Author Topic: The courtesy of the curtsey  (Read 11849 times)

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Offline basilforever

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Re: The courtesy of the curtsey
« Reply #15 on: October 17, 2006, 05:59:56 AM »
Ha ha.  ;D Well not in pubic I wouldn't throw myself at his feet. But in private - well I would try to behave with restraint and serenity.  ;D :D ;)
His Royal Highness Prince Albert Victor Christian Edward of Wales, Duke of Clarence and Avondale, Earl of Athlone, Knight of The Most Noble Order of the Garter, Knight of The Most Illustrious Order of St Patrick

Offline CHRISinUSA

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Re: The courtesy of the curtsey
« Reply #16 on: October 17, 2006, 08:44:26 AM »
I would definitely bow to The Queen and to the Duke.  I am a British subject, so I've never considered what I would do in the case of say, the Queen of the Netherlands.  I am not her subject, but I would probably bow to her as well.

Would I bow to the Prince of Wales?  Doubtful.  Would I bow to him after he becomes King?  Probably.  Would I bow to Mrs. Simpson, er, I mean the Duchess of Cornwall?  No.    Would I bow to her after she becomes *insert whatever name the PR people decide to call her when Charles becomes King*?  No.


Leuchtenberg, I'm confused by the logic. If you bow to the Queen and DoE, isn't it because you are showing respect to the kingly office, rather than to the individuals?  I mean, Elizabeth Windsor is by all accounts a lovely lady, but I doubt you'd bow to her were she a shopkeeper.

When Charles and Camilla ascend the throne, they will be holders of the same kingdly office.  Will that office be any less deserving of your respect than it is today when occupied by Elizabeth and Phillip?

Offline Marlene

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Re: The courtesy of the curtsey
« Reply #17 on: October 17, 2006, 08:45:26 AM »
Here is a link to the story.

None wore shorts

http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/07/19/flipflop.flap.ap/


Delightfully expressed Taren.   I think your attitude is echoed around the world.

tsaria

Thank you, Tsaria, but apparently it's not. The flip flop reference actually happened. A female sports team was visiting Washington and invited to the White House. Many showed up wearing flip flops and shorts. It was in the news for a little while, with many people remarking that the idea of etiquette has gone down the drain. It's the same thing on the IMDB message board for thr queen film. I'm sure most that post these things are just trying to get a reaction, but you wouldn't believe the amount of posts that say something like "if I met the queen I'd just be like 'hey b****"'" or "she's so old, why doesn't she just die already?". it's depressing.
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Offline Marlene

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Re: The courtesy of the curtsey
« Reply #18 on: October 17, 2006, 08:46:28 AM »


With this post I hope you will act with restraint ...

 :o

Ha ha.  ;D Well not in pubic I wouldn't throw myself at his feet. But in private - well I would try to behave with restraint and serenity.  ;D :D ;)
Author of Queen Victoria's Descendants,
& publisher of Royal Book News.
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Leuchtenberg

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Re: The courtesy of the curtsey
« Reply #19 on: October 17, 2006, 10:36:06 AM »
I would definitely bow to The Queen and to the Duke.  I am a British subject, so I've never considered what I would do in the case of say, the Queen of the Netherlands.  I am not her subject, but I would probably bow to her as well.

Would I bow to the Prince of Wales?  Doubtful.  Would I bow to him after he becomes King?  Probably.  Would I bow to Mrs. Simpson, er, I mean the Duchess of Cornwall?  No.    Would I bow to her after she becomes *insert whatever name the PR people decide to call her when Charles becomes King*?  No.


Leuchtenberg, I'm confused by the logic. If you bow to the Queen and DoE, isn't it because you are showing respect to the kingly office, rather than to the individuals?  I mean, Elizabeth Windsor is by all accounts a lovely lady, but I doubt you'd bow to her were she a shopkeeper.

When Charles and Camilla ascend the throne, they will be holders of the same kingdly office.  Will that office be any less deserving of your respect than it is today when occupied by Elizabeth and Phillip?

Yes,  the monarchy will be less deserving of my  respect because Charles and Camilla have made it so.   I have respect for the institution of the monarchy.  But once that institution has changed hands, so to speak, and become run into the ground....why should I respect it?

The monarchy is about, among other things, duty, selflessness, sacrifice, and dignity.   I'm sorry, but Charles and Camilla seem to have fallen short of the mark, very much so.

I don't expect Royalty to be perfect.  They are humans after all.  But, I do expect monarchs to do their best.   The Queen and the Duke are not perfect, yet they DO their best.  The Queen is about the monarchy.  However, unless the Prince of Wales does a complete turnabout when he becomes King, he will continue to behave as though the monarchy is all about him.   I don't dislike Charles at all.  I don't think he's evil.  But, he is selfish.  So how will he adequately be able to devote himself to duty and the people when what matters to him is only what he wants.  Qui vivra, verra.

The institution of monarchy will only be as good as the monarch who serves it.  And in the past few decades, Charles serves only himself.   :(


Offline basilforever

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Re: The courtesy of the curtsey
« Reply #20 on: October 17, 2006, 10:37:43 AM »


With this post I hope you will act with restraint ...

