Grand Duchess Maria Pavlovna-younger, her life and relations

Two failed marriages, no apparent maternal intinct, plus a poor head for business and not knowing what she wanted makes a loser. I found people here are very generous with their accessment of charecters. There is no apparent reason why her marriages failed. Marie was not sexually or verbally abused or even beaten. Most Royal women at the time would stay married for the security of status and financial stability. Do remember it was the norm for royal marriages not to marry for love. Many royal women had to love the husbands they were given. Marie Feodorovna considered it is better to be dead than divorced. It was fool hardy for Marie to chase after rainbows when she had a husband and child that needed her. I think the great sin of Marie Paulovna was that she does not understand responsibility, and flung herself into situations without thinking the consequenses.

for Maria i think she got a bit carried away, ever searching, perhaps more used to pursuit than anything else. . .and perhaps she passed by chances to be happy in favor of the thankless possibility of such things, which have their own benefit in validation of a past pain. . .but you cannot say, because she was not abused she had no right to be messed up. she had no steady paternal OR maternal figure (Ella's changing behavior towards her would have confused any child), and too much pity coupled with neglect can do much damage to a child in way of security, pursuit of happiness, and responsibility. I personally think it is absolutely inexcusable to leave your own child, but whether Wilhelm "needed" her is another question, which I cannot judge. I am not so educated on Wilhelm. In any case it is very sad Maria had no maternal instinct, or did not want one, for raising a child might have absolved more than a few of her own wounds

I think you cannot blame Ella for ALL Maria Paulovna's failings. Most certainly Marie herself did not present her case when she wrote her memoirs. It gives the impression that she was floating aimlessly through life. Indeed, had the Russian Revolution not happened, she might have found herself gambling her wealth away (like Anastasia, Grand duchess of Mecklenburg) or dating different men like a female version of her Russian Uncles. However even Anastasia stayed within the confines of marriage and only remarried after her husband's death. A more common situation would have been a seperation, but no divorce (like Queen Ena of Spain or Crown Princess Cecilie of Germany). Both women did their duty to their children and tolerated the existance of their husband. That was the way royalty operated then. Marie Paulovna sought to go her own way with disasterous results. She left Lennart motherless and only very late in late when they began to bond again.

I was wondering, in an ealier posting from 2004 someone had mentioned that Maria was buried on the Island of Maineu (sp) and also her brother was buried there.

They mentioned that Maria's "china and photo's" were also there.  Does that mean that her photo's and china are on display? or they are in her crypt?

I know it was said that her son Lenart lived out his life on that island until he died at age 95.  Just wondering about the china and photo comment made.

Svetabel: You always compare Maria Pavlovna with Olga Alexandrovna. I repeat and will repeat that such comparing is not correct due to their education, characters and lives.

I agree with you Svetabel, I see Maria and Olga as being totally different people, different situations/lives.

I think Marie Paulovna had more going for her than Olga Alexandrovna. She was pretty, talented and had a husband and child. Married to one of the more secure European Royal Families, she managed to land herself in financial ruin and emotionally disatisfied. Olga Alexandrovna was tied to her mother's apron strings and landed herself into a friendship marriage. After her divorce, she was married to the love of her life. Although financially strapped for cash, she manage to have a simple but fulfilling life (family & her art). Both pf them were born grand duchesses and grown up in luxury. The routes they took in life was very different.

I think Marie Paulovna had more going for her than Olga Alexandrovna. She was pretty, talented and had a husband and child. Married to one of the more secure European Royal Families, she managed to land herself in financial ruin and emotionally disatisfied. Olga Alexandrovna was tied to her mother's apron strings and landed herself into a friendship marriage. After her divorce, she was married to the love of her life. Although financially strapped for cash, she manage to have a simple but fulfilling life (family & her art). Both pf them were born grand duchesses and grown up in luxury. The routes they took in life was very different.

i very much admire the way Olga Alexandrovna handled herself after the Revolution. She was a vary talented artist and lived a private life

I am too...However she was not close to Xenia after her mother's death. Marie Paulovna had a close relationship with her brother Dimitri, and it was the longest standing one with a male person (consistanstly longer than either of her husbands or her son).

Not everybody is close to their siblings. I have no sisters, so can't comment on that relationship from experience, but my brother and I have always been rivals rather than friends..

There were seven years between Xenia and Olga, so they are unlikely to have been close as children. After that, maybe they were just different people.

Ann

I think you cannot blame Ella for ALL Maria Paulovna's failings. Most certainly Marie herself did not present her case when she wrote her memoirs. It gives the impression that she was floating aimlessly through life. Indeed, had the Russian Revolution not happened, she might have found herself gambling her wealth away (like Anastasia, Grand duchess of Mecklenburg) or dating different men like a female version of her Russian Uncles. However even Anastasia stayed within the confines of marriage and only remarried after her husband's death. A more common situation would have been a seperation, but no divorce (like Queen Ena of Spain or Crown Princess Cecilie of Germany). Both women did their duty to their children and tolerated the existance of their husband. That was the way royalty operated then. Marie Paulovna sought to go her own way with disasterous results. She left Lennart motherless and only very late in late when they began to bond again.

Annastasia of Mecklenberg Schwerin DID NOT remarry after her husbands death.

You are right, however she did created scandal by having a child out of wedlock.

I didn't think Xenia and Olga were ever particularly close. but most siblings do not have the closeness that Maria and Dmitri have, being the only constant to rely on, as they are passed from family to family etc

Agree. Marie and Dimitri were unusually close, due to circumstances.

Ann

Was Maria Pavlovna in contact with the 2 Paley sisters after the revolution, in exile?

Was Maria Pavlovna in contact with the 2 Paley sisters after the revolution, in exile?

She was in contact with their mother Olga Paley and obviously from time to time meet her half-sisters.