first page of Success appears the latest and finest photograph of the most powerful ruler in the world — Nicholas II, Czar of all the Russias. The Autocrat of the Russian Empire is the only absolute monarch on earth. His personal authority is without any limitation except that created by himself. His orders must be obeyed, without hesitation or criticism, from the Baltic Sea to Bering Strait, from Archangel to Odessa, throughout the vast area of his domains.

The Empress Catherine, who refused to sell her subjects to England to fight against Americans in the Revolutionary War, and who, next to Peter the Great, did more to extend Russian power than any other sovereign, summoned the prefect of police to her presence, one day, and ordered him to have a deceased poodle, named Sutherland, after a celebrated banker in St. Petersburg, skinned and stuffed. When the prefect hesitated, the empress thought he considered the task beneath his dignity, and laughingly repeated the command. The prefect withdrew in great consternation, for he supposed the empress meant his friend, the banker, and not the poodle, and that the banker had in some way incurred the terrible anger of her majesty. The official went with trembling steps to the banker’s office and informed him of the imperial sentence. Sutherland, horrified, begged for permission to communicate with the empress, but the prefect, fearful of exciting her wrath after his former experience, granted the favor only after repeated pleading and with great reluctance. Of course, the tragedy was averted. The incident, however, illustrates the absolute power of the Russian autocrat over his subjects.

If autocracy were ever secure from abuse in any hands, it is so in the hands of the present czar. No sovereign could have the welfare of his subjects more deeply at heart. His great ideal is that of a Russian empire leading the world in the march toward universal peace, in the direction of that millennium of which intelligent Christians, Jews, Turks and pagans have dreamed for ages. The czar, however, is not a dreamer. He realizes that the only sound way to make the world better is to build up from established foundations, — not to overturn the fabric which is the work of centuries, and which, — however incomplete, — represents the efforts, the labors, the sacrifices of many generations. Not in his own interest, selfishly speaking, but in behalf of his own people, he will maintain, unimpaired, the mighty heritage of the Romanoffs, and carry forward that policy of redemption and civilization which is turning Central Asia from a robbers’ rendezvous into a garden of industry.

First among monarchs, the czar has taken practical steps toward universal peace by inviting the great nations of the world, including the United States, to the present Peace Conference at the Hague.

Americans are deeply interested in this conference. The United States has never been an aggressive power. All foreign wars in which the nation has been actively concerned, have been defensive, excepting perhaps, the late war with Spain, and that was morally, if not actually, of the same description. The armed forces of this country have been maintained, in times of peace, at the smallest possible standards, as to numbers, and the highest as to efficiency. There is no occasion, therefore, for the United States to disarm. This country is, however, a party to the Peace Conference, and will, no doubt, be glad to co-operate with the other great nations in any practical steps looking toward the abolition of war, with due regard for the honor and safety of the American people. With this view, President McKinley has appointed commissioner to take part in the conference.

инок Николай