Author Topic: Why do the people love Sissi??????  (Read 29665 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Nathalie

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 78
    • View Profile
Re: Why do the people love Sissi??????
« Reply #30 on: June 10, 2006, 07:25:19 AM »
Nah come on! Many of you talk like we were still in those king-and-queen ages... :-X So what she couldn't behave as a "proper princess"? Don't condemn her because of not being able to fit into a system what is so unjust and -IMO-alien to human nature (hereditary kingdoms, aristocrats)...
I wrote in an other thread this about ther last Tzar and I can only repeat it here, Elisabeth is a clear proof, how such systems damage a person's life.

certainly both are romantic and beautiful legends, but at least Diana knew the meaning 'duty'.

What duty she exactly had? Don't say, charity, cz I find such royaltie's charity rather hypocritic...just like the Pope's. If they'd really care, they could probably sell their diamonds and castles, come on, they have like 100 and people still and ere dying on streets. What other duty? Cercles? Visiting hospitals? Oh...

Im not a "fan" either. Im not a fan of any royal or prince, I prefer to be fan of certain peole, personalities, regardless of their lineage. An Arabic bedouin in the desert is even more keen to his horse's lineage, than any European aristocrat... :P
She was not fit into this and I would really welcome a psychological analysis, if there is any about her. Perhaps she was in love with the Kaiser, so what, she was 15, people usually don't keep their first love...Her wedding night's horror due to the shyness of the Victorien education...the humiliations, many of them because she didn't have "the proper blood" (her grandmother was not a royal, "just" a princess), etc etc...
How tragic!
And how ironic, that Lucheni found HER as his victim, her, who was already victimized by the system, what Lucheni hated.
she reminds me of the first wife of Joseph II., Isabelle, who could had been also like elisbaeth but (un?)fortunately due to her early death, we have only traces from her extraordinary abilities concerning writing, arts and some psychological hints and theories about her being...attracted to the fair sex as well.

Oh, and not to forget: she might had been instable...no wonder if she was...Its also an other crime of these lineage-maniac people back those days, marrying cousins with cousins-seems like for them, a menthally instabil or many times a sick, retarded "heir" was still better than a "non-royal".
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Nathalie »
Dites-moi, Vladimir Lvovich, si j'avais une amie ou une sśur plus jeune, et si vous appreniez qu’elle…enfin, supposons qu’elle vous aime…que feriez vous á cette nouvelle?

Offline Vaska_Meow

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 26
  • Eat my litter, Bolshie!
    • View Profile
Re: Why do the people love Sissi??????
« Reply #31 on: June 16, 2006, 02:25:18 PM »
While I don't "dislike" Sissi I must say that were I her child I would probably kill myself!

(Whooops, Hello Rudolf!)

To be honest I just don't understand the woman. Her beauty was stunning, still is in the pictures that have come down to us, and beauty is an incredibly powerful thing, but the poor child seems to have been a case of arrested development.

She never did learn to see herself in other people it seems.
Considering that they shared many views and personality traits she could have been such a help and support for her son but no, she ignored the boy quite literally to death!
She sniped at her daughter-in-law when she might have shown support in that quarter.

Her relations with her daughters veered between indifference and smothering favoritism.

I have no doubt that court was stultifying and at a time when personal naturalness was held in such low esteem there would have been almost no place at all where Sissi could simply let her miles of hair down and be herself while in Vienna.

I guess my problem is that she was such a basically venal woman. Look at Alexandra of Russia, she was shy, she was overwhelmed by a backstabbing court and a mother in law who, given an inch could be assured to take a mile, yet Alexandra reacted in a grown up way.

She attacked her new role as a mother head on and hewed to the ideal of creating a close and warm place within her family. She strove to share her interior world with her loved ones.

Sissi froze those who most needed her out. I suppose the difference is that Alexandra married as a woman who had had experience of suffering and overcoming painful situations by searching within. Sissi was simply a child who developed a crush on a picture book emperor and went headlong into a hothouse atmosphere before she'd even developed a "within".

So, why do people love Sissi? Probably because the glamour of position and the image of eternal beauty give her the aura of a glorious cast out angel who floated a foot above the mire and tragedy that surrounded her. Unfortunately she was a human woman whose refusal to take an active role in the lives of those dependent upon her is what led to the tragedy.

That, no doubt has a certain glamour too.
Vaska is back, and this time...it's personal.

