Author Topic: Princess Diana  (Read 228604 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Grace

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 3126
    • View Profile
Re: Had there been no 'Camilla' - would the Wales marriage have survived?
« Reply #450 on: August 17, 2007, 05:35:16 PM »
The marriage was doomed from the start...Camilla might be seen as the catalyst/scapegoat but if she had not been around somebody else would have.Diana was too damaged by her childhood to be the right wife for Charles indeed most men and the over the top media attention which she played up to (and which went to her head) was among the many things that widened the breach....Charles was too insecure to handle it....there were other factors/faults too ON BOTH SIDES !!! but inevitably there would have been a seperation...

This oft repeated line that Diana was 'too damaged by her childhood' is, frankly, rubbish.  She was described by those who knew her pre-Charles as a happy and uncomplicated girl.  Her former nanny Mary Clarke blames Diana's experience within the royal family, and Charles in particular, for 'turning the practical, warm little girl she looked after into a basket case, then rewriting her early life history to justify it'.  I couldn't agree more.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2007, 05:43:06 PM by Grace »

Offline dmitri

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 2018
    • View Profile
Re: Had there been no 'Camilla' - would the Wales marriage have survived?
« Reply #451 on: August 17, 2007, 09:02:58 PM »
You're spot on as always Tsaria. Others could do well to learn from your wise words.

Offline Mary R.

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 249
  • Queen Mary: Visions of Grandeur
    • View Profile
Re: Had there been no 'Camilla' - would the Wales marriage have survived?
« Reply #452 on: August 17, 2007, 11:34:09 PM »
First off bravo for the topic suggestion, what stimulating discussion! Many previous posts have simply taken the words out of my mouth! I have mixed views, on one hand I would like to believe the marriage would have been strong etc. However, I also lean towards the idea that the marriage would still exist if for appearances only. Of course, there were so many factors it is rather difficult to tell what would have been.

Mary R.
"I shall be very disappointed," she remarked for the record, "if George doesn't come up again." Queen Mary upon hearing her husband was to ride in a submarine.

When asked the question of when her eldest son would return to the country Queen Mary said, "Not until he comes to my funeral."

Offline dmitri

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 2018
    • View Profile
Re: Had there been no 'Camilla' - would the Wales marriage have survived?
« Reply #453 on: August 18, 2007, 02:58:23 AM »
The marriage surviving just for appearances sake would have been far better than the current situation which has only brought a lack of respect for the heir to the throne and the loss of a very popular asset to the crown, Diana, Princess of Wales.

Offline TampaBay

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 4213
  • Being TampaBay is a Full Time Job.
    • View Profile
Re: Had there been no 'Camilla' - would the Wales marriage have survived?
« Reply #454 on: August 18, 2007, 05:20:40 AM »
If Camilla had never existed, Charles would have found someone else to provide what Camilla provides.  We are not talking Edward VII here who loved his wife as a wife but also "loved" the excitment of many others too.  As Alix stated on many occasions (or a different variation), " He always loved me best". 

I do not believe Charles loves Camilla as one should love his wife or mistress or whatever.  I think he loved and married a "nanny" for life.

I feel for any woman in Camilla's position as I have posted many times.  As time goes on I think Charles got the better end of the deal.

I do not believe for one moment that Camilla really and truly wanted to marry Charles.

TampaBay

"Fashion is so rarely great art that if we cannot appreciate great trash, we should stop going to the mall.

Offline dmitri

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 2018
    • View Profile
Re: Had there been no 'Camilla' - would the Wales marriage have survived?
« Reply #455 on: August 18, 2007, 05:56:41 AM »
Well if she had not wanted to marry him she would still be his mistress.

Offline TampaBay

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 4213
  • Being TampaBay is a Full Time Job.
    • View Profile
Re: Had there been no 'Camilla' - would the Wales marriage have survived?
« Reply #456 on: August 18, 2007, 06:25:40 AM »
Of course she would still be his mistress and "have the best of both worlds".

TampaBay
"Fashion is so rarely great art that if we cannot appreciate great trash, we should stop going to the mall.

Offline Janet

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 224
  • There is nothing like a Dame ... of the Thistle
    • View Profile
Re: Had there been no 'Camilla' - would the Wales marriage have survived?
« Reply #457 on: August 18, 2007, 01:08:51 PM »
If Camilla, or a Camilla manque, had not existed, would the marriage of the Prince and the Princess of Wales survived to this day?   Could it have been a happy union?   Would there have been more children?   Would the Prince of Wales' popularity be greater, lesser or just as it stands at the moment?   Would the British monarchy have stood a higher possibiltiy of surviving the turbulent times of multiculturism with all its social schisms, political correctness, European unity and probably its greatest enemy of all - apathy?

tsaria

I'm going to answer the topic as presented. Camilla never existed.

