Author Topic: Seriously... Or Not...  (Read 7694 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Azarias

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 175
    • View Profile
Re: Seriously... Or Not...
« Reply #30 on: February 04, 2006, 09:26:58 PM »

When I went to that site, re AA's marriage to Manahan, it mentioned the ceremony was attended by the bride's long time friend Gleb Botkin, Archbishop of the Church of Aphrodite." Checking further on the "Church" I found this:

"In 1939 Botkin founded his own Pagan religious group, the Church of Aphrodite, first in Long Island, N.Y., and then in Charlottesville, Va., after he moved there. The "church" ended with his death in the mid-1960s, but at least one member, W. Holman Keith, was connected with subsequent Pagan bodies such as Feraferia, the Church of the Eternal Source, and the Church of All Worlds."

Has anyone ever heard of this?

« Last Edit: June 10, 2009, 04:16:23 PM by Alixz »
"My! People come and go so quickly here!" - Dorothy, The Wizard of Oz

Offline Annie

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 4757
    • View Profile
    • Anna Anderson Exposed!
Re: Seriously... Or Not...
« Reply #31 on: February 04, 2006, 09:44:11 PM »

Thanks for posting that, Eddie!

This person, for a writer, seems uniformed about a lot of things. For example, he put this at the end:

Quote
That they happened to have Franziska's family DNA available for comparison is another tie to the Romanov machinations of the 1920s, and the latest link in the long chain of plausible denial.

Even the AA supporters here are aware that her great nephew's blood was donated in 1994 for this test  ::)






« Last Edit: June 10, 2009, 04:17:39 PM by Alixz »

Offline Tania+

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 1206
  • I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
    • View Profile
Re: Seriously... Or Not...
« Reply #32 on: February 04, 2006, 09:44:51 PM »
Azarias,

Sorry, but I have a question. If Gleb Botkin, turned his back on his being christined Russian Orthodox, how does and still do the Russian Orthodox view this ?

Are they (the Russian Orthodox Church) like the Catholic Church, state to these people excommunication, and their church christining records marked as such ? Do you know what happens to people who renounce their russ orthodoxy faith ?

Thanks for any info.

Tatiana+


Quote

When I went to that site, re AA's marriage to Manahan, it mentioned the ceremony was attented by the bride's long time friend Gleb Botkin, Archbishop of the Church of Aphrodite." Checking further on the "Church" I found this:

"In 1939 Botkin founded his own Pagan religious group, the Church of Aphrodite, first in Long Island, N.Y., and then in Charlottesville, Va., after he moved there. The "church" ended with his death in the mid-1960s, but at least one member, W. Holman Keith, was connected with subsequent Pagan bodies such as Feraferia, the Church of the Eternal Source, and the Church of All Worlds."

Has anyone ever heard of this?


TatianaA


Offline Tsarfan

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 1848
  • Miss the kings, but not the kingdoms
    • View Profile
Re: Seriously... Or Not...
« Reply #33 on: February 05, 2006, 07:24:25 AM »
Quote
I also noticed that Maria Rasputin even in old age clearly resembles herself as a teenager . . . .  However, AA looks nothing like teenage Anastasia


To me, that fact alone puts the whole Anna Anderson debate to rest.  However, I said as much ages ago on one of the Survivors threads and drew only frustrated denial from the AA-is-AN crowd.

Just look at the list of things they must rationalize away to make their case:

- The photo comparing ear shapes was inadvertently reversed.
- AA could speak Russian; she just wouldn't.
- Grand Duke Ernst really did visit Russia in 1916; but the families on both sides are still intent on concealing that fact almost a century later.
- Grand Duchess Olga A. really did recognize AA as AN, but she just said she didn't . . . in part to protect an interest in a secret Romanov fortune that has never been found but that is surely out there someplace.
- Since AA was not a virgin when she arrived in Berlin, AN must have borne a child somewhere on her flight from Siberia.
- The reports on the birthdate of this child are all mistaken, because the birthdate AA gives would mean Anastasia either got pregnant during her captivity, or she bore a child that survived at a miraculously premature point in gestation.
- The DNA doesn't match because there was a successful conspiracy to switch a piece of intestines in a hospital in Virginia . . . years before it could have been foreseen that such tissue would be of any use in proving identity.

Despite this list (which is just a sampling of a much longer list), many still persist in believing AA was AN.

I don't know why I'm wasting my time on this board.  Giving the willingness of this crowd to suspend their disbelief on a massive scale, I could probably convince them I am Nicholas II's grandson if I just put my mind to it.  And then I could have all that money when it's found.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Tsarfan »

Offline Azarias

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 175
    • View Profile
Re: Seriously... Or Not...
« Reply #34 on: February 05, 2006, 11:46:47 AM »
I could not say for sure what the Russian Church did or did not do. Technically, no one would have to excommunicate Gleb Botkin, he by his own actions did that to himself. I am sure that his actions would have been noted and that the word of it would be common knowledge amongst the Orthodox.