Offline Guinastasia

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 175
  • Celestial Grand Duchess of Penguins
    • View Profile
Re: Why do the people love Sissi??????
« Reply #32 on: June 25, 2006, 11:09:43 AM »
IIRC, she suffered from either schizophrenia, or bipolar disorder.  Having an untreated mental illness, in her position, what else could one expect?  Also, didn't her husband infect her with the clap early on in their marriage?  I know if I had that happen to me, I don't think I'd be all that thrilled in my marriage!

I do agree though, her treatment of her children was horrible.  I feel sorry for poor Gisele.
May the road rise up to meet you.
May the wind always be at your back.
May the sun shine warm upon your face,
and rains fall soft upon your fields.
And until we meet again,
May God hold you in the palm of His hand.

Offline koloagirl

  • Graf
  • ***
  • Posts: 488
  • Loving each other and having faith always.
    • View Profile
Re: Why do the people love Sissi??????
« Reply #33 on: June 30, 2006, 09:21:41 PM »
 :)

I think that Sisi suffered from various mental illnesses that were not able to be diagnosed in her time.  Her lineage was riddled with people labeled "eccentric" - and who were in fact, probably mentally ill.  Certainly her cousin, Ludwig II was one of the more notorious ones.

I love seeing her photos and portraits -- you cannot help but admire her beauty -- but as far as "warmth" - no, don't see it in any pictures at any time.  I do have sympathy for her - but she was just so self-centered -- can't get around that I'm afraid.  

I do not love her, but she fascinates me all the same!   ::)

Janet



Janet R.

Offline grandduchessella

  • Global Moderator
  • Velikye Knyaz
  • *****
  • Posts: 13061
  • Getting Ready to Move to Europe :D
    • View Profile
    • Facebook page
Re: Why do the people love Sissi??????
« Reply #34 on: July 01, 2006, 11:02:18 AM »
Quote

I love seeing her photos and portraits -- you cannot help but admire her beauty -- but as far as "warmth" - no, don't see it in any pictures at any time.  I do have sympathy for her - but she was just so self-centered -- can't get around that I'm afraid.  

This is exactly how I feel. I look at her photos and, yes, there's beauty there but nothing soft or warm like you see with Queen Alexandra, another legendary beauty. It's almost like admiring a statue.  :(
They also serve who only stand and wait--John Milton
Come visit on Pinterest--http://pinterest.com/lawrbk/

Offline Eric_Lowe

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 17014
  • I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
    • View Profile
Re: Why do the people love Sissi??????
« Reply #35 on: August 14, 2006, 08:43:29 PM »
Well...Certainly Sisi was capable of love. Her devotion to Valerie was complete, as she fretted over every aspect of her daughter's life. When she discovered the object of her love, she actively campaign for Valerie's happiness. One must remember that she was the only child that she was allowed to love (she did not even allow Archduchess Sophie to touch the child).  :-[

Offline Guinastasia

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 175
  • Celestial Grand Duchess of Penguins
    • View Profile
Re: Why do the people love Sissi??????
« Reply #36 on: August 19, 2006, 01:03:13 AM »
I think it's a shame that she and her sister-in-law, Charlotte, couldn't have bonded.  Both had a lot in common-both were great beauties neglected by their husbands and both of them suffered from mental illness-Charlotte though had a complete breakdown, where it seems Sissi went back and forth.

May the road rise up to meet you.
May the wind always be at your back.
May the sun shine warm upon your face,
and rains fall soft upon your fields.
And until we meet again,
May God hold you in the palm of His hand.

Offline Eric_Lowe

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 17014
  • I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
    • View Profile
Re: Why do the people love Sissi??????
« Reply #37 on: August 19, 2006, 12:03:00 PM »
I think there was a bit of jealousy on both sides. Charlotte was a bit spoiled (as the only daughter of Leopold I) and as she was better educated and rich, looked down on the poor duchess in Bavaria, who only by a fluke accident became Empress. Sisi liked Max and adored his dreamy sentiment and advertures at sea, and could not figure out why he fell for that money consisious, politically ambitious and proud princess.

Offline Noelle Royale

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 31
    • View Profile
Re: Why do the people love Sissi??????
« Reply #38 on: April 26, 2007, 12:21:50 AM »
I guess why people loved and still love Sissi to this very day,is because of the romantic legend that has been created around her.Her beauty and her mysterious personality.She was very odd like the rest of the Wittesbalch.But her eccentricity and her rebellious nature alongside her physical look made her a romantic heroine.She did look pretty amazing.Accounts of many who met her is very intriguing.Like when the Kaiser,the then Prince Wilhelm of Prussia,first met her,he was so amazed with her beauty that he just froze there staring at her upon presentation,forgetting to bow his head and kiss her hand.