My answers would be yes, the marriage of the Prince and Princess of Wales would have survived to this day. 
Yes, it could be a happy union.
Yes, there would be more than two children.
The Prince of Wales's popularity would be greater than it is now.
The Monarchy would have stood higher than now.

These are my opinions because had Camilla never existed, the Princess of Wales in question would not have been Diana Spencer.  Having never known Camilla, having never become her friend and more, Charles's interest and affection would have been free to form some other relationship and to fall in love and marry.  And he would have, probably 4 or 5 years earilier than he actually did.   

Part of my point really is that it was Camilla herself who made it possible for Diana to acheive her childhood fantasy of marrying the Prince of Wales.  Had she not existed Charles would have married someone suitable and compatible well before Diana could have come into the picture at all,

Offline CHRISinUSA

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 844
    • View Profile
Re: Had there been no 'Camilla' - would the Wales marriage have survived?
« Reply #458 on: August 18, 2007, 05:21:16 PM »
Now THAT is a very interesting point Janet.  You are probably correct - had there been no Camilla, there probably would have been no Diana, Princess of Wales.

Wow, when you think about it - fate has an interesting way of working, doesn't it???

Offline gogm

  • Graf
  • ***
  • Posts: 361
    • View Profile
    • Grand Ladies
Re: Had there been no 'Camilla' - would the Wales marriage have survived?
« Reply #459 on: August 18, 2007, 05:57:45 PM »
I was going to say no way (the marriage would have lasted)! But CHRISinUSA is right. No Camila to keep the POW distracted, no Diana.

Offline dmitri

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 2018
    • View Profile
Re: Had there been no 'Camilla' - would the Wales marriage have survived?
« Reply #460 on: August 18, 2007, 09:38:29 PM »
Now that supposition is away wit the fairies completey.

Offline NAAOTMA

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 88
    • View Profile
Re: Had there been no 'Camilla' - would the Wales marriage have survived?
« Reply #461 on: August 18, 2007, 10:26:29 PM »
Janet is on to something!

What if the women who turned down Charle's earlier proposals of marriage did so because they had no desire to be the royal broodmare with a husband whose affections were engaged elsewhere? Certainly Amanda Knatchbull's diplomatic "the royal life is not for me" could be read that way in hindsight. Anna Wallace's storming off also.

Too sad that the Wales marriage never had the break of starting out minus Charles' dependence on Camilla or Camilla's engineering to stay in the picture. Recently Patrick Jephson gave an interview saying that if Diana had not died in Paris, she and Charles would have both "grown up" and gotten back together. Interesting thought. 

Offline TampaBay

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 4213
  • Being TampaBay is a Full Time Job.
    • View Profile
Re: Had there been no 'Camilla' - would the Wales marriage have survived?
« Reply #462 on: August 19, 2007, 07:27:19 AM »
Janet,

You are correct!  I never thought about that way.  If not for Camilla, Charles would not have married Diana.  He would have married someone else!

TampaBay
"Fashion is so rarely great art that if we cannot appreciate great trash, we should stop going to the mall.

Offline ChristineM

  • Moderator
  • Velikye Knyaz
  • *****
  • Posts: 2882
    • View Profile
Re: Had there been no 'Camilla' - would the Wales marriage have survived?
« Reply #463 on: August 19, 2007, 05:45:49 PM »


Janet has opened a very interesting aspect to the development of this triumvirate, but has, to an extent, moved the goalposts.

However, as if to confirm Janet's hyposthesis, an important fact which has been thus far overlooked - Charles proposed to Diana in the garden at Bolehyde Manor.   This, of course was the home of Andrew and Camilla Parker Bowles.    All 'neat and tidy', just as Diana believed she had a duty to keep herself.

tsaria

 




















« Last Edit: August 20, 2007, 04:05:29 AM by tsaria »

Offline dmitri

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 2018
    • View Profile
Re: Had there been no 'Camilla' - would the Wales marriage have survived?
« Reply #464 on: August 19, 2007, 05:54:22 PM »
Yes Diana really was enormously betrayed. How Charles and Camilla can sleep at night is beyond me. Diana certainly deserved much better than what she received.