I had never heard this story before, so I was posting it to see what others had to say about it. I wonder if this was part of some major disenchantment with the Church, or if it was another casualty of the Revolution. Perhaps both.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2009, 04:19:14 PM by Alixz »
"My! People come and go so quickly here!" - Dorothy, The Wizard of Oz

Offline LisaDavidson

  • Moderator
  • Velikye Knyaz
  • *****
  • Posts: 2665
    • View Profile
Re: Seriously... Or Not...
« Reply #35 on: February 05, 2006, 11:54:05 AM »
Quote

When I went to that site, re AA's marriage to Manahan, it mentioned the ceremony was attented by the bride's long time friend Gleb Botkin, Archbishop of the Church of Aphrodite." Checking further on the "Church" I found this:

"In 1939 Botkin founded his own Pagan religious group, the Church of Aphrodite, first in Long Island, N.Y., and then in Charlottesville, Va., after he moved there. The "church" ended with his death in the mid-1960s, but at least one member, W. Holman Keith, was connected with subsequent Pagan bodies such as Feraferia, the Church of the Eternal Source, and the Church of All Worlds."

Has anyone ever heard of this?



Sure. Gleb became a pagan after he left Russia. I'm not sure what the point is here. Gleb was not the first and will not be the last person to start up a religion, and most of these fall by the wayside when the person dies.

Offline Eddie_uk

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 2925
    • View Profile
Re: Seriously... Or Not...
« Reply #36 on: February 05, 2006, 12:00:00 PM »
Excellent post Tsarfan. I think people just want to believe some member of the IF survived regardless?

In this sad story I couldn't care less about AA, however what does irritate me is the problems and grief she caused the surviving Romanovs. They were a family in exile, short of money, many family members had been butchered, in circumstances completely foreign to them.

I know I've said it before but it gets me every time. It's wickedness what those pretenders did if you ask me :)

MF, Olga and Xenia espcially just didn't need it, I feel so sorry for them *sigh*
Grief is the price we pay for love.

FREE PALESTINE.

Offline Azarias

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 175
    • View Profile
Re: Seriously... Or Not...
« Reply #37 on: February 05, 2006, 12:24:12 PM »
Quote

 I'm not sure what the point is here.


Several posts back Eddieboy had posted a link to a site on AA. I went there to read it and found the mention of Gleb Botkin. I was simply asking if anyone else knew of his actions or church? It was news to me.
"My! People come and go so quickly here!" - Dorothy, The Wizard of Oz

Offline Eddie_uk

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 2925
    • View Profile
Re: Seriously... Or Not...
« Reply #38 on: February 05, 2006, 12:25:43 PM »
hey Azarias if you look under the "Servants and Retainers" section their is a thread on Gleb Botkin with quite a bit of info on!  :)
Grief is the price we pay for love.

FREE PALESTINE.

Offline Tania+

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 1206
  • I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
    • View Profile
Re: Seriously... Or Not...
« Reply #39 on: February 06, 2006, 02:24:23 PM »
I have only one question to make inquiry of you, if you don't mind, and won't take offense. Why did you choose the name "Tsarfan" ? Thanks.

Tatiana+


Quote

To me, that fact alone puts the whole Anna Anderson debate to rest.  However, I said as much ages ago on one of the Survivors threads and drew only frustrated denial from the AA-is-AN crowd.

Just look at the list of things they must rationalize away to make their case:

- The photo comparing ear shapes was inadvertently reversed.
- AA could speak Russian; she just wouldn't.
- Grand Duke Ernst really did visit Russia in 1916; but the families on both sides are still intent on concealing that fact almost a century later.
- Grand Duchess Olga A. really did recognize AA as AN, but she just said she didn't . . . in part to protect an interest in a secret Romanov fortune that has never been found but that is surely out there someplace.
- Since AA was not a virgin when she arrived in Berlin, AN must have borne a child somewhere on her flight from Siberia.
- The reports on the birthdate of this child are all mistaken, because the birthdate AA gives would mean Anastasia either got pregnant during her captivity, or she bore a child that survived at a miraculously premature point in gestation.
- The DNA doesn't match because there was a successful conspiracy to switch a piece of intestines in a hospital in Virginia . . . years before it could have been foreseen that such tissue would be of any use in proving identity.

Despite this list (which is just a sampling of a much longer list), many still persist in believing AA was AN.

I don't know why I'm wasting my time on this board.  Giving the willingness of this crowd to suspend their disbelief on a massive scale, I could probably convince them I am Nicholas II's grandson if I just put my mind to it.  And then I could have all that money when it's found.

TatianaA


Offline Tsarfan

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 1848
  • Miss the kings, but not the kingdoms
    • View Profile
Re: Seriously... Or Not...
« Reply #40 on: February 06, 2006, 02:30:58 PM »
Given my obvious lack of regard for Nicholas II, my choice of "stage name" has confused several Forum members.

I am fascinated by the institution of tsardom and hold some of its representatives in high esteem.

I'm a movie fan, too, but think some real clunkers have been produced.