Offline Zanthia

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 215
  • "She always made other women look common"
    • View Profile
Re: Why do the people love Sissi??????
« Reply #39 on: April 27, 2007, 01:21:11 AM »
I find her a fascinating person, and I feel very sorry for her. She had a difficult mind, but she knew from the beginning that she wasn't suited to be Empress, and she certainly never wanted to be it either. The accussaions of her being a bad partner for FJ is a little harsh in my opinion. I, for one, can safely say that if I were married off in the tender age of 16 to a man I hardly knew, just because I wouldn't be allowed to say no to an emperor, and then, in spite of him saying he loved me above everything on earth, be raped by him on the wedding night, breaking all my imaginations of love and romance, I probably would be a cold fish towards him too and prefered that he maintained his distance.
Of Alix: "I was raised in an age of beautiful women, and the two most beautiful was the Empress Elisabeth of Austria and my own mother"  George V

"We've invited all the beautiful women we know, but the Princess of Wales in the most beautiful of them all"  Bertie

Offline Eric_Lowe

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 17014
  • I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
    • View Profile
Re: Why do the people love Sissi??????
« Reply #40 on: April 27, 2007, 03:06:37 AM »
True...Sisi was truthful from the start" I love him so much...if only he is not the Emperor." she cried. So it was for her personally that she fell for not the Emperor. That is why she treated FJ more a husband than soverign. Not for her would she repeat Queen Mary's words " I have to remember that their father was also their king" (She was talking about her children of course).

Offline Greenowl

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 584
    • View Profile
Re: Why do the people love Sissi??????
« Reply #41 on: April 27, 2007, 05:54:03 PM »
Present day society is extremely egocentric thus part of Elisabeth’s appeal may lie in the fact that she “did her own thing”, regardless of the consequences. This makes her appear somewhat modern and ‘real’ in comparison to many of her contemporaries. The fact that she was a very attractive woman also helps and no doubt Romy Schneider added to the legend.

Offline Eric_Lowe

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 17014
  • I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
    • View Profile
Re: Why do the people love Sissi??????
« Reply #42 on: April 27, 2007, 08:30:41 PM »
Yes all the above is true !  ;)

Offline Greenowl

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 584
    • View Profile
Re: Why do the people love Sissi??????
« Reply #43 on: April 28, 2007, 07:48:47 AM »
Thanks Eric L!! What I forgot to mention is that Elisabeth suffered from both severe depression and anorexia, which are also “modern” diseases insofar as they were not recognised until relatively recently (especially anorexia, which only became known in the 1970s). It is a strange coincidence that Elisabeth felt misunderstood by her contemporaries and addressed many of her poems to the “Zukunftsseelen”…which I roughly translate as “the spirits of the future” or future generations. She had some of her poems printed, but insisted that they should not be published until 60 years after her death. She left these instructions in a letter written in her own hand, again addressed to “Liebe Zukunfts-Seele!” (Dear future spirit/person). She added that any financial gain from her work should be given to the families/dependents of political prisoners, “as then (i.e. in 60 years time), just as now (1890), happiness and peace, in other words freedom, will be equally rare on our little planet. But perhaps on another?”(my rough translation from the German) In this regard, like her idol Heinrich Heine, Elisabeth was either prophetic or had such a good grasp of reality that she was able to predict the future fairly accurately….Heine died in 1856, Elisabeth in 1898 and neither were under any illusion that things would improve…Heine hints at environmental problems and the holocaust among other things. Elisabeth believed that her poetry was as good as Heine’s and that he “dictated” it to her from “the other side”. Obviously there is no resemblance, and to even suggest that her work is a pale imitation of Heine’s would be grossly overstating its quality. In view of the fact that she so idolized Heine (indeed some of her poems about him are even slightly erotic in content) it is ironic that she unwittingly insulted him by comparing his work to hers, but obviously she was oblivious to the paradox. Fascinating!!!!

Offline Eric_Lowe

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 17014
  • I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
    • View Profile
Re: Why do the people love Sissi??????
« Reply #44 on: April 29, 2007, 08:22:57 PM »
Indeed ! Sisi is actually quite talented by nature. She could have done so much for Austria had she been guided properly. However Archduchess Sophie was not the one to do it. In fact her repressive regime and FJ's "supposed infidenlity" drove her into deep depression. When she did came out of it, she was too wounded in spirit to do anything but to constantly escape... :(