 :o

Ha ha.  ;D Well not in public I wouldn't throw myself at his feet. But in private - well I would try to behave with restraint and serenity.  ;D :D ;)

I did! There's no reason to be shocked. I was only joking besides!  :)
« Last Edit: October 17, 2006, 11:02:44 AM by basilforever »
His Royal Highness Prince Albert Victor Christian Edward of Wales, Duke of Clarence and Avondale, Earl of Athlone, Knight of The Most Noble Order of the Garter, Knight of The Most Illustrious Order of St Patrick

Offline Marlene

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Re: The courtesy of the curtsey
« Reply #21 on: October 17, 2006, 10:57:53 AM »
I was referring to the mispelling of a word    ???



With this post I hope you will act with restraint ...

 :o

Ha ha.  ;D Well not in pubic I wouldn't throw myself at his feet. But in private - well I would try to behave with restraint and serenity.  ;D :D ;)

I did! There's no reason to be shocked. I was only joking besides!  :)
Author of Queen Victoria's Descendants,
& publisher of Royal Book News.
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Offline basilforever

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Re: The courtesy of the curtsey
« Reply #22 on: October 17, 2006, 11:01:42 AM »
Oh God, I didn't notice that!  :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ I meant public of course.  :-[ :-[
Sorry, what a bad typo to make.
His Royal Highness Prince Albert Victor Christian Edward of Wales, Duke of Clarence and Avondale, Earl of Athlone, Knight of The Most Noble Order of the Garter, Knight of The Most Illustrious Order of St Patrick

Offline Grace

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Re: The courtesy of the curtsey
« Reply #23 on: October 17, 2006, 02:28:33 PM »
That's rather comical, isn't it?!  ;D  - I never noticed it either, until the eagle eye of Marlene swooped!  :D :D 

Offline Marlene

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Re: The courtesy of the curtsey
« Reply #24 on: October 17, 2006, 02:54:46 PM »
oh, it just jumped out at me.

That's rather comical, isn't it?!  ;D  - I never noticed it either, until the eagle eye of Marlene swooped!  :D :D 
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Offline Grace

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Re: The courtesy of the curtsey
« Reply #25 on: October 17, 2006, 02:58:20 PM »
Quote

Yes,  the monarchy will be less deserving of my  respect because Charles and Camilla have made it so.   I have respect for the institution of the monarchy.  But once that institution has changed hands, so to speak, and become run into the ground....why should I respect it?

The monarchy is about, among other things, duty, selflessness, sacrifice, and dignity.   I'm sorry, but Charles and Camilla seem to have fallen short of the mark, very much so.

I don't expect Royalty to be perfect.  They are humans after all.  But, I do expect monarchs to do their best.   The Queen and the Duke are not perfect, yet they DO their best.  The Queen is about the monarchy.  However, unless the Prince of Wales does a complete turnabout when he becomes King, he will continue to behave as though the monarchy is all about him.   I don't dislike Charles at all.  I don't think he's evil.  But, he is selfish.  So how will he adequately be able to devote himself to duty and the people when what matters to him is only what he wants.  Qui vivra, verra.

The institution of monarchy will only be as good as the monarch who serves it.  And in the past few decades, Charles serves only himself.   :(

I agree with every word of Leuchtenberg here.  Charles is not a bad man.  In fact, he is a very earnest and well meaning person on many issues.  But I think he is planning to change the monarchy in ways we don't know about now when his time comes - and it will change to suit him, in my opinion, not because he believes it's best for the people or what the people want. 
« Last Edit: October 17, 2006, 02:59:56 PM by Grace »

Offline basilforever

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Re: The courtesy of the curtsey
« Reply #26 on: October 18, 2006, 04:14:10 AM »
oh, it just jumped out at me.

That's rather comical, isn't it?!  ;D  - I never noticed it either, until the eagle eye of Marlene swooped!  :D :D 

Well, everybody makes typos. Most people make them far more than me!
His Royal Highness Prince Albert Victor Christian Edward of Wales, Duke of Clarence and Avondale, Earl of Athlone, Knight of The Most Noble Order of the Garter, Knight of The Most Illustrious Order of St Patrick

Offline Prince_Lieven

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Re: The courtesy of the curtsey
« Reply #27 on: October 18, 2006, 10:42:40 AM »
It's only a joke, bforever . . .
"How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?"
-Sherlock Holmes

"Men forget, but never forgive; women forgive, but never forget."

Viscount

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Re: The courtesy of the curtsey
« Reply #28 on: October 19, 2006, 02:58:17 PM »

Just to throw a spanner in the works.....  in my humble and personal view - I dont see how you can pick and choose who to "show respect to" - the whole idea of a bow or a curtsey is to show repsect to their ROYAL rank and not the individual person's popularity.....  and surely popularity contests should be left to the press ??? 

Im sure that this will be unpopular but regardless of my personal thoughts, I would ALWAYS bow to PMOK as she is an HRH and should be afforded the same respect as any other ROYAL, be it HM, HRH, HSH, HH etc.....  and the same would apply to other foreign royals!


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Offline Grace

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Re: The courtesy of the curtsey
« Reply #29 on: October 19, 2006, 03:52:07 PM »
I would treat all members of the royal family with courtesy, but now that protocol has deemed bowing/curtseying optional, I would apply this only to those of the RF I deeply respect, such as Her Majesty and Prince Philip. 

These days, with this change in protocol, we are seeing this deferential act less and less but I still think it is appropriate for the Queen to be accorded this honor.  She has given her life to serving the monarchy and is above reproach.  Prince Philip is not exactly above reproach but his devotion to duty and his support of the Queen in her role cannot be questioned. 

The same cannot be said for any other members of the current RF, in my opinion.  I think people will pick and choose related to the esteem in which they hold the individual royal